BajaNomad

FMM (Tourist Card) update March 2017

David K - 3-5-2017 at 11:13 PM

My Previous FMM was 4 days from expiring when I began my current Baja trip. The downtown Mexicali border is being expanded so there is some construction, but no problem.

The INM building is on the left, the first building in Mexico once you clear the border crossing. There is usually few or no regular parking spots so double parking here is okay, you are likely to hear.

The INM official was outside chatting with a border officer.
He spoke perfect English and apologized the cost this year was up to $30 from $25. I said I had pesos, and in pesos it is 500. I went over the rules and they are still that the 180 day FMM can be used for any number of trips during that period and thrown away when it expires.

The free 7 day MUST be turned back in when you leave Mexico. I mentioned how some have said the Tijuana INM told people they didn't need to.
He said that is not the case and don't get info from Internet sites, but ask INM.

From the INM, there are 3 streets radiating away... take the street with the train tracks in the center to head south. Lots of signs for San Felipe, too.

mrfatboy - 3-6-2017 at 08:14 AM

For what it is worth I will throw in my own experience with the 7 day free FMM here. I'm not advocating one way or another.

In November 2015, our group did our annual trip to Gonzaga Bay. We have been going for decades. We never stopped for an free FMM before but decided to on this trip because of all the chatter on this forum. At the time forum members were stating get the free FMM but don't bother returning it.

Upon getting the free FMM at the Calexico West border the INM official did state that we must return them. We didn't 😝

In Feb 2016, we travelled to PVR and got the paid 180 day FMM. At TJ airport. Passports were scanned. There was no mention of not returning the free one.

In Nov 2016, we went down to Gonzaga again. This time we didn't bother with the free FMM. Mainly because at the time some of the group didn't want to risk getting hassled at the Calexico West border for not turning in last year's free FMM. It would have been interesting to see if we would have.

In Jan 2017, we went to PVR again. We got the free FMM at the Otay Mesa INM office as we walked across the border. They scanned our passports and gave us the FMM. There was no mention of them being needed to returned or any thing about our non returned Nov 2015 free FMMs.

So what does this all say? It's Mexico😀😀😀😀

YMMV






[Edited on 3-6-2017 by mrfatboy]

[Edited on 3-6-2017 by mrfatboy]

David K - 3-6-2017 at 08:52 AM

Yes, it's Mexico!
Thanks for you report!
When Baja Angel and I got the free ones in Mexicali, a year ago, our passports were scanned and told to return them, which we did at Tecate. They rescanned our passports. It appears that they are being traced. This to ensure people don't stay longer on the free one, I suppose?

Anyway, Nomad is where we can read the reports and you can decide! In my 5,000 miles of Baja travel in 2016 and so far in 2017 between the border and Loreto region, not once was there any INM check asking to see the FMM. The Guerrero Negro INM booth at the stop sign has not been open.

You know what they say, right?
Better to have it and not need it then to need it and not have it!





[Edited on 3-6-2017 by David K]

sancho - 3-6-2017 at 09:29 AM

I don't believe one can state there are Imm regs that ALL I'm
offices follow. Doesn't happen that way. There are slight differences, how in heck is one to turn a 7 day fmm at TJ?
Next to impossible. The logic escapes me, as one is required,
at least by Mexicali West, to turn in the 7 day fmm but not the
180 day. But I cross at Mexicalli West, if I have a 7 day from
that office, I return it. Had a TJ 7 day, not returned, Mexicalli
West didn't mention it. Continuing, clear as mud. Would be
nice for uniform regs

soylent_green - 3-7-2017 at 11:19 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
..

The free 7 day MUST be turned back in when you leave Mexico. I mentioned how some have said the Tijuana INM told people they didn't need to.
He said that is not the case and don't get info from Internet sites, but ask INM.
.


in 2015, I was at a seminar where the Baja head of Immigracion, Rodolfo Figueroa, was asked about returning FMNs. His response: he pretended to wad up a piece of paper and throw it in the trash.

---

if anyone is interested in an official clarification, here is the TJ office to call. An official answer from the main office would end a lot of worrying for some.

http://www.inm.gob.mx/gobmx/word/index.php/baja-california/

Rodulfo Figueroa Pacheco

01 (664) 636 60 17 // 01 (664) 636 60 22

01 (664) 636 60 23 // 01 (664) 636 61 66

01 (664) 636 61 73 // 01 (664) 636 61 80

Calle Diamante s/n, Fracc. Esmeralda, Delegación San Antonio de los Buenos, C.P. 22640 Tijuana, Baja California.

Horario de Atención al Público: Lunes a Viernes de 09:00 a 13:00 hrs.


[Edited on 3-7-2017 by soylent_green]

mrfatboy - 3-7-2017 at 11:46 AM

Mexicali West seems to be the wild card.

sancho - 3-7-2017 at 12:12 PM

Quote: Originally posted by soylent_green  

in 2015, I was at a seminar where the Baja head of Immigracion, Rodolfo Figueroa, was asked about returning FMNs. His response: he pretended to wad up a piece of paper and throw it in the trash.
[Edited on 3-7-2017 by soylent_green]









Calling a Mex Govt office is not something I have the patience
for. I for one would like Sr. Figueroa to call over the Mexicali
West and inform of proper handling of 7 day fmm's. I have
been told directly by that office twice within the last few
mo's to return the 7 day fmm. There have been 2 reports
here of tourists being denied a 7 day fmm from that office
due to not returning a previous one. Don't know what their
screen shows when info entered, they for some reason, a
7 day fmm issued by them they handle differently. Not
sure I feel comfortable telling them their regs




mtgoat666 - 3-7-2017 at 12:21 PM

Inm is on FB. And you can find their info email addys online. Suggest that y'all ask 'em via msgr or email :light::?::light::?::light:
Quote: Originally posted by sancho  
Quote: Originally posted by soylent_green  

in 2015, I was at a seminar where the Baja head of Immigracion, Rodolfo Figueroa, was asked about returning FMNs. His response: he pretended to wad up a piece of paper and throw it in the trash.
[Edited on 3-7-2017 by soylent_green]









Calling a Mex Govt office is not something I have the patience
for. I for one would like Sr. Figueroa to call over the Mexicali
West and inform of proper handling of 7 day fmm's. I have
been told directly by that office twice within the last few
mo's to return the 7 day fmm. There have been 2 reports
here of tourists being denied a 7 day fmm from that office
due to not returning a previous one. Don't know what their
screen shows when info entered, they for some reason, a
7 day fmm issued by them they handle differently. Not
sure I feel comfortable telling them their regs




David K - 3-8-2017 at 12:23 AM

The logic for tracking the free FMM is to catch people staying longer than 7 days, for free!

If you pay the 500 pesos, then you are done donating to the government. They have no need to follow your passport if you paid.

mrfatboy - 3-8-2017 at 05:38 AM

I never bothered to look at the free FMM but isn't there an "entry" or "valid Until" date stamped or writen on it ?

David K - 3-8-2017 at 07:22 AM

Naturally... but since we turned ours in, can't show you. However, our passports were scanned getting them in Mexicali and turning them in at Tecate.

mrfatboy - 3-8-2017 at 08:38 AM

So the only real benefit for turning the FMM back in to the INM would be to ensure that the tourist actually left.

It seems the Mexicali West INM thinks they can collect more money by none returned FMM penalties than actually stopping people and veifiying if they have a valid FMM.

norte - 3-8-2017 at 09:26 AM

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=85928

David K - I guess I'm not explaining this right. It's not that they physically didn't allow us to cross or come back. They just wanted to know where we were going and when. Seeing that we had walked across the border they knew we weren't going to walk to San Felipe. We did buy the 180 day one online and just couldn't get the silly thing stamped. Technically the FMM is only good for one entry and it's clearly stated as such on their website:

"The applicant acknowledges herein that the FMM has a maximum validity of 180 calendar days and shall be valid for one entry only."

David K - 3-8-2017 at 09:59 AM

Airplane FMM, one use.
Automobile FMM, good for 180 days, regardless if it is one trip or a dozen.
I asked the English speaking INM officer lasy week. My current one then had 6 days left on it... and I have been to Baja three times on it.
This was actually true for years.

DeMinimis - 3-8-2017 at 10:41 AM

Thanks for the info in the first post DK. Going to try crossing at downtown this trip (with a Jeep in tow).

norte - 3-8-2017 at 10:50 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Airplane FMM, one use.
Automobile FMM, good for 180 days, regardless if it is one trip or a dozen.
I asked the English speaking INM officer lasy week. My current one then had 6 days left on it... and I have been to Baja three times on it.
This was actually true for years.


So just to muddy the waters. You are saying that three2tango does not know what he is talking about and the FMM does not state one entry.

AKgringo - 3-8-2017 at 01:56 PM

I am in Northern California at the moment, reading the back of the FMM that was issued on Nov 20, 2016 at Mexicali west.

The top line, right under IMPORTANT (in red letters), it says; During your stay in Mexico, you must retain this immigration form and surrender it upon leaving the country.

Either the policy has changed, or I am in violation of the law! I am not arguing with DK, just reporting on what I am looking at on the form.

sancho - 3-8-2017 at 02:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Airplane FMM, one use.
Automobile FMM, good for 180 days, regardless if it is one trip or a dozen.
I asked the English speaking INM officer lasy week











With you on that, probably the same Mex Imm officer I've talked
to at Mexicali West the last 2 times, younger guy perfect English
said fmm CAN be used for mulitiple entries. On occasion there
has been Mex Imm positioned just as one enters Mexicali West,
will flag tourists driving, tell them to get an fmm at the nearby
office, if one has an existing 180 fmm that will satisfy them,
crossing into TJ by foot, if one has a current fmm you can
bypass the tourist fmm line, and enter with existing fmm,
can only speak of those 2 crossings. Internet info is, at times,
different than what is applied at the Border

mrfatboy - 3-8-2017 at 04:47 PM

I used a paid 180 FMM bought at TIJ airport multiple times to PVR. I guess I got lucky. When stopped the authorities look at it and say OK. Maybe they are not paying attention😜

sancho - 3-8-2017 at 05:14 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mrfatboy  
I used a paid 180 FMM bought at TIJ airport multiple times to PVR. I guess I got lucky. When stopped the authorities look at it and say OK. Maybe they are not paying attention😜









The previous mentioning of fmm's being good for 1 entry
when flying
is referring to flights from the US into Mex. Typically they
collect the fmm's as one boards the plane for return to the
US. A domestic flight within Mex, TJ/Cabo etc. MAY be
different, in the past no one asked for an fmm when flying
back from Vallarta to TJ. So a valid 180 day could/should
be used for mulitiple domestic flights from TJ. But as we
all know, it's Mexico. To me the Imm regs are the one's
that the Mex Imm officer say they are at the time you
are dealing with him






David K - 3-8-2017 at 08:45 PM

He said he used it, not that anyone needed to see it. To have it on you is to use it.
I am using mine as much as I can over the 180 day life it has, as I did with my previous ones.

mrfatboy - 3-9-2017 at 08:10 AM

I have never been asked specifically for my FMM at the TIJ airport. I have been asked for "paperwork" or passport. When hanging over my passport my FFM was in the passport. They seemed more interested in the passport.

On my last trip back from PVR arriving in TIJ coming off the plane an official singled us out but just asked our nationality. We said US and he just waved us thru.

It may be that the airports don't care about the FMM but once you are on the ground somewhere in Mexico is good to have it hush in case.

David K - 3-9-2017 at 08:48 AM

Well, it is clear that once we are in the Mexican Republic, we are to obtain an FMM.
It doesn't matter if anyone sees it ever again.

I have obtained the 180 day one, the 7 day one, and the flying one in the past 3 years and have reported the details of all three in my trip reports. That's all I can do. What others do with the data is up to them.

Have a great Baja experience no matter what you do or where you go!!

HeyMulegeScott - 3-9-2017 at 09:46 AM

Quote: Originally posted by norte  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Airplane FMM, one use.
Automobile FMM, good for 180 days, regardless if it is one trip or a dozen.
I asked the English speaking INM officer lasy week. My current one then had 6 days left on it... and I have been to Baja three times on it.
This was actually true for years.


So just to muddy the waters. You are saying that three2tango does not know what he is talking about and the FMM does not state one entry.


You can to the Immigration website and read the regulations for yourself -
https://www.inm.gob.mx/fmme/publico/en/solicitud.html

Click "by land" and you will see the terms that include one entry. My friend who's traveling with us is from Argentina and had lengthy conversations in Spanish with the officials where they reiterated the rules. I've traveled in Mexico enough times to understand the inconsistencies in how rules are enforced.

rts551 - 3-9-2017 at 10:46 AM

Some people look for the answer they want regardless of what is in writing. you missed the discussion for years about turning in your tourist permit even though it was clearly stated on the back.

willardguy - 3-9-2017 at 11:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Three2tango  
Quote: Originally posted by norte  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Airplane FMM, one use.
Automobile FMM, good for 180 days, regardless if it is one trip or a dozen.
I asked the English speaking INM officer lasy week. My current one then had 6 days left on it... and I have been to Baja three times on it.
This was actually true for years.


So just to muddy the waters. You are saying that three2tango does not know what he is talking about and the FMM does not state one entry.


You can to the Immigration website and read the regulations for yourself -
https://www.inm.gob.mx/fmme/publico/en/solicitud.html

Click "by land" and you will see the terms that include one entry. My friend who's traveling with us is from Argentina and had lengthy conversations in Spanish with the officials where they reiterated the rules. I've traveled in Mexico enough times to understand the inconsistencies in how rules are enforced.


you're going to take gob.mx word over dk.mx? wow thats bold!

David K - 3-9-2017 at 11:23 AM

I am not doubting what is on Mexico City web sites or printed on Mexico City paper.

I am just reporting on what is happening in Baja California, a place Mexico City almost forgets about...

Just look at the Federal highway in Baja!

There is probably a paper somewhere that says the national means of communication (roads) must be maintained!

HeyMulegeScott - 3-9-2017 at 11:36 AM

Sounds like we would have been better off trying to get stamped in the main Mexicali crossing.

Looking forward to some Baja tomorrow.

David K - 3-9-2017 at 12:15 PM

Things are way less complicated in Mexico than we sometimes make them sound like. Not everyone who goes to Mexico reads Baja Nomad. I mean, anyone can just drive across the border and there are NO SIGNS saying EVERYONE (not Mexican citizens) MUST STOP HERE and get an FMM. Only recently and briefly has an INM officer been reported as flagging obvious gringo tourist cars to pull over to get it.

Can you imagine the traffic jam, parking, and chaos at the border???

There are people who cross daily or very often, and no way are they going to go through the time to park, to refill out forms. The INM official will have you just do it once every 6 months.

Anyway, each time I get mine, I will report the answers given, as I have in the past (at Tijuana, Tecate, Mexicali).

[Edited on 3-9-2017 by David K]

sancho - 3-9-2017 at 01:02 PM

This topic has been running for decades. A little off
target, but I get a kick out
of the ? about the need for an fmm,
then the person who asked the ?, regrets paying the fmm
fee, because he didn't get 'checked' for the fmm on his trip, regretting
the $25 spent, the regs say get one, if one doesn't want to spend the fee, don't get one. There are virtually no negative
reprocussions on not having one, save getting into a serious
accident. Believing a site info on fmm's is like believing Homeland
Security site on needing a Passport to return to the US, on the
ground/border that info may not apply





TedZark - 3-9-2017 at 02:04 PM

I had family visiting late last month and when they left took their FMMs to the San Ysidro/TJ crossing immigration, to the very office where they were obtained. Three officers were there and they all said, "No need to turn it in". I pointed to the back of the form and... again got "No, no need."

David K - 3-9-2017 at 02:05 PM

Perfect answer Sancho! ;)

David K - 3-9-2017 at 02:07 PM

Quote: Originally posted by TedZark  
I had family visiting late last month and when they left took their FMMs to the San Ysidro/TJ crossing immigration, to the very office where they were obtained. Three officers were there and they all said, "No need to turn it in". I pointed to the back of the form and... again got "No, no need."



The free 7 day one or the pay 180 day one?

Bajazly - 3-9-2017 at 02:14 PM

Look at it this way, if you can only use the 180 day FMM for single entry, then you would not be stopped at the border and asked to see if you had one because you get them at the border. If no one looks at them at the border and stamps, scans, remembers, whatever them then there is no record of entry other than the date on the FMM itself. If you happened to be asked to show it within the country, not at the border because that is where you get them after you are in and you don't get checked there, then how would anyone know that you had not been there since the date on the FMM?

In other words, who really give a flying rats culo if its single or multi entry? If by some chance you got checked and by some other stranger chance they could prove you had made multiple entries on a single FMM, wouldn't it be more likely with a little money and not a lot of time a new FMM could be acquired and you go on your merry way? It's not like anyone is going to jail over this. Sure, technically they could deport you but Really???

mtgoat666 - 3-9-2017 at 02:17 PM

I am surprised DK doesnt save every expired FMM in an online scrapbook.

sancho - 3-9-2017 at 03:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
I am surprised DK doesnt save every expired FMM in an online scrapbook.











I wished I'd have saved some stuff. To keep track of
trips to Mex. Way off, but back in the day,
'87, I took the then Cabo/Vallarta ferry, yes there was one, had
a Toy Truck w/camper shell, this was when the Mex Govt owned
operated the ferry system. Wish I had the reciept to prove the
cost of passage,
gf, me, private cabin, includes the price for
the truck, total cost $11dlls.
Some 325 mi open ocean to Vallarta. Telling that story often
elicits disbelief. Maybe some other
bits, to keep track of the yrs



David K - 3-9-2017 at 04:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
I am surprised DK doesnt save every expired FMM in an online scrapbook.


Of interest, I showed the guy last week my FMM that had 6 days left on it (counting 180 days from the day it was issued) and while I was filling out the new FMM he took the older one.

As for keeping scraps, I am trying to downsize!

I have already sold nearly all of the duplicate books I had in my library. Next are all the Baja magazines... SCORE programs, Baja newspaper articles (many on the construction and completion of Hwy. 1).... a lot from Graham Mackintosh's first walks in the 80s. Mexico West Travel Club stuff, and their newsletter... I wrote a few trip reports for them in the 80s and 90s (before the Baja Internet).

AKgringo - 3-9-2017 at 04:12 PM

Dave, the FMM should be a deductible expense for you, so you should keep it if you can. :light:

David K - 3-9-2017 at 04:24 PM

As I said, he took it... and it is only 500 pesos... $26.60 for me at the exchange I got (18.80:1)

TedZark - 3-9-2017 at 05:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Quote: Originally posted by TedZark  
I had family visiting late last month and when they left took their FMMs to the San Ysidro/TJ crossing immigration, to the very office where they were obtained. Three officers were there and they all said, "No need to turn it in". I pointed to the back of the form and... again got "No, no need."



The free 7 day one or the pay 180 day one?


The free 7 day visa.

David K - 3-9-2017 at 07:08 PM

Thanks Ted!

I specifically mentioned to the Mexicali officer that there are Internet reports stating the Tijuana INM office has been telling people they don't need to return them.

His reply:
"Don't get information from the Internet, go to INM."

HA!

TedZark - 3-11-2017 at 04:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Thanks Ted!

"Don't get information from the Internet, go to INM."

HA!


I went directly to INM. They didn't want them.

I just didn't want a surprise next time family came to visit and couldn't get across the border.

Of course, none of that means anything to an INM guy who has had a bad day and you are next in line.

[Edited on 3-11-2017 by TedZark]

David K - 3-11-2017 at 04:47 PM

Yep, I know... but the quote was from the Mexicali INM officer. That was right after I said that the Internet posts say Tijuana doesn't want the FREE 7 Day ones back.
Tecate and Mexicali are in sync, Tijuana has its own rules, I guess?

sancho - 3-12-2017 at 10:23 AM

Quote: Originally posted by TedZark  

I went directly to INM. They didn't want them.
I just didn't want a surprise next time family came to visit and couldn't get across the border.
[Edited on 3-11-2017 by TedZark]










With you on that, I want to avoid a surprise. The Mexicali West
guys seem to take the 7 day fmm as if they are doing you a
favor for issuing you one. Mex Imm has stood out in front
of their Mexicali West office and pointed out how I can drive
to that office when coming back. I typically get out of my vehicle
while on line, let wife drive and walk 3 blks to their office
and return it. Almost worth it to avoid the 7 day at THAT office