BajaNomad - Vaquita report on 60 Minutes

Vaquita report on 60 Minutes

Frigatebird - 5-22-2016 at 08:15 PM

This may have aired previously, but in LA, this story will broadcast this hour (8 PM Sun 5/22).
YMMV

BNSC

[Edited on 5-24-2016 by Frigatebird]

Ateo - 5-22-2016 at 08:48 PM

Awesome. Gracias.

Hook - 5-22-2016 at 10:03 PM

Too little, too late.

The story of Mexican fisheries.

mtgoat666 - 5-22-2016 at 10:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook

Too little, too late.

The story of Mexican fisheries.

The sea of Cortez was destroyed long ago.

People will continue to overfish, it's impossible to stop.

Human nature is to chase the short term gain, long term management requires strong government.

In the USA the right wing hates government control of the excesses of capitalism. In Mexico the government is too weak to control the excesses of capitalism.

Personally, what is most infuriating is silly superstitious nonsense from China causing poaching. It is illogical, and the net result is so destructive.

People are stupid and selfish.

[Edited on 5-23-2016 by mtgoat666]

chuckie - 5-23-2016 at 05:39 AM

I watched it. It was pretty fatalistic, didn't seem to offer much hope. A sad thing indeed, but like much else in the SOC,been coming for a long time....

woody with a view - 5-23-2016 at 06:19 AM

Goat, you claim that US drug users create the demand that the cartels are serving yet Chinese superstitions aren't the cause of Mexicans selling fish bladders. You can't sit on both sides of the fence at once.

mtgoat666 - 5-23-2016 at 06:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by woody with a view

Goat, you claim that US drug users create the demand that the cartels are serving yet Chinese superstitions aren't the cause of Mexicans selling fish bladders. You can't sit on both sides of the fence at once.

? Don't the Chinese create the market for fish bladders?

Not the same fence. Different fences.

PaulW - 5-23-2016 at 07:26 AM

Online
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-endangered-sea-mammal...

bezzell - 5-23-2016 at 09:34 AM

Estimates utliizing SCIENCE are that 150-200 species of plant, insect, bird and mammal become extinct every 24 hours. This is nearly 1,000 times the “natural” or “background” rate and, say many biologists, is greater than anything the world has experienced since dinosaur expiration. Mostly attributable to human footprint. But as 'the bloated one' likes to point out ... humans are by far the most important species (because you know ... a god made us from dirt and then breathed life into our nostrils !!)

such ignorance is proving to be so costly.

[Edited on 5-23-2016 by bezzell]

David K - 5-23-2016 at 10:10 AM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

Online
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-endangered-sea-mammal...

Thank you for the link Paul.

ncampion - 5-23-2016 at 12:50 PM

This may not be "PC" but as was pointed out, species go extinct on a regular basis. Maybe it's just time to let the Vaqita go the way of other animals who were unable to adapt to the changing pressures on their survival. And yes some of those pressures come from the animal homo sapiens, but there are probably other pressures as well. It's stupid for man to think we should save every animal from extinction no matter what the cost. Someday we will be extinct as well. I understand that it's a "feel good" thing to many people to "save" cute animals, but it's also a part of the natural world and Darwinian evolution.

bezzell - 5-23-2016 at 03:08 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ncampion

This may not be "PC" but as was pointed out, species go extinct on a regular basis. Maybe it's just time to let the Vaqita go the way of other animals who were unable to adapt to the changing pressures on their survival. And yes some of those pressures come from the animal homo sapiens, but there are probably other pressures as well. It's stupid for man to think we should save every animal from extinction no matter what the cost. Someday we will be extinct as well. I understand that it's a "feel good" thing to many people to "save" cute animals, but it's also a part of the natural world and Darwinian evolution.

just wow. what else can be said.
you obviously missed or chose not to believe (your right) the ... 'This is nearly 1,000 times the “natural” or “background” rate'

'nother margie?

ncampion - 5-23-2016 at 04:29 PM

Quote: Originally posted by bezzell

just wow. what else can be said.
you obviously missed or chose not to believe (your right) the ... 'This is nearly 1,000 times the “natural” or “background” rate'

'nother margie?

Just saying, less than 100 animals left, better to let them go or do you suggest spending 100's of Millions of dollars to try to "recover" an animal that apparently will not make it in the wild under today's pressures. Not that I don't believe your statement about 1,000 X but you didn't cite a reference that I could review.
BTW, couldn't find the word "margie" in the dictionary (other than as a girl's name), maybe you misspelled it?

David K - 5-23-2016 at 04:46 PM

While I tend to agree that if the Vaquita was a slug or scorpion, we would not be all worked up over its extinction or should disrupt human life over it. But because it is a "panda porpoise" all cute and all... well, we can't help ourselves.

Like the California Condor, the Vaquita life cycle may have been interrupted more by human action than other aspects of Nature. If the Condor was not the largest North American bird, maybe it would not get the attention it has?

dtbushpilot - 5-23-2016 at 07:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

While I tend to agree that if the Vaquita was a slug or scorpion, we would not be all worked up over its extinction or should disrupt human life over it. But because it is a "panda porpoise" all cute and all... well, we can't help ourselves.

Like the California Condor, the Vaquita life cycle may have been interrupted more by human action than other aspects of Nature. If the Condor was not the largest North American bird, maybe it would not get the attention it has?

If the Condor's last stand had been in Mexico we would only see them in books today. Unfortunately the Vaquita will be gone soon. :no:

Frigatebird - 5-23-2016 at 09:09 PM

It's upsetting to me that people & governments (same) won't make a stand (question the status quo) as our population ramps and the rest of nature is selected to endure only if it is compatible with our transformation of world.

A future overflowing with many more of our kind wanting to consume and live "the good life" of the post-industrialized western democracies is one that will only be occupied by the monocultures of Big Ag, and of course, rats & other vermin, coyotes, crows, starlings, weeds, and the like. Can't wait, and it won't end well for most involved.

Rant done.

mtgoat666 - 5-23-2016 at 09:17 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Frigatebird

It's upsetting to me that people & governments (same) won't make a stand (question the status quo) as our population ramps and the rest of nature is selected to endure only if it is compatible with our transformation of world.

A future overflowing with many more of our kind wanting to consume and live "the good life" of the post-industrialized western democracies is one that will only be occupied by the monocultures of Big Ag, and of course, rats & other vermin, coyotes, crows, starlings, weeds, and the like. Can't wait, and it won't end well for most involved.

Rant done.

The world is going to hell in a hand basket, and the old white men of USA have allied behind Trump to save themselves,...

God save us!

DENNIS - 5-24-2016 at 06:30 AM

Ohhh boy........BajaNomad is gettin' heated up just like the good 'ol daze. :bounce:

StuckSucks - 5-24-2016 at 08:42 AM

Another version from YouTube:

60 Minutes: The Last Vaquitas

DENNIS - 5-25-2016 at 06:52 AM

Not sure of Bezzel's commitment to clarity over brevity, but Goat? Well.....he grows on you, not always in a clinical fashion, but at times entertaining as well. He's been consistent for a while, as you can see.
Thing is, in time you'll feel as most here do, the less Goat says, the better. [I say that in a kind way, Mr. Cloven Hoofed can eater]

dtbushpilot - 5-25-2016 at 08:00 PM

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

willardguy - 5-25-2016 at 08:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

maybe these lipsticked little rascals have seen the writing on the wall and are pulling up stakes and heading south?

dtbushpilot - 5-26-2016 at 08:13 AM

Quote: Originally posted by willardguy

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

maybe these lipsticked little rascals have seen the writing on the wall and are pulling up stakes and heading south?

May be, wouldn't be the first time a specie moved to a better environment to avoid extinction...

bezzell - 5-26-2016 at 08:49 AM

Quote: Originally posted by seasider

Hopefully in future, both will take the time to back up statements,thoughts and philosophy with links and provide links when asked which at this time, neither one thinks is important in order to get the point across.

While I understand 100% what you're saying, this has gotta be a joke!?
Baja Nomad history has proven time and again what a colossal waste of time that is. Even peer-reviewed science !!

If you're interested ... it's all there at your fingertips.

sancho - 5-26-2016 at 09:11 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ncampion

I understand that it's a "feel good" thing to many people to "save" cute animals, but it's also a part of the natural world and Darwinian evolution.

I'm not sure Chuck would approve of your reference to him,
with your logic, Scammon and the rest of the whalers
were just folllowing NATURAL
selection, natural being the key word. your use of that phrase
is incorrect. Seems a contradiction
for folks to appreciate Baja, and not be on board with
any and all conservation efforts, shameful in my opinion

bajadogs - 5-26-2016 at 11:18 AM

no

Frigatebird - 5-26-2016 at 12:27 PM

Quote:

...I doubt he would approve of us humans trying to save the vaquita, or any other species...

Even trying to save the ones who should know they may eventually be next in line?

BigBearRider - 5-26-2016 at 02:56 PM

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

Pics?

I've never seen one.

How do you know it was a Vaquita? In the water, I'd think they'd be difficult to distinguish from other porpoises unless you are close? Did you see the eye patch?

Are you saying you've seen them in BCS before, or just seen them before?

BigBearRider - 5-26-2016 at 02:58 PM

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

Quote: Originally posted by willardguy

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

maybe these lipsticked little rascals have seen the writing on the wall and are pulling up stakes and heading south?

May be, wouldn't be the first time a specie moved to a better environment to avoid extinction...

I wonder if BCS really is a better environment. There is no ban on net fishing, and the Navy and Sea Shepherd guys are up north.

BigBearRider - 5-26-2016 at 03:00 PM

Quote: Originally posted by seasider

I was out on a tour boat last year when all of a sudden we were in a big school of porpoises or something like that. I asked the skipper and I'm sure he said "vaquita,lots here". While he was talking there was a bump and we all looked around and could see he had just hit a vaquita and it was laying dead at the surface. I told skip to head back but he didn't want to.
Finally I told him to get the boat back cause I was paying by the hour. We searched for awhile but the vaquita must have sunk. A shame really, cause I wanted to get it stuffed and put it up on the wall. Anyway, I don't know why those scientists figure there is less than one hundred and only around San Felipe. There probly thousands of em out there. You just got to know where to look.

Where was your boat tour?

I really hope the guy didn't kill a Vaquita.

I would like to think there are thousands, but suspect that is not the case.

bajadogs - 5-26-2016 at 03:36 PM

Quote: Originally posted by seasider

Quote: Originally posted by sancho

Quote: Originally posted by ncampion

I doubt he would approve of us humans trying to save the vaquita, or any other species. It would undermine the basic principle of his theory:survival of the fittest.

Ugh. Kill everything man! :mad:

Darwin was observation.. not activism.
Science
Your comment was offensive if not sarcastic

dtbushpilot - 5-26-2016 at 04:40 PM

Quote: Originally posted by BigBearRider

Quote: Originally posted by dtbushpilot

We saw a Vaquita today while out fishing in BCS, not the first one we have seen.

I've seen 3 in the last 5 years, all in BCS. They aren't difficult to distinguish if you know what they look like, my Mexican captain and I both know what they look like and how they act in the water. They are more boat shy than other porpoise species so getting close for a picture isn't easy or necessary for me. The one I saw yesterday was near the northern border of Cabo Pulmo Marine Park.

[Edited on 5-26-2016 by dtbushpilot]

dtbushpilot - 5-27-2016 at 06:50 AM

Quote: Originally posted by seasider

Quote: Originally posted by BigBearRider

Quote: Originally posted by seasider

Where was your boat tour?

I really hope the guy didn't kill a Vaquita.

I would like to think there are thousands, but suspect that is not the case.

Sorry guys. I thought Dt was joking so that is why I posted what I did. There is nothing I can find that there has ever been a confirmed sighting of a vaquita in BCS or even as far south as LA Bay.

What proof would you require for "confirmation"? If I were to get a quick out of focus pix with my cell phone would it really matter? I'm probably mistaken, not the first time...