BajaNomad - POLE LINE ROAD 2015 REPORT/PHOTOS (Sheri's pics + Chuck's Video added)

Damn !!!! I missed the poop picture.... :no:

don't despair!

http://carlosnpainter.smugmug.com/Events/Glass-insulators-an...

chuckie - 4-14-2015 at 01:23 AM

Its easy to do if you get too absorbed in the old pictures of tire tracks....

Chiming in...

David K - 4-14-2015 at 07:50 AM

Quote: Originally posted by captkw

yes that's true... there s is many old story's about this...I thought you were implying the hwy 1 was a US thing.....which is a total mexico gig...I drove it as it was being made...hrs watching a small diesel/wax/kerosene flame can on the side of a road to no where....DK and others can chime in with that....BUT, I was 17 yrs old and on my own....So,,as a long term Res of Baja and mex (8yrs old) and I do have a firm thought/insight to many things you gringos don't,,,,,,please keep that in mind...bein dias.....K&T

The thread is titled 'POLE LINE ROAD...', and in the many discussions over the years (thanks to Neal Johns and others), as well as in the Lower California Guidebook, the builders and purpose is described. The United States built the landing fields at Ensenada (now their airport El Cipres), El Rosario on the mesa, and other places for the defense of California. We had three radar facilities in Baja California. Two were on the Pacific side and one was at San Felipe. To communicate with the radar base at San Felipe, a telephone line from Ensenada was built across the peninsula, as well as a road along side it. The 30 miles of it that has survived modern activity and can still be seen with cobblestone paving and telephone poles goes across uninhabited desert. It is remote today, and far more so in 1942, when the United States built the road and pole line.

4x4abc - 4-14-2015 at 08:00 AM

David or Ken,

could you put names to faces of participants - because I have forgotten at least half the names already.

screen names and vehicles would be cool, too

maybe use the image below:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153162681819277&am...

Harald Pietschmann - 4x4abc - black G500
Karl Volger - fernweh - black G500 (with roof tent)

David K - 4-14-2015 at 08:09 AM

David or Ken,

could you put names to faces of participants - because I have forgotten at least half the names already.

screen names and vehicles would be cool, too

maybe use the image below:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153162681819277&am...

Harald Pietschmann - 4x4abc - black G500
Karl Volger - fernweh - black G500 (with roof tent)

Coming right up Harald...
PS... as soon as you get any history on the road construction, please let me know!

4x4abc - 4-14-2015 at 08:30 AM

digging through some papers I found that the road between Mexicali and San Felipe was also built by USACE in 41/42

Whale-ista - 4-14-2015 at 08:38 AM

Thank you for the detailed reporting & photos of your adventures. Looks like a great trip.

David K - 4-14-2015 at 08:39 AM

digging through some papers I found that the road between Mexicali and San Felipe was also built by USACE in 41/42

Correct! Some years after the war, Mexico paved it... finished in 1953 or '55, as I recall. My dad told me in the early 60's on our trips south that the U.S. built the new road to San Felipe.

Here is the group photo I took, with names...

Here is Ken's camera with timer full group pic (I am between Chuck and Ed)...

Names added to Ken's photo...

16 People, 12 Vehicles, 1 Adventure!

[Edited on 4-23-2015 by David K]

PaulW - 4-14-2015 at 08:45 AM

David, Are there some missing from the pic?

David K - 4-14-2015 at 08:56 AM

David, Are there some missing from the pic?

That is everyone (12 vehicles) who did the Pole Line Road. MICK, John M, and others (3 vehicles? Ford, Blazier, Tacoma) returned to Rio Hardy Sunday morning from our Saturday night camp near the Summit Road/ Locked Gate when MICK's FORD lost tranny oil. They went back out the same way we had driven in Saturday, as far as I know.

[Edited on 4-14-2015 by David K]

rts551 - 4-14-2015 at 08:56 AM

digging through some papers I found that the road between Mexicali and San Felipe was also built by USACE in 41/42

first road built in early 1900's
http://www.blueroadrunner.com/aboutsf.htm

Trip Report from February 1948 on the new road...

David K - 4-14-2015 at 09:11 AM

motoged - 4-14-2015 at 10:01 AM

Gracias, Harald.....now I can get on with my day :biggrin:

Damn !!!! I missed the poop picture.... :no:

don't despair!

http://carlosnpainter.smugmug.com/Events/Glass-insulators-an...

Mexitron - 4-14-2015 at 10:15 AM

I still wonder why they built the PLR thru such inhospitable terrain when San Matias Pass seems like an easier route. Preventing sabotage by isolating it was one idea on a thread a while back.

mtgoat666 - 4-14-2015 at 10:16 AM

Gracias, Harald.....now I can get on with my day :biggrin:

Damn !!!! I missed the poop picture.... :no:

don't despair!

http://carlosnpainter.smugmug.com/Events/Glass-insulators-an...

4x4abc - 4-14-2015 at 11:51 AM

I hate those white flowers!

Since 1987 I have organized hundreds of events on the Rubicon Trail. Like many other trails threatened by closure. Would the users behave like responsible citizens to minimize the threats? Hell, no!
One year, with some Sacramento grant money, stickers and bandanas were produced. Save the Rubicon. Eradicate white flowers.
Only to have some upstanding citizens use the bandanas to wipe their ass.

I am afraid, we will lose Baja the same way.

David K - 4-14-2015 at 01:47 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Mexitron

I still wonder why they built the PLR thru such inhospitable terrain when San Matias Pass seems like an easier route. Preventing sabotage by isolating it was one idea on a thread a while back.

Steve, one thing we noticed was how unusual the route was to San Felipe from the highlands... It had to be to avoid detection through inhospitable and non-populated lands... Where the PLR ran straight, like on the mesa east of 'Bad Hill', the phone poles were a long ways away from the road (harder to spot the line without a road next to it?).

I hope we can dig up the building orders for it... Should be long ago declassified. I mean, instead of being attacked by the Japanese, we are best of friends and driving their 4x4s!

1962 vs. 2015 Road Logs

David K - 4-14-2015 at 04:00 PM

Added on the left, are mileages I recorded last week, on the 1962 edition of Gerhard & Gulick's Lower California Guidebook (where we all learned about this road). This is westbound from Hwy. 5:

The first mileage was mostly parallel to the road used in 1960's that was not in Arroyo Grande for 5.3 miles from the wells to the Pole Line Road. However it is quite close to Gulick's figures. The next three mileages were on the same road and I was the same of just a tad less.

The next point (road and trail to Jamau) we did not see, nor could I spot on Google Earth.

The next point (road to Guatamote) is located 0.2 mile past the detour access road we reached the Pole Line Road on.

The next point (Arroyo el Sáiz) is about where the locked gate was or within a mile. Again, as we had to detour around the locked gate, I could not compare that mileage.

[Edited on 4-14-2015 by David K]

2015 Road Log HWY. 5/ La Ventana to Cohabuzo Junction via Pole Line Road

David K - 4-14-2015 at 05:41 PM

TRIP START (GPS MAP DATUM: WGS84, Google Earth) Total Miles/ Partial Miles:

0.0/ 0.0 HWY. 5, KM. 106+ (La Ventana + 1 km.). 31º43.900', -115º03.900'

6.0/ 6.0 T Junction, turn right (follow power line).

8.1/ 2.1 Race Course crosses road, continue straight.

12.5/ 4.4 Well Pump, turn left (south). Grading ends at second well (0.6 mi. south). Sandy road continues (deflating tires recommended).

17.8/ 5.3 Pole Line Road turns right (west). Road ahead goes 22 miles to Rancho Arroyo Grande, deep sand driving. A gate may prevent passage through to HWY. 3 from the ranch. Road log turns onto Pole Line Road. 31º37.550', -115º15.700', elev. 800'. First 1942 telephone pole (cut) passed around Mile 21, on the left.

21.6/ 3.8 Detour off old road to right (ahead is washed out). Drop steeply into wash, go left then rejoin old road and climb out other side of wash.

22.4/ 0.5 T Junction. Remains of WWII construction camp. Ahead was once a road to Ejido Saldaña, now washed out. Turn left for Pole Line Road (small landing strip possible here). 31º39.055', -115º18.190'.

26.4/ 4.0 Briefly drop into and back out of Arroyo Jaquegel, keeping to left side. Road repair at bottom of drop performed.

26.9/ 0.5 Bottom of steep grade to mesa. Many poles along mesa top, off to the right of the road at some distance.

28.7/ 1.8 Top of long grade, named 'Bad Hill'.

29.3/ 0.6 Pass close to one full length pole, a second is in the distance.

30.2/ 0.9 Reach wide Arroyo Jaquegel, turn left up arroyo. Rocky going for nearly 1 mile. 31º35.730'/-115º 23.120'

31.1/ 0.9 Road leaves Arroyo Jaquegel to left (south). Up arroyo 500 feet past road is wrecked Suzuki Samurai. Road crosses over hills and washes and drops back into Arroyo Jaquegel a final time.

34.1/ 3.0 Road leaves Arroyo Jaquegel with a cobblestone paved ramp at bottom of grade. Palms are up Arroyo Jaquegel and can be seen from ledge above.

35.5/ 1.4 Top of 'Basketball Hill'. Steep grade down so named for the rocks in the road. Cut phone poles seen going down. A wrecked SUV is also halfway down. 31º34.800', 115º26.300', elev. 1,800'.

35.6/ 0.1 In side canyon, bottom of 'Basketball Hill' grade.

35.7/ 0.1 Enter Cañada de Enmedio (Arroyo Jamau) with very rocky conditions for next 2 miles.

38.1/ 2.4 Cobblestone paving.

38.6/ 0.5 Long Cobblestone paving.

40.9/ 2.3 White Pila (water tank). 31º36.820', 115º30.070', elev. 2,300'.

41.6/ 0.7 Short cobblestone paving.

43.6/ 2.0 Fence gate (re-close after passing).

44.6/ 1.0 Y Intersection, keep right.

46.3/ 1.7 Road to right, go straight.

46.4/ 0.1 Y Fork, keep right. Left is new/ south summit road to top. 31º37.140', -115º34.740'

46.8/ 0.4 DETOUR road, turn left. Ahead is original road, blocked by locked gate.

47.3/ 0.5 DETOUR road turns sharp right, downhill, rough.

48.7/ 1.4 Cross Pole Line Road in Arroyo El Sáiz, Locked Gate on right, original Summit road up to left (2.3 miles to top). 31º37.815', -115º35.145', elev. 2,900'.

Cohabuzo Junction is 25 miles north, Highway 2 is 73 miles north.

MAP OF ROAD LOG ROUTE:

[Edited on 4-24-2015 by David K]

David K - 4-15-2015 at 08:12 AM

Photos from Sheri coming soon...

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 09:40 AM

David,

Cañon Jamau drains into Arroyo de Enmedio - not into Cañada de Enmedio

[Edited on 4-19-2015 by 4x4abc]

David K - 4-15-2015 at 09:45 AM

Howard Gulick called it Arroyo Jamau, so I added that to the Almanac name Enmedio just to be clear on where we were discussing.

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 09:49 AM

Google Earth has the answer for you

PaulW - 4-15-2015 at 11:15 AM

It sure has been a learning experience catching up with you guys.
The Almanac shows Can Enmedio heading a long way N after the PLR exits the canyon. It also shows the PLR when traveling west from the Enmedio exit then heads for the white tank plateau.
I thought the PLR entered Can Jamau from the east (white tank) at the locked gate? Then Jamau canyon/wash/arroyo followed the track north (the one Ken used for access to the PLR)?
I am in the states with limited resources and need info for Google Earth. Can you provide the coordinates for:
Bad hill, Jaquegel/Enmedio junction, Bottom of the hill that needed your reconstruction.
Also a picture of the ’62 Gulick map showing the area near the locked gate including the summit would help.
Thanks, Paul

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 03:24 PM

here is what I am talking about :
Cañon Jamau drains into Arroyo de Enmedio (flowing north)
Cañon de Enmedio (flowing south) is the one that drains into Cañada Jaquegel

David K - 4-15-2015 at 03:30 PM

I am not disagreeing with the modern name (Enmedio)... I included the Gulick applied name (Jamau) as that is the name HE gave to the same location... see Mile 36.3 from his book, I was comparing the 1962 book road log to mine:

[Edited on 4-15-2015 by David K]

David K - 4-15-2015 at 03:43 PM

It sure has been a learning experience catching up with you guys.
The Almanac shows Can Enmedio heading a long way N after the PLR exits the canyon. It also shows the PLR when traveling west from the Enmedio exit then heads for the white tank plateau.
I thought the PLR entered Can Jamau from the east (white tank) at the locked gate? Then Jamau canyon/wash/arroyo followed the track north (the one Ken used for access to the PLR)?
I am in the states with limited resources and need info for Google Earth. Can you provide the coordinates for:
Bad hill, Jaquegel/Enmedio junction, Bottom of the hill that needed your reconstruction.
Also a picture of the ’62 Gulick map showing the area near the locked gate including the summit would help.
Thanks, Paul

The Almanac/ Mexican map makers have switched names with arroyos, canyons, and bays in many places with the historic names.

The Pass that the Pole Line Road uses is/was Portezuelo de Jamau, regardless of what the Almanac calls it today. There also could be more than one Jamau, such as Cañon de Jamau vs. Portezuelo de Jamau.

Here's the Gulick map of the area... followed by the 2009 Almanac map...

PaulW - 4-15-2015 at 04:49 PM

Harald, Thanks my eye sight is failing, but I see on GE that "A Enmedio" does join "C Jamau". Looks like "A Enmedio" begins on high ground Plateau N of the white tank. When you drive the wash I never suspected that there were two washes joining.

Gulick said words about "A/C El Saiz" Do you suppose "C jamau" and Saiz are being confused?

David, do you have the INEGI topo to see if it sheds any light on some names?
Thanks for helping me out, Paul

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 05:08 PM

thanks to Google Earth we can now see clearly that Cañon Jamau drains north.
It's easy to mistake Jamau as the source for Enmedio - that's why Gulick named Enmedio Jamau
And with high water flow, some Jamau waters actually enter Enmedio
(white lines are the water drains - PLR in blue)

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 05:13 PM

Harald, Thanks my eye sight is failing, but I see on GE that "A Enmedio" does join "C Jamau". Looks like "A Enmedio" begins on high ground Plateau N of the white tank. When you drive the wash I never suspected that there were two washes joining.

Gulick said words about "A/C El Saiz" Do you suppose "C jamau" and Saiz are being confused?

David, do you have the INEGI topo to see if it sheds any light on some names?
Thanks for helping me out, Paul

I checked H11B25 and the names are Saiz, Jamau, Enmedio from west to east. The topo also confirms the north drainage of Jamau

4x4abc - 4-15-2015 at 05:19 PM

here is the divide between Jamau and the beginning of the 2 arms of Enmedio

David K - 4-15-2015 at 05:29 PM

Arroyo el Sáiz is the bottom of the summit grade, where the locked gate is facing, and where we camped Saturday night.

chuckie - 4-16-2015 at 05:14 AM

Whew, I am so glad we got that resolved.....

4x4abc - 4-16-2015 at 06:30 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

Whew, I am so glad we got that resolved.....

you are absolutely right! why would you care
some of us do - most don't
it's all good!

chuckie - 4-16-2015 at 07:16 AM

It was keeping me awake nights....

mtgoat666 - 4-16-2015 at 09:13 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

Whew, I am so glad we got that resolved.....

you are absolutely right! why would you care
some of us do - most don't
it's all good!

you should use the online INEGI map to see what the mother ship decrees to be the proper geographic names.

what geographic names do the locals use?

TMW - 4-16-2015 at 09:19 AM

[Can you provide the coordinates for:
Bad hill, Jaquegel/Enmedio junction, Bottom of the hill that needed your reconstruction.
Also a picture of the ’62 Gulick map showing the area near the locked gate including the summit would help.
Thanks, Paul]

Paul if you still need the coordinates they are: In degrees, decimal minutes.

Bad Hill 31-36.160x115-21.050
Jaq-Enm jct 31-35.350x115-25.100
Hill reconstruction 31-36.500x115-20.740

David K - 4-16-2015 at 09:27 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

Whew, I am so glad we got that resolved.....

you are absolutely right! why would you care
some of us do - most don't
it's all good!

you should use the online INEGI map to see what the mother ship decrees to be the proper geographic names.

what geographic names do the locals use?

There are no locals on the Pole Line Road 30 mile section we are discussing. In other words, no homes or ranches along the way that can be seen. One ranch near the west end, and who probably put up the locked gate, a over a mile north of the Pole Line Road, near that gate on the west end. This is at or near the ranch called Guatamote in the Lower California Guidebook.

As stated before, the Mexican made topo maps are not 100% accurate with names, so we use them to help spot where we are talking about, but they are often in error.

Insulator model on the Pole Line Road

David K - 4-16-2015 at 12:19 PM

Scroll down to the second photo...

http://www.hemingray.info/database/detail.php?cd=122

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 03:50 PM

Tom,
I will use the info when I get back from my trip to Denver. Its important to me to correct my PLR GPS track WPs.
Thanks
======

Quote: Originally posted by TMW

[Can you provide the coordinates for:
Bad hill, Jaquegel/Enmedio junction, Bottom of the hill that needed your reconstruction.
Also a picture of the ’62 Gulick map showing the area near the locked gate including the summit would help.
Thanks, Paul]

Paul if you still need the coordinates they are: In degrees, decimal minutes.

Bad Hill 31-36.160x115-21.050
Jaq-Enm jct 31-35.350x115-25.100
Hill reconstruction 31-36.500x115-20.740

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 04:08 PM

David there is a guy that has taken up residence near the summit. He has the usual collection of animals and a beat up truck. I forget which side of the summit , but my guess its on the east side.
The guy that redid the lock gate grading and placement of the new boulder came from and returned via the road between the LG and the road we used for the go around for the lock gate. We could plainly see the fresh tracks of his bulldozer. That road heads northerly and my GPS & GE both show it as a dead end. Anyway, I suspect that is where his ranch base is located?
Paul

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 04:10 PM

David there is a guy that has taken up residence near the summit. He has the usual collection of animals and a beat up truck. I forget which side of the summit , but my guess its on the east side.
The guy that redid the lock gate grading and placement of the new boulder came from and returned via the road between the LG and the road we used for the go around for the lock gate. We could plainly see the fresh tracks of his bulldozer. That road heads northerly and my GPS & GE both show it as a dead end. Anyway, I suspect that is where his ranch base is located?
Paul

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 04:15 PM

So -- does anybody think the wash just below the Lock Gate Is Saiz or is it Jamau? That would be the wash Ken and crew drove from the north and arrived at /near the lock gate.
I do not have a trace on the Enigi map to allow me to make a judgement.
Paul

David K - 4-16-2015 at 04:18 PM

Hi Paul, Google Earth is real handy to get waypoints of points along the road. The area of Basketball Hill is under cloud cover on GE, but clear as a bell on Bing... pick Bing here: http://www.flashearth.com/

Just move the screen so that the target spot is in the small cross-hair in the center and read the GPS. You have to choose between decimal degrees or degrees, minutes and seconds. The decimal minutes we typically use will need to be converted from either of the others. You can enter them in the GE go box and it will convert it, or use one of the map datum converters on the Internet: http://www.fcc.gov/encyclopedia/degrees-minutes-seconds-tofr... or http://www.onlineconversion.com/map_decimaldegrees.htm or http://www.directionsmag.com/site/latlong-converter/

David K - 4-16-2015 at 04:23 PM

So -- does anybody think the wash just below the Lock Gate Is Saiz or is it Jamau? That would be the wash Ken and crew drove from the north and arrived at /near the lock gate.
I do not have a trace on the Enigi map to allow me to make a judgement.
Paul

El Sáiz, per Gulick and per Baja Almanac.

David K - 4-16-2015 at 05:43 PM

Here is from the Inegi digital site... and El Sáiz is listed along the arroyo, up in the canyon... with the added large block names and arrow from me

Improved instructions for INIGI download

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 06:41 PM

Now I am in the states and I get a mix of spanish and english.
Here are the key strokes
www.inegi.org.mx
Geografica or Geography
Choose first =Themes
Choose Topography
Top of the list - click on first one = Cartas topography
In the first box highlight and type H11B25 then Search=Buscar
Click on the title of the first entry
Click on Discharge
Click on PDF and save

Works good

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 06:44 PM

Here is from the Inegi digital site... and El Sáiz is listed along the arroyo, up in the canyon... with the added large block names and arrow from me

And A/C Jamau is missing. Can u tell where it is?

4x4abc - 4-16-2015 at 07:14 PM

here are Saiz and Jamau on the INEGI map
dotted line: PLR

4x4abc - 4-16-2015 at 07:20 PM

and here is the same in Google Earth:

4x4abc - 4-16-2015 at 07:30 PM

so, how about the secret airstrip east of Guatamote cattle camp?
US WWII? Mex?

PaulW - 4-16-2015 at 07:32 PM

Harald, Can you send me a KML file for the siaz & Jamau pic ?
Thanks, Paul<pwpc@sisna.com>

[Edited on 4-17-2015 by PaulW]

4x4abc - 4-16-2015 at 07:58 PM

Harald, Can you send me a KML file for the siaz & Jamau pic ?
Thanks, Paul<pwpc@sisna.com>

[Edited on 4-17-2015 by PaulW]

done

David K - 4-17-2015 at 07:18 AM

There are many secret runways in Baja... and not all have been ditched by the military!

David K - 4-17-2015 at 07:23 AM

Quote:

Here is from the Inegi digital site... and El Sáiz is listed along the arroyo, up in the canyon... with the added large block names and arrow from me

And A/C Jamau is missing. Can u tell where it is?

As Harald showed on the bigger area map, it is southeast from El Sáiz.

I think a lot of confusion comes from the double use of the name 'Jamau'.?

The original Pole Line Road route comes off the summit and is called Portezuelo de Jamau. Several miles south is a different canyon, and arroyo named Jamau (above the old ranch site of Jamau).

[Edited on 4-17-2015 by David K]

4x4abc - 4-17-2015 at 07:55 AM

Rancho Jamau, Cerro Jamau, Cañon Jamau, Jamau (location)

PaulW - 4-17-2015 at 08:54 AM

My hand is not enough steady for the Flash earth drill. Do you have a trick?
The image sure is better
I will keep trying
Paul
On my way to the print place to get hard copy of the INEGI downloads
======

Hi Paul, Google Earth is real handy to get waypoints of points along th
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e road. The area of Basketball Hill is under cloud cover on GE, but clear as a bell on Bing... pick Bing here: http://www.flashearth.com/

Just move the screen so that the target spot is in the small cross-hair in the center and read the GPS. You have to choose between decimal degrees or degrees, minutes and seconds. The decimal minutes we typically use will need to be converted from either of the others. You can enter them in the GE go box and it will convert it, or use one of the map datum converters on the Internet: http://www.fcc.gov/encyclopedia/degrees-minutes-seconds-tofr... or http://www.onlineconversion.com/map_decimaldegrees.htm or http://www.directionsmag.com/site/latlong-converter/

[Edited on 4-17-2015 by PaulW]

David K - 4-17-2015 at 11:49 AM

My hand is not enough steady for the Flash earth drill. Do you have a trick?
The image sure is better
I will keep trying
Paul
On my way to the print place to get hard copy of the INEGI downloads
======

1) Go to http://flashearth.com
2) On the left menu box click Bing Maps
3) Zoom in to where in the world you want to see, or enter a GPS waypoint in the Search box.

OR, just go to Bing Maps: http://bing.com/maps and zoom in. You can pick Bird's Eye or Aerial for two different images of the same place.

[Edited on 4-19-2015 by David K]

Photos from Sheri...

David K - 4-18-2015 at 05:03 PM

Sheri sent me a disc with the photos she took during the Pole Line Run.
Here are 25 of them:

Cohabuzo Junction

Saturday Night Camp, Arroyo el Sáiz

Karl and Harald

Coleman Insta-Tent, easy even in wind!

Pop up camper, even easier!

Sunday morning on the 1942 Pole Line Road, eastbound.

Continued...

David K - 4-18-2015 at 05:04 PM

...

Mike

Cobblestone Road

Great shot of Basketball Hill climb.

Arroyo Jaquegel looking west from the Suzuki wreck area.

Why the road has its name.

German 4X4 Camp in Arroyo Jaquegel, Sunday night.

Road building!

The good road from the wells out to Hwy. 5 at La Ventana.

Thank you for sharing Sheri!!!

ChuckMRN - 4-18-2015 at 10:51 PM

Thanks for sharing Sheri! Got this put together tonight. It's free music so should be able to watch on mobile devices too.

Chuck

PLR 2015

David K - 4-19-2015 at 07:04 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ChuckMRN

Thanks for sharing Sheri! Got this put together tonight. It's free music so should be able to watch on mobile devices too.

Chuck

PLR 2015

GREAT... thank you Chuck for producing the nice video (and with music that doesn't make your ears bleed)! Lot's of good footage of Basketball Hill shows that this 73 year old road is no walk in the park!

PaulW - 4-19-2015 at 07:28 AM

Excellent.

Mexitron - 4-19-2015 at 09:39 AM

Nice video!

TMW - 4-19-2015 at 11:05 AM

Wow that was great. Thanks

San Felipe 1948

PaulW - 4-19-2015 at 11:25 AM

We enjoyed the article and passed it around to the family and thyey all found it interesting and enjoyable.
Thanks,Paul
==========

....

David K - 4-19-2015 at 11:44 AM

Great... Desert Magazines are just awesome... and they are all online to read, as well!

Two web sites have all of the Desert Magazines online:

http://www.mydesertmagazine.com/Desert_magazine_archive.html

http://dezertmagazine.com/original-desert-magazine/
(the second site is owned by Nomad dzeertmag2 )

Genecag - 4-19-2015 at 01:16 PM

Cool adventure!

ChuckMRN - 4-19-2015 at 02:25 PM

Thanks so much for the kind words. Really enjoyed this adventure. When Joni makes a trip with me we are able to get a little more footage. Harder for me to manage all the stuff when I'm alone

Thanks again
Chuck

ehall - 4-19-2015 at 02:53 PM

Nice video Chuck. I got alot of airtime.

David K - 4-20-2015 at 08:18 AM

When Baja Angel came home last night, we watched it on the big screen TV (Blu-Ray player connects to You Tube)... just type in PLR2015 and the video (Ken's Jeep) appears!

She really wished she could have gone... it reminded her of Jeepin' on the Rubicon trail near Tahoe (where she went to high school). All day in low range 4WD... slow and sure!

bajatrailrider - 4-20-2015 at 08:50 PM

Thank You Sheri/David too much to enjoy. Since looking at all the rocks,and feeling them raking under the truck.I just had full skid plates made,From the front diff all the way to rear diff. :light:

David K - 4-21-2015 at 09:01 AM

Thank You Sheri/David too much to enjoy. Since looking at all the rocks,and feeling them raking under the truck.I just had full skid plates made,From the front diff all the way to rear diff. :light:

Sounds like a plan... I too (being non-lifted & stock suspension) had some scrapes below... Thankfully, Toyota does not have anything exposed down there that would kill the truck!

I saw you chatting with a mutual friend, Whistler over on the Nissan Frontier forum... He has been a good friend I met back in 2000... I read he stopped posting here because of the ... 'them' ... Too bad that the 'anti-Nomads' are allowed to chase off good guys like Glenn (Whistler). I hope he changes his mind and returns to Nomad!!

TMW - 4-21-2015 at 09:15 AM

I wonder if he (Whistler) ever finished his truck he was building and if so how well does it work for him.

ehall - 4-21-2015 at 01:27 PM

Thank You Sheri/David too much to enjoy. Since looking at all the rocks,and feeling them raking under the truck.I just had full skid platesmade,From the front diff all the way to rear diff. :light:

[/rquot
e]
Does this mean your truck is ready for the no wimps trail?

ehall - 4-21-2015 at 01:28 PM

Wow I screwed that post up good. Typing on a phone is difficult sometimes.

bajatrailrider - 4-21-2015 at 04:31 PM

Yes David,before I joined this site (Im on many other off road forums)I was told by many dont even bother with Baja Nomad.Was told about the marooons.The ones that did not go on this trip.Here you are David you spend hundreds of hours,Writing posting pictures,Gps,maps.For all to enjoy.Then the marooons try to tell you and ABC what to do,when to do it,how to do it,what to do with what you find.marooons did not attend,but try to tell all what to do.I did not know all of you,but my own friends.All that went on trip,very cool people.Just down to earth great people,very respective.I Think best way for you,just let them post,but dont even answer them.Good thing is,They can post,but wont change a thing.

David K - 4-21-2015 at 04:51 PM

Yes David,before I joined this site (Im on many other off road forums)I was told by many dont even bother with Baja Nomad.Was told about the marooons.The ones that did not go on this trip.Here you are David you spend hundreds of hours,Writing posting pictures,Gps,maps.For all to enjoy.Then the marooons try to tell you and ABC what to do,when to do it,how to do it,what to do with what you find.marooons did not attend,but try to tell all what to do.I did not know all of you,but my own friends.All that went on trip,very cool people.Just down to earth great people,very respective.I Think best way for you,just let them post,but dont even answer them.Good thing is,They can post,but wont change a thing.

That's the truth... the player haters or anti-Nomads (as I call them) will quickly criticize a trip report... but you never or almost never see a trip report from them. They also will not reveal themselves here with a photo of themselves. I am real, I don't hide, I like to make friends, and I like to help people...

The founder of this forum (Doug) is a good friend I have known for 15 years. I was the first from the old Amigos de Baja site to join his new Nomad forums in 2002. When Amigos de Baja went off line without warning in 2003, I contacted everyone I could to let them know we were welcome on Doug's site.

Posting photos and maps and history and having get-togethers are all things Doug likes that I do or have done here, and it has helped grow Nomad as THE place to get Baja information. I also understand that there are new people here daily, and some of the anti-Nomads really get worked up if I cater to the newbies with some stuff that has been posted here in the past... as if my repeating things takes away their time here, lol! Just scroll past stuff if you have seen it and don't want to. The newbies appreciate the info... and so does the host of this site, and that is good enough for me.

Others like those of us on the Pole Line Trail trip are also open and friendly and helpful... I see it every time I am on a group trip in Baja. We all help each other. See our Nomad Mission Santa Maria trip of 2010. Neal Johns broke down... we got him out (and to Baja Cactus, El Rosario, where Antonio went into action), it was a great trip with great memories and new friendships made: http://vivabaja.com/msm2010/

bajatrailrider - 4-21-2015 at 07:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ehall

Thank You Sheri/David too much to enjoy. Since looking at all the rocks,and feeling them raking under the truck.I just had full skid platesmade,From the front diff all the way to rear diff. :light:

[/rquot
e]
Does this mean your truck is ready for the no wimps trail?

Hey Ed if ABC says I can make it then Im ready.I would like to go on the dirt bikes first.

Ken Cooke - 4-21-2015 at 09:31 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ChuckMRN

Thanks for sharing Sheri! Got this put together tonight. It's free music so should be able to watch on mobile devices too.

Chuck

PLR 2015

Great production, Chuck!!! :bounce:

POLE LINE ROAD MILEAGE MAP

David K - 4-22-2015 at 10:27 PM

Experimenting with the most user friendly methods to make trip maps, here is one I did with my recorded mileages between points along the road, pointed to with arrows (mileage between the arrows).

*On the west end, the first mileage is from the bottom of the summit/ locked gate (25 miles south of Cohabuzo Jcn.) on the detour route to...
*Rancho Huatamote road. 2.4 (if gate was open, subtract ~1 mile)
The next points are:
*Left at Y (Rancho/ Cañon Jamau road). 1.7
*The white water tank. 3.7
*Cobblestone road near Cañada de Enmedio. 2.8
*Leave Enmedio for bottom of Basketball Hill. 2.4
*Cobblestone ramp into Cañada Jaquegel. 1.6
*Leave Jaquegel to south. 3.9
*Briefly drop into Jaquegel final time. 3.8
*T Junction. 4.0
*Arroyo Grande. 4.3
*Wells (water pumps) for gold mine on Hwy. 5. 5.3
(Hwy. 5 by La Ventana is 12.5 miles east).

David K - 4-23-2015 at 10:55 AM

Map with labels added:

If I put too much text on the map it spoils it, but if I don't say enough, it can be unclear.

The full road log was posted earlier, so I just used some points from that log that are events on the map.

1942 Pole Line Road mileage as traveled in 2015 on modern map. The 73 mile road from Hwy. 2 to the gate is not shown. The Pole Line Road southeast from Arroyo Grande is also not shown.

Map Notes:

Locked Gate/ 1st Summit Rd. to the Huatamote road (2.4): mileage shown is on the detour route (if the gate is open, subtract ~1 mile).
Just 0.1 mile west of the Huatamote Road is where the 2nd or Middle Summit road joins the Pole Line Road. 0.5 mile west of the Huatamote Road is where the detour road meets the Pole Line Road.

The Jamau Y is also known as 'Left at Y'. Rancho Jamau may no longer be there. A road once climbed the mountain beyond, making this the Cañon Jamau or 3rd Summit road.

The 'Cobblestone' point shown is the third cobblestone going east, or the first of three upon exiting Cañada Enmedio going west. This was very close to entering Cañada Enmedio eastbound.

Enmedio/Basketball is where the road leaves Enmedio and soon is at the west side of Basketball Hill, with the first telephone poles seen going east.

Jaquegel/Basketball is the east side of Basketball Hill where it meets Cañada Jaquegel via a cobblestone ramp (palms nearby).

Jaquegel (west) is the point where the eastbound road exits Jaquegel to the south (after 0.9 mile travel in the wide wash). A wrecked Samurai is 0.1 mile west of where the road enters the wide wash.

Jaquegel (east) is where the road briefly drops into Jaquegel a final time, road construction was performed here to exit Jaquegel.

T Junction. The map is not accurate, it is actually to the west of that narrow mountain’s north end, not to the north-east of it, where the map places the road junction. This explains why the 4.0 mileage is longer looking than the 4.3 mileage that follows (eastbound).

The 5.3 miles from the Arroyo Grande junction to the wells, is in the arroyo, not on the road shown east of the arroyo.

[Edited on 4-23-2015 by David K]

Pole Line Road on 4 Topos (labels + miles)

David K - 4-23-2015 at 10:06 PM

Please enjoy my work, today's project:

David K - 4-25-2015 at 10:45 AM

While seeking some reports on the building of the Pole Line Road, I found this little gem:

After a conference in San Diego, on cooperation in defense, attended by General C a r d e n a s, controls were placed on fishing activities in the Gulf of California and the Pacific Coast north of Mazatlan. Soldiers and volunteer militia were assigned to construct telephone and telegraph lines and roads in the peninsula.

More posted here:
http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=78618

PaulW - 4-25-2015 at 01:57 PM

Where do Enmedio and Jaquegel merge?
The answer is it is not obvious even with the topo in front of me.
The picture sells the story
And here are some coords I pulled off the topo then loaded them into my GPS to get better accuracy by matching the waypoint to the real GPS track.
Junction of Enmedio and Jaquegel 31 35.358, -115 25.120
PLR leaves Jaquegel 31 34.15, -115 26.029
PLR then shortly enters Enmedio at 31 24.227, -115 26.056. And yes the PLR leaves then enters Enmedio in a short distance that I did not document. You can see that track in the pic.
Cliff in Enmedio where the Zuk came tumbling from higher up in Enmedio is very close to the Jct of the two washes. At 31 35.2, -11525.147 This is where I drove for my first trip. This year the canyon is filled with big boulders that prevented my return to view the cliffs.
It’s interesting to me that Enmedio which drains from quite a ways north is just a tributary of Jaquegel which is a much larger drainage in the overall scheme.

David K - 4-25-2015 at 04:21 PM

Gulick and the Mexican topos put the junction of Cañada Enmedio (Gulick calls Arroyo Jamau) and Jaquegel (Gulick spells Jaquejel) where your blue line meets the yellow. Nice work!

PaulW - 4-25-2015 at 05:44 PM

On my first trip I drove by the exit from Jaquegel. And I drove to the cliffs, found the Zuk. I certainly saw the two cliff areas, but not until today did I recognize the lay of the land. We all headed back to find a passage. The no name small wash exit did not seem to be a good choice to drive. Gave it a try and shortly found a hard place, back tracked and saw the faint track up the bank. Success continued.
On the most recent trip I found Jaquegel completely blocked at the narrows just past the new Zuk location.
If I go back to do the PLR again I will probably walk to the cliffs for pics.

David K - 4-26-2015 at 09:29 AM

On my first trip I drove by the exit from Jaquegel. And I drove to the cliffs, found the Zuk. I certainly saw the two cliff areas, but not until today did I recognize the lay of the land. We all headed back to find a passage. The no name small wash exit did not seem to be a good choice to drive. Gave it a try and shortly found a hard place, back tracked and saw the faint track up the bank. Success continued.
On the most recent trip I found Jaquegel completely blocked at the narrows just past the new Zuk location.
If I go back to do the PLR again I will probably walk to the cliffs for pics.

On the geology map, it shows a road bypassing Basketball Hill and staying in Enmedio to the Jaquegel junction (Zuk), plus a branch road going north from it...

Here is that Geology Map from 1971 showing roads in the Basketball Hill area. There is an overlay (GE) of my blue line (true PLR location) and markers...

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 11:16 AM

I have driven the north bypass of the waterfall in 1986 - was pretty easy

there is also an interesting south alternative to the established trail (GE shows most of it)

David K - 4-26-2015 at 12:10 PM

I have driven the north bypass of the waterfall in 1986 - was pretty easy

there is also an interesting south alternative to the established trail (GE shows most of it)

ON GE, the Basketball Hill region is under cloud cover, here is Bing with labels of the road and arroyos. I am curious where your south alternative is?

[Edited on 4-26-2015 by David K]

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 12:31 PM

here we go:

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 12:37 PM

here is the waterfall bypass

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 12:42 PM

here is the road into North Canyon (nameless on map)

David K - 4-26-2015 at 01:25 PM

Cool... how about the south road you mentioned?

PaulW - 4-26-2015 at 03:45 PM

Harald
How about a markup line on the H11B25 PDF?
Here is how -- Open the PDF Pull down menu:
View
Comment
Drawing markup
Now see the pencil in the tools side bar. Click on it for color choice.
Use eraser for mistakes.
Thanks PW

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 04:19 PM

rather than boring you with faint lines, here is the kmz file:
PLR select

[Edited on 4-26-2015 by 4x4abc]

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 04:32 PM

David,

how did you get the 1971 map? INEGI only has a 1976 version (showing different road detail)

4x4abc - 4-26-2015 at 04:33 PM

question, how do you do an overlay or combine topos with GE?

PaulW - 4-26-2015 at 05:18 PM

We tried to do it with Powerpoint overlays. Huge time eater because the images do not line up even when you pin the same coords at 4 corners.
Very advanced.
There has to be a better way ,but I do not know?
Pw

question, how do you do an overlay or combine topos with GE?

David K - 4-26-2015 at 05:47 PM