things most white people don't understand.
This is mostly for Germanicus but it's for everyone.
People that are of color are a lot more in tune with these things although, it is still pretty much a mystery to them as well.
But, they are aware of them and realize there is something to them and use them to the best of their ability.
We as whites, have a lot to learn from these (primitive) alternative ideas rather than keeping our minds closed and denying they exist.
When it comes to moving to Mexico, many of these people practise a lot of "ancient" techniques.
But, they only use them because they work. Not because they are trying to impress their friends.
A funny thing happened when I was setting up the bamboo park. My plants kept getting rearranged. This was because I had planted them in the wrong
places.
Flaco knew, the locals knew, but I had no idea. Sometimes, I only missed by a couple feet but I just didn't understand the entire "scheme" of
things. I still don't. But, I'm trying to learn.
And then, other plants would show up that "needed to be planted" for the tranquility, health aspects, and general good of the area.
I don't remeber the word for Feng Shui in Spanish but it came as a surprise that the hill people are very much aware of it. I thought that was an
asian thing.
The stars are their basis for growing, planting, which crops to use which years, and a huge part of their lives.
The witchcraft I have already written a little about but that will be continued. Suffice it to say, it is alive and well in Mexico.
The bamboo has incredible properties besides it's many commercial uses. That was forgotten about when the asians were trying to conquer the world.
We whites considered it something bad because of those that were already aware of it and using it, but because of prejudicial thinking, we have lost
out on the benefits of bamboo. Until now.
I think perhaps I spent a little too much time in Borneo and the Phillipines but one thing for sure, I do have a love for bamboo and an open mind.
You saw the first "new" idea with my truck rack. Just wait. What other's have been using and appreciating for thousands of years, we as whites
think of as a new thing.
Same with the rest of the title. I highly recommend listening to others rather than trying to teach our "modern" ways to them, especially if you
want success and en lightenup ment elgatoloco - 8-28-2004 at 10:53 AM
As Skeet would say "If it makes you feel good,do it!" Germanicus - 8-28-2004 at 11:28 AM
JR, as usual, we do have the same opinion about what you are saying.
The "colored" people do have mor knowledge about those things you are talking about.
That planting a certain plant dependends on the constellation of the stars to each other, is something, I do not believe.
Maybe out of other reasons it is better not to plant. i.e. when there is a lunar eclipse.
I agree, in those nights, don't plant anything as you can't see your own hand infront of your eyes and maybe you are running into a ditch.
But the stars are certainly not influencing our lifes.
That was my point.
No question that colored people do have more knowledge about ancient things.
But that is mostly because the white race has developed in a complete different way than the colored race.
Exeeptions even here.
Look at the Japanese.
The most modern country in the world > no doubt even more "civilized" than the U.S.
It is more the fact that the "colored" (look at the Siberians, Mongoles, Tibetians, and many Asians) did not had and have the opportunity to
"develope" in the way we did.
I put <"develope"> this way, as I am not sure if our way (the white peoples way) of development is the best development for our planet.
Isn't it the white race which is destroying this world the most.
Especially the Americans?
(Bush not accepting the Kioto treaty because he gives a damn chit what happens to the world after he's out of office / Look at the environmental
desaster in these United States.
Here in texas it is not better than in some parts of Baja > trash everywhere.
an old car? dump it in the backyard!
an old car-battery? we can use that one as weight for our fishing-throt-line.
fighting Mesquite in the pasture? the best way to do it is pooriong diesel to the Mesquite.
well, well, well, but I do know what you mean.
Germanicus
No offense, but fact remains fact.
No matter how the discussion ends.
You are crackin me up Man
jrbaja - 8-28-2004 at 11:37 AM
One thing I think for sure is that where you want to go in Baja, you will be pleasantly surprised when it comes to Baja being trashy.
I think some of the Brujas cast a spell and it all magically disappeared!
I guess they put it in Texas David K - 8-28-2004 at 06:41 PM
A note about plant cuttings and the moon...
Doc (Camp Gecko) asked me to obtain some pomegranate cuttings from Jose at San Borja, to plant at Gecko. I guess there is a very tasty variety at the
mission orchard. Jose consulted with the calendar as to what phase the moon was in before taking a cutting from the tree. Now I have taken cuttings
and grafted onto fruit trees, but never heard how the moon could affect the success of such activity! I told Doc that Jose was a little concerned as
it was not the perfect day for taking a cutting, but close enough I guess. Doc said the mountain people have many such superstitions.
Germanticus, please leave the politics to the off topic board. The Kyoto accord was just an attempt to have America pay out billions to solve mostly
other countries' problems, as usual. Now, I want an extra beer when we meet...!!! HA HA
full moon
thebajarunner - 8-28-2004 at 08:11 PM
Full moon means better visibility on a night hike and better views of the road while driving a Baja race road at night.
Otherwise, NOT!!!
As to your comment on Japan being the "most civilized in the world"
Obviously you have never spent much time there.
"whatever floats your boat, baby"
For me, good old Gringolandia, with all of its flaws, is still the most civilized.
Actually, I was staying in Rotenburg aub Tober, and thought it to be incredibly civilized, next day we visited Dachau...
NOT!!!!
Baja Arriba!!Gypsy Jan - 8-28-2004 at 08:42 PM
bajarunner,
You make a very valid point.
We have to leave what we are used to, in order to get a new perspective.
Regardless of where we are, there are areas of beauty and ugliness, but familiarity creates indifference and often contempt for how we perceive that
it is mismanaged.
I'm still looking for big answers about this, the only ones I have at this moment is love and care for your home the best you can and travel as much
as possible to wonderful places to get new ideas.
Runner
jrbaja - 8-28-2004 at 09:01 PM
have you ever "not raced" down the peninsula?
Giving out candy in a matter of seconds is cool but, there is a lot to be learned from these "hicks" other than feeling sorry for them and causing
dental problems.
And Jan, while you are in those "wonderful places", learning something different, feel free to help in any way that seems to apply. Like a stuck
truck for instance.
And as far as showing gratitude to your instructors, teach them that we pick up trash and are concerned about the environment, no matter who
thinks they can own it. They don't ! Mexitron - 8-28-2004 at 10:28 PM
In response to white people not having knowledge of the mystic traditions---our history is full of it....remember the Druids? The Cabalist
traditions in the Jewish culture, the Goddess cultures which dominated Europe for 50,000 years(until about 5,000 yrs. ago when they were subfucated by
the patriarchal Judeo-Christian-Muslim traditions), and the Wiccan cultural rites, which are still practiced today in many places in the United
States. However, most whites do not practice mysticism anymore. The Age of Reason(Newton and the mechanistic universe) combined with the Puritan
Ethic(which is alive and well today in the environmental movement) pretty well took the attention of the white cultures and even made them suspicious
of the mystic arts(remember the Salem witch trials?)
mysticism in western culture...
whitelight - 8-28-2004 at 11:42 PM
the mystical traditions in judaism are deep, ancient and fascinating....the kaballah is a complete cosmology of mysticism and numerology....
prague was a place also of great mystical study.....and of course... there is a resurgence of interest in kaballah today....
and thank goodness for the protective Golem....keeping the jews safe forever!
....of course....christianity is based on strong mystical teachings as well.....
and so are the fairy tales of western culture....filled with mysticism and enchantment....
...the teachings of carl jung...
keats, yeats, saint-exupery, celtic lore and writings...emerson..thoreau...
great western artists from hundertwasser to monet to klimt...redon...
composers like satie, ravel...debussy..
gregorian chanting....new age musics...
all around us are mystical traditions and their offspring....
one only needs to look at the religious works of da vinci to know that even in the western world of humanism and classicism...mysticism is indivisibly
at the heart of great art, artists and creation....
JR, you asked....
thebajarunner - 8-29-2004 at 02:03 PM
"have you never raced the peninsula??"
Well, sir, as a matter of fact, the racing was totally secondary to the commitment made by me and my family to the poorest of the poor in Baja
California.
Starting in 1972 we spent all of our Christmas, Easter and Thanksgiving vacations at our place within the compound at the Door of Faith Orphanage in
La Mision.
My kids thought that was the 'norm' for vacations.
In 1977 we took the extraordinary step of faith and took two 13 year old boys home to live with our family. Over the next 10 years we had a total of
4, all of whom lived with our family, as a part of our family, and to this day they call me Dad, my daughters are their sisters and their kids think I
am their grandpa...
It was a marvelous experience, fraught with more agonies and joys than any thing you could possibly imagine.
During that time we also spent extended times living at the orphanage, I had my family spend an entire Summer at Rancho Santa Marta, simply a life
experience.
We also helped to equip the little school in La Mision, which was woefully short of supplies.
When a swimmer died at Rosarito Beach I got a local med. supply company to donate a defibrillator to Dr. Fregoso, so that this might possibly be
avoided in the future. The only one in town, at the time.
We knew every kid, not only by name, but by their needs and their wants.
We also watched the gates close, from within, every evening, and we watched the typical big-hearted gringo dash down the road, back up to the storage
room, dump all the goods out of the back, hand out a bit of candy, and dash for Ensenada. And never hug a kid, and never get to know a name.
Ahhhhhh, yes JR, I did more than race.
Ask Bill Lawrence, at Santa Marta south of San Vicente, who has been his biggest backer, ask Bill who was responsible for that lovely 15 acre premium
fruit orchard in back of the complex.
And, while you are at it, ask my sons how they are giving back to a country that never gave them a chance.
Last week my boy Juan sat on my porch, and with tears in his eyes said, "Dad, in 10 years when the kids are gone we are moving back to Guadalupe to
start a place where kids can have a chance,"
And then, JR, it all starts being worthwhile.
Have a great day, Yeah, I did more than 'race the peninsula.'
Baja Arriba!!Natalie Ann - 8-29-2004 at 02:42 PM
Bajarunner -
Thanks for the excellent story of caring and sharing, and the dedication and discipline it takes. 'Tis said what you do comes back to you. Sounds
like you're already receiving those rewards.
My apologies for even wondering
jrbaja - 8-29-2004 at 04:13 PM
"Full moon means better visibility on a night hike and better views of the road while driving a Baja race road at night. "
I got the wrong impression.
Sounds like you are a wonderful family indeed!
Thanks...
thebajarunner - 8-29-2004 at 04:48 PM
Yeah, been an interesting life, to say the least.
And the ultimate irony, Teresa and I are celebrating our 10th anniversary next month and she does not like Baja... sigh!
I guess when you were raised in a house with a dirt floor, rats in the attic, pigs in the pen that adjoins the house and a road that stops two miles
short of home during the rainy season would turn anyone off.
She did promise to go see San Ignacio whales next Feb. We shall see.
Meanwhile, we give lots and lots of time to the less fortunate, working with a school in Puebla, a medical mission in the mountains of the
Philippines, etc.
33 years on the local Salvation Army Board in Modesto and 21 years on the National Board of the Salvation Army, we do our best.
Will be starting a new thread soon about finding a more "needy" orphanage in Baja to hook people up with.
More later
Baja Arriba!!
I may be able to help you out
jrbaja - 8-29-2004 at 06:20 PM
with one needy orphanage. They are awesome humans as well.
And it sounds as if you may have a lot in common.
Where in the Phillipines? I spent time in Baguio, Manila, Cagayan de Oro, and Hasaan.
Thank You BajaRunner
Skeet/Loreto - 8-30-2004 at 03:58 AM
Yes Runner.Words of Wisdom and Heart.
To be able to see the Light of the Eyes of a Child in need, and do somethng about it is the Ultimate act of Charity.
God Bless You and Yours!
Skeet/Loreto
"In God I Trust"jrbaja - 8-30-2004 at 09:49 AM
wilderone - 8-30-2004 at 10:30 AM
Hugs to you bajarunner - you're the kind of person who makes the world a better place.Germanicus - 8-30-2004 at 06:35 PM
JR, tell us , my wife is invoved, more about that pic > girl.
We are thinking about.....
Germanicus
How about this,
jrbaja - 8-30-2004 at 09:00 PM
here's her brother.
And, they have a lifestyle and parents that cannot be beat ! Anywhere on the planet !
What they need is school supplies and clothing.Germanicus - 8-31-2004 at 10:55 AM
To david K: leaving the p[olitics out of this thread is one thing and is agreed, but earnin an extra beer at our meeting is another challange:
Kyoto was NOT about money the US hav to pay.
Kyoto was the try of most of the worlds nations to get control of global warming.
Under the umbrella of the UN, signing the Kyoto treaty means to renounce / dispense certain gases etc in the country signing the treaty.
Our Commander of Stupidity did cancel the treaty because he was perssured from lobbyists. No money involved.
If you want to veryfy, go to: http://unfccc.int/resource/convkp.html
UNFCCC means United Nations Framework on Climate Control.
Nobody was asking the U.S. to spend money.
Just signing the treaty and helping to help the world.
But anyway, The U.S. are the world greatest singe polluter nation, but do not want to pay the biggest shunk to clean the world up.
Did I earn an extra beer now??
Germanicus wilderone - 8-31-2004 at 11:47 AM
A little off topic here, but could I ask you all to get ahold of the Sept. 04 National Geographic and read the global warming article. It will
astound you. http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0409/feature1/David K - 8-31-2004 at 05:41 PM
Just one volcanic eruption can produce more greenhouse gasses then all of man's leaking freon, hair sprays, and exhaust fumes... There are several
volcanic eruptions each year and there is still ozone overhead... Nature takes care of itself and FAR more powerful than mankind.
Global Warming and Global Cooling has been going on since time began and in no way can our tiny time on this planet (measuring temperatures) give us
the credentials to determin if what we have is normal or not normal. Since there was global warming (after the last ice age) long before factories and
automobiles, how can you blame anything like this on man?
In fact, as you see, it is blaming the United States that this nonesense is all about... The former communists, became socialists, became Greens and
the fringe left of the Democrat party all want to destroy capitalism which is what gives people hope and prosperity... why people come to America. Why
we are the last hope for a free world. Being like France or any socialist country is the LAST thing anyone who loves America should want...
Oh, the seven trash cans sounds lovely... more freedom lost to an oppressive government. Have you followed the seven trash trucks to their
destination? Wouldn't surprise me to see it all go to the same land fill! However, now you have seven times more government employees to manage your
trash... What is that tax rate in Europe??? Where do you live now???
That will be TWO extra beers my Arian friend!
So....
Tucker - 8-31-2004 at 05:51 PM
does that mean that we should all go stand in a volcano since we are going to die anyhow?Germanicus - 8-31-2004 at 06:33 PM
well David, you lost one beer again, because I'm not an Arien.
But don't you worry about two, five, seven or eleven beer.
We'll have enough.
G.wilderone - 9-1-2004 at 09:24 AM
Nature cannot take care of itself when human beings keep interfering at the rate they have been - especially in OUR generation. Only the past 30 years
or so has wreaked havoc on our planet. Only small fractions of our forests remain - most of cut in the past 50 years; how many billions of
automobiles have been spewing exhaust in the past 70 years? etc, etc. Learn the facts. Human beings have made a mess and it's time to clean it up.Mexitron - 9-1-2004 at 10:57 AM
As I posted somtime before, as far as CO2 goes, the US contributes very little, net, to the world's atmosphere, since we
1-are constantly cutting down forests and planting new ones(a cut tree is carbon taken out of the system and locked unless composted or burned. New
forests gobble up lots more Co2 than mature forests)
2-The eastern farmlands are returning to forest.
3-the advantage of the disposable society: anything carbon based(paper plates, wood, grass clippings, newspapers, etc.) thrown in a landfill is CO2
taken out of the system, since modern landfills are anaerobic. Ironically, the environmentalist today often religiously composts their refuse which
re-releases CO2 back into the system.
4-we use massive amounts of fertilizers on our crops leading to high rates of growth which also soaks up CO2.
Tests were done and written up in the Journal of Nature which corroberate this.
pappy - 9-1-2004 at 06:40 PM
out of dumbness and curiosity, what gas(if any) is released when i crack open a fresh Tecate??
Today
jrbaja - 9-2-2004 at 07:32 AM
I will be meeting with some brujas. Topic of conversation, casting spells on any who change the direction of my posts
Brujas
Natalie Ann - 9-2-2004 at 07:53 AM
Don't need to meet with some, JR, ya already know one.... and the force is with ya, amigo.
BTW - where are you? I thought you'd just left.
I'm at Tuckers
jrbaja - 9-2-2004 at 07:58 AM
Left Rosarito at 8:00am Tuesday. 1st stop pretzels in Ensenada, 2nd stop, bicycles in Maneadero, 3rd stop, met with Antonio in El Rosario for GPS
coordinates and stuff.
18 hours to Requeson for the night and then to La Paz yesterday. Early dinner ala Charles and a nights rest before trying to find Lera and then
down for mangos and bamboo.
bamboo rack survived the first 800 miles of (the baja)Bob H - 9-2-2004 at 08:16 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
18 hours to Requeson for the night ... bamboo rack survived the first 800 miles of (the baja)
JR, will be interested to know if any construction has started around Requeson. And, as far as the bamboo rack surviving... Audrey and I saw and
actually touched that rack - in our opinion it ain't going anywhere. Strong like bull!
Bob H Natalie Ann - 9-2-2004 at 08:19 AM
Given the load on that truck, you flew! Musta been that Mercury thing
Hi to Lera. Hi to Tucker. And leave a coupla mangos there for me, por favor.
JR, Gernanicus, and Mexitron
Baja Bernie - 9-4-2004 at 08:07 PM
I have been reading this thread for the past two days and have been wondering if I should chime in. JR started the post with some very good points
BUT it was soon hijacked by our German friend who began to show his 'lack' of green credientals by talking about destroying native plants in Texas by
flooding them with desiel and setting them on fire. In the next breath he castigates our President by claiming that he refused to sign the Kiote (his
spelling) treaty. Guess he has no way of knowing that the Congress approves Treaties in the United States and they rejected this one as did several
other major nations.
Mexitorn then came aboard with some very good references about knowledge around the world.
David K then suggested to our German friend that his poliitical statements should be placed on the 'off topic board' Germanicus agreed with this and
then continued to spew political statements here.
Sad! I also get angry when some unthinking individual hijacks a thread for his own purposes ( or he does not even realize that he is destroying a
very good, flowing conversation).
Anyway, We started started helping the kids without parents in La Mison in 1964 and as of 2004 we continue to help a kid with leukemia who we have
been helping since 1999. I call him Miguel Jordan and caress his bare head as I laugh with him. We have also helped support several kids through high
school and two through college.
We have been quietly proud of what we have done to help those people who helped us so much as we wandered through our 40 years in Baja.
Our friend as well as our relatives have shared with us their knowledge of herbs and other things that are less than what is normally accepted as
natural.
I would like to end my spiel with the statement that all people of all races and climes have the same basic knowledge of old cures and spells. AND
faith is what has always made them work. So sad that most of the white race, including Europeans, have rejected this knowledge and replaced it with
political slogans that have absolutely no value.David K - 9-4-2004 at 08:24 PM
Thank you Bernie... I hope self control or the moderators here keep the Baja forums about Baja and us Baja Nomads. I fear more politics will be
spilling over from the Off Topic forum as their desperation increases... I have not even gone to read that board in weeks (and probably won't until
the election is over).Natalie Ann - 9-4-2004 at 09:56 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Germanticus, please leave the politics to the off topic board. The Kyoto accord was just an attempt to have America pay out billions to solve mostly
other countries' problems, as usual.
I agree that politics belong on the off-topic board. However I would like to point out that David K got his shot in before bowing out of the
discussion.
Regarding witchcraft and bujas and the like... anyone been to La Candelaria? David K - 9-5-2004 at 01:32 AM
Yes Natalie, me bad, so sorry. I was providing balance, then closing the politics (I hoped) otherwise just the leftist side is heard. That is only
fair, isn't it?
There was a thread on La Candelaria... use Nomad search.
Bernie
jrbaja - 9-5-2004 at 11:13 AM
To mention "treaties" and the u.s. in the same sentence is a little scary. There may be some native Americans watching!
And as far as the rest of you nimrods, start yer own dang topics and leave mine alone!!elgatoloco - 9-5-2004 at 11:23 AM
OK, JR, I'm not hijacking your topic.... witchcraft is why I asked about La Candelaria. Previous thread posted by RandyMac (is he better yet?) after
he and I'd discussed it on Fred's board. We didn't get much new info either there nor here.
So I'm asking again. It's an area noted for cuanderos and herbal healings. (I believe they also make some beautiful black and white pottery there.)
Yet I can find no one who has been there. Seems odd.
I have often wanted to visit but have found most folks don't want to go. Old rumor was the locals were afraid of the brujas. This year I learned
that just beyond La Candelaria, at road's end, lies an area of haciendas which are stop-overs for drug smugglers. But again, this is all what I've
read or been told, and I wonder if anyone had any personal experience with the curanderos of La Candelaria or the town itself.
DavidK - Thanks for owning up to your part in the mild political foray.
Thanks Gato
jrbaja - 9-6-2004 at 06:52 AM
We used to go there when we lived i8n Valley Center. Very fun to stroll around through.
baja giving
midwifevicki - 9-8-2004 at 09:40 PM
Just read through this interesting communication. I would also like to know who and where are the baja kids that need help, school supplies, clothes
or whatever. Please let's here your suggestions, With specific advice about where and what is needed. Thanks
Helping kids
jrbaja - 9-9-2004 at 07:14 AM
OK, I give. More important than witches and bamboo are the kids.
Vicki, for the past two years, I have been taking supplies to the kids and mountain folks where the tourists don't go.
Most of the coastal communities benefit from tourism in one way or another. It's the rest of the people of Baja that I am concerned with.
I usually take school supplies, medicines, clothing, shoes, safety goggles, plastic tarps, mosquito repellants, tools, bicycles and any other usable
items destined for destruction.
I made it down here in the nick of time this year with repellants and lot's of em.
The mosquitos are becoming fierce as we speak so I guess we will know if this was a successful venture in a couple weeks. Let's hope we don't hear
anything about Dengue fever this year!!
For the coastal communities I would say that school supplies and medicines would be what I would take to them.
Given the load on that truck, you flew! Musta been that Mercury thing
