BajaNomad

Cerveza Questions

Baja Bernie - 6-5-2005 at 11:07 AM

Which internationally acclaimed Mexican beer was affectionately called ?Skunk Beer? in Baja during the 50?s and 60?s?

AND why was it given that loving name?

Boy! You really know that someone has BAJA FEVER when he sits here on this gloomy day and asks silly questions like that. Oh! Well. I guess it is better that sitting here and drinking the stuff.

comitan - 6-5-2005 at 11:12 AM

Bernie

I think everyone knows the answer to that, in those days we didn't have the refrigeration like we do now and corona being in a clear bottle was the the worst but in my case I grew to like the skunky tast and to this day still do.

Baja Bernie - 6-5-2005 at 11:42 AM

Okay, that didn't last long but do you know who first put the lime in Mexican beer?--I don't. Never did like it hiding the flavor of the beer.

I still like warm beer but never did like holding my nose as I swallowed the Corona.

Oso - 6-5-2005 at 12:06 PM

I always thought Sol had the skunkiest taste and smell, but that wasn't in Baja. The absolute cheapest beer was always Victoria. I can remember "Vickies" at 50 centavos (4 cents USD at the time.)

Tecate was the first Mexican beer to come in cans, steel, not aluminum. The custom of squeezing lemon or lime juice in the rim of the can and sprinkling with salt may have originated as a means of killing the metallic taste of the can. I still prefer TKT that way but not any other beer, especially not quality brews like Bohemia. I'm not sure who carried this over to shoving a slice down the neck of a bottle, probably gringos, but with returnable bottles it's a dumb thing to do. Ever since I read of people finding moldy old lemon peels in a fresh bottle of beer after drinking half of it, I've despised the custom and always hold a bottle up to the light before opening it.:mad:

beer talk...

eetdrt88 - 6-5-2005 at 12:52 PM

almost as much fun as drinking an ice cold pacifico on a warm baja day....but not quite;D;D;D;D

or even a tecate...

eetdrt88 - 6-5-2005 at 12:52 PM

Hose A

Baja Bernie - 6-5-2005 at 01:20 PM

You forget yourself--this is not a dating forum. And besides posting a deceptive picture in Baja is unlawful. Far to many youngin's to be taken advantage of down here.
Next thing you know you'll be painting stripes on a donkey.

hilarious

eetdrt88 - 6-5-2005 at 02:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Baja Bernie
You forget yourself--this is not a dating forum. And besides posting a deceptive picture in Baja is unlawful. Far to many youngin's to be taken advantage of down here.
Next thing you know you'll be painting stripes on a donkey.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

XXXs

Sharksbaja - 6-5-2005 at 02:21 PM

Tres XXXs was the worst beer I ever had. At Rancho de Castro back in 1970. Hot beer and disgusting! Yeck!
Here is a partial list:


Bohemia
Carta Blanca
Casta
Chihuahua
Corona Extra
Corona Light
Estrella
Indio
Le?n Negra
Light Modelo
Modelo Especial
Montejo
Negra Modelo
Noche Buena
Pac?fico
Sol
Superior
Tecate
Tecate Light
Victoria
XX (Dos Equis)
XX (Dos Equis Lager)
XXX (Tres Equis)

Sharkbaja

Baja Bernie - 6-5-2005 at 02:48 PM

You got the right one on the top--Bohemia is far and away the best--at least in my book

Dave - 6-5-2005 at 02:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Sharksbaja
Tres XXXs was the worst beer I ever had. At Rancho de Castro back in 1970. Hot beer and disgusting! Yeck!
Here is a partial list:


Bohemia
Carta Blanca
Casta
Chihuahua
Corona Extra
Corona Light
Estrella
Indio
Le?n Negra
Light Modelo
Modelo Especial
Montejo
Negra Modelo
Noche Buena
Pac?fico
Sol
Superior
Tecate
Tecate Light
Victoria
XX (Dos Equis)
XX (Dos Equis Lager)
XXX (Tres Equis)


Maybe that's why they no longer make XXX.:biggrin:

I would add:

TJ beers...lager and dark &
Mexicali

Also:
XX is a lager....sorta, they also make XX amber.

IMO Casta beers are the best.

Where can I find Leon Negra?

Oso - 6-5-2005 at 05:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave

Where can I find Leon Negra?


It's Leon Negro (otherwise it would be Leona Negra) and it's from Yucatan. You'd find it in Merida, Cancun, Cozumel. Maybe a classy licor store could order some for you.

I actually liked XXX (Oscuro), reminded me of an Irish Stout.

xxx

Sharksbaja - 6-5-2005 at 05:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Oso
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave

Where can I find Leon Negra?


It's Leon Negro (otherwise it would be Leona Negra) and it's from Yucatan. You'd find it in Merida, Cancun, Cozumel. Maybe a classy licor store could order some for you.

I actually liked XXX (Oscuro), reminded me of an Irish Stout.

I think they put horse pee in there or something or maybe it was in the heat too long but man it was bad....

Braulio - 6-5-2005 at 06:48 PM

Next time I order a Modelo Negra I think I'll ask for a Modela Negra - and see what I get.

Actually the negra part is modifying "cerveza" not Le?n or Modelo - at least that's the way it sounds to me.

Oso - later on - in the language Topics I'll send you a link to an enertaining article by a guy in Venezuela dealing with gender - it's kind of long - but I think you'll get a kick out of it - if you like academic type humor.

What the heck - here it is:

http://www.analitica.com/bitblioteca/roberto/genero.asp



[Edited on 6-6-2005 by Braulio]

lemons limes

jerry - 6-5-2005 at 07:00 PM

the reason the put lemons or lime in the beer is the same reason the english are called limeys its a carry over from the old salling shipps it took solong to get to where they were going the the food rotted and the carried limes abord to stop the scurvy

seeing the nonreturnable beer bottles broken all over the beaches streets roadway and ditches makes me think that the long neck returnables are something that mexico should have stayed with its only going to get worse besides if the prices in baja keep going up i might need to go collecting bottles lol

jerry - 6-5-2005 at 07:02 PM

dang the only thing worse them my spelling is my typing

comitan - 6-5-2005 at 07:32 PM

Only at christmas time can you buy Noche Buena I think it is the best of all the mexican beers.

A-OK - 6-5-2005 at 08:59 PM

One thing is for sure... all the other mexican beers should follow Carta Blanca with the bottle opener under every bottle.:yes:

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 08:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Braulio
Next time I order a Modelo Negra I think I'll ask for a Modela Negra - and see what I get.

Actually the negra part is modifying "cerveza" not Le?n or Modelo - at least that's the way it sounds to me.
[Edited on 6-6-2005 by Braulio]


One right, one wrong. I am ready to bet a case of same on this (or Guinness to make it easy on you). It's Negra Modelo because it's made by Cerveceria Modelo (Which also makes Modelo Especial, which sux.) so, in that instance, negra does modify the "cerveza" made by Modelo.

Howsomever, it's Le?n Negro because "Black Lion" is the brandname of the beer, as illustrated by the logo, which is, in fact, a black lion.

Bet?

Baja Bernie - 6-6-2005 at 08:31 AM

It just don't pay to cross verbal swords with the Bear.

Arthur - 6-6-2005 at 01:25 PM

I agree about Noche Buena. Mmmm-mmm.

But -- just in case someone gets confused -- scurvy didn't have anything to do with rotten food. It's caused by lack of Vitamin C.

Steve in Oro Valley - 6-6-2005 at 01:35 PM

OK OSO:

Why is it EL GATO PANTERA? Should it not be El Gato Pantero? Actually I know the reason.


Steve in Oro Valley

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 05:08 PM

No way I'm going to bet you about beer, guns, or pickups Oso - besides - I already owe you - (thanks for the book man).

Actually you could have got me for like 1 1/2 out of 2 - Modelo Negra is an ale not a beer - gender happens to be the same but as long as we're being culeros......

I'm not familiar with Le?n Negra beer - but I've mostly heard the Negra(o)associated with it used in the the feminine - maybe that's because I hang around a lower class than you. Or maybe not ....

Any way wey - the bet's off - but I'd still like to see your hand.

Culero pomposo K soy.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 05:09 PM

Well, here we get into the fascinating area of exceptions. Every rule has them and as Braulio's link points out, the gender of nouns in Spanish does not rely on their biological sex or lack thereof.

While there are gatas and gatos there are no panteros, only panteras both macho (male) and hembra (female).

For that matter, as much as Braulio may have been wishing that Tara Banks would join him at his table (en tus sue?os, wey), there is no such word as modela. So I should have said one wrong and one half right. The name Cerveceria Modelo literally means "Model (as in exemplary) Brewery". The name of the beer is Negra Modelo, not Modelo Negra or Modelo Negro or Modela Negra or Negro Modelo. "Modelo" modifies "Negra", not the other way around. So the name could be translated as the model dark one (dark beer) or the dark one by Modelo (the brewery). The reason I'm using dark instead of black is because in English we say dark beer, not black beer. In Spanish it doesn't make any difference.

Remember, it's la mano, el mapa etc. Don't rely on the a or o ending.

The end of this thread ought to be cut off and moved to the Spanish forum and Pablo's last post there moved here.

BTW, there is a very good movie called "The Ballad of Gregorio Cortez" based on an incident in New Mexico when an incompetent interpreter caused a small war and the deaths of several people because of his ignorance of the word "caballo". A herd of horses both male and female can be called caballos in plural. But one "caballo" is always male (even a gelding). There is no such word as "caballa". If you want to specify a female horse, the word is "llegua" (mare).

[Edited on 6-7-2005 by Oso]

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 05:29 PM

I thought you were smarter than that Oso - we're talking about beer and you want to drag the DRAE* into the argument.

I just ran a google @ google.com.mx - I got 252 hits on "Leon Negra" with cerveza - and I got like 10 (actually I forgot - but it's low) on "Leon Negro" with cerveza. Virually all of the "Le?n Negro" hits refered to things other than the beer we're talking about ( like the country - or restaurants named the Blcak Lion and such).

It'd seem that most of Mexico is confused about how to order one of it's beers - are you like related to JR or something?

*BTW - The DRAE = a dictionary published by a group of old kooks in a dark room in Spain.

And as far as Tara Banks goes - you're wrong again - we're actaully pretty tight - I'm just not at liberty here to explain.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 05:45 PM

Again - Lecho - Oso is refering to something out of the DRAE - not the way people in Mexico speak the language.

Anyone who has watched television in Mexico would know that the usage I used (vis-a-vis modela) is comon usage in Mexico.

And ?guila is spelled with a q - sometimes - by some mexicans.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 05:45 PM

Yeah, right...

:rolleyes:

Anyway, the bet may have ended in a draw. It appears that the Le?n Negro of my youthful Carribean days, in the short dark glass bottle with the stylized Black Lion logo, no longer exists.

It seems to have been bought out by Modelo and the bottle, label and name changed. It's still a dark Munich style beer, but now it's just plain "Leon", prefaced by "Cerveza Negra".

http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/marcas/leon.html

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 05:48 PM

"Wey" is Braulio's spelling.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 05:50 PM

If your idea of a draw is when you lose on all counts then yeah - it's a draw wey.

Damn - I wish we could get folks like ferna and Jesse to participate more in stuff like this - anything WE say is kind of like qualified in some way - it'd be nice to get some horse's mouth's involved here.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 05:51 PM

"Esposa ejemplar" and "esposa modelo" would be interchangeable.

And yes, Mexico is a full of bad spellers as this board, certainly an excellent reason to follow their example.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 05:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Braulio
it'd be nice to get some horse's mouth's involved here.


Yeah, you already got the other end covered.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 05:57 PM

Sure you want to go there dude?

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 06:03 PM

And another thought Oso - no - it's not a matter of mexicans being poor spellers - it's the way they speak their language.

In fact that's why the old men in the dark room in Spain have been allowing more Latin American contributions than in the past.

Eventually the definition of modela will be expanded - probably about the time it becomes obsolete.

BTW - Another fact - the majority of the habitantes of the Iberian Peninsula speak spanish as a second language - that's why the whole idea of the Academy makes so much sense.

[Edited on 6-7-2005 by Braulio]

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 06:06 PM

http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/marcas/negramodelo.html


Yes, modelo can be either adjective or noun. A "modelo modelo" would be a model model i.e.; an exemplary model.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 06:08 PM

So - Bernie - did you get enough bang for your buck on your topic?

It's been fun.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 06:09 PM

I have no defense for the DRAE or the Frog equivalent, they're silly old pedos fighting a losing battle. But "modela" is not yet in any dictionary and I disagree that it's common usage yet. I think you're just hearing it wrong.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 06:16 PM

Grammar - even at high levels - is flexible - in the end about anytime you can make a reasonable argument for something you're entitled to stand your ground.

For example in Esposa modelo it'd be necessary to carry the feminine form of the adjective in order to avoid ambiguity.

(yeah - i know - Esposa isn't the adjecvital form - but it is - because it was just used that way)

At least that's what I would swear to.

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 06:18 PM

Run a google on modela on google.com.mx. - Or better yet - turn on the tele.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 06:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
Originally posted by Oso
"Esposa ejemplar" and "esposa modelo" would be interchangeable.


How's that work grammatically? There is no listing for modelo as an adjective...

--Larry

[Edited on 6-7-2005 by lencho]


Yes there is. What dictionary are you looking in? It's actually the first meaning listed in my LaRousse:

modelo adj inv model; es una ni?a modelo she is a model child; empresa modelo model company.

when I first started posting

fdt - 6-6-2005 at 06:29 PM

in the amigos or freds I used ferna de tijuana and everyone thought ferna was a girl, when it's short for fernando. As for esposa modelo, it is correct to use it, but I'm yet to meet one ;) , so the word negra referes to the model that in this case is a beer, that is cerveza, that would be femenine. I have a lot of fun with Mrs. ferna when she starts talking spanish (she has learned a lot) she thought "no tire basura" meant don't throu tires on the road. And the times that one would use modela is when you are using the verb modelar (to model), yo modelo, tu modelas el modela etc.

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 06:37 PM

Well, hello dere Ferna. Yes I was about to retract my statement about "no such word" as modela. It is indeed the 3rd person singular of the verb modelar. Braulio's google suggestion brought up some VERY interesting sites...:O

*There was one called "Modela la Modelo", meaning "The model models"

As for the tele, Don Francisco is always saying "Que venga la modelo" on Sabado Interminable".

[Edited on 6-7-2005 by Oso]

Dave - 6-6-2005 at 07:00 PM

So, now it's OK to go to the classy liquor store and ask for Leon Negra?

Braulio - 6-6-2005 at 07:09 PM

Dave - you and Bajalera are like folks that drive real slow on the freeway - never had an acident - but cause thousands.

Dave - 6-6-2005 at 07:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Braulio
Dave - you and Bajalera are like folks that drive real slow on the freeway - never had an acident - but cause thousands.


Maybe I should change my handle. How about Mr Magoo?

Oso - 6-6-2005 at 07:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
]

That's pretty funny-- it ain't in MY LaRousse at all (as an adjective): Gran diccionario de la Lengua Espanola, Larousse, Barcelona 2001, 1851 pages. I THOUGHT it to be pretty complete.

So, even Larousse can't make up its mind.

Is yours by chance published in Mexico? Maybe mine is following the Academia stodges...

--Larry


Yep, mine (unabridged 1547 pages) was printed in Chilangolandia. (BTW, there is a Chilango Beer, although I've never tried it.) It doesn't say when, but I got it in 2000. I picked it precisely because it claimed "generous coverage of Latin American Spanish". I do not own a DRAE and have only mild curiosity about strictly Iberian usage, mostly just for etymological research. I have never wanted to sound like a gachupin. Unfortunately, some of my chuntaro friends here on the border think I sound a bit like a chilango:no:

Gato fight or is it gata?

Gypsy Jan - 6-6-2005 at 08:01 PM

Whatever,

I just love that you guys are arguing about feminine gender issues.

Ferna is no muchacha!

David K - 6-6-2005 at 08:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fdt
in the amigos or freds I used ferna de tijuana and everyone thought ferna was a girl, when it's short for fernando.

forgive me

eetdrt88 - 6-6-2005 at 08:32 PM

but i'm to hammered to understand how this thread turned from beer talk to.....well,actually i dont know what the hell it turned into but it sure is funny:lol:

Lencho

fdt - 6-6-2005 at 10:06 PM

I think it's M?-puchi not mepuchi, but you can also use puchi-m?. M? is typical BCS mostly La Paz, also used with m?-veras or just M? and puchi is more pronunced like push? used instead of puta, like in puchi no or hijuepuchi. Or just go for it all and say me-verajelijuepuchi pariente.:tumble:

Braulio - 6-7-2005 at 06:17 AM

...but ferna...you must be mistaken...I can't find that in my LaRousse.

Thanks for showing up man - you are the master here.

Braulio - 6-7-2005 at 06:35 AM

...and Oso...go (again) to google.com.mx...click on p?ginas en espa?ol - search modela with an article - "una modela" or "la modela"...and then tell me that modela isn't used in the context I described - amongst others.

No - you ain't going to find it in LaRousse - but you'll hear it in conversation all the time.

eetdrt88

Baja Bernie - 6-7-2005 at 06:37 AM

Hey guy, I agree with you.

I think they are in a contest to see who's book is bigger and badder.

Salute! Otra Mas!

Any bets on the winner?

Oso - 6-7-2005 at 07:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Braulio
...and Oso...go (again) to google.com.mx...click on p?ginas en espa?ol - search modela with an article - "una modela" or "la modela"...and then tell me that modela isn't used in the context I described - amongst others.

No - you ain't going to find it in LaRousse - but you'll hear it in conversation all the time.


I did exactly that and the first couple of pages of either search came up with modela as a verb or the brandname of a product on an English site, except for one page on the "neoliberal model" regarding poverty in Peru.

But hey, if you just gotta use it as a noun, do what you like. A mi me vale ma'. If you can read the label on the bottle, we've established that the name of the beer is NEGRA MODELO, which is what got us on this track in the first place. Someday maybe I'll find a picture of the old-style Leon Negro from Yucatan. Meanwhile if Dave wants to look for it in a classy licor, he'll have to ask for plain Leon.

If you're by SLRC anytime soon, come by for a michelada. I've still got some MODELO ESPECIAL in the fridge. :barf:

Well, it was the only thing on sale last week, but if you add enough Clamato it almost kills the taste.


BTW, I rarely use just google. Dogpile is much better, it pulls from google, yahoo and others at the same time.

turtleandtoad - 6-7-2005 at 03:59 PM

You guys have me shell-shocked. I tuned in expecting to read about Mexican beer and ended up wearing out my spanish dictionary.

I could have sworn that this was the "General Baja Discussion" forum, not the "Spanish as a second language" forum. Did I go astray somewhere?

Baja Bernie - 6-7-2005 at 04:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
Originally posted by turtleandtoadI could have sworn that this was the "General Baja Discussion" forum, not the "Spanish as a second language" forum. Did I go astray somewhere?


To give this some perspective, more folks in Baja speak Spanish than drink beer. Mmmm, wonder if that's really true...? ;>

--Larry


Perhaps, But I'm sure that more people on this forum drink beer than speak Spanish.

David K - 6-7-2005 at 05:37 PM

I'm drinking a Dos Equis, right now! (or) Tomando una Dos Equis, horita!

Oso - 6-7-2005 at 06:58 PM

Ahora se trata de lo esencial.

Oso - 6-7-2005 at 07:01 PM

This entire thread has always been about the beer if one was paying attention. Of course that may have been increasingly difficult if one were consuming more of the latter while trying to follow the former.:lol:

Another for the list

Dave - 6-8-2005 at 07:11 PM

Found a new beer in TJ today.

Potro- a porter, full bodied and slightly sweet. Made in Guanajuato. Excellent!

Packoderm - 6-8-2005 at 09:15 PM

Dave, which store in TJ had the porter? Is the price ok? I'd plan a trip just for the porter. I just love Sierra Nevada's porter. I also like their stout.

About Leon Negra, the last time I tried it about 2 years ago, it seemed lighter than I remembered. Maybe it'll be more widely available under Modelo.

I especially like Belekin stout, however, my sister made a trip to placencia this year and said the place is pretty much gone as far as how cool it used to be. Sometimes I feel lucky to make it to a place before it goes, but it also makes me a bit sad. Onward and upward I guess.

Dave - 6-8-2005 at 10:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Packoderm
Dave, which store in TJ had the porter? Is the price ok? I'd plan a trip just for the porter.


It's called Bodega la Playa. On eleventh street (Elias Calles) about six blocks east of Revolution, north side of street. It's about 20 pesos for a 500 ml bottle. While you're there check out the tequila selection AND the Cuban/South American rums. Best selection in TJ. THEN:

Head south on Fundadores to the TJ brewery. Great unfiltered beer on tap!

Corona Lovers

Baja Bernie - 6-9-2005 at 11:55 AM

The secret is out of the bottle. Corona uses an additive made from seaweed (kelp) in their beer. Source Union Tribune 6-9-05 page C-1. Could that have a bearing on the smell????:lol: