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RFClark
Super Nomad
Posts: 2457
Registered: 8-27-2015
Member Is Offline
Mood: Looking forward to 2024
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New Review of the Todos Santos PDU (water usage vs supply)
https://journaldelpacifico.com/blog/issues/jdp_summer2023.pd...
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Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3500
Registered: 10-2-2006
Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
Member Is Offline
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Sobering.
US Marines: providing enemies of America an opportunity to die for their country since 1775.
What I say before any important decision.
F*ck it.
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JDCanuck
Super Nomad
Posts: 1579
Registered: 2-22-2020
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Seems to be the #1 unresolved issue wherever you go in Baja. Continuously declining aquifer levels and increasingly hard water supplies. Since
municipalities seem to be unable or unwilling to deal with it, seems to be yet another issue to be planned for by individuals as you build or buy.
Least ecologically disruptive solution I have found is atmospheric water generators, but the one drawback is a reliable power supply to run them.
Another use for solar power surpluses?
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AKgringo
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6017
Registered: 9-20-2014
Location: Anchorage, AK (no mas!)
Member Is Online
Mood: Retireded
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Is de-salinization on a small scale practical? I have no experience using water from that sort of system, and I wonder what the result is in terms of
water quality, and how much waste concentrates are generated.
If you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space!
"Could do better if he tried!" Report card comments from most of my grade school teachers. Sadly, still true!
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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7084
Registered: 8-5-2011
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Holy mackerel! I looked through the advertising brochure and am wondering when Todos Santos was moved to coastal Orange County CA.
Glad I got to know the area when Cerritos was ejido property, and nobody lived there. When Shut-up Franks was the only gringo business, and Frank was
there. When San Pedrito had palapas for $3 a night, and the circular palapa roofed restaurant/bar was open.
It was a wonderful place.
[Edited on 7-1-2023 by SFandH]
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tiotomasbcs
Super Nomad
Posts: 1837
Registered: 7-30-2007
Location: El Pescadero
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Todos Santos is trying hard to repel fast growth w/o regards to water, power, trash issues.....but Big Money is moving in! Still a good place to
live. I've been here since early 90s and our core community is working to keep it Alive and culturally enjoyable! IMHO
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
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I really wish you guys lots of luck trying to combat the growth. My daughter lives in T.S.
Where I live, on the mainland, the growth is rampant and unchecked. The wells are almost empty and even though I paid my water bill for the year in
January, they haven't sent water to my area since mid-April- I have had to buy pipas. 3 days ago, we lost the electric for 24 hrs, and again for
almost that long yesterday because of all the people using fans and blasting the AC.
Yet they just keep letting people built more hotels and more houses and put in swimming pools. It's insane and corrupt.
[Edited on 7-2-2023 by surabi]
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JDCanuck
Super Nomad
Posts: 1579
Registered: 2-22-2020
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Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  | | Is de-salinization on a small scale practical? I have no experience using water from that sort of system, and I wonder what the result is in terms of
water quality, and how much waste concentrates are generated. |
AKGringo: I looked at that and it seemed its big problem was the concentrated brine discharges. What do you do with it without causing more
destruction? On boats the effect would be minor, but any land based system would cause problems on discharges. Softeners add salt to the effluent and
create even higher water use for back flushing and rinse cycles. RO systems...about double the water use and a lot of filters to change out.
Then i saw how much byproduct distilled water was produced by my 1 1/2 ton air conditioner (about 7 gal per day under best conditions) and started
thinking atmospheric water generation. If you have a readily available surplus of solar or wind energy, why not put that to use producing distilled
water as the natural systems do and have done in the past millennia under previous civilizations?
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RFClark
Super Nomad
Posts: 2457
Registered: 8-27-2015
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Mood: Looking forward to 2024
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AK,
You need AC anyway and the humidity this time of year adds 10-15 Gal/day to our gray water system. We’re set up to collect and drink the AC water if
necessary. It all runs on solar too.
We're currently using about 3500 gal/month with the gray water system running the last 2 weeks and construction. July will be the first full month for
gray water recycling. I’ll report how we’re doing in August.
[Edited on 7-2-2023 by RFClark]
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
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| Quote: Originally posted by RFClark |
We're currently using about 3500 gal/month with the gray water system running the last 2 weeks and construction. July will be the first full month for
gray water recycling. I’ll report how we’re doing in August.
[Edited on 7-2-2023 by RFClark] |
Construction definitely sucks up water if they are mixing cement. But I hope that is not going to be your average water consumption going forward. I
am only one person, so you can double it for the two of you, but I use 3500 LITRES of water in about 2-3 weeks. And less if I am being conservative.
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JDCanuck
Super Nomad
Posts: 1579
Registered: 2-22-2020
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I am only one person, so you can double it for the two of you, but I use 3500 LITRES of water in about 2-3 weeks. And less if I am being conservative.
In the few months we spent in Baja, we used 6-8000 liters per month for two of us being very careful on water use without using any of that for
drinking or cooking. We purchased bottled water for all potable uses.
There are systems that will produce potable water from atmospheric water generation, they tend to run about 2-3 times the cost of a similar sized air
conditioner. It might be cheaper to collect all non-potable water in a supply cistern and then install a small RO system to produce potable water.
At the bottom of this web page are 5 available atmospheric potable water generators. Genaq produces multiple residential and commercial/industrial
sized systems, while H20Machine does a residential sized one for 4000 USD.
https://h2omachine.com/
We have ordered a small condensing 1000w maximum dehumidifier to test out that runs a bit cheaper than an AC unit for non-potable water production
only. It will use our excess solar capacity to reduce hardness in the cistern. At our place on the Baja Pacific, we have very high humidity,
exceptionally strong year round solar availability, and also much higher than normal year round breezes. When you combine all those factors, we should
be able to come up with a relatively inexpensive method of providing all our water needs in the future without relying on purchased well water or
trucked in water.
[Edited on 7-2-2023 by JDCanuck]
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
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I like the idea of the atmospheric water generation. I'm going to look into it. It's very humid where I live, too. I don't care about the water being
potable. I have a low tech system for that. After years of dealing with those ridiculously heavy garafons, I finally got a Berkey. Just pour tap water
in the top, clean, filtered drinking water comes out the bottom.
My heaviest water usage is for my extensive gardens in the dry season. I'm a quick shower person, wash dishes once a day, don't flush the toilet just
for pee, and have about 1 load of laundry a week. While all of my grey water is routed to various areas of the garden closest to the house, I don't
produce enough grey water as one person to water most of the garden.
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surfhat
Senior Nomad
Posts: 537
Registered: 6-4-2012
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Since most of us prefer to live as close to the ocean as we can afford, haha, and for the inherent cooling reasons as we can, these atmospheric water
collectors appear to be the best choice of what is available at the present time.
Supplying our own water source is optimal in a desert climate that we all love. The big plus is knowing we are not a part of draining the limited
underground aquifers.
The pressures of big money backed developing doesn't appear to care about sustaining the all important aquifers that matter, or should matter, to
everyone who gives a sheet about future generations having the same experience we were all blessed to have due to our timing.
As history has shown, many of us are modern versions of the dinosaurs, some obviously more than others. haha
Thank you Baja Nomad for providing a source for all to spout their own valued and sometimes valueless questionable opinions.
How boring would it be without the detractors referencing some opinionated and non-science backed sources, when 98% of the worlds scientists offer
their reliable and educated views?
Oh, of course, the overwhelming strong majority 98%, of these scientists are just paid for their opinions. ?????
"You see what you want to see".
"You hear what you want to hear."
Harry Nilson fifty years ago with his "The Point" was so prophetic.
History can teach us all valuable lessons, if we listen. Some do not and will never. \
Happy 4th to all who remember what this holiday is really about when our democracy is threatened like few times in our history.
Deniers are going to deny until their last breaths that cannot come too soon.
Over and out.
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
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RFClark
Super Nomad
Posts: 2457
Registered: 8-27-2015
Member Is Offline
Mood: Looking forward to 2024
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WG,
Look at the facts. China is over 50% of the problem. Are you a “if California just bans IC engines, gas appliances and cows it will solve the
problem” people?
Got solar, EVs and recycle your gray water? Talk’s cheap! Walk the walk too!
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soulpatch
Nomad
Posts: 404
Registered: 7-30-2005
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Are you catching rainwater?
One of my clients here in San Miguel de Allende just installed 2-10,000 liter tanks and last night I estimated we had at least a 100gmp running off
the roof for a solid 30 minutes and then a repeat of that a few hours later.
Finally,rain
| Quote: Originally posted by surabi | I like the idea of the atmospheric water generation. I'm going to look into it. It's very humid where I live, too. I don't care about the water being
potable. I have a low tech system for that. After years of dealing with those ridiculously heavy garafons, I finally got a Berkey. Just pour tap water
in the top, clean, filtered drinking water comes out the bottom.
My heaviest water usage is for my extensive gardens in the dry season. I'm a quick shower person, wash dishes once a day, don't flush the toilet just
for pee, and have about 1 load of laundry a week. While all of my grey water is routed to various areas of the garden closest to the house, I don't
produce enough grey water as one person to water most of the garden. |
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pacificobob
Super Nomad
Posts: 2304
Registered: 4-23-2006
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by surfhat | Since most of us prefer to live as close to the ocean as we can afford, haha, and for the inherent cooling reasons as we can, these atmospheric water
collectors appear to be the best choice of what is available at the present time.
Supplying our own water source is optimal in a desert climate that we all love. The big plus is knowing we are not a part of draining the limited
underground aquifers.
The pressures of big money backed developing doesn't appear to care about sustaining the all important aquifers that matter, or should matter, to
everyone who gives a sheet about future generations having the same experience we were all blessed to have due to our timing.
As history has shown, many of us are modern versions of the dinosaurs, some obviously more than others. haha
Thank you Baja Nomad for providing a source for all to spout their own valued and sometimes valueless questionable opinions.
How boring would it be without the detractors referencing some opinionated and non-science backed sources, when 98% of the worlds scientists offer
their reliable and educated views?
Oh, of course, the overwhelming strong majority 98%, of these scientists are just paid for their opinions. ?????
"You see what you want to see".
"You hear what you want to hear."
Harry Nilson fifty years ago with his "The Point" was so prophetic.
History can teach us all valuable lessons, if we listen. Some do not and will never. \
Happy 4th to all who remember what this holiday is really about when our democracy is threatened like few times in our history.
Deniers are going to deny until their last breaths that cannot come too soon.
Over and out.
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Well said.
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by soulpatch | Are you catching rainwater?
One of my clients here in San Miguel de Allende just installed 2-10,000 liter tanks and last night I estimated we had at least a 100gmp running off
the roof for a solid 30 minutes and then a repeat of that a few hours later.
Finally,rain
|
I am currently catching rainwater but in the most basic way. I have 2 water pipes that come off my balcony that all the rain on my roof gushes out of,
and I put pails under there, then use that water to wash dishes, flush the toilet, water potted plants. But I have been planning to hook those 2 pipes
up to a lateral pipe that then goes into a downpipe that would fill my cistern.
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JDCanuck
Super Nomad
Posts: 1579
Registered: 2-22-2020
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by surabi | | Quote: Originally posted by soulpatch | Are you catching rainwater?
One of my clients here in San Miguel de Allende just installed 2-10,000 liter tanks and last night I estimated we had at least a 100gmp running off
the roof for a solid 30 minutes and then a repeat of that a few hours later.
Finally,rain
|
I am currently catching rainwater but in the most basic way. I have 2 water pipes that come off my balcony that all the rain on my roof gushes out of,
and I put pails under there, then use that water to wash dishes, flush the toilet, water potted plants. But I have been planning to hook those 2 pipes
up to a lateral pipe that then goes into a downpipe that would fill my cistern. |
Sounds like a very inexpensive plan that just might surprise you with how much it yields annually. Filtration to the cistern supply would be a high
priority I think. RFClark way back showed us a very inexpensive filtration box he had installed.
I envy people who live in Baja year round and can reuse their discharges through Engineered septic water systems to water their shrubs and fruit
trees. Much of our water demand is used to just keep plants alive year round when we aren't in residence, and rooftop rainwater is just discharged
uselessly to our lot at present as the storage system would prove very expensive.
[Edited on 7-4-2023 by JDCanuck]
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surabi
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4707
Registered: 5-6-2016
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Some sort of screen that filters out leaves and such would be a good idea, but beyond that, I'm not concerned with filtration. I would design the
simple gutter and downpipe system so it could be easily disconnected at the start of the rainy season until the dust, dirt, and bird poop that had
accumulated on my roof was well washed away. It rains so hard where I live that the water runs clear and clean after the first few rains. I have put
my garafons under the water spout and drunk that water with no filtration with no ill effects.
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