Sharksbaja
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Grafitti contact
Received a letter asking for more info.
JR, TW please note and respond.
the letter:
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Mr. Kuhlman and Members of the BajaNomad Forum,
Thank you for writing us and letting us know about the graffiti that is
being spray painted on various rocks and roadways in Baja. I am writing
to clear up any confusion and to put to rest any discussions pertaining
to BFGoodrich Tires' involvement in this matter.
We, like you, respect Baja and I can assure you that BFGoodrich Tires
neither sponsors nor condones this type of course marking. In fact, at
the request of SCORE, we work closely with racing officials (Sal Fish)
to mark the course with official course signage (signs stapled to wooden
stakes) and have done so for many years. As the overall racing governing
body, SCORE is in charge of all course signage. This process, as you
can imagine, takes many hours and days to complete and have not changed
the way it is done in more than 30 years.
I am not sure who the source of the graffiti is, but in speaking with our
off-road motorsports manager, he assures me that this is not something
that we condone and if it is discovered someone on our team or a volunteer
is involved, we will take appropriate action including any cleaning of areas
that may have been painted.
If you have an image of the alleged representative spray painting
markings, please feel free to forward to me at this e-mail address.
I would like to see the picture and will forward to our off-road motorsports
manager if it is determined this is an employee or volunteer representing
our company.
BFG takes a lot pride in its support of the Baja Peninsula and desert
racing in general. We take great care to ensure that all of our
employees and the hundreds of volunteers that serve as pit crew members
at each race, leave each location better than they found it and we work closely
with the Mexican officials to continue to build on our very close working
relationship. We are proud to say that our respect for the people, the
racing and terrain of Mexico has not changed since we arrived for our
first desert race 30 years ago.
In your e-mail, you mentioned that you and others have tried to contact
BFGoodrich Tires, but have had no response. Please detail your
communication attempts so that I can investigate. All Web site e-mail,
such as the one you sent via bfgoodrichtires.com is forwarded directly
to me for response. As a side note, please be aware that in addition to
the sanctioned SCORE races in which BFGoodrich participates, there are
numerous Mexican racing series that we are not involved with directly
and have no way of identifying how they mark their courses.
If you have any questions, please feel free to write me. Thank you for bringing
this to my attention and we will investigate appropriately.
Best Regards,
Christian Flathman
BFGoodrich Tires
Christian.Flathman@us.michelin.com
[Edited on 7-26-2005 by Sharksbaja]
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TMW
Select Nomad
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Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Bakersfield, CA
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Shark, my contact at BFG is Bob Bower and JR sent him the photo in question. Bob's boss works for Frank DeAngelo who I think is the Off-Road
Mororsport Manager mention in the letter above. it is my understanding that BFG will come down and clean the rock when the location is pin pointed.
When JR goes down south he can get the GPS location or I can follow him to Catavina and he can show me so I can forward to Bob.
As a personal note,I would like to think that the guys that did it were not regular BFG pit people but maybe someones friend just helping out and this
kind of help BFG don't need. I've been involved with Score racing sinse 1987 and I can honestly say I don't ever remember BFG being painted on a rock
like this. Of course I haven't been down every course at every race to every BFG pit but it does seem out of character for them to to something like
this.
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jrbaja
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Registered: 2-2-2003
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I understand it is in numerous places along the course
as well as being spray painted on the highway that I saw. I didn't get pictures of the highway though.
I see this somewhat as blaming someone else sort of deal on BFG's part.
What it tells me is that they didn't spend any time at all teaching whoever is wearing their shirts, that they are representing the entire company.
And it's not really good to mess up the environment. Maybe just a mention anyway!
It also shows me that something about these alledged signs would have eliminated this whole problem and I stated that in my original letter.
I didn't see any! At least not in the national park anyway. Maybe they used them somewhere else!
I am getting madder.
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Me No
Banned
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Registered: 11-24-2003
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TW, Sharks, JR. Thanks. Off-Roading does not need this kind of thing, and neither does BAJA. Hopefully this will promote some kind of awareness
that this crap ie; JR's photo of people blatantly marking giant boulders with spray paint, is totally unacceptable. I don't know of a single driver
or team that would condone this type of thing. It has to STOP!
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bajalou
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So what about all the orange and silver painted rocks along the courses?? That ain't BFG, it's either SCORE or the racing teams!
No Bad Days
\"Never argue with an idiot. People watching may not be able to tell the difference\"
\"The trouble with doing nothing is - how do I know when I\'m done?\"
Nomad Baja Interactive map
And in the San Felipe area - check out Valle Chico area |
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Me No
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Registered: 11-24-2003
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BajaLou, I don't think your post was necessarily directed at my comment, because I say. It has to STOP! We have all seen it. It does happen. With
out a long explination, Spray Paint, has no place in a Pit Box. Someone want to explain what a pit box is? FYI< a box can be as large as a SEMI
trailor.
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bajalou
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No, Me No, just to the subject itself. But the thread kind of makes BFG the sole bad guy, and that just ain't so. I agree that most racers/teams
don't want to paint up the whole course, but if you've been over the course, you've seen it I'm sure. Their excuse will be "safety" but that's just
an excuse. If you can't see rocks and cacti, you shouldn't be out there racing.
Just my thoughts on the subject.
No Bad Days
\"Never argue with an idiot. People watching may not be able to tell the difference\"
\"The trouble with doing nothing is - how do I know when I\'m done?\"
Nomad Baja Interactive map
And in the San Felipe area - check out Valle Chico area |
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
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Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
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keep pushing on them....
so they know we are all serious.
TW, good on ya for hammering them. From all I've heard Frank is the man and he also received a (same)note from me via another party. I should think
that they WILL act on it, especially since they know it's circulating in cyberspace. They(most big Corps) ARE monitoring their PR thru various
channels online and in this case BajaNomads. Certainly they (BFG) would never sanction the painting. It does appear they would like to pin blame
elsewhere tho. Any info sent helps. Has anyone made contact with Christian before??
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TMW
Select Nomad
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Location: Bakersfield, CA
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Lou the orange and silver paint was done by the Score marking people. Maybe I'm wrong but I think that stopped several years ago when the
environmentalist approched Sal, maybe mid 90s. To be honest, I welcomed many of them when I would be coming down a trail in the middle of know where
looking for a turnoff. During a race the ribbons and stake markers can get knocked down or pulled down and at night the painted signs might be all
you'll see. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but personally I never considered the painted bullseye or arrow as grafitti.
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bajalou
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Location: South of the broder
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Tom, I know what it's for and I'm sure it's helpful at 60mph. But I'm not too ancious to see any painting in the desert. Of course, I might trade
the painting for smoothing out some of the whoops.
No Bad Days
\"Never argue with an idiot. People watching may not be able to tell the difference\"
\"The trouble with doing nothing is - how do I know when I\'m done?\"
Nomad Baja Interactive map
And in the San Felipe area - check out Valle Chico area |
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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For as much time
as they spend pre running along with chase vehicles, preparing the course, setting up pits, spray painting rocks, (they even came back to touch up the
one in the picture) there is no excuse for not having removable signs.
Again I stress, this is a one of a kind spot on the planet. They have laws against it and police to protect them in the u.s.. I doubt they even
allow racing in the parks up there because of environmental impact.
When something as big as the Baja 1000 sets an example as bad as this, it is time for something to be done to make sure it doesn't happen again. By
anyone!
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Dave
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| Quote: | Originally posted by jrbaja
They have laws against it and police to protect them in the u.s.. |
Are there laws against it here? Have you checked?
They also have police here.
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jrbaja
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Registered: 2-2-2003
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Yes, Yes, and not enough.
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Dave
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So, if there were enough police do you think this would be a law that would be enforced?
And have you reported this to the Mexican authorities? If so, what was their response?
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
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Lot's of info in previous threads titled "Graffiti" in search
I met with PROFEPA 3 years ago regarding the artwork in Catavi?a and elsewhere, dumps, litter, cave protection, etc..
They don't have the funds to police many areas.
This was prior to the Catavi?a incident with BFG which I just happened to be at. You can imagine my dismay when I saw that happening.
I have met with PROFEPA on numerous occasions since but have not brought this particular incident up or shown them the pictures.
I have a pretty good idea what would happen and I kind of enjoy the racing here. I would much prefer working with BFG to get this stuff cleaned up.
They can afford to do something about it and maybe help me get some other areas cleaned up as well. I hope so.
I have also discussed these issues with the locals in many areas. Nobody likes it and with some fines and punishments posted, people would be
willing to do something about it.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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Just an additional observation------
For many years I have noticed that the racing folks have defaced the "narrows" of Matomi Canyon (just NW of Puertecitos) with HUGE graffiti just
downstream of the intersection of Matomi Wash and Valle Chico road. Between that, and the whoop-de-doos left on the roads, I do not have a very
favorable opinion of the "racing crowd". Those whoop-de-doos tear my heavy rig up unless I just creep along at about 2 miles per hour. Very annoying.
JR (and others) are right-----they need to be educated, and cited (and fined) if necessary, and the roads need to be dragged after the races to get
rid of at least the worst of the whoop-de-doos. It can be done----and is done, in the CA deserts.
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
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but JR is right about....
circumventing Mex authorities. Because the stakes are so high, I can imagine a "sensitive" corp would much prefer in-house alternatives. We shall see
soon what their "real" spin is on all this. I can't see them (BFG) putting their heads in the sand over this. Like I said earlier, it's possible to
turn all this into something positive, for everyone.
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mcgyver
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Registered: 8-22-2003
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BFG Markings
There has been a "BFG PIT AHEAD" painted in the road at KM 53 south of San Felipe for at least 2 years. There is or was another last year just west of
El Alamo on a boulder. It was near the boulder that is painted with the name of the racer who aparently hit it, this is along with the dayglos and
silver arrows in .the area. Matomi Wash has already been menitoned, its a disgrace! And as Barry A. said it is almost impassable now for other
traffic, it has went in the last 4 years from a place a place a regular passenger car could go to to a place even a big (or small) 4WD has trouble and
even the racers have problems in places. If Matomi were in any other country it would be a National park. The entire area around the road crossing at
about KM 48 south of San Felipe is a huge garbbage dump after the races with home made outhouses, yellow tape, signs, trash of every discripition
thrown in every hidden wash nearby, the open area at KM 53 is used by R/V's as a dump station after the race. All this is taken by the Mexican people
as disrespect to them and their country and someday the reckoning will come. There has been a lot of surveying done in Matomi Canyon the past year and
the locals tell me that it is private property and has been sold to a new owner, who or what is unknown but no one who has ever been there or hopes to
go would like to see it closed to entry. If all this were done in the USA you would see an outcry that would be to the 10th power of what it already
is about offroad racing.
PS: Don't even think about getting on my case about being down on the Baja Races, I have supported them for years but they have to start taking some
responsibility for the race course the next day after the races. Talk to the ranchers who live along the course, they detest the races! The ranch
roads from Ojos Negros to Independencia are maintained by the people and they were made impassable by the races last year, many areas had to be
moved 100s of feet to new roadbeds especialy in the El Alamo and east area.
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