BajaNomad

Baja 1000 hi jacking

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Dave - 11-23-2007 at 02:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
One can only hope.


On this, we disagree.

It's how Mexico got into this mess. One little "bite" at a time. Solving it will require a moral course correction. Anything less is window dressing.

BajaNomad - 11-23-2007 at 03:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave
It's how Mexico got into this mess. One little "bite" at a time.
Reminds me of the adage (here in reverse) of how to complete a large project....

Question: How do you eat an elephant?

Answer: One bite at a time.

(reference)

What we may be seeing is the current enormity of a "project" built through time "bite" by "bite" that has now become the "elephant in the room" (reference).

--
Doug

Wingnut - 11-23-2007 at 03:22 PM

I have read this thread with some concern. It appears that there is a major issue with police corruption, drug cartels and general banditos in the Tijuana area. I really don't see how it will get cleaned up until the Mexican government steps in. It is only after the Federal police from other areas are sent in by the President of Mexico, that corruption gets flushed out for a while. If all Nomads want to help solve this issue we have to push for the Tourism group and all local business entities to start a campaign to clean this up. Believe me, if something isn't done, people will start doing what they have always done in the past, they will arm themselves and that is something that Mexico does not want to see happen. Open warfare on the roads would not benefit anyone but the tourists aren't going to stop coming too soon and more problems can be expected. Bajalou's post is great, if Nomads can get citizens with connections to speak up, something might get accomplished. Good luck to us all!

carlo - 11-23-2007 at 05:38 PM

In the last 4 months there have been about 6 car jackings in the baja headlines. They've all been between midnight and 6am. Don't drive through TJ in the middle of the night. Especially if your vehicle screams I've got money.

baja829 - 11-24-2007 at 12:13 AM

My husband and I drive from Mexicali South to just above Puertecitos at least 4 times a month, generally after dark. Have never had a problem, always felt safe and are leaving again in the morning, returning after dark -- hopefully holiday travelers will discourage possible problems. We've done this for years, but always advise family and friends not to do so = seems as if we should begin to follow our own advice.

This is much food for thought and so sad for anyone to have to stop coming here== wonder what will happen on this side as the highway continues South to Chapala over the next 2 yrs.

Bajafun777 - 11-24-2007 at 12:29 AM

baja829, have always driven from Mexicali to San Felipe after work and into the night with no problem also. Have only heard of a few times that the tourist have been robbed by dirtbags on this road to San Felipe. It happen about three years ago and federal and state police started rolling on these roads a few arrests made and no more robberies. Knock on wood it seems the road that direction is not a problem but less roads to run away if cops got after you, so T.J. is still the best chance for these dirtbags. A strong boycot of Baja might be the thing to turn the situation around, no pain no gain, let Mexico not be held accountable and it will only continue until someone dies. Later========bajafun777

Pescador - 11-24-2007 at 08:44 AM

In nature, the wolves prey on large packs of animals like deer and elk but stay on the perimeters and attack the weak, sick and non-functional members. They are never strong enough to hit the center of the herd.

The only problem is that we (meaning the people who come to baja) are not a very organized pack or group. We have surfers, fishermen, desert race enthusiasts, travelers, campers, back road 4 wheel enthusiasts, and who knows what else. Even on this board it is apparent that we have liberals, conservatives, libertarians, and a hodge podge of who knows what else. When this topic arose and someone suggested that we start writing letters even those naysayers were doubting the effectiveness of that project. So our very diversity, which should be a strength, has split us into factions of seperateness that makes us a weaker force to reckon with.

I don't have the answer, but I do know that if there was something that we could rally around "LIKE OUR OWN SAFETY AND WELLBEING" when traveling in Mexico that if we were united and vocal that it would come to the attention of the proper people who do have the power to get something done. But perhaps it is easier to do nothing, slink in and out of Mexico during the daytime light and hope that nothing happens. It is only hopeless if we allow it to be so in our minds.

hIjacking

awfulart - 11-24-2007 at 03:44 PM

Perhaps if we all called or e mailed Roger Hedgec-ck at
KOGO Radio in San Diego it might get on the air. Roger also has a national program, syndicated, on Saturdays. It is worth a try particularly if he would mention the situation on his National program. Roger has always been at the forefront of those that believe illegal immigration IS ILLEGAL!!:light:.

dccf - 11-24-2007 at 11:42 PM

Rick Rogers has a show on San Diego 760AM from 5:00AM to 10;00AM weekday mornings. He has featured the two most violent incidents and interviewed the BP Supevisor in the last couple of days. He sounds irate enough to the help us stay headied in the right direction.

Also, I suggested we contact Donald Trump and was told he doesn't care at all about us. Maybe it's time to think again about telling him all those customers he sold Ensenada condos to in San Diego last week will have to run the gauntlet to see their "property".

wornout - 11-25-2007 at 08:54 PM

Maybe SCORE should talk with the powers that be in Ensenada, about pulling the three races out of Baja, to get some Politicos to put some pressure on eliminating this hijacking situation. It is not a lot of tourist money to all of Mexico but it is a lot of tourist money to Baja.

Hijacking

awfulart - 11-26-2007 at 07:47 AM

Todays issue of the North County Times (San Diego) has an article on the front page detailing some of the incidents. It appears to reflect some of the info already on this thread.

hijacking

awfulart - 11-26-2007 at 07:51 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by awfulart
Todays issue of the North County Times (San Diego) has an article on the front page detailing some of the incidents. It appears to reflect some of the info already on this thread.



link to the N.C. Times is: http://www.nctimes.com/

The Sculpin - 11-26-2007 at 07:54 AM

If you bring in Hedgec-ck and Roberts into this, you taint the issue with their own personal demagoguery. I would advise to let the issue stand on its own and not bring it into the illegal alien debate. There are many people on a national level that feel that these two only play at the fears of the nation, and you wouldn't want these real and serious issues to be written off as just another example. Better to work with those who can actually do something about it.

awfulart - 11-26-2007 at 08:28 AM

Sculpin might be correct but on the other hand perhaps he might be wrong. I guess we must form our own opinion . However, name calling generally solves nothing.

RD55 - 11-26-2007 at 10:38 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
Maybe somebody should remind them.......


Mission

UNITED STATES BORDER PATROL
SAN DIEGO SECTOR

TO ENFORCE THE RULE OF LAW ALONG THE BORDER, WHILE ENHANCING THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THE PEOPLE WE PROUDLY SERVE.

WE VALUE:

PROFESSIONALISM

We strive toward the highest standard of ethical conduct.

HUMAN LIFE

We value human life and seek a safe environment for all.

INTEGRITY

We value honesty and integrity; always remaining loyal to the mission of the Service.

TRUST

We hold ourselves accountable in the performance of our duties to create and maintain an environment of trust.

SHARED EFFORT

We value ourselves, our community, and working together to solve issues of mutual concern.

Commissioned by the Agents and the Staff of San Diego Sector


-------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally posted by Woooosh
...

I think people try to report these incidents at the border like this family did- but what you hear from the US Border Patrol is "you basically asked for it by going down there in the first place". They blame the victim and do nothing to help (the "go to macdonalds for help" attitude has to stop!).

...


Just to set the record straight. The agency at the Port of Entry is U.S. Customs. The U.S. Border Patrol is the agency looking for people sneaking across the border in the hills between ports of entry.

---------------------------

On another note, this is one of the best threads about safety in Baja I've read on any forum. To all who've posted - thanks.

tripledigitken - 11-26-2007 at 11:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by wornout
Maybe SCORE should talk with the powers that be in Ensenada, about pulling the three races out of Baja, to get some Politicos to put some pressure on eliminating this hijacking situation. It is not a lot of tourist money to all of Mexico but it is a lot of tourist money to Baja.



I think this suggestion has legs. With some of the racers being victims themselves Score should be dealing with the issue already. Anyone here have Sal's ear?

Ken

toneart - 11-26-2007 at 11:35 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by The Sculpin
If you bring in Hedgec-ck and Roberts into this, you taint the issue with their own personal demagoguery. I would advise to let the issue stand on its own and not bring it into the illegal alien debate. There are many people on a national level that feel that these two only play at the fears of the nation, and you wouldn't want these real and serious issues to be written off as just another example. Better to work with those who can actually do something about it.


Yes! This shouldn't be a political issue. Those particular broadcasters could get the word out, but they could also diffuse the impact by wrapping this issue in their larger agenda. If they were to responsibly report this issue as a stand-alone, I would be for giving it to them.

As Pescador said, we are a cross section of people and interests and need to band together in this.

Hook - 11-26-2007 at 11:52 AM

Wouldn't it make sense for us to enlist the support of the State Department in the US and the equivalent Canadian entity? I mean, arent they THEORETICALLY interested in the safety of their citizens abroad.

I dislike the Hedgec-ck/Roberts idea as they will find a way to make this issue divisive............if only for ratings. That's the nature of their business.

I'd say an organized effort through that umbrella business organization in San Diego that is involved with a TJ business organization is the way to go. Get THEM to approach the State Depts. about this issue. Cant remember the name of the group but I think they were involved in cancelling a proposed SANDAG meeting in TJ a couple years ago when the safety of the group could not be guaranteed by the TJ police.

Of course, these business groups would never countenance a boycott but at least this could yield high visibility on the situation with no divisive axe to grind.

BajaWarrior - 11-26-2007 at 06:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Roberto
All the talk about boycotts from folks like the ones on Baja Nomad and letters to Vincent Bond, etc will amount to nothing. There is no political will to do anything about this in Mexico - if we haven't figured that out by now, we never will.

HERE is the kind of thing that MIGHT, truly, have an effect:

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36312

When race teams like the McMillins start talking about not racing in Mexico any longer, I imagine folks like Sal Fish might start to pay attention. If the threat of the Baja races coming to a close or not attracting the high-end teams they do today doesn't do it, nothing will.


Still wondering what happend to the Weekend Warrior trailer they had to leave behind that belonged to Andy McMillan?

Anyone heard more details?

[Edited on 11-27-2007 by BajaWarrior]

Hook - 11-26-2007 at 06:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaWarrior
Quote:
Originally posted by Roberto
All the talk about boycotts from folks like the ones on Baja Nomad and letters to Vincent Bond, etc will amount to nothing. There is no political will to do anything about this in Mexico - if we haven't figured that out by now, we never will.

HERE is the kind of thing that MIGHT, truly, have an effect:

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36312

When race teams like the McMillins start talking about not racing in Mexico any longer, I imagine folks like Sal Fish might start to pay attention. If the threat of the Baja races coming to a close or not attracting the high-end teams they do today doesn't do it, nothing will.


Still wondering what happend to the Weekend Warrior trailer they had to leave behind that belonged to Andy McMillan?

Anyone heard more details?

[Edited on 11-27-2007 by BajaWarrior]


A new taco stand in Rosarito?

Tacos Cartelos?

Dont order the cabeza.............:o

DENNIS - 11-26-2007 at 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hook
[Dont order the cabeza.............:o


Ohhhh jeeeezo......

BajaWarrior - 11-26-2007 at 07:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by soulpatch
This is a horrible deal..... I just got back from a 10 day-er w/my family and we turned it into a two day trip north based on daylight hours.
This will cancel our Christmas time trip based soley on that and we will spend our time and money this side of the border when daylight hours are at a premium.
We also took FDT's free road advice north today. It was fine and the border was ****** as usual. 85 minutes after getting re-routed but what is new these days. I will not travel the northern part of the toll road any time of day anymore because I really don't see the transition to 24/7 robberies and mayhem being that big of a leap. Continued success builds expanding confidence.......
Is the transition from what is occurring now to rape and murder really that big?
I know I won't take that chance w/my family. Is that prudence or fear? I don't really care at this point.


No, your smart, and being sensible. I can't tell you what is going through my head regarding my family's safety and how that makes me feel. I'd hate to throw in the towel though, I have enjoyed Baja for over 30 years now.

[Edited on 11-27-2007 by Hose A]

dccf - 11-26-2007 at 11:03 PM

Grover,

Do you really feel that blue?

elgatoloco - 11-27-2007 at 08:04 AM

At the risk of hijacking this thread, that would have been a fun recital to have witnessed! The King of the Blues. :dudette:

David K - 12-3-2007 at 05:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
The part that I am most concerned about is:

"The customs and immigration folks were less than helpful and even less sympathetic to our situation. While they did let us walk into the US they would not let us use their phone, bathroom nor have a drink of water. They directed us to the McDonald’s for assistance."

Maybe you could get Vince to be a regular on this board, or at least look at it once in a while.


Here is what I just posted on the Baja News Forum (and Vince said sorry, but he would not be joining Baja Nomad... far too busy with his work load now, but thanks):

After Bajaguy posted the contact info for Vincent Bond (in the Baja 1000 hijacking thread by Frank), I posted that I would deliver the print out of the thread to him, at home...

Vince Bond is the public affairs officer for CBC (Customs & Border Patrol) office in San Ysidro...

Today was his first day back from vacation and after he read my letter and attached copy of the thread about what happened to the Baja 1000 (Chris Hall) family, he found plenty of emails waiting for him at work today!

Many of the emails demanded that the CBC do something to stop the crime IN MEXICO! Mexico is an independent country and the U.S. border patrol or customs personal have NO authority there... Naturally all of us Baja Nomads should already know this, so I will assume none of those emails came from any of you. CBC contact info is not to report problems in Mexico, but to report problems at the U.S. port of entry.

Vince told me that if something bad does happen to Americans while in Baja Ca, Mexico, the only U.S. government office they should and ought to contact is the U.S. Consulate in Tijuana... Their number is (664) 622-7400. From the U.S. add 011-52 before the other numbers. The email for the consulate to send your messages regarding problems to U.S. citizens that happen IN BAJA is consulartijuan@state.gov (Consular Tijuana, without the 'a' at the end of Tijuana).

About the possible apathy or disrespect the American victims received by the CBC officer at the U.S. port of entry: That is being investigated and should not have happened.

Vince told me that if anyone receives less than professional treatment by one of our officers you can ask to speak to a supervisor. The officer's last name is on a name tag on his uniform for you to note.

You also can request a 'Comment Card' that you can mail in if you would like to comment on the actions of a CBC officer.

The Baja 1000 family could have used the public restroom... but after I asked about the distance to the McDonald's restaurant being a great distance away to walk, Vince said it was quite close to their facility, like next door. Again, he has not talked with that officer.

My letter to Vince, the Baja Nomad thread (as it appeard that day) have been faxed to Washington D.C. for further processing about the possible mistreatment to the Hall family of El Cajon. Vince also contacted the consulate in Tijuana with these details and the emails that should have gone to there instead of his inbox.
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