BajaNomad - Mark and Olivia today

Long complex story made short and simple

Mark was arrested on Friday
Mark went to jail
Mark is out of jail
Mark makes great soup as well as great burgers
The beer is cold
Business as usual

I seem to recall a thread about the soup...

DianaT - 3-2-2015 at 05:11 PM

Rafael may have been overzealous in his posting, but it looks like he was NOT lying about Mark going to jail even if he is now out of jail.

There is always lots of sides to all of these stories, and I enjoyed hearing Rafael's information about land and real estate in Mexico, even if I might not have agreed with all of it, it was interesting to read and raised more questions for people to ask.

blackwolfmt - 3-2-2015 at 05:33 PM

Quote: Originally posted by StuckSucks

Don't think I've shared this. A photo sphere I took of Buenaventura. Click and drag to look around - think: Google Street Views:

http://goo.gl/maps/AXdp0

Just like you were there!

Thanks Stuck U always have them cool pano's looks like a cool seclude place ,,where can you beach camp close by???

David K - 3-2-2015 at 05:43 PM

Playa el Requeson is just south, around the bend.

David K - 3-2-2015 at 05:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DianaT

Rafael may have been overzealous in his posting, but it looks like he was NOT lying about Mark going to jail even if he is now out of jail.

There is always lots of sides to all of these stories, and I enjoyed hearing Rafael's information about land and real estate in Mexico, even if I might not have agreed with all of it, it was interesting to read and raised more questions for people to ask.

Being arrested when wrongly accused is NOT the same as going to jail. Just the police doing their job, and the judge or someone releasing an innocent man... and the same day... that has got to be a record in Mexico.

Bajahowodd - 3-2-2015 at 05:52 PM

Accused of what? :?:

Skipjack Joe - 3-2-2015 at 05:57 PM

Would like to hear the long version of the story.

David K - 3-2-2015 at 05:58 PM

I guess we will have to go there like Chuckie did?

StuckSucks - 3-2-2015 at 06:26 PM

Playa el Requeson is just south, around the bend.

A photo sphere from Requesón:

http://goo.gl/maps/nBCPz

[Edited on 3-3-2015 by StuckSucks]

willardguy - 3-2-2015 at 06:27 PM

I guess we will have to go there like Chuckie did?

wouldn't it just be easier to ask rafael? he seems to have more credibility than you do!
reinstate him. :yes:

chuckie - 3-2-2015 at 07:15 PM

Could be it's nobody's business except the people involved?

SFandH - 3-2-2015 at 07:27 PM

OR:

$$$$$$$$$$$

who knows?

willardguy - 3-2-2015 at 07:27 PM

Could be it's nobody's business except the people involved?

not since they brought it to social media, someone was looking for an audience!

Pompano - 3-2-2015 at 07:33 PM

Nobody is exempt from saying silly things, but the harmful thing is saying them deliberately in order to hurt somebody.

edit to clarify my point..which is to try being nice.

[Edited on 3-3-2015 by Pompano]

norte - 3-2-2015 at 07:35 PM

How do not understand how David would know if this guy is guilty or not...He rally should request Rafael be reinstated.

David K - 3-2-2015 at 07:48 PM

Really guys, I don't get some of you here who thrive on drama. Can't we act like we do around the campfire with a cold Pacifico instead of this? Willard, I don't understand what it is that makes you post some of the stuff you do to me, sorry if I did something to bug you, but I never tried to...

Mark and Olivia have a business, they have gone through Hell with Munoz trying to push them off so he can take their place over. Look at how he destroyed the motel next door... is that what you want for the cantina?

Mark and Olivia take care of travelers needs in a remote place and Rafael Munoz just takes care of himself and his greed. It seemed obvious in 2009 before I met Mark and Olivia, so I kept an open mind. Once I met them it was obvious who 'the good guys' were in this battle.

You can also check with the other Nomads on Concepcion Bay or read their posts (Pompano, Bob & Susan, etc.)... Other Mexican nationals, like JESSE, really anyone who knows anything...

I don't know Mark any more than a couple of personal meetings but I can judge character by actions. Rafael gets a zero and Mark gets a 10 for being most 'human' (as jr baja would call it).

I will stick up and help any Nomad who has been wronged by an oppressor as best I can. Why are you here, to have a great Baja experience or to trash a couple catering to tourists in Baja under attack by a bully 700 miles away using thugs and unpaid workers?

motoged - 3-2-2015 at 08:02 PM

I have enjoyed a beer or two and a few burgers at Mark and Olivia's over the years....before and since the turtle soup saga.

Yep....seem like nice folks.

I don't know if they have committed any of the crimes they are to have allegedly committed.

I do know some people through my career as a therapist that have been incarcerated for crimes ranging from spousal abuse, drug trafficking, sexual assaults and murders. Some of them were personable and, unless you knew their rap sheets, would enjoy having a beer and a burger with them.

A few initial impressions are not always accurate....others are.

Baja Nomads are not yet sworn in is a jury....and likely haven't ALL the facts at this time.....

But don't let that stop another run at this saga....

woody with a view - 3-2-2015 at 08:12 PM

remember all you chicken coop groupers, there are 3 sides to EVERY story.

side 1
side 2
what really happened.

edit: even eye witnesses get it wrong on occasion!

[Edited on 3-3-2015 by woody with a view]

J.P. - 3-2-2015 at 09:23 PM

Quote: Originally posted by motoged

I have enjoyed a beer or two and a few burgers at Mark and Olivia's over the years....before and since the turtle soup saga.

Yep....seem like nice folks.

I don't know if they have committed any of the crimes they are to have allegedly committed.

I do know some people through my career as a therapist that have been incarcerated for crimes ranging from spousal abuse, drug trafficking, sexual assaults and murders. Some of them were personable and, unless you knew their rap sheets, would enjoy having a beer and a burger with them.

A few initial impressions are not always accurate....others are.

Baja Nomads are not yet sworn in is a jury....and likely haven't ALL the facts at this time.....

But don't let that stop another run at this saga....

I agree completely I have ben in their establishment a lot of times over the years. I have no knowledge of their personal life or business tactics. I have spent time in the area and they both caught my interest, whenever their name came up around the area in general conversation I noticed it wasn't what people said in the conversation that intrigued me it was what was not said that got my attention.

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 06:30 AM

I don't chime in often on the board because of the 'evidence' of character revealed by a few posters. But as one who has lived a life torn by false accusation, I sometimes find it necessary to confront the harm that can be done to the innocent...especially since the establishment of innocence is revealed somewhere in the depth of the damage done to the innocent.

At the risk of becoming subjected to the fodder of others, please enter my son's name into any search engine; Uriah Courtney

At his side in the story and photos, is his mother and I.

chuckie - 3-3-2015 at 07:14 AM

I suspect that a few of the kibitzers have never been to Olivias place and maybe couldn't even find it...Amazing to me how knowledgable they are or want to be about something they have no skin in,,,I have known Olivia for 25+ years and I don't pretend to understand this situation, and if I did would keep it to myself

Pescador - 3-3-2015 at 07:50 AM

Never let the facts stand in the way of a good opinion.

monoloco - 3-3-2015 at 09:40 AM

Paranewbi-That sounds like a horrendous nightmare. I'm sorry for your family and I hope that your son is doing well.

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 09:48 AM

I don't chime in often on the board because of the 'evidence' of character revealed by a few posters. But as one who has lived a life torn by false accusation, I sometimes find it necessary to confront the harm that can be done to the innocent...especially since the establishment of innocence is revealed somewhere in the depth of the damage done to the innocent.

At the risk of becoming subjected to the fodder of others, please enter my son's name into any search engine; Uriah Courtney

At his side in the story and photos, is his mother and I.

I posted the opportunity for others to see our story to perhaps draw attention to the case of Mark and Olivia; The innocent accused tend to not run from the accusation. The faith in truth being eventually revealed motivates the innocent to face all consequences...my son did and never faltered even though it meant 9 years in prison before his exoneration.
I would suspect that Mark and Olivia trust in the truth because they have had all the opportunities to flee and have not. To claim they trust in dishonesty within the judicial system to keep them safe would be insanity. Dishonesty is never safe even at the risk of harm proclaiming a truth of innocence.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Man-Freed-After-Eight-...

David K - 3-3-2015 at 10:02 AM

Thank you for sharing your pain and then good fortune with us... Sometimes things do not seem real unless they happen to someone you know.

LancairDriver - 3-3-2015 at 10:34 AM

Quote: Originally posted by monoloco

Paranewbi-That sounds like a horrendous nightmare. I'm sorry for your family and I hope that your son is doing well.

x2 What a shame you had to go through that. Makes you wonder how many more are in that situation.

ELINVESTIG8R - 3-3-2015 at 11:35 AM

Here is a brief summary of the arrest of Mark Burbey.

[Edited on 3-3-2015 by BajaNomad]

norte - 3-3-2015 at 12:45 PM

Really guys, I don't get some of you here who thrive on drama. Can't we act like we do around the campfire with a cold Pacifico instead of this? Willard, I don't understand what it is that makes you post some of the stuff you do to me, sorry if I did something to bug you, but I never tried to...

Mark and Olivia have a business, they have gone through Hell with Munoz trying to push them off so he can take their place over. Look at how he destroyed the motel next door... is that what you want for the cantina?

Mark and Olivia take care of travelers needs in a remote place and Rafael Munoz just takes care of himself and his greed. It seemed obvious in 2009 before I met Mark and Olivia, so I kept an open mind. Once I met them it was obvious who 'the good guys' were in this battle.

You can also check with the other Nomads on Concepcion Bay or read their posts (Pompano, Bob & Susan, etc.)... Other Mexican nationals, like JESSE, really anyone who knows anything...

I don't know Mark any more than a couple of personal meetings but I can judge character by actions. Rafael gets a zero and Mark gets a 10 for being most 'human' (as jr baja would call it).

I will stick up and help any Nomad who has been wronged by an oppressor as best I can. Why are you here, to have a great Baja experience or to trash a couple catering to tourists in Baja under attack by a bully 700 miles away using thugs and unpaid workers?

And this from the drama king? Why don't you just admit you were wrong ad Burbey was arrested. This all just anther good reason to stay away from Mexico.

StuckSucks - 3-3-2015 at 12:55 PM

</bickering>

Dorado tacos from Buenaventura:

Let the bickering resume ...

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 01:46 PM

Thanks to those who expressed condolences at our families experience. to LancairDriver; Over 1200 have been exonerated so far...and I once viewed a survey of members of the judicial system that by percentages suggested there may be up to 10,000 innocent people of the 2mil incarcerated.

To Elinvestig8r; Our family lived with the notoriety of being connected to the monster my son was portrayed to be. The initial two years (trial) were particularly painful. The posting of the 'arrest' of Mark brings back memories of our son's booking photo plastered all over the media and internet.
For 9 years the internet was constantly made aware of what people thought should happen to my son both physically and while incarcerated. The eyewitness's identification accusation was paramount and unquestionable to the extent that my testimony of my son being with me at the moment of the crime, and my employee testimony of the same, was said by a juror to me 'you loved him, we thought you might lie for him'.
Portrayed as liars by the Jury and Prosecutor, I and my employee were the only ones in that room of accusers, detectives, and investigators, telling the absolute truth.
I don't know you Elinvestig8r, but I have come to understand by reading posts that you hold yourself to a higher esteem and thought processes. I ask you once again, barring complete arrogance or insanity, why would the guilty not flee where the innocent stand strong?
I sense no arrogance on Mark's part nor do I find the insane capable of continuing on with life as this couple have. The only party I find to exhibit those characters, in all due respect, is the man who has made the accusations (I do not include you here El).

I have experienced first hand how accusers can be. I am one who knows how the innocent act.
I know what harm can be done by posting arrest documents even as public material readily available elsewhere. From what I have seen others post of you El, you should to.

chuckie - 3-3-2015 at 01:53 PM

Soup yesterday was not turtle....had lots of lentils in it, served with garlic bread....very good....Saturday BBQ's are excellent....in a neat place....

David K - 3-3-2015 at 02:01 PM

Quote: Originally posted by norte

And this from the drama king? Why don't you just admit you were wrong ad Burbey was arrested. This all just anther good reason to stay away from Mexico.

Mark didn't tell me he was arrested, so I did not say he was either, but he did confirm he was NOT IN JAIL. That was the claim made by ramuma. I suppose we all can presume if one is arrested, he would be in jail. Not so in Mexico, one can PAY the police to arrest someone, and then that person is released as soon as it is clear the arrested person is NOT GUILTY.

I did get a third message from Mark last night, as I pressed him about what Chuckie posted, and he did say he was arrested and released later the same day... It is what we in America might call a FALSE ARREST.

Yes, I get sucked into the drama, but only because I wish only the best for our Nomad business friends who do nice things in a rugged land for us who enjoy our vacations there, and others who are there more.

David K - 3-3-2015 at 02:03 PM

Thanks to those who expressed condolences at our families experience. to LancairDriver; Over 1200 have been exonerated so far...and I once viewed a survey of members of the judicial system that by percentages suggested there may be up to 10,000 innocent people of the 2mil incarcerated.

To Elinvestig8r; Our family lived with the notoriety of being connected to the monster my son was portrayed to be. The initial two years (trial) were particularly painful. The posting of the 'arrest' of Mark brings back memories of our son's booking photo plastered all over the media and internet.
For 9 years the internet was constantly made aware of what people thought should happen to my son both physically and while incarcerated. The eyewitness's identification accusation was paramount and unquestionable to the extent that my testimony of my son being with me at the moment of the crime, and my employee testimony of the same, was said by a juror to me 'you loved him, we thought you might lie for him'.
Portrayed as liars by the Jury and Prosecutor, I and my employee were the only ones in that room of accusers, detectives, and investigators, telling the absolute truth.
I don't know you Elinvestig8r, but I have come to understand by reading posts that you hold yourself to a higher esteem and thought processes. I ask you once again, barring complete arrogance or insanity, why would the guilty not flee where the innocent stand strong?
I sense no arrogance on Mark's part nor do I find the insane capable of continuing on with life as this couple have. The only party I find to exhibit those characters, in all due respect, is the man who has made the accusations (I do not include you here El).

I have experienced first hand how accusers can be. I am one who knows how the innocent act.
I know what harm can be done by posting arrest documents even as public material readily available elsewhere. From what I have seen others post of you El, you should to.

RIGHT ON! :light:

mtgoat666 - 3-3-2015 at 02:33 PM

most people do not know that our (USA) justice system is often unjust. many of the people employed by the justice system rarely stop to think how the system often railroads the innocent.

rafaelmunoz - 3-3-2015 at 02:41 PM

Maybe I dont unbderstand, you want to stay away from Mexico???? as I uderstand the victim was a Mexican 16 year old kid; while Mark Jerome Burbey is an American; do that mean that you want to keep the child molestors in the US???? because that would be ok with mexicans,

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 03:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by rafaelmunoz

Maybe I dont unbderstand, you want to stay away from Mexico???? as I uderstand the victim was a Mexican 16 year old kid; while Mark Jerome Burbey is an American; do that mean that you want to keep the child molestors in the US???? because that would be ok with mexicans,

Rafael, my son's accuser was also 16 years old. She was led by the prosecutor to have a better memory of her attacker 12 months after the fact than she did 30 days after the attack. As was proven by the DNA on her clothing, the man who attacked her was NOT my son.

This young girl in my son's case was led to believe what those around her tell her something was, other than her actual experience.
Mark was arrested and nothing has been proven. An accusation is not proof of an individuals guilt. Read about my son!
Not even a conviction is proof of a persons guilt.
You don't even have that yet.

motoged - 3-3-2015 at 03:56 PM

One person's innocence does not remove another's guilt.

Para, your family story is one separate situation from the allegations regarding a totally unrelated situation (despite some possible similar dynamics).

None of the Nomad's know all the facts....but have plenty of opinions and seem to have taken sides (such is the screech of the Greek chorus).

I don't have a horse in this race....but am watching the process with interest.

ELINVESTIG8R - 3-3-2015 at 04:31 PM

Paranewbi I do not know your son's story so I will not comment on it. As far as what mean things others say about me I will fight back because I can with words or any other means I deem appropriate.The person accused will just have to roll with the punches until his case is adjudicated as any of us would. He been accused not convicted. Time will tell If he is guilty.

bajabuddha - 3-3-2015 at 05:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by rafaelmunoz

JUST FOR THE RECORD:

For those sports fans not 'in the know' here who are watching this fiasco "with interest", this newbie poster, Rafael Munoz is also "ramuna" from the long-running Buenaventura thread, http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=60639 and is a.k.a "The Black Hand", the guy who's been harassing Mark and Olivia for about 10 years now trying to take their property from them, who had buildings destroyed and burned down on their property, gutted and ruined the hotel, and who (in the past as well) has had Mark arrested on trumped up phony charges trying to get them both to knuckle under and fold so he can justify his illegal claims. Also the retired sergeant's buddy.

Just to level the playing field here.

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 05:13 PM

Motoged, 'one separate situation' is belittling a massive problem that exists in the world today, the abuse of the innocent through false allegations. The similarity in ours and others, as well as Marks is the patent rush to judgment you cite. The advent of the internet and the spreading of innuendoes over it, especially of what Mark is experiencing now, is detestable.
The advocating as Elinvestig8tr has expressed of 'just having to roll with the punches until his case is adjudicated' is a true statement of honesty on El's part. Yet, I desire to educate on who might be the true victim when we pursue to beat down someone who in no way has been shown guilty...thus abuse of the innocent, it can be nothing else. The similarity to my son is that my son like Mark had to take those punches first. How sad.
That is criminal.

ELINVESTIG8R - 3-3-2015 at 05:16 PM

Yep I'd rather have Rafael as a friend than someone who throws a grenade in the fire and blows himself and his friends up. Just for the record!!

motoged - 3-3-2015 at 05:52 PM

Motoged, 'one separate situation' is belittling a massive problem that exists in the world today, the abuse of the innocent through false allegations. The similarity in ours and others, as well as Marks is the patent rush to judgment you cite.

Para,
I meant no disrespect towards you or others with my comment....and "got it" that you are addressing the pain of wrongful accusations in your family's experience. I also can understand how the situation with Mark et al stirs up the wounds and pain of your own experience.....and your efforts to heal by sharing your story as an example of the harms that can be done.

I am not rushing to any conclusions as to guilt/innocence....but am taking a step back from the fray and watching how the process of "right-wrong/ good-bad" unfolds here. I am watching the "process" more than the "content" in this thread's conversation.....

Gawd knows I stick my opinions more pointedly with other topics .... :rolleyes:

paranewbi - 3-3-2015 at 06:17 PM

You are most appreciated Motoged. I too meant no disrespect. Life is to precious to hold those feelings. Hope to clank bottles of beer with you one day on the sunny side of the border!
That's where my wife and I found our refuge.

chuckie - 3-3-2015 at 06:17 PM

David K.....You are SO full of s<>t.....Why don't you actually come to Baja once in a while? Where do you think Mark was after he was arrested? In his recliner at home? I give up....Do you ever actually talk to anyone or make this crap up to remain the oldest Non expert ??? ZERO credibility=David K......

norte - 3-3-2015 at 06:53 PM

David K.

If you could step back from the cheeseburger for a minute you might
wonder about a few things.

-There have been allegations (unfounded I guess) of drug activity going back to Olivia's previous beau.
-By all accounts, here and on facebook, there does not seem to be a huge clientele (all pictures show the photographer there and no one else). Apparently the pig roast was not well attended. Where does all the money come from to keep this place running AND pay all the lawyer/court costs going all the way back to title fights with the Ejido.
- You bemoan the attempts by Rafael to acquire property but say nothing about Mark and Olivias confiscation of homes along the bay.

There is more, but between bites, ponder these things. Makes one wonder.

LancairDriver - 3-3-2015 at 07:28 PM

David K.....You are SO full of s<>t.....Why don't you actually come to Baja once in a while? Where do you think Mark was after he was arrested? In his recliner at home? I give up....Do you ever actually talk to anyone or make this crap up to remain the oldest Non expert ??? ZERO credibility=David K......

I personally know DK's detractors about as well as I personally know DK, which is not at all. My opinion of all is based solely on the quality of the content of the posts of the past few years by the various characters involved. If DK has zero credibility the rest are undoubtedly well into the negative of zero. There is no comparison to the quality of the content contributed by the detractors vs the contributions by DK.and his knowledge of Baja passed on to all via this forum.

bajabuddha - 3-3-2015 at 10:26 PM

Paranewbi, check your u2u.

bajabuddha - 3-3-2015 at 10:55 PM

Quote: Originally posted by LancairDriver

Let me state for the record, I think DK is 2 lbs of B.S. in a one-pound bag when it comes to his political rants. Maps, Baja history, more power to him. I had an afternoon with DK in MARK'S BAR and believed he was the main man of Nomads gathering more info... although there was no gathering, just outflow.

HOWEVER:
In this situation, DK is spot-on. I was a neighbor of Buenaventura for months at a time and for many years, even before Mark came on the scene. I had a good relationship with both Mark and Olivia for many years, spent a LOT of time over there, just a mile from my winter home, and more than just "a burger and beer once or twice a year" as most posters here. We've had our differences too. This situation is all a matter of long-term bullying and criminal attempts at acquisition of property under Mexican standards, and he who has the biggest pockets pushes the most buttons.

I saw first-hand all the carnage that happened at Buenaventura; armed thugs, looting and stripping of everything take-able, burning of buildings... vandalism, customer and owner harrassments........So think of this. If you had business venture, would you destroy your own hotel? Would you strip and gut all your holdings, and vandalize all your potential income property? Would you hide behind the name "The Black Hand" and let a potential gold mine not only rot, but order someone to burn parts of it?

I owe nothing to the Burbeys, have no more relations to them. However I won't sit idly by and watch the defamation and slander from internet bullies and false statements, especially hurtful abuse just for discretization. Notice a similar pattern here between Munoz and his bestest buddy? Hit below the belt for personal discretization? Typical; pukes take cheap shots. Real cheap; with NO HONOR. Mark shared many a campfire and martini at my place, and nobody got hurt.

And, also for the record, my old friends are still my friends; they would agree they wouldn't rub shoulders at the bar with La Mano
Negro or you, remf. Cheap shooter, like your buddy in Texas; shoot 'em in the back.

David K - 3-3-2015 at 10:59 PM

I don't drink the same Kool Aid as some of you, so I DO NOT get it... Chuckie, you opened this thread with a photo to prove Mark is not in jail, now you say I am full of **it for AGREEING with you???

Is this a Mars/ Venus thing? I don't get it... Are so many of you that easy to jump on the burn Mark and Olivia band wagon, but why? They have harmed nobody. None of ramuma's claims came true of crimes. Still standing by the underdog here, Mark. As said above, he has not run from Bahia Concepcion. Where is ramuma... hundreds of miles away?

ELINVESTIG8R - 3-4-2015 at 05:12 AM

Quote: Originally posted by bajabuddha

My rebuttal to bajabuddha. Enough said unless you wish to go for more!!

motoged - 3-4-2015 at 11:59 AM

Oh, boy....here we go again.... :rolleyes:

I suggest that some of us Coopers may discern which feed to pick up that cartoon guy throws down.....it may be tainted with Agent Orange or some such toxic residue....

dtbushpilot - 3-4-2015 at 12:51 PM

Oh boy, a new group! Can I be one of the new "coopers"? Please, pretty please :lol:

motoged - 3-4-2015 at 12:57 PM

David,
Sure....someone will be in charge of T-shirt designs, bumper stickers, and coffee mugs (other than "Sreamin' Airlines" mugs).

If we have a board meeting, would you host it and serve pizza? :cool:

vgabndo - 3-4-2015 at 01:08 PM