gringorio
Senior Nomad
Posts: 812
Registered: 4-10-2004
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
More fish tails
By the time I had reached Bahia San Luis Gonzaga I had seen enough pangas, nets, and flagged buoys to be keenly interested in what a day fishing was
like for the artisanal fishermen on the Sea of Cortez.
I wanted to know what was happening under the water: Where there more nets, more hooks? What were the fishermen catching? Sea bass, turtles, sharks? I
had no idea.
Paddling in to Bahia San Luis Gonzaga I stopped at the first fish camp I saw (On Isla San Luis Gonzaga) and said hello and inquired about a mythical
place named ?Alfonsina?s.? The fishermen seemed to be laughing at me, but I understood enough of their reply to follow their directions and find my
way to the sandy beach in front of Alfonsina?s: restaurant, bar, hotel.
It was there that I ? a sunburned, blond and skinny gringo - stepped out of my comfort level and approached Antonio, el Jefe de Alfonsina?s, to ask
about tagging along with some fishermen to take photos, video, and learn more about what the fishermen do. He turned and pointed to the group of men
he had been talking to before my approach and said in Spanish, ?All these guys are fishermen, ask them.?
Jose Luis and Jose both turned to me as I spoke to them in my poor Spanish, 'Si Possible, yo deseo ir contigo in la manana para intender mas y para
tomar fotos y video.' In a no-nonsense manner, Jose Luis said in Spanish 'OK be here at six, six thirty. Bring food and water.'
The rest of the story plus photos is found here: http://www.bajacaliforniaconservation.org/phpbb/viewtopic.ph...
[Edited on 6-15-2005 by gringorio]
|
|
|
David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64490
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
|
|
Awesome!
|
|
|
Ken Bondy
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3326
Registered: 12-13-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mellow
|
|
Fabulous report Greg. I am so envious. I have wanted to do that SOOOO many times over the years, never did, something always got in the way. Buena
suerte on the rest of your trip, que le vaya bien.
++Ken++
PS did you get my email about the D70?
|
|
|
Frank
Senior Nomad
Posts: 861
Registered: 6-5-2005
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Is it time to leave yet?
|
|
Just finished reading, great story.
|
|
|
neilmac
Nomad
Posts: 127
Registered: 1-3-2005
Member Is Offline
|
|
Great story!
What's a Vaqueta ? A kind of huachinango?
Neil
|
|
|
eetdrt88
Senior Nomad
Posts: 986
Registered: 2-20-2005
Location: Az/Ca/Baja
Member Is Offline
|
|
hows that for an insiders look
at the local fishermans average day....thanks gringorio
|
|
|
gringorio
Senior Nomad
Posts: 812
Registered: 4-10-2004
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
Thanks everyone! I really felt lucky to be accepted like that and it helped me gain a perspective I could have only speculated about before.
Ken, I did get your email - Thanks! I'll be shooting at the Medium/Fine for now one. Today I'll be getting some 8 by 12 prints back that were shot
at the Large/Normal settings and I'll see how those look.
Neil, I don't even know what a 'huachinango' is! Jose Luis spelled the word for me because at first I thought he was saying 'Vaquita' like the
porpoise on the northern Gulf. I'm no fishermen so I don't know my fish. They just looked like some kind of sea bass to me. I couldn't find a
look-a-like on Gene Kira's fish ID web page either...
| Quote: | Originally posted by neilmac
Great story!
What's a Vaqueta ? A kind of huachinango?
Neil |
|
|
|
wilderone
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3779
Registered: 2-9-2004
Member Is Offline
|
|
They're sometimes called California Snapper.
|
|
|
Don Alley
Super Nomad
Posts: 1997
Registered: 12-4-2003
Location: Loreto
Member Is Offline
|
|
Baqueta, or Gulf Coney
http://www.mexfish.com/fish/baqu/baqu.htm
|
|
|
pokey
Nomad
Posts: 199
Registered: 5-20-2005
Location: ensenada
Member Is Offline
Mood: sun burned
|
|
Great story. Maybe now that folks have seen first hand how a commercial fisherman earns his living they will think twice before accusing commercial
fisherman of destroying a fishery.
|
|
|
Skipjack Joe
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8084
Registered: 7-12-2004
Location: Bahia Asuncion
Member Is Offline
|
|
Baqueta, eh. I'm a croissant man myself.
Thanks for the ID Don. It didn't really look like a snapper from the photos.
|
|
|
Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by pokey
Great story. Maybe now that folks have seen first hand how a commercial fisherman earns his living they will think twice before accusing commercial
fisherman of destroying a fishery. |
What are you saying. Do you condone long-lining. It's not only primative but is responsible for the destruction of fisheries all over the planet. Are
you not aware of the international treaties agreeing on banning this indiscriminate type of harvest. Maybe Gringorio should show the other side of the
issue. The side that shows helpless,hapless turtles, giant brood fish, sharks of all sizes marine mammals and diving birds "dying on the vine"
Just because these fishermen are unadvised and uneducated does not warrant this type of harvest. Moreover, the problem becomes exacerbated when it's
accepted as a "normal" routine.
Like has been said earlier;" it's Mexicos' problem and the U.S. should worry about it's own". That is true, however our problems led to answers and
adjustments so as to limit overall damage on the sea. Mexicos' approach is very simple: turn a blind eye because it's (supposedly)in the best interest
of the people. When a living natural resource(s) is treated with this attitude it becomes clear that the future concern is not a priroity. This will
become a big problem when the Sea of Cortez has to feed a huge market just around the corner.
|
|
|
pokey
Nomad
Posts: 199
Registered: 5-20-2005
Location: ensenada
Member Is Offline
Mood: sun burned
|
|
Not one fishing method is %100 environmentally sound. Hook and line, purse sein, trawler, gillnets all have their problems. Granted hook and line
(trolling) is probably the least destructive but all fishing methods have their drawbacks.
Do you sell Oregon caught Dungeness at your restaurant Sharks? If so then you know it was a bumper year for the Dungeness fishery. And you have
profited from it; probably more so then the guys who worked on the crab boats. Do you think that this years Dungeness harvest is
sustainable? Definitely not. But it hasn't prevented you from profiting off of this years harvest. Blaming the commercial fisherman for the
decline of fisheries is a bit odd considering that you enjoy a comfortable living off of their work.
I won't even bother getting into the Oregon rockfish trawl fishery. Which as we both know has seen better days. Overfished to the extreme. Do
you sell rockfish in your restaurant?? If so then you share the blame.
You don't like long lining? Ever try to catch Halibut in a gillnet or purse sein. Lol, probably not cuz it can't be done. Sometimes long
lining is the only way to catch a fish.
|
|
|
gringorio
Senior Nomad
Posts: 812
Registered: 4-10-2004
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Member Is Offline
|
|
Thanks for your posts and opinions everyone. Please feel free to post them on the conservation site too. Sharks, I like your idea about describing
the other side: Waste. In short, in simple poundage, there were probably about 200 pounds of ?bait fish? killed to catch maybe half that in ?good?
fish. The unwanted fish/eels were kicked overboard dead or well on their way. At the end of the day the unused bait fish were thrown overboard as
waste too.
I'm trying to report factually what I observed with getting emotionally involved in the story, though I do have my opinions for sure! A little
education on all sides will go a long way as well as proper enforcement of existing regulations for everyone.
One important piece of this for me was putting a human face to the issues. Getting to know Jose and Jose Luis the little bit I did helped me turn the
issues from an impersonal ?they? who are apparently creating all the problems in to a personal ?we? who need to work together to solve the issues we
see. It?s easier to blame a faceless person for all the problems in the world rather than look to ourselves for potential solutions. One of the
ideas behind my web site.
Just a thought...
[Edited on 6-16-2005 by gringorio]
|
|
|
Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by pokey
Not one fishing method is %100 environmentally sound. Hook and line, purse sein, trawler, gillnets all have their problems. Granted hook and line
(trolling) is probably the least destructive but all fishing methods have their drawbacks.
Do you sell Oregon caught Dungeness at your restaurant Sharks? If so then you know it was a bumper year for the Dungeness fishery. And you have
profited from it; probably more so then the guys who worked on the crab boats. Do you think that this years Dungeness harvest is
sustainable? Definitely not. But it hasn't prevented you from profiting off of this years harvest. Blaming the commercial fisherman for the
decline of fisheries is a bit odd considering that you enjoy a comfortable living off of their work.
I won't even bother getting into the Oregon rockfish trawl fishery. Which as we both know has seen better days. Overfished to the extreme. Do
you sell rockfish in your restaurant?? If so then you share the blame.
You don't like long lining? Ever try to catch Halibut in a gillnet or purse sein. Lol, probably not cuz it can't be done. Sometimes long
lining is the only way to catch a fish. |
First off,
exactly where did I say that the commercial fishermen were to blame for fishery depletions.
Come to Newport #1 West Coast landings last year and probably this year. The fishery here has been strong for many years. At least 4-5. Back in the
mid 90s everyone said the Crab industry was doomed. In just one year landings reversed. The salmon industry too although this year has been off.
If you want to make parallels thats' fine but don't confuse the issue of OUR messed up fisheries to that of Mexico.
One could argue that Korean, Japanese and Russian fleets used extensive long-lines and tangle nets and helped in the demise of turtles, cetaceans,
king-crab and swordfish to name a few and the fact that they are not is probably because of enacted laws.
The argument was in favor of alternative methods to sustain the pagueros way of life. I have no issue with fishing for food and a living. I have many
friends that are fishermen. Don't try to paint me as some fish-hugging capitalist. My point has always been to eliminate or regulate SOME types of
harvest techniques for SOME types of game. I am sure you don't condone fin-fishing.
The fact that local sea lions have learned how steal the set bait indicates how man has created a false dinner plate for the sea lions and now can't
fill it for themselves..
the crabbers are all driving nice new trucks here in Newport....
on the issue of rockfish
Recent local ocean surveys by NOAA confirmed what many fishermen have been saying all along about the rockfish populations(sebastes complex) Data does
confirm certain discrepancies in a few (out of 47) species i.e. "yellow eye" in distinct areas. The fact that the fishery has been compromised in
certain areas does not necessarily translate into an endangered group of fish. The damage done by dragging the continental shelf many years ago and
still practiced does serious damage to rockfish habitats. It is estimated that it takes 100 years for nature to restore itself back to healthy
conditions. There is a way to manage this resource.
In answer to your question about our use.: Yes, but When I can get hook & line rockfish I most certainly do.
My dream has always been about a good managed fishery. It is my livelyhood, and I think with good data , methods and common sense we can utilize most
gamefish species, but when you have years of neglect, and idiots making decisions regarding an inexact complicated science like this it forces
drastic measures, sometimes too late.
You may be right though about pinning blame. I don't think global warming is the culprit.
|
|
|
pokey
Nomad
Posts: 199
Registered: 5-20-2005
Location: ensenada
Member Is Offline
Mood: sun burned
|
|
| Quote: | Sharks, although we see ocean fisheries from two different view points I think we both share a love for the ocean and it's inhabitants.
| Quote: | First off,
exactly where did I say that the commercial fishermen were to blame for fishery depletions. |
You didn't. I did, in a poor attempt to show that all forms of commercial fishing have serious environmental consequences. In my experience the
by-catch from long-lining pales in comparison to trawling. Purse seining, gill netting, hook and line all catch more than a few non-target species
but not to the extent that trawling and long- lining do. Any person who buys trawled rock fish, whiting, cod, pollock, sole ... contributes to the
decline of the ocean floor. Imo the most serious and lasting consequences of commercial fishing.
Which fishing method would have the smallest effect on the Sea of Cortez? Purse seining? Trawling? Imagine the impact that 10 ton purse sein
sets would have on the Sea of Cortez. Trawling is so damn productive that inshore Sea of Cortez would be fished out in no time!! Hook and line
would be nice but it is the least efficient of all the fishing methods. Are we willing to pay $10 a lb for jurel? All in all, long lining sems
like one of the better ways to fish the Sea of Cortez.
Supply=demand. It's easy to criticize long- lining but who is selling and purchasing fish caught with this method? If a person buys Alaskan
Halibut they are purchasing a fish caught on a long line. If there were no buyers there would be no sellers. Who are we to fault a panguero for
his fishing method when the restaurants eagerly buy his fish and sell it for 10x the amount they paid for it? Maybe consumer education would help
the situation out. But then again it might not. The incidental catch of a few eels and the mortality rate of bait probably won't get Americans in
an uproar like dead dolphins do.
| Quote: | | the crabbers are all driving nice new trucks here in Newport.... |
Usually a good sign that the stocks are going to collapse. Reminds me of Opilio (snow crab) in the late 90's. FAT quotas and
then...........nothing. We fished them out. But the money was good while it lasted. .
Again.... supply=demand. If people buy and sell a fish then somebody will catch it.... (Until the stocks are severely depressed). What the
oceans need are sane regulations and proper enforcement. Unfortunately due to the number of parties making a living off of fish it is difficult for
the various parties to come to a mutual agreement that will be benificial to whats most important. Healthy fish stocks.
[qoute] My dream has always been about a good managed fishery. It is my livelyhood, and I think with good data , methods and common sense we can
utilize most gamefish species, but when you have years of neglect, and idiots making decisions regarding an inexact complicated science like this it
forces drastic measures, sometimes too late. |
Thats an admireable dream. Perhaps with planet wide IFQ's (individual fisherman quotas) and better by-catch regulations this would be possible.
But we all know that isn't going to happen in our life times. In the mean-time we can insist on better local regulations and purchase fish that
isn't in the process of being overfished.
And NEVER buy farmed fish. 
|
|
|
Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
|
|
We are all in this together.
I really can't see where we differ much on our attempt to justify this beleaguered industry. We both know how much pressure particular areas get
especially when there is ZERO regulation and responsibility, common in Mexico. I can only imagine if they started dragging/exploiting the coast of
Mexico.
Long lining halibut is another thing that has potentially fatal
ramifications. The Bering Sea sees more pressure now than the North Sea ever did and look at it now.. Like you said supply and demand drives world
markets. It is good we are so far from Asia where consumption of seafood is astronomical.
For my part, I refuse to sell shark.
Pokey said:
"Who are we to fault a panguero for his fishing method when the restaurants eagerly buy his fish and sell it for 10x the amount they paid for it?"
And shark fins even more! All I can say to that is that education eminates from somewhere else, not the restaurant industry.
Farmed fish sucks....
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
