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fdt
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4059
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Tijuana, Baja California
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Mood: Yeah, what if it all goes right
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valla al fin
Not to offend the few friends I have (from way back) but I have to agree w/JR on
#12 as a mexican. I, as a commoner or just a citizen talking, living and simply conversing with others of my kind (mexican citizens). WE DO NOT
LIKE, CAN NOT SWALLOW, GWB! We do not agree with his politics.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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fdt----
That is fine, and I am sure you are right concerning you and your friends. Still, the stats say that up to 40% of hispanics in the USA do support
JWB.
We (all of us) usually gravitate towards those that agee with us on important subjects.
Case in point-----I spent 5 weeks in Italy prior to two weeks ago, and I talked to litterally 100's of Italians----most (not all) agreed with me and
supported what GWB was trying to do. Of course, some just looked at me in horror, but not most. We often hear what we want to hear--------I am sure
that this is true with me, tho I try to keep an open mind.
Only time will tell, I guess.
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
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I've lived in Mexico through all of GWB's presidency and I have never, ever met one Mexican who supports him. Of course, the same thing could be said
of Fox.
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lindsay
Nomad
Posts: 189
Registered: 9-9-2003
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It Takes All Kinds of People....& Tortillas
For about a week, I haven't posted because we have been busy here at the school and I also smashed an index finger in the car door...still a nice
black and blue color but now I'm up for typing again so here goes...
I have stayed out of some posts because my own personality, for better or worse, is to avoid confrontations and be the diplomatic one....JR's post
remind me of how it's good to have someone confront you in a style that is not like your own and sometimes really ponder where you stand on something
whether you agree with him or not.
I learned this recently when talking to a father whose daughter attends my kid's preschool. We were at a local park in La Jolla and as the kids were
playing he told me that his family was relocating to NYC because of a work opportunity with a cultural organization. He told me how excited he was to
return to a big city with all its offerings and asked me why I liked SD? His "in your face" style pressed me to really explain myself and I realized
that I had to think it over and give him some concrete reasons. We had an interesting conversation about what satisfies people in life and I respected
him for his ability to make me think about these issues. His personality is totally different from mine and when I first got to know him over a year
ago, my initial impression was that he was pushy and obnoxious. He would strongly express his politics and ,in general, was too intense for my
tastes....but over time I realized that he was really talented and had also produced some truly wonderful cultural exchanges between SD and TJ youth
groups through the music production organization that he directed in SD. So, what's my point...don't worry I'll get there eventually....
Lately, I've seen a lot of anger and bickering on the board. Some people like it and some are off the board now due to it. What do I think?? Well, as
I said before, my personality is to naturally seek out diplomacy and avoid negativity. However, conflict and differences can be positive when, as this
parent showed me, we can be pushed to look at a view or enraged enough to stand up for what we really feel.
Another related lesson came from a wise man in Mulege via a food analogy. He said some days he likes flour tortillas, other days corn, some days just
rice and beans no tortillas but throw in some ranch queso. Then, he added that the same offering everyday was boring and not healthy for food or in
life. Next, he said just like food, we are not all the same tortillas and we should not surround ourselves with sameness. So, his words lead me back
to JR's posts. JR, some of your posts are not how I would communicate my views but just as the parent I spoke of before, being pushed and challenged
to take a stand or reflect on our views is healthy...we are not the same tortilla but that is part of the variety found here.
As for your list, I have seen what you describe in Mulege but showing foreigners that path to respect is complex. If your views get others to think
about how we live in Mexico that is useful but there are many paths to get there...you have found yours but it is possible to get there another way.
Learning Spanish is one that I believe in strongly when living in another country whether it's Mexico, the U.S., or any other place....if you want to
interact in a community beyond just the day to day needs level. As far as getting involved, I think that it all depends on the approach...is it a
paternalistic, I know better than you do or I'm interested in being part of your world, what do you think would be useful?? During my time in Mulege,
I saw all these areas both the positive and negative. As for the negative, sometimes people don't reflect on how their actions may be taken, sometimes
we all make mistakes that were done with good intentions. Does it make us evil or contributors to the downfall of Baja California?? Maybe yes, maybe
no....now I need that in your face parent who's moving to NYC to kick my butt and make me take a stand on this!! Anyway, enough is enough from
me....sorry, by now some of you may be wishing I did break my finger when it got slammed in the car door!!
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fdt
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4059
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Tijuana, Baja California
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Mood: Yeah, what if it all goes right
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you say 40%
of hispanics in the US. I just happened to agree with JR that has nothing to do with Hispanics (that are unknown in M?xico as also are latinos
unknown in M?xico as a race) wich are not the mexicans JR is probably refering to. AS a mexican I and other mexicans do not agree w/gwb
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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I most assuredly do not
bring up u.s.politics in my travels. Don't even like it that much on here!~
What I will say is that the rural Mexican folks used to bring it up plenty when I started going down there. I was asked everywhere I went how I feel
about the war.
I don't feel to kindly about it at all and watching what is happening now, I feel even less kindly and think that people that promote this crap are
idiots but again, this isn't about that.
And my friends here in the north feel the same way. They do not like war. Especially another ridiculous one where lives are being lost because of an
arrogant idiot. But this isn't about that either.
ALL of them considered gb the same as bin laden! I couldn't argue!!
This is about some ideas about foreigners moving to another country. I got these ideas from the gwb handbook on how to win friends and fit in while
visiting foreign countries.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64480
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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But, did they support Saddam Hussein and his rape and torture chambers? That is no longer happening, thanks to us, and the coalition forces (and GWB).
That had to stop... just like Hitler had to be stopped (Germany didn't attack us either).
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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Guantanamo David?
Arent you in enough trouble already?
Lindsay, this isn't about you.
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fdt
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4059
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Tijuana, Baja California
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Mood: Yeah, what if it all goes right
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JR, leave DK alone
I am for once suporting your # 12 and yes, probably MY FRIEND DK wont agree, but I know he respects my opinion and I will not dwell on it
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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What about 1 - 11
and 13 - 16?
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fdt
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4059
Registered: 9-7-2003
Location: Tijuana, Baja California
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Mood: Yeah, what if it all goes right
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de acuerdo, OK? nfm
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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And Barry
If yall believed stats coming from that place, none of you would vacation in Mexico, right?
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lindsay
Nomad
Posts: 189
Registered: 9-9-2003
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JR, be careful before you absolve me...as I said before as a "freshman" in Baja California I think most of us can find experiences that we would
approach differently if we could have them to try again....I know that I had mine. So, as I said in the last post, maybe some of the people that you
find fault with are not in a place where they are capable of looking at their actions...I don't know. You have seen behavior and attitudes that you
find unacceptable. Do I have a remedy for it? No. Do I know all the ins and outs of your feelings about what's happening in Baja California. No,
again. I did write though because I identify with some of your points but because we are not the same tortilla and look at life differently, hopefully
you can see my view as well. It goes back to the good, bad and ugly theme...we are ALL a little bit of each one and hopefully we're able to own up to
that, call out others when we see it and find a way to negotiate it all. Sorry, it's my diplomatic side but I'm working on getting the "in your face"
part going...it's a work in progress. Cuidate!!
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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Are you related to Mike Humfreville
by any chance?
And no worries, just joshin ya teach.
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by lindsay
maybe some of the people that you find fault with are not in a place where they are capable of looking at their actions...I don't know. You have seen
behavior and attitudes that you find unacceptable. Do I have a remedy for it? |
I do. Ban the sale of alcohol to gringos.
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Bajame
Nomad
Posts: 458
Registered: 6-12-2005
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Mood: Baja Dreamin
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Some have eye's and cannot see  and ears and cannot hear. If he put's some
extra coins in your pocket then he must be a great man! 
We all want a peaceful world, filled with love and laughter, but we fill ourselves with anger and hate trying to fiqure out how to achive it.
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jrbaja
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4863
Registered: 2-2-2003
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Stop it you guys
Some genius may accuse me of tampering with the numbers of replies and views.
I wonder where he gets those ideas from? Florida perhaps
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lindsay
Nomad
Posts: 189
Registered: 9-9-2003
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Hasta Manana
Have enjoyed the posts tonight...no JR, I'm not related to Mike but remember some day the diplomat might just take you out to the bamboo shed for a
good whooping...just joshin'...remember I'm still trying to get that "in your face" part going!!
Dave, you're right alcohol and some gringos do not mix but in fairness, I could put that label on many other nationalities when people are in vacation
mode, living la vida loca or just have driven down alcoholism lane. When we're in Mexico, unfortunately, the drunk gringo sterotype gets reinforced
but the ugly "visitor" I don't think is just an American by-product. You can come see some of my adult students at the English school here in SD to
illustrate the point....they come from all over the world and believe me, some of them live it up with "drink" as well as any "gringos gone wild" down
south!! Take care everyone and off to the land of night-night and suenos for me!!
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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Oh, I can tell you...
that the Mexicans I know in these parts and the ones I have hired in Mexico are not shy about their feelings of Bush.:moon:
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Sharksbaja
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5814
Registered: 9-7-2004
Location: Newport, Mulege B.C.S.
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by jrbaja
Some thoughts on moving to a foreign country.
1. Learn the language at least a little.
2. Don't move to a gringo enclave where thieves like to prey
3. Don't move to a city
4. Meet and talk to the local people
5. Show them you are either a good or bad person. (they can tell)
6. Don't complain
7. Don't try to change anything your first week or year
there.
8. Make a friend
9. Don't think that you are better than them for whatever silly reasons. You are not.
10. Learn from the locals and don't try to teach them your ways
11. Mind your own business
12. Don't tell them you like george bush!
13. Respect everyone, no matter thier appearance or social status
14. Mind your own business
15. When you are established/respected, work together with the community to make things happen for the benefit of all, not just you.
16. Mind your own business |
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Gee, finally a test for the palabras de espanol impaired.
Piece of pie:
1. Ola, como esta?
2. Estato del seso
3. Mulege... pop:3500, es ciudado?
4. Ola, como esta?
5. Que pasa?
6. No problema
7. Despues mi amigo
8. Ola, como esta mi amigo
9. Tu suerte mi amigo
10. Gracias amigo
11. No problema
12. No problema
13. No problema
14. No problema
15. No trabajo solomente.
16. No problema
No problem
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