BajaNomad

Two way radios

pappy - 9-14-2017 at 06:21 PM

Hey fellow nomads we are looking for some suggestions for two way type communication devices we can use in the backcountry ( Ventura/ Santa Barbara counties) for our mule/horseback pack trips. Any suggestions? Thanks!

basautter - 9-14-2017 at 06:36 PM

Check out the Garmin inReach. It has GPS, and emergency satellite beacon and 2-way satellite texting.

https://explore.garmin.com/en-US/inreach/

TMW - 9-14-2017 at 06:54 PM

If you just want two communications such as person to person or vehicle to vehicle then get the Baofeng handheld radio UV-5R at Amazon for about $35 each. Better than CB, FRS, GMRS, etc. Use the key lockout so dummys can't screw with it.

BooJumMan - 9-14-2017 at 07:48 PM

I agree with the Baofeng units from Amazon. They are 2m/70cm amateur(ham) radio band which requires a license, but operating them on simplex in the back country, you should be OK.

freediverbrian - 9-14-2017 at 09:28 PM

If you do any boating a pair of Icom vhf radios are a good choice. Versatile but a little pricey at $125 each. Love mine long battery life good range

JZ - 9-14-2017 at 10:59 PM

BaoFeng has a newer 8w radio for $62. You can add a better antenna for longer range.

https://www.amazon.com/BaoFeng-BF-F8HP-Two-Way-136-174MHz-40...

https://www.amazon.com/Authentic-NA-771-15-6-Inch-SMA-Female...

MulegeAL - 9-15-2017 at 07:01 AM

^^ What JZ said. That is the best value setup going. The better antenna helps a lot in Baja. They can be programmed for a variety of channels too.

2 meter ham band

Warf - 9-15-2017 at 07:07 AM

Our little group has used 2 meter mobile units in our RZR's for a couple of years. 75 watts of transmit power gives you 50+ mile range depending on terrain. Perfect for Baja.

woody with a view - 9-15-2017 at 07:25 AM

In the midlle of nowhere, with no repeaters, these are all line of site, correct?

Hook - 9-15-2017 at 07:55 AM

Pappy, tell us more about your use of them. Mule-to-mule? Mule to civilization? Are you going to places out of cell tower coverage? Or do you just want a more simple means of communication from mule-to-mule? Would you be giving a radio to clients or simply regular members of your packing group?

One free alternative you might try are the walkie-talkie apps for Android and/or iphone that got so much publicity during the recent hurricanes. But you must have cell tower service. Some are only person-to-person while others allow for a "broadcast" to anyone within your circle that has the app.

If mule to mule, the Baofengs would be fine. Actually, even a simple FRS/GMRS would be fine for that.

If you are wanting mule to civilization communications AND you are out of cell tower coverage, you might contact the Santa Barbara Amateur Radio Club and ask them about their repeaters' coverage. They have been around since 1920 and should know their coverage area. Persons would have to get a license to use it, which is cheap and easy these days.

Do the two Baofengs talked about in this post, transmit and receive on the marine frequency band, out of the box, folks? The marine band is within 136-174mhz, but is often blocked on many 2 meter radios. That could be valuable, as they could be used by anyone with a hand held marine radio, too.

There are some funny stories in the reviews about how much off-frequency these radios can be, even in harmonic frequencies above the main frequency you are transmitting on. Interference with neighbors TVs, baby monitors, etc. Also, many stories of having to send back the original radios as non-working, out of the box. Many dont have a very long lifespan, but they dont cost very much, either.

Udo - 9-15-2017 at 08:00 AM

Portable VHF radios. The best are available in marine stores like West Marine. But search the internet. Best brand is ICOM.

Hook - 9-15-2017 at 08:07 AM

Quote: Originally posted by woody with a view  
In the midlle of nowhere, with no repeaters, these are all line of site, correct?


They are line of sight, but communications do reflect off of things, especially if putting out 75 watts (which the hand held models do not).

A 75 watt model would have to me mounted and have a whip-type antenna. He probably is using the Yaesu FT-2700, 2800 or 2900.

There is really nothing that will beat out a 75 watt, 2 meter radio for relatively long distance communications from vehicle-to-vehicle, in areas without cell service. At least, nothing out of the box and ready to go. Especially if they have repeater access. And especially if cost is a consideration. There are portable ham radios that transmit at 150 watts but they are much more expensive than the Yaesu's mentioned above. 2900s can be found for less than 200.00.

People forget that one of the biggest advantages of radio is multiple parties receiving a single transmission, rather than calling multiple persons on a cell phone. Very valuable in large groups; this ability to broadcast communications. And no need for cell towers.

[Edited on 9-15-2017 by Hook]

PaulW - 9-15-2017 at 08:11 AM

VHF radio 101
Mostly line of sight. The hand held 5 watt portables - for sure. They work great when traveling with multiple companions. Very similar to the low watt CBs that some use in the states.
Regular VHF radios in the 50 watt plus are much better. I even talked to friends near El Golfo from the top of the trail north of San Felipe.
My latest radio is a 2 meter Ham unit bought with the mod to add all the spectrum, like commercial, Family, weather, etc. It is a Yaesu Ft-2900 ($219 with mod). 4 power levels 5, 10, 25, and 75 watt. Nice because I can use it set at 5 watts for family radio freqs and not get in trouble with the feds here in the states.
For any VHF radio one still needs to program it for freqs. For Baja the race forums will provide those freqs. I always buy my radios with the compatible CD and USB cable to allow me to program the radio to my desires or revise it when new people show up. Cost is low and the some radio sellers will give it to you free if you ask.
More dollars are required for coax, and antenna, but a mag mount does keep the cost down compared to a permanent mount. Of course a tuned permanent mount antenna will greatly improve both transmit and receive performance.

willardguy - 9-15-2017 at 11:04 AM

I don't claim to know anything about these radios but over at RDC RuggedRadios is having a sale.....maybe deals to be had?

https://www.ruggedradios.com/index.php?main_page=special_cat...

JZ - 9-15-2017 at 11:28 AM

We've been using our portable marine radios when we ride our bikes. Distance is very limited in the trails. Not sure the output power, but guessing 5W. Two are older, so maybe even 2.5W.

Any one have an idea how much better the BaoFeng at 8W, plus upgraded antenna would perform?

Bob and Susan - 9-15-2017 at 02:11 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Warf  
Our little group has used 2 meter mobile units in our RZR's for a couple of years. 75 watts of transmit power gives you 50+ mile range depending on terrain. Perfect for Baja.


75 watts of transmit power ??? WOW

I thought legal limit was 2 to 5 watts

you MUST be bleeding into tv along the way

chuckie - 9-15-2017 at 03:02 PM

BOW FUNG's is the best ..ICOM is 3rd world these days...For once I agree with JZ...Mulege Al? Who would want to talk to him?:biggrin:

Hook - 9-15-2017 at 03:52 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
We've been using our portable marine radios when we ride our bikes. Distance is very limited in the trails. Not sure the output power, but guessing 5W. Two are older, so maybe even 2.5W.

Any one have an idea how much better the BaoFeng at 8W, plus upgraded antenna would perform?


I would say that the increase would not be worth the cost. Just too small a wattage increase to make a big difference.

And upgraded antennas can be fine for walking around but may become a nuisance on an MX bike. They can be quite a bit longer.

TMW - 9-15-2017 at 05:28 PM

Back when I first got my Baofeng radios the knock was the standard antenna that came with them caused the radio to burn up. Not sure why. It was recommended to upgrade to another antenna that is about 2-3 inches longer, which I did.

They also have a roof top mag mount antenna with the SMA connector. The antenna is about 2 feet long with a mag mount area about the size of a half dollar, kind of a cheap setup. I broke one at the base but was able to glue it back together.

They are real easy to program either by hand or with computer software.

The biggest problem I've had is when other people use them they will push a button on the face and then I usually have to play with it or read the manual to get it working again. There is a feature where you can lock the keys out which is what I do.

VHF/UHF radios

Jack Swords - 9-15-2017 at 07:37 PM

Some more information on the easily tuned VHF/UHF radios, Channel 16 VHF of the marine frequencies (156.8 MHz) is an international distress frequency and other channels are used by the Coast Guard and/or port captains. Best to avoid some of these. The Baofeng radios and most 2 meter radios will transmit on the marine frequencies. Also 144-148 MHz is the 2 meter amateur radio band. Lots of spectrum out there other than the above. As to power levels, hams with General class or above licenses can have power output when transmitting of 1500 watts PEP. Those hams doing aurora scatter or moon bounce do definitely use legal power on 2 meters. 2 meters and 432 MHz are also used for satellite communications with ham equipped satellites functioning as repeaters, one of which is the International Space Station (ISS).
N1IY

Hook - 9-15-2017 at 10:46 PM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie  
BOW FUNG's is the best ..ICOM is 3rd world these days...For once I agree with JZ...Mulege Al? Who would want to talk to him?:biggrin:


There are other options to ICOM. Specifically, Yaesu.

Yeah, ICOM's QC seems to have gone downhill in the last few years, from the reviews I have read.

Of course, finding radios, even from Japanese companies, that are Made in Japan can be difficult to find. My Yaesu VX-6 is M in J, but it is about eight years old. Only the legal 5w, for a hand held. It probably has a lot of parts from China, though.

Bob, the 75w has to be what is usually termed a mobile unit. Mounted, separate power supply, external antenna. A very good option for a standard vehicle. I really like having a mobile in the truck or house with an external speaker I can put outside and monitor transmissions. Lots of people still use VHF 2 meter frequencies for house-to-house communications in Mexico. The standard marine band is within the receive-only frequencies of most 2 meter radios but it is a simple modification to free them to transmit on the frequencies, too. Most marine mobile (not HH) radios are 25w max.

Bob and Susan - 9-16-2017 at 05:17 AM

what about the old units that could FIND the other unit...

you would talk and the other boat could find you...

they still make those?
can you buy them

saved me a couple og times before gps

chuckie - 9-16-2017 at 05:50 AM

Well, there was the Model T, and now the Tesla...The older radios, of course still work and are functional...We still have some around that get used once in a while...

PaulW - 9-16-2017 at 06:09 AM

For those that want a hand held. Search and find a compatible aftermarket antenna for better performance. All my hand helds have a longer whip antenna for portable use. For use in my various cars I use a 1/4 wave mag mount antenna and it greatly improves performance especially distance. Still no comparison distance wise to a regular 2 meter installed radio with some good power like 25-50 watts.
Many, many options for radio system choices. Have fun choosing.
And yes do not forget looking for a used radio, either hand held or installed. Lots of guys upgrade or change needs. Ebay has lots to chose from.

pappy - 9-16-2017 at 06:16 AM

Great feedback and info.appreciate it!

mtgoat666 - 9-16-2017 at 06:57 AM

A lot of advice here o buy radios that require a license.

We have the Motorola radio from Costco. Work great for the short distances we deal with. They are weather resistant. They are cheap. They don't require a licennse. They are simple. (The bow Fung ham radios being recommended here are super complicated, too many buttons, to share amongst wide variety of casual users)

PaulW - 9-16-2017 at 07:24 AM

License - yes - in the states. Of course this is is a Baja forum and it is very rare that the MX authorities are concerned. However when we cross a military check point we always turn off our radios.
The family radio has freqs and uses the only spectrum other than CB that do not require a license in the states. Marine radios also legal without a licence, but if you have a real marine radio you will find certain freqs are receive only.
One can go to a race in the states and listen with one of the radios discussed, but one should not transmit. The race organizer takes care of the waivers for the racers in the states.

Hook - 9-16-2017 at 08:20 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Bob and Susan  
what about the old units that could FIND the other unit...

you would talk and the other boat could find you...

they still make those?
can you buy them

saved me a couple og times before gps


I think you are talking about RDFs, radio direction finders. Different than a radio. They have an antenna array and can analyze a received radio signal and tell what DIRECTION it came from, but not necessarily how far away it was. Some boats still have them, but I have to believe the sales of those has probably dropped off the map, with how cheap and popular GPS units have become. Even inexpensive phones have GPS. People just share their coordinates now and one boat follows their GPS to the coordinates.

RDFs would still have a purpose on a rescue vessel, if it was receiving a transmission from a vessel in distress that could not relay coordinates. And they would still have some appeal to fishermen who hear a transmission about fish biting, but the sending vessel doesnt reveal their location. I have never used one but I believe all you can do is follow the direction path to the source and hope to locate the vessel. It's kind of a big-boat thing; the arrays were never that small, but maybe they have become smaller, the way GPS antennas have.

There is also something in the ham radio world where two radios set up in the same function (Yaesu calls this ARTS, or Automatic Range Transponder System) will automatically transmit a coded signal at regular intervals. No voice, just a coded transmission. If the other radio receives this signal, both radios recognize that they are still in potential verbal communication range. The radio will beep or sound a bell or something. It saves transmitting "can you still hear me" on something like a search and rescue operation.

woody with a view - 9-16-2017 at 08:42 AM

FINALLY, an interesting thread!

Hook - 9-16-2017 at 08:50 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
A lot of advice here o buy radios that require a license.

We have the Motorola radio from Costco. Work great for the short distances we deal with. They are weather resistant. They are cheap. They don't require a licennse. They are simple. (The bow Fung ham radios being recommended here are super complicated, too many buttons, to share amongst wide variety of casual users)


Licenses are a snap, these days. And cheap.

FRS radios are like, 1W. Even CBs had more range.

HH ham radios can do things that even cell phones cant, in the back country. And they are 5W. Amateur radio clubs have repeaters in places that cell towers aren't economically feasible. So does the USFS and BLM. In an emergency, you can break in on their frequencies and call for help. But not in Mexico.

BTW, in an emergency situation, non-licensees are legal to use ham radios.

There are a lot of really good deals on Baofeng radios through Amazon Prime. Just make sure you get a package with a lithium ion battery and charger, belt clip, lanyard, etc. A US warranty is not a bad idea, either.

A really sweet setup would be to get a magnet mount antenna, an antenna adaptor and maybe a 12v power plug. Clip the radio to your sun visor in the car. Your range would be dramatically increased, even line of sight. You would probably still be well under 100.00.

And have a lot more capability and distance than a Motorola FRS radio. Disconnect the external mag mount antenna, slap on the rubber duckie and you have a walk-about radio.

I have a Yaesu that is a far superior radio. But it is 10x the price of a UV-5R.

woody with a view - 9-16-2017 at 09:03 AM

We use our VHFs for car to car comms while SOB. The only bad part is terrain, interference everywhere and getting south up to and past SQ. We don't need too much more than that, and then the same handhelds go on the boat.

STILL, a bunch of tried and true info from this thread!

Barry A. - 9-16-2017 at 09:22 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
A lot of advice here o buy radios that require a license.

We have the Motorola radio from Costco. Work great for the short distances we deal with. They are weather resistant. They are cheap. They don't require a licennse. They are simple. (The bow Fung ham radios being recommended here are super complicated, too many buttons, to share amongst wide variety of casual users)


I have long (15 yrs plus) had Midland & Motorola FRS/GMRS hand-held walky-talkys, and like MtGoat says, they work fine for short distances like veh. caravans of friends and family, and hikes, and they are REALLY cheap. It just depends on what you think you need. I have at least 10 of them, and on trips spread them around to those that don't have them. A set of 4 Alkaline AA batteries last up to a week in them, even with lots of short transmissions, and you can set privacy-codes in the radios to keeps the nuts from interfering with your conversations. No lic. required.


JZ - 9-16-2017 at 10:58 AM

I'm gonna get 3 of the Baofeng. 2 for the bikes, 1 for the truck. Put a roof mount antenna on the truck as Hook suggests.

Will test it out on our next ride. Gonna bring my VHF radios for a comparison.

willardguy - 9-16-2017 at 11:10 AM

Bob Steinberger would attach an antenna to a weather balloon with a length of coax!

Bob and Susan - 9-16-2017 at 01:46 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
I'm gonna get 3 of the Baofeng. 2 for the bikes, 1 for the truck. Put a roof mount antenna on the truck as Hook suggests.

Will test it out on our next ride. Gonna bring my VHF radios for a comparison.


no need ...just tie 2 to your drone...one transmitting one receiving

a repeater and long antenna : )

JZ - 9-16-2017 at 05:17 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Bob and Susan  
Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
I'm gonna get 3 of the Baofeng. 2 for the bikes, 1 for the truck. Put a roof mount antenna on the truck as Hook suggests.

Will test it out on our next ride. Gonna bring my VHF radios for a comparison.


no need ...just tie 2 to your drone...one transmitting one receiving

a repeater and long antenna : )


Funny.