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Baja Air Taxi

gmata - 10-16-2011 at 04:29 PM

Hello guys,

I am currently going to school in Phoenix Az to become a commercial pilot, i finished my PPL last semester and i am now working on my Instruments, then Multiengine, commercial and finally Instructor.

My familiy lives in La Paz and i go there as much as i can. La Paz is my favorite place in the world so when i finish school i would like to stay around baja if possible.

One of the ideas i have maybe long term would be to start my own Air Taxi business from San Diego to La Paz, or other cities in baja.

My questions are....

Are there any companies currently operating an Air Taxi service from San Diego to Baja?

Would people be interested in this kind of Service?

Thanks for your time.

Pompano - 10-16-2011 at 05:22 PM

Yes, I'm interested in flights from Mulege - San Diego. I'll hire you to fly me from Mulege to San Diego ...around Nov 10th-11th.

Of course, it's all about dinero.

Would it be cheaper to buy my own taildragger? :rolleyes:

David K - 10-16-2011 at 05:33 PM

Im am sure there would be interest... but could you get the permit to do so?

BAJA AIR SERVICE (Capt. Francisco Muñoz) used to fly from Tijuana to Bahia de los Angeles, Mulege and Puerto Vallarta. Government run Aero Mexico shut him down (pulled his permits). Of course, this was 40 years ago! Ed Tabor of the Flying Sportsman Lodge in Loreto flew a DC-3 to Loreto until he was shut down by the government in the mid 1970's.

Dave - 10-16-2011 at 05:45 PM

I can't speak for everyone but I'd kinda like airplane pilots to have a bit of experience.

We don't mind if you want to practice on Pompano and DavidK, though. :rolleyes:

Udo - 10-16-2011 at 05:49 PM

The one with the strongest opinion on the subject is capt.mike. How about sending a U2U to him, gmata?

Curt63 - 10-16-2011 at 05:55 PM

If you are American, you can count on a very lengthy process to start a legitimate business in Mexico.

Congratulations and good luck.

gmata - 10-16-2011 at 07:12 PM

Thanks guys,

I am not saying i would be starting this right away i would first want to gain some experience flying for the airlines. Like i said this is a long term goal i have.

Interesting to hear about the government permits, hopefully things have changed. I have dual citizenship.

Pompano - 10-16-2011 at 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
I can't speak for everyone but I'd kinda like airplane pilots to have a bit of experience.

We don't mind if you want to practice on Pompano and DavidK, though. :rolleyes:

May your codpiece be the playground of a thousand mosquitoes.

Woooosh - 10-16-2011 at 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gmata
Thanks guys,

I am not saying i would be starting this right away i would first want to gain some experience flying for the airlines. Like i said this is a long term goal i have.

Interesting to hear about the government permits, hopefully things have changed. I have dual citizenship.

If what you need is help with expenses while you get some hours in why not just post a week or so out and see how many are interested? Not airfare- just chipping in for fuel. n That wouldn't take any permits, would it?

JESSE - 10-16-2011 at 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
I can't speak for everyone but I'd kinda like airplane pilots to have a bit of experience.

We don't mind if you want to practice on Pompano and DavidK, though. :rolleyes:

bonanza bucko - 10-17-2011 at 08:10 AM

I have been flying into and around Baja for 35 years. The Mexicans are VERY jealous of anyone carrying passengers for hire. They periodically demand that you have the same names on your flight plan and manifest going out of Mexico that you had going in...but, as with everything in Mexico, this changes a lot.

I know!! you are gonna have a very tough time setting up a charter or scheduled air service in Mexico if you are a Gringo and you can multiply that trouble by about 1000 if you think you're gonna fly people into the country and out of it.

But...flying in Mexico is a pure pleasure and the Mexican officials you meet at the airports are uniformly nice guys even though they have to enforce their laws. It's also nice to fly in a beautiful place without six different classifications of air space and the radar bureaucrats to enforce them. One is sometimes tempted to say "It's nice to fly in a free country!"

BB

David K - 10-17-2011 at 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
I can't speak for everyone but I'd kinda like airplane pilots to have a bit of experience.

We don't mind if you want to practice on Pompano and DavidK, though. :rolleyes:

Just wait until I do a restaurant review!!! :smug:

Pompano - 10-17-2011 at 09:11 AM

Restaurant? Does somebody here have a restaurant?? I was born hungry...who's got a good burger?

Skeet/Loreto - 10-17-2011 at 09:34 AM

Bucko says it right! I too flew in out and around Baja for 35 years.

I would suggest that along with your Airline Experience you purchase a Taildragger and start flying all over Baja, landing at any of the Short Strips that you can. Most of those strips have been closed off by the federales but a few are still open.

Next go to Bishop Calif and get one of the Mountain Pilots to give you some time around the mountains as well as get your Glider Certificate and sometime in a Glider.
Get sometime in the Sierra Wave Condition.

Getting as much time as you can in all types of heat and Wind conditions.

Finally get in touch with Miguel Isquerido in La Paz and ask him for help in getting a permit.

Skeet/Loreto

CortezBlue - 10-17-2011 at 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Im am sure there would be interest... but could you get the permit to do so?

BAJA AIR SERVICE (Capt. Francisco Muñoz) used to fly from Tijuana to Bahia de los Angeles, Mulege and Puerto Vallarta. Government run Aero Mexico shut him down (pulled his permits). Of course, this was 40 years ago! Ed Tabor of the Flying Sportsman Lodge in Loreto flew a DC-3 to Loreto until he was shut down by the government in the mid 1970's.

Answering a contemporary question with a 40 year old answer doesn't help much.

Your Baja in your mind is just that.

Don't bust his bubble, Mexico is trying to promote international growth and a small airline just may be the ticket to open up areas that aren't currently supported by any airline.

Go for it kid!

[Edited on 10-17-2011 by CortezBlue]

David K - 10-17-2011 at 09:45 AM

Blue, I hope he has success... Because he might not know the history that I know, I am sharing with him some SO HE CAN PREPARE FOR IT and SUCCEED.

Those who don't know their history are hard pressed to not repeat it!

Skeet/Loreto - 10-17-2011 at 09:50 AM

Forgot one other thing to do:

Buy a Copy of "Exploring the Monster by Whelan Study it and learn.

We do not know what the future holds in Mexico as far as Air Travel but I am 100% behind your efforts! Go for it! Just think about all the Fun you will have trying to accoumplish the Dream!

paranewbi - 10-17-2011 at 10:22 AM

Just marry the daughter of the guy who controls what your trying to do!

CortezBlue - 10-17-2011 at 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Blue, I hope he has success... Because he might not know the history that I know, I am sharing with him some SO HE CAN PREPARE FOR IT and SUCCEED.

Those who don't know their history are hard pressed to not repeat it!

Yes, your a legend in your old mind

Pompano - 10-17-2011 at 11:52 AM

Quote:

gmata, with dual citizenship, you will have a much better start at this business venture than most...if you keep the greasy side down.

Before this thread goes completely down the drain on you, here's some 'historical' reading on the subject of commercial non-Mexican airlines doing business in Baja.

Chance favors the prepared mind.

Over the years since 1973, I've flown both private and commercial to and from Mulege's 2 strips, plus the old Loreto airport. My commercial flights were with Air Cortez, Gunnell, Aerocalifornia, Aeromexico, Mexicana, Resort, and some other obscure companies. They came..and went...just saying?

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=10478&pag...

The following is mostly yak-yak, but should be of interest to any Baja flyer.

"Baja flyer Francisco Munoz....

I never had the pleasure of meeting Senor Munoz, but my old Baja amigo, JW Black, told me a lot of stories about their exploits together with 'UncleEarl' Gardner. JW (Blackjack) was a pilot also..although he told me he quit soon after landing at a California airport and they said he had to get a license to fly. No fun after that, he said. I have a photo for you showing Munoz, Gardner, and plane.

Air Cortez.....I can still smell the whiskey coming out of that Air Cortez pilot's thermos! (He had the same first name as mine.) I was a learning pilot then and he just turned the controls over to me and asked me if I could keep it straight and level. Of course he had it trimmed up pretty good so it was not a big deal for me. The passengers in back were a little 'white' the rest of the trip, though.

I flew a DC-3 originating in Mexico City with quite a few stops..also Loreto and finally landing at the old strip north of Mulege a couple miles west of the highway. That didn't last long.

Remember Gunnel Air ... I think out of Santa Monica? They flew a few times in/out of the Serinadad, too. I flew them once or twice.

Resort Airlines...screwed us big time. My friends from ND were stranded here because that airline went belly up during their vacation. Gave them an old station wagon to leave at LAX so they could get home.

Dusty's 'To Places You Shouldn't Oughta Go!' Air Servicio. He used a 180 taildragger with big tundra tires and we went to the boonies many times. I think he was having 'flashbacks' from 1500hrs+ of Cobra time in Vietnam. He had greasemark sighting X's on the inside windscreen and we 'straffed' a few beaches, whales, pangas, ranchos, Baja road semis and motorhomes. We once flew a load of lobster back to Mulege from San Jaunico on the Pacific side. He wanted to see an old rancho way down in a canyon coming over the mountains. Banked a little too hard and the passenger door popped open...scared the bee-jesus out of me.

Those were some times! "

David K - 10-17-2011 at 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CortezBlue

Quote:

Yes, your a legend in your old mind

Sad that if you knew something that could help a Nomad, you would sit on it... I don't think telling him about past airlines in Baja is some kind of secret. You do get high marks for rudeness, however! People come to Nomad to be informed and entertained... If everyone kept their mouths shut, it wouldn't be a very interesting place to be! :light:

Vince - 10-17-2011 at 12:49 PM

gmata- You can do it. I have been flying to Baja since 1975 out of SD, but never for hire. There are 2 guys at Brown Field that fly people down there, they are separate and use Cherokee 6's. Kevin is one, he brings surfers down, stays with them for the 2-3 days and brings them back. Not complicated at all, just "sharing expenses". Another guy out of First Flight has been doing it for less than a year and really enjoys it.

capt. mike - 10-17-2011 at 01:58 PM

Gmata - you emailed me a few weeks ago but i have been out of town a lot on biz.

Its VERY hard to make it work - and here's why - you have to get DGAC approval in mexico city and they change their rules constantly. My buddy here worked 2 years on a permit to fly Cessna Caravans from Scottsdale to Rocky Point and Alamos on scheduled service and demonstrated he could make it work. DGAC told him the fee would be $20,000 US annually based on schedules and pax seats revenue.
When he went to Mex City to final everything they pulled him aside and started an extortion operation to get all the staffers properly paid which CHANGED the contract to $100,000 per fricking year which could not work. They completely lied to him and wasted his time and thousands of $$$ in his good faith due diligence.

Keven Warren has done this a long time and got all his permits early, plus he is/was married to a mexican licensed atty so she can make things happen.

Your best bet is to join Areo Calafia out of cabo and la paz and work for them. If there is good biz they smell it and make it work.

gmata - 10-17-2011 at 08:37 PM

Thanks all for your nice comments!

I will see what happens with time, I know few guys in Mexico city that might be able to give me a hand. If it dosen't work oh well i tried!

Please keep in mind this is still a very long term dream of mine, Besides going to school in phoenix right now, i own a charter business in La Paz, www.bajaspearfishingadventures.com as the name says we take people spearfishing to several destinations in Baja, right now we are struggling to buy a bigger panga since our 21 ft is too small for the amount of clients we are having.

If getting the permits is a huge hazzle then it would be cool to at least take my clients and some H&L fisherman down to Baja even if its not an scheduled flight.

CortezBlue - 10-17-2011 at 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Originally posted by CortezBlue

Quote:

Yes, your a legend in your old mind

I think it is probably more important for you to hear yourself relish in the old days, than it is valid information for someone who wants to stretch his entrepreneurial wings in today's global economy. Everyone here knows you are the Oracle of Baja, and if we disagree we will be censored, but I try not to repeat history.

Mexico has changed drastically and yes, there will be obstacles. but sometimes, not knowing the past, and jumping into the future, can make moving forward with a different idea more successful.

Again, go for it kid!

PS
You may have sent him to Wall Street to protest, "Da Man?"

PPSS, Please notate what you consider rude in my previous comments?

I don't know how politically correct I could be.

You need to start accepting criticism the same way you deliver it.

[Edited on 10-18-2011 by CortezBlue]

[Edited on 10-18-2011 by CortezBlue]

[Edited on 10-18-2011 by CortezBlue]

How did you find out?

Dave - 10-18-2011 at 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pompano
May your codpiece be the playground of a thousand mosquitoes.

It was just the one time and she came from a respected family.

Pompano - 10-18-2011 at 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave

Quote:

Originally posted by Pompano
May your codpiece be the playground of a thousand mosquitoes.

It was just the one time and she came from a respected family.

Touché! I yield to your well-used...er...well referenced explanation. I'm sorry for the humble misunderstanding on my part. :rolleyes: