BajaNomad - Why does David K bug you so much?

Why does David K bug you so much?

Gypsy Jan - 2-5-2005 at 12:28 AM

I've been reading this forum for years and I don't understand where all this negative attitude towards him comes from.

I don't know the man, except from this forum and, in my experience, he only posts positive stories, and/or promotions of getogethers for likeminded bajalunatics, which are about the subject and not self aggrandizing.

It is patently obvious that he has a sincere love of the subject of Baja and an encyclopedic knowledge of its history.

I think that his contributions on the board about the history of Baja are very instructive.

I am puzzled as to why a great number of his posts are attacked?

surfer jim - 2-5-2005 at 12:48 AM

Oh boy, this should be good...

correct answer...."because he gets go to BAJA more than I do" :saint:

Gypsy Jan - 2-5-2005 at 12:53 AM

OK, Surfer Jim,

I guess that you are talking about,

"Baja Envy"?

:lol:

David K - 2-5-2005 at 01:00 AM

I am guessing you are reading old stuff... things have been very peaceful here recently.

Thanks for your kind support and I am happy you enjoy my stuff...

I was just telling Elizabeth that for some, my writing is pretty 'black & white'... you know, just the details (milages, GPS, dates). To counter my stoic trip reports, we are fortunate to have people like Mike Humfreville, Eli, and others who write with 'color', and present their inner most feelings in their words. They paint a picture with their stories... where as I do the lines and numbers (without the paint)!

Why I get some grief and hate (in the past, at least)??? I suspect it is for different reasons... some take aim because I am one of the most vocal (appear here a lot)... some want me to shut up and keep my findings a secret... some think I make stuff up or steal info. because nobody could possibly know so much about various Baja places or events?!

Well, I hope they get over it, because I am not going anywhere (except to Baja). My reports go to you guys (Baja Nomads) who also love and respect Baja. Graffiti and trash is NOT caused by my trip reports, and that should be what people get mad at.

My mission reports are designed to inform and cause appreciation for what remains. If we know about it and appreciate it, we will have value in preserving it... helping the Mexicans preserve the sites for future generations...

Thanks again Gypsy... and I hope things remain peaceful! Come to the April Booksigning at the Pyramid Resort, the Baja Rosario Festival in July, and if I have a Viva Baja #5, as well!

[Edited on 2-7-2005 by David K]

Thank You David

BajaRob - 2-5-2005 at 07:32 AM

I often view your website as a part of trip planning. Black and white without the fluff is exactly what I am looking for. Thank you for sharing with us. Some others apparently have too much time on their hands. Keep it up. Rob

David K.

academicanarchist - 2-5-2005 at 07:47 AM

I see no reason for anybody to be bad mouthing anybody else on this forum. David K., among other things, shares his information with us, maintains the Baja California mission web site, posts his photos, although they often need to be edited, and hosts the party for Baja enthusiasts.

Bruce R Leech - 2-5-2005 at 08:00 AM

I enjoy very much David K and his writings. If you have a question about Baja he will generally give you the best answer.

But one of the good things about this Forum is people are not afraid to be critical. when I make a mistake some one will jump on it right away. this helps to keep posts correct.

David K puts his name on every Post. that means he stands behind what he says. the ones that are posting garbage don't do that.

The Sculpin - 2-5-2005 at 08:55 AM

Gypsy Jan...don't know where you're getting this from, but it dates back to the original Amigos board. When the Amigos board started, it was mostly a bunch of baja rats that loved to share stuff like the best/worst dirt road from La Pastora to Canejo, which shocks and tires worked best, who were the best pangueros, where to find "companionship", and of course, the fish. The lures, the lures, the lures....The information was very good, but it was also very cryptic. Of immense benefit to those who knew, and practically useless to those who didn't. As the popularity of the board grew, so did the way it exchanged information. Pretty soon, the new people on the board were actually IDENTIFYING spots!!!! Giving GPS co-ordinates! and horror of all horrors...actually using the board for wholesale get-togethers - they were called BBBB's. Boy did that set some of the "old timers" off!!! From info to social club in a matter of months! For some, David K became the poster child for the "new breed Amigos", even though he's known baja longer than most of the "old timers"....go figure. So he took some heat. What the "old crew" ( me included) realized is that the days of having baja to yourself were gone, if they ever existed at all.

David's a great guy. He's living his life with passion, and trying to pass that passion on to others. You can't do much better than that.

[Edited on 2-5-2005 by The Sculpin]

I have never met David, but love his stuff.

BajaVida - 2-5-2005 at 09:23 AM

In fact David, why don't you join us on our trip to BOLA? We can meet you near the border mid afternoon on 4/7 and you can be back on 4/15 to file your taxes.

Thebajarunner and El Almirante (and about 10 others) are going with me.

My negative feeling towards David is envy, but that is not his fault. It is a good thing.

[Edited on 2-5-2005 by BajaVida]

Neal Johns - 2-5-2005 at 09:40 AM

Because:

1. He has a few books I don't have...

2. He has Elizabeth and I don't...

I could go on and on... :lol:

Eli - 2-5-2005 at 10:17 AM

When ever I think of David K., my mind returns to sitting at a round table with him, Dad, Capt. Mike, and Bernie.

I wasn't paying to much attention to the conversation, my mind was on the shine in David's eyes as his chin rested on his forearms and I watched how he hung on every dang word the ol Man had to say.

Well, You can know for sure my love and respect grew to curicumspect for David K. that fine day.

[Edited on 2-5-2005 by Eli]

I'll admit to locking horns.....

Hook - 2-5-2005 at 11:10 AM

......with David in the past, and being one of the "old crew" that the Sculpin refers to. Many of us felt it was a poor use of that board to organize every detail of all the BBBB get-togethers; that an email distribution list would have sufficed. Several of us publicly suggested this to the BBBBers and were accused of trying to censor the board. In a sense, that was true, but there was a reason for it.

You see, that old Amigos software was a bear to sort through posts for info and all the BBBB posts began to become a significant impediment to searching for basic info that many wanted. Yeah, the BBBB posts were indirectly about Baja, but it was really alot like reading the minutes to an organizing committee function for a party.

The compromise that Earl and Co. (I assume with the input of David) came up with was a Q & A board for those of us who simply wanted the basic info that we used to glean from the main board. In short, WE (if I may use this term, collectively, for many of us old timers on that board) were told to move to the other board. Well, it had about a third of the traffic of the main board. Answers to questions were slow in coming. In a couple of cases, I posed questions on the main board (out of frustration) and was told to move on to the other board. I think that rubbed many of us the wrong way. Probably unfairly, we blamed David for this, as we knew what the board was like before him and what it became after his arrival.

In retrospect, the inconvenieces that the BBBB logjam caused, certainly didn't outweigh the good info David provided. We just felt that both could have co-existed; easy info and party planning.

Fortunately, software improved that allowed people to "surf" through subjects much more easily. Unfortunately, those software improvements were never realized on the Amigos board. So, many of us moved on.

Then there is an intangible element to some of David's posts that can come off as being very pompous. I really doubt he intends them that way, but many sense that tone. Hey, when you are, without question, the eminent authority on land travel on much of the peninsula, there are times you are going to come across as being superior. Well, his knowledge in this area IS superior to most all. I guess that can also rub some oldtimers the wrong way.

I have never felt animosity towards him for revealing too much info about the peninsula. That's a myopic view. If we want to blame anyone, it would have to be Ray Cannon. He, more than anyone, gave Baja fever to the US.

David does, however, appear to have the most virulent strain these days. :biggrin:

Now I welcome his posts wholeheartedly. I really think that some of the scars of past conflicts have made him a more humble carrier of the fever. He really has a great sense of humor.

Anyway, that's my recollection on this whole thing. I have still yet to meet him. Maybe at the El Rosario festival?

TMW - 2-5-2005 at 11:29 AM

I would like David much more if he would finally and truthfully tell us where the lost missions are really at, instead of teasing us with tid bits. I think he's found the treasures and is keeping it for himself. That's why he can go to Baja more than us (and leave his business unattanded) and why he's thinking of buying a new Toyota. I'm sure he will say this isn't true.

I agree with Baja Vida

thebajarunner - 2-5-2005 at 12:02 PM

David should go to Baja with us in April,
in fact, I would be willing to leave Baja Vida in Oceanside and take David in his place, we could pick up BV on the way home and his lovely wife would never know the difference.
Think about it, DK, best offer I can muster up today...
oh yeah, hope you can drink lots of Pacificos to fill the void BV would leave.

Baja Arriba!!

David K - 2-5-2005 at 12:50 PM

All right you guys... you are making me blush

I actually hope that my numerous posts inspire the rest of you to post your stories if you don't already.

I do get several U2Us and emails that encourage me to 'stay the course' and not let the handfull of disgruntled to push me away.

Yes, I am a generation AFTER the one that gave us Ray Cannon, Howard Gulick, Harry Crosby, Choral Pepper, Erle Stanley Gardner, Tom Miller, Marvin Patchen and Mike McMahan. These are the people that opened Baja to the world with their books, maps, and photos. I have personally met every one except Gardner, but my friendship with Choral Pepper gave me a deep understanding of 'Uncle Erle' and his love of this peninsula. Choral's note to my Viva Baja guests where she compares me to Gardner has a deep effect on my soul.

From Amigos de Baja, I learned that there was more than just a handfull of people afflicted with Baja Fever. I wanted to meet these folks (you folks) and confirm that not only is it okay to love Baja so much, but it is a good thing!

The two small gatherings that we Amigos had (jeans pizza party and the San Clemente Pier gathering, both in 2000) showed me that it would be great to have a regular meeting or party... Viva Baja was born... and it was good!

The first camping party organized off the Amigos board was hosted by El Camote and I lead the two days' expeditions (Sulfur Mine & Shell Island on Sat. and Matomi Canyon on Sun.) President's Day, 2001. That Matomi Gang event was great... last year (2004) we repeated the weekend.

The BBBB events (Boojum Buddies Baja Bash) are not mine... they are the creation of 'M' (Michelle). She saw the magic of these Baja people getting together and thought it would be great to have organized camping parties in Baja.

It is all about our love for Baja California, afterall... There is plenty of Baja out there... and our Internet postings are not going to ruin it. The people that go to Baja who are NOT part of this group (Baja Nomads) are more to be feared...

Because of Baja Nomad and Amigos de Baja before it, we inter-relate our concerns and teach each other what is important. Simple things like hauling out what you haul in, don't paint graffiti, try and learn Spanish and make friends with the people of Baja California are all good ideas that will keep Baja a pleasure for years to come.

Thank you for the kind words... please join me in sharing the love of Baja California with your fellow Nomads and Amigos... Let's keep this a good, positive experience and deal with concerns in a friendly manner....

Viva Baja everybody!!!!

Hook

Baja Bernie - 2-5-2005 at 01:02 PM

I am most impressed with your ability to step outside yourself and evaluate what really went on.

It has bothered me for a long time that David did seem to act like a lightening rod for some.

Like a lot of us I have been coming to Baja since 1964 and I think I know a lot about its people but when I start writing a story or a book about Baja I always check it out with "The Baja Connection"----for a kid he just knows too damn much about our Baja.

He also owns a few more books than I do but I am gaining.

JESSE - 2-5-2005 at 01:02 PM

David is the Dalai Lama of Baja

Although I like David

jrbaja - 2-5-2005 at 01:10 PM

Seems to me that for advice on Baja, Jesse would be a little more qualified for current information from someone who does more than vacation here and have a lot of books. :light:

Unless of course, you are looking for coordinates of well know places (now) and stories of family vacations. :?:

But then, I guess if you aren't here, anything helps!

David K - 2-5-2005 at 01:54 PM

So, I guess I should take JESSE with me when I go exploring the interior of his state to make it legitimate? That's okay with me, as Jesse is a cool dude... So is Ferna, Antonio, Doc, and my other Mexican friends. In fact, Doc was with me on one trip and Antonio on another... So, that is at least two web pages of mine you can trust JR!

I don't see an invisible line (border) making where I was born or live more qualified to write about a place visited. I never have called myself an expert on Baja, because I am not... I just like writing about the interesting places I have visited there.

Any person who loves to write about some place they go to, should... What nationality they are should not matter. Judge a person by the content of his character... not the color of his skin (King).

JESSE - 2-5-2005 at 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
So, I guess I should take JESSE with me when I go exploring the interior of his state to make it legitimate? That's okay with me, as Jesse is a cool dude... So is Ferna, Antonio, Doc, and my other Mexican friends. In fact, Doc was with me on one trip and Antonio on another... So, that is at least two web pages of mine you can trust JR!

I don't see an invisible line (border) making where I was born or live more qualified to write about a place visited. I never have called myself an expert on Baja, because I am not... I just like writing about the interesting places I have visited there.

Any person who loves to write about some place they go to, should... What nationality they are should not matter. Judge a person by the content of his character... not the color of his skin (King).

David knows far more about Baja than i know, i might know the cities and the social aspects of Baja better, but he is hands down far more informed about traveling and exploring Baja.

lizard lips - 2-5-2005 at 02:25 PM

I have lived in Baja for the last 17 years and have been coming here since my folks had their place close to Estero Beach since I was 3. I tune into this site to get information from all of you who travel to places in Baja that I have only heard about and hope that one day I will visit. The information that David K. has related is well worth the read. He has not once put anyone down and always has a kind word. He is the first to help if someone is having a problem and offers his polite wisdom to those in need. Is he an expert? Probably not, but he is more of an expert that anyone I know, myself included. Keep it up David!

In support of David K

Barry A. - 2-5-2005 at 02:38 PM

I have been camping in Baja since 1954 and I, for one, have learned more from David K's postings than any other person. He posts exactly the stuff that I want to know, which is more on the historical and exploring aspects of back-country Baja, without getting too technical. So, he gets my vote as the most interesting and knowledgable person on the board, and I would hate to see him change anything about the way he posts. I cannot immagine why he would "annoy" anybody. Barry

To TW

academicanarchist - 2-5-2005 at 03:47 PM

TW. There are no lost missions in Baja California, just stories and legends.

bajalou - 2-5-2005 at 06:04 PM

I've lived full time in Baja Calif. for almost 10 years and was coming on several trips a year for a few years before that. (first trip about 1963). I know without a doubt that David, Mike H, Mexitron, Taco de Baja, Neal Johns and any number more know more about the whole of Baja than I. Living here only lets me know quite a bit about a little area, these others explore and report on a much larger portion of this land we love. I certainly need their reports to keep me reaching out for new destinations - not seeing the same old ones all the time.
Thanks David - (and all the rest of you explorers) - keep the reports coming.

:biggrin:

I have learned so much !!!

Sonora Wind - 2-5-2005 at 07:08 PM

From David K places in Baja I will never see but now feel a connection. From Jesse places I will never surf but I feel the VIBE. From JR more than I ever wanted to know about bambo. Come to think of it, I still don't know thit about bambo. Come on JR give up the bambo info. See you all at the signing of the books III. :cool:

It's all good

Packoderm - 2-5-2005 at 07:26 PM

About David K, I say leave him alone and let him do his thing. The kind of tourism that he espouses to benefit Baja and her people is the antithesis of the Rockodile sort of developments that seem to have become the norm.

Baja Fever

rogerj1 - 2-5-2005 at 07:49 PM

When I got back from the trip that started it all for me with Baja, I was passionate to find people to talk about my new obsession with. I did all the typical newbie mistakes, asking where to buy property, what's the best city, etc, etc. To the credit of this board, nobody slammed me. David responded to my post with the description of my affliction. He said, my friend, you have "Baja Fever". Now I had an answer to why I was so obsessed about this magical part of the world. I was elated to find you all, and David, in particular, helped me to feel welcome. For that, I am grateful. Thank you David. Now everytime I get in my car, I can look at my "Baja Fever" sticker and get a little flashback.

Diver - 2-5-2005 at 08:02 PM

Gee David,

People drop your name and there are a record number of posts today......
You're Famous ! Like Brad Pitt

Nice to hear you speaking about Elizabeth; that she's still part of your scene.

Offense at David ?? No way !!

BornFisher - 2-5-2005 at 10:29 PM

Why does everyone think David gives out too much info?? Geeeeesh.......... he didn`t even mention the tortilla soup at Chela`s!!!

Dave is just doing his thing..... critics be dammed. He has no agenda except to inform. Unfortunately, some suffer from "BajaNomad Alpha Male" syndrome so they b-tch, whine, snivel, complain and ....... well you know!!

HotSchott - 2-6-2005 at 08:24 AM

David K is a big weenie!

Chevy's Rule!

bajaandy - 2-6-2005 at 08:40 AM

David K is like the Baja Nomad version of Don Quixote, only David is doing battle against the Sacred Saints of the Secret Spots.

Bob H - 2-6-2005 at 09:23 AM

If it hadn't been for David K, Audrey and I would have never seen Matomi or Shell Island! And, also, met a great bunch of folks last President's day weekend! David's love for Baja and his desire to share his knowledge is unsurpassed by anyone I've ever met.
And, he's repaired my sprinkler system and it still works.
Bob H :lol:

David K - 2-6-2005 at 11:34 AM

Wow, I am speechless (almost)! Thank you Nomads!

Yes, Elizabeth is still in my life (lucky me).

Hotschott is a weenie Chevy owner! :lol:

Don't worry Glenn, Steve (Hotscott) and I are good friends and tease each other about our choice of trucks.

Again, thank you all! Remember, if you want to do something nice for me, then post YOUR trip reports and travel stories... They are all very interesting to the rest of us, even if you don't think so!!! :yes:

Trip reports are the best and most accurate news from the peninsula. Include place and people names whenever it would help describe your trip.

I hope to be going to Tijuana today and see Antonio and bring back the stickers... As soon as I reach him by phone...
David

Bajaboy - 2-6-2005 at 03:57 PM

This is kind of sounding like a retirement party...

Seriously, I have known DK for a few years now. About the only thing I don't like about the man are his politics.

Keep up the good work David.

Zac

Sorry Paulina (and others)

BajaVida - 2-6-2005 at 05:53 PM

went off on I tangent

[Edited on 2-8-2005 by BajaVida]

Is this what's called "morphing a thread" ?

Paulina - 2-6-2005 at 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaVida
How can a true baja lover be a Republican? seems they would want to pave and develop the whole place

:biggrin:

I figured this would happen. Too bad.
P><*)))><

[Edited on 7-2-2005 by Paulina]

David K.

academicanarchist - 2-6-2005 at 07:39 PM

David K. is a good guy, despite his politics. :lol:

David K

bajapablo - 2-6-2005 at 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaandy
David K is like the Baja Nomad version of Don Quixote, only David is doing battle against the Sacred Saints of the Secret Spots.

To me, DK is the Baja Nomad version of Marlin Perkins (Let's see if that name triggers any fond memories.) Anyway, when planning trips or asking questions, DK and everyone else on this board have been nothing but polite. The only time I encountered any hooliganism (myself as chief hooligan, and it was my fault for going there) was when I ventured into the off-topic area and tried to dabble in politics. It was fun to battle with the darkside but it wasn't worth hurting feelings (or me getting bent out of shape) over something that really wasn't worth arguing over. DK is da Man! and I appreciate his knowledge and his desire to share. Keep it up and thanks for the stickers!

David K - 2-7-2005 at 12:22 AM

Yes, remember if we were all the same, things would not be very interesting!

I don't even go to the Off Topic board anymore... Politics and religion need to stay in one's own mind... nobody is going to change their beliefs when people argue or are nasty to each other, right?

BAJA is what brings us together here... not political arguing... so, let's stick to Baja and give the politics a rest for 4 more years (even on the Off Topic Forum!).

Now, about the new batch of stickers... I was going to pick up in Tijuana today when we visited with Antonio and Lorenia...

I got a sad email from Lorenia (Antonio's wife)... Antonio had an emergency in El Rosario and had to rush there to help... The home of one of his employess burned to the ground and she lost everything... there was also a death in the family of another employee. I am telling you all this to show you what great character this man has... The bumper stickers will be delayed, and you can understand why.

David K likened to Marlin Perkins?.......

Pompano - 2-7-2005 at 11:19 AM

Hoo-boy, that's a wild comparison. First place, Marlin is dead. Second place, Marlin was as clumsy as could be..hopefully David is not as accident prone as Marlin Perkins was on the famous TV special, Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom of the sixties and seventies.

In 1970 I was visiting a good friend who was working as a game biologist for Montana Game&Fish Dept. at Red Rock Refuge in southwestern Montana. The Wild Kingdom TV show with Marlin Perkins and Jim Fowler were doing a show there on swans. Now if you have ever seen any of the old shows, you will remember that Marlin was kind of a modern day Huckleberry Finn and got into all kinds of predicaments with wild animals...it was a real fiasco at times keeping him in one piece but made for great entertainment.

It was a very ecological-minded series on wildlife throughout the world. Anyway, on this particular show the migrating trumpeter and whistling swans which flocked to the Red Rock Refuge every fall were the subjects of that week's TV series.

My friend, Roger, ran the airboat carrying Marlin around the sloughs to photograph and narrate the story of trumpeters in their natural habitat. Marlin being Marlin, he fell off the airboat quite a few times during the movie-shoot and my friend's laughing would be cut out of the film. Later, we realized the film editor had dubbed in someone else's voice for my friend's voice...guess his own voice would have given away the hilarity of the moment. Rog, airboat skipper and Marlin's pilot, was going very fast and making some hairpin turns to stay close to the flapping swans when all of a sudden Marlin was airborne himself and landed on a muskrat lodge covered in mud. They must have edited that scene out because we never saw it later that month on national televison. It was hilarious!

Now.. I hope David K has not shown himself to be Marlin's counterpart in the 'accident-on-location' while on his Baja expeditions? :yes:

Perkins

academicanarchist - 2-7-2005 at 11:52 AM

Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom.

DanO - 2-7-2005 at 12:05 PM

Ditto what Zac and AA said. David's OK as long as you don't use the P-word. But he and I both respect a person's right to express a point of view. Even if it's wrong (heh). By the way David, you still haven't identified the L.A. freeway that is wide open between 10 a.m. and 2 p.m.

David K - 2-7-2005 at 12:24 PM

What is the P word? Politics??

I never said 'wide-open'... I suggest going around that mess and use I-15 to Escondido and on to Mexico.

IF you can time it to be in the L.A. Basin, the best time is 10am-2pm compared with 6-10 am or 2-7pm, right? Even better would be to go through in the middle of the night!

Now, this is from my experiences traveling a lot on business about 7 years ago.

I guess you are saying it is gridlocked all day now?

bajalera - 2-7-2005 at 12:40 PM

Morphing back to David K, I first heard of him on another board where a really nasty series of posts criticized him for no particular reason, and even had his happy little sun Xed out as their avatars--my first and last visit to that particular source of Baja bilge. Since signing on as a Nomad I've found his posts informative and helpful, and when one of mine located the Baja Sur prison in the wrong place he sent me a tactfully worded U2U. To me he's a Mr. Nice Guy.

Although my personal view of the Lost Baja Mission is that Santa Claus sometimes stops off there to chat with the Tooth Fairy and Tinkerbell, I think we oughtta let DK and other believers continue their searches without raining disbelief on them. I can't think of a better excuse for exploring the backlands of Baja [so you might consider lightening up a bit, Acadanarchist].

Lera

Neal Johns - 2-7-2005 at 01:03 PM

Bajalera,
You are breaking my heart with your scurrilous posts about the existence of Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy and Tinker Bell. I?m 74 now, too old for Xmas presents, have no teeth left to put under the pillow, and have an unrequited love for Tinker Bell. So you can understand how upset it makes me when reading anything that tends to undermine my deep conviction that these icons of my youth are real. Have you no sensitivity to those of us who are Chronologically Challenged and trying to hold on to their dreams?

P.S. I forgot to mention that I?m far better looking than David:

David K - 2-7-2005 at 01:23 PM

Thanks Lera,
Robert (AA) is very sensitive about the term 'Lost Mission'. To him it automatically means a place where treasure is mythically hidden and has meant the destruction of many mission walls by treasure hunters.

In fact, the damage has been done to found missions, as the lost ones are still lost (or never existed)...

'Lost Missions' to me is just a fun term for exploring the backcountry, looking for some evidence of old construction. I do not believe there is any gold, pearls, or jewels hidden in some secret place. The missionairies were quite poor and spent all their time trying to produce enough food for themselves and their Indian slaves/subjects.

The four 'Lost Missions' mentioned (Santa Isabel, Santa Maria Magdalena, San Juan Bautista in the Santa Clara mountains, and Dolores del Norte) are described on the 1757 Jesuit map (Santa Isabel is shown as a water hole, the other three as missions started).

AA has done research after we debated Dolores del Norte, and discovered it did exist, but only on paper... the name eventually was changed to Santa Gertrudis. Even INAH has it wrong and calls the visita of San Pablo 'Dolores del Norte'... as it is an impressive adobe looking very much like Mision Santa Maria.
The villagers at San Francisco de la Sierra told Choral Pepper in 1964 that the old walls up there were 'Dolores'... who knows, maybe an early site for the mission?

The site I am looking for was discovered in Feb. 1966 by the Gardner expedition going south of L.A. Bay to El Barril. This is in the area where the 1757 map places a mission started called Santa Maria Magdalena... Obviously, it wasn't completed... perhaps the spring dried, perhaps the Jesuit council decided to develope San Borja instead... perhaps it was a mission visita for Santa Gertrudis (which was called Dolores del Norte on that map).

Whatever it was, it is out there in the desert hills south of L.A. Bay... and I would like to photograph it and compare it to the '66 photos... To me it is my Lost Mission quest, or my mission to find a lost site! Choral Pepper believed it was these old stories that inspires us to explore the desert and to preserve it for the future explorers because it has value as a place with lost treasure, not as a wasteland...

See http://vivabaja.com/1757/

Here is Bruce Barron at the wall discovered in 1966...

[Edited on 9-22-2006 by David K]

Mexitron - 2-7-2005 at 01:42 PM

That would be a fun trip to explore for that lost mission DK.

You do great work here on Nomads DK, and David is a nice guy! I met him and BajaLou(another great guy!) in Parral Canyon last year after hiking into the San Pedro Martir Mission site with Jack Swords. David was the one who invited me to go on the trip to the mission--a generous gesture for someone he hardly knew....always be grateful for that one DK! Keep up the good work!
Ask me for anything except info on the Sisters :lol:

David K - 2-7-2005 at 01:56 PM

Yes, and here's Mexitron (second from right) with his amigos the day we met at Parral...

Another thing I have done for some here on Nomad is create a web page to show their photos to the world...
Here is Mexirton's web page!: http://vivabaja.com/mexitron

Yah, I am a bad SOB all right! :?:

bajalera - 2-7-2005 at 02:08 PM

Thanks, DK, for all that info. I have a lot more faith in the printed word than in the history provided by local people, most of whom are descendants of relatively recent [ethnographically, that is] migrants from the mainland.

Although even official Mexican publications in Spanish can sometimes have bloopers. One of my books--the result of an INAH investigation of existing BC missions--has detailed site plans and descriptions and all that, but also says Sir Francis Drake sailed up the Gulf of California and explored the area around Mexicali.

Lera

DanO - 2-7-2005 at 03:45 PM

Yep, David, the P-word is politics. As for the L.A. freeways, in my view, the traffic is much worse than it was 7 years ago. The only bright side is that a number of the freeways now have carpool lanes.

synch - 2-9-2005 at 09:33 AM

Why would you originate a Post such as this...
talk about a negative aspect...

Hook - 2-9-2005 at 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by synch
Why would you originate a Post such as this...
talk about a negative aspect...

In the end, it didn't really matter. I think Sculpin and I were the only ones who actually addressed the orginal question.

And even those posts became positive in a circumspect way.

I suspect this post might have gone very differently over on Baja.net? :biggrin:

Time to put this one to bed.

Gypsy Jan - 2-9-2005 at 11:31 PM

Dear Synch and Hook,

I started this post when I read yet another post that repsponded in a sarcastic and dismissive manner to David K's contributions.

In my several years of reading what he has posted on the Amigo and this board, his contributions have been uniformly informational, courteous and civil and welcoming to posters interested in Baja, regardless of their newbie status and (to the seasoned vetarans) dumb questions.

Don't diss the ones who are just joining. They might become the best defenders of the Baja that you love so much.

To all of the grinchers out there that want to protect their secret places and experiences - Get Over Yourselves!

You are railing against the tide of change that is flowing through the peninsula from both ends.

Share your knowledge with the right people and put energy and enthusiasm into working here in a positive way to help to preserve your Baja.

Err, cough; sorry, must step off my soap box now. :rolleyes:

Dave - 2-9-2005 at 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan
In my several years of reading what he has posted on the Amigo and this board,

You have been lurking for a VERY long time. :lol:

Gypsy Jan - 2-10-2005 at 12:07 AM

Well Dave,

IMH0,
better a lurker than a shirker

Cyndarouh - 2-10-2005 at 08:11 AM

I think David K. Is great! I have met him and he is a really nice guy, always offering info and helping us all to have better and more informed tirps in Baja. Thank You David K. Keep up the wonderful Post..

Bajabus - 2-10-2005 at 08:21 AM

David K is a great guy. I got to meet him and Jeans in eliascalles. Never understood why some folks bash him but the post up thread about alpha male exhibitionism sounds about right.

Dave I hope we run into each other again soon. You ever need to stay at my place just let me know.

David K - 2-10-2005 at 08:25 AM

Thank you again...

I think the silent masses get the point that I am a good guy and not the lying, stealing bum that people have posted about me mostly on another Baja message board (that even created a topic thread to trash my name).

In the end, the truth wins...

Now, some more truth: I am not the only one who does nice things here... MOST of your fellow Baja Nomads & Amigos are just as nice or more so! I think Baja brings out the best in (most) people who discover its magic.

I have met the nicest people (Mexican, American, British & Canadian) through this Internet connection... I am very lucky for this, and spending pleasurable time sharing Baja stories and info. is well worth the effort for such a great reward... your friendship!

bajaandy - 2-10-2005 at 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan

To all of the grinchers out there that want to protect their secret places and experiences - Get Over Yourselves

Well said Gyspy Jan!
(Now just don't tell anybody about the Seven Sisters. :lol

And David, keep up the good work!

Skipjack Joe - 2-10-2005 at 10:18 AM

1. Posts far too much, often useless, dry information.

2. attempts to be an authority on baja arguing with those who don't agree with him.

3. His self promotions. Endless routing users to his own website.

4. Often injects political views into baja topics in an offensive manner causing the entire thread to go into a tailspin (not the only one to do this).

baitcast - 2-10-2005 at 12:02 PM

I normaly don,t get involved in this sort of thing but for the last couple of years i,ve tried to figure what it was that bothered me so about DK and SKIPJACK JOE laid it out so very fine for me.
I could,nt have said it better myself :bounce:

BAITCAST

David K - 2-10-2005 at 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
1. Posts far too much, often useless, dry information.

2. attempts to be an authority on baja arguing with those who don't agree with him.

3. His self promotions. Endless routing users to his own website.

4. Often injects political views into baja topics in an offensive manner causing the entire thread to go into a tailspin (not the only one to do this).

1) Perhaps you have me confused with another? Seriously, I think the forums are like watching TV, you can choose to not read my posts if you don't want to... a far greater number here seem to want me to do what I have done... democracy rules, right?

2) I would like you to prove or retract this... I sure do not have any desire to argue with anyone over Baja info. Unless they are knowingly posting false information. Information is not an idea like politics, it is fact or fiction.

3) I do not 'promote' myself, as I am not in a Baja business... If anything, I promote 'Baja' (for free)! My web site is full of information, photos and links to many great Baja sites... and that is why I have it in a signature at the bottom of my posts... It is to help people find adventure and information... I don't sell anything... I am even giving away stickers as my gift to you. Have you visited VivaBaja.com? The collection of mission photos from Jack Swords and others is one of the really great things to find there. The El Camino Real report, GPS list, maps, satellite images, and more are generally well received by viewers.

4) I 'often' do this, you say? How often..., like almost never? Yes, I have made a political comment on rare occaisions, when it was funny or to counter a wacko leftist statement! (I guess this counts as one). I am human afterall.
Frankly, I restrain myself a lot more now than in years past... Which means others are posting political comments a lot more! I knew the results of the election would validate my political thoughts, so I have nothing to add... Do you want to see how much of America voted the same as I did? (oops, is that #2?.. I was provoked, lol)

Hey, have a beer or if you rather, a latte and chill.

My 2 cents...

lindsay - 2-10-2005 at 09:56 PM

Wow, I just finished scrolling through page 4 of the "DK files" so what the hay, I'll add my 2 cents!!

I met David for the first time almost 5 years ago when I was helping out at Discover Baja for a few months before my "Baja baby", Sara, was born and in support of David, the word enthusiasm and genuine Baja fever come to mind when I think of him. As for the critics, this passion may rub others the wrong way but I have only seen the positives of his love for exploring the Baja peninsula. I was kindly invited to events that he helped organize and he graciously asked for my help in contacting a Mulege friend who participated in Earle Stanley Gardner's various Baja adventures so he could do research on one of the mission sites that he was exploring. David was also a very willing advice giver when I had questions about visiting Bahia de L.A. last year.

So, David, I think after all these pages, you should feel that there are many amigos who appreciate your love of Baja California and your generous spirit. :):):)

David

Baja Bernie - 2-10-2005 at 10:32 PM

This thread by Gypsy Jan has had so many peaks why even bother to venture into those shadowed valleys that occasionally mar the landscape.
Put your hand on the bill of your cap, lean forward, and find more wonders of Baja to share with your friends.

Marie-Rose - 2-11-2005 at 09:04 AM

Geez David...I didn't want to reply at risk of repeating any of these compliments (which must make your onging work to share Baja very fulfilling!)...but just had to add that had it not been for that fab. breakfast on the day before we crossed the border we would have missed so much. It was our first drive into Mexico and you boosted our confidence and shared so much!

David K - 2-11-2005 at 09:23 AM

Thank you Marie-Rose... It was fun meeting you folks... It is hard to imagine that you have to drive 1,000 miles (1,600 kilometers) BEFORE your Baja trip can begin! Everyone from Canada I have met going to to Baja or in Baja have been really great people. The breakfast at Sunrise Cafe was a great day, and my pleasure to help you find some interesting spots for your trip... which you have shared via your photos... http://www.diarybase.com/members/hagensinbaja

Thanks again, eh?

thekookbuster - 2-11-2005 at 09:26 AM

Who's David K?

:lol:

David K - 2-11-2005 at 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by thekookbuster
Who's David K?

:lol:

Thanks for a good laugh, kookbuster! :lol:

I am sigining off on this topic

Gypsy Jan - 2-12-2005 at 09:31 PM

that I originated,

but, when I started it, I had a feeling about what the response would be.

It is interesting that the mean-spirited posters haven't had much to say.

It is easy to disparage someone off the cuff; it takes logic and brain power (and a certain amount of ability to write well) to back up a put down.

As our amigo says, "Viva Baja".

I wish you all smiles and good adventures.