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gtx510
Junior Nomad
Posts: 34
Registered: 11-16-2006
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Tenayan?
I always figured all the dirt roads around there gave the lawless types plenty of room to hide or get around.
We finally got in touch with the Mulege police. I'm not sure why that took so long. We don't know anything definate but apparently they're working on
it. ie. we're not sure if the Jeep has been found or not. Or if there's any suspects.
[Edited on 12-4-2006 by gtx510]
[Edited on 12-4-2006 by gtx510]
Help us find my father\'s killer(s?)!!!
Description of Jeep
He was murdered on Playa Armenta, south of Mulege B.C.S. The local police say it was on the 11th, but it was probably Tuesday the 7th.
PLEASE help us to find his killers.
They stole his ALL WHITE 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
It has a large dent on the rear liftgate to the left of the license plate.
There\'s a large black roof rack, about 4\'x4\'x1/2\', made from thin, round steel tubes and rods.
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kellychapman
Nomad
Posts: 246
Registered: 9-19-2006
Location: Loreto CBS
Member Is Offline
Mood: heavenly
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It is pretty common knowledge that crime is everywhere now it seems....you are not really safe ANYWHERE in these time and that is the pure and simple
truth......I hate it.....
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
Member Is Offline
Mood: Inquisitive
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How is it that KGTV has the story, yet the family of the victim hasn't been notified?
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gtx510
Junior Nomad
Posts: 34
Registered: 11-16-2006
Member Is Offline
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I think when I last talked to 10news they mistook "might have found" for "did find"? and ran a quick follow-up peice?
Help us find my father\'s killer(s?)!!!
Description of Jeep
He was murdered on Playa Armenta, south of Mulege B.C.S. The local police say it was on the 11th, but it was probably Tuesday the 7th.
PLEASE help us to find his killers.
They stole his ALL WHITE 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
It has a large dent on the rear liftgate to the left of the license plate.
There\'s a large black roof rack, about 4\'x4\'x1/2\', made from thin, round steel tubes and rods.
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Minnow
Banned
Posts: 1110
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: Lost Wages
Member Is Offline
Mood: Embarrased Harry Reid is a Nevadan
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Tenayan is one brand of a cheap cane liquer that contributes greatly to alcoholism in Mexico. IMHO, whoever did this horrible act to your father had
to have been on something. What a shame.
Proud husband of a legal immigrant.
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Cincodemayo
Senior Nomad
Posts: 725
Registered: 3-7-2005
Location: Pacific NW
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gtx510...
This whole story is absolutely unbelieveable. The GROSS stupidity of officials and the total lack of responsibility of the governmental departments
within the US. I'm amazed what you have gone thru.
Condolances don't even skim the surface of what anger you must feel towards the police and chain of BS. I'd think it's time to rattle EVERY elected
officials neck and get something done. My thoughts surely go out to you and your family.
Don\'t get mad...
Get EVEN.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Cincodemayo
gtx510...
This whole story is absolutely unbelieveable. The GROSS stupidity of officials and the total lack of responsibility of the governmental departments
within the US. I'm amazed what you have gone thru.
Condolances don't even skim the surface of what anger you must feel towards the police and chain of BS. I'd think it's time to rattle EVERY elected
officials neck and get something done. My thoughts surely go out to you and your family. |
"total lack of responsibility of the governmental deprtments within the US" ????????? Just what depts. are you talking about??? and what do they
have to do with Mexico????
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kellychapman
Nomad
Posts: 246
Registered: 9-19-2006
Location: Loreto CBS
Member Is Offline
Mood: heavenly
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The same thing that happens everywhere.....crime is what comes with growth and the influx of workers from all over, probably from very high crime
rates. It has just come to the time in life where no matter where you go it is imperative to take safety percations for you and your family.....and
not to be stupid to think that there is a possiblity that something could happen to you....but most importantly..... do whatever you have to do to
keep your family safe because it is our job to take care of our loved ones....
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gtx510
Junior Nomad
Posts: 34
Registered: 11-16-2006
Member Is Offline
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My family and I have talked to the:
State Dept + TJ consulate and Mexico City embassy (and the FBI agent there)
DEA
FBI
Border Patrol
Customs/Immigration
SDPD
CHP
ICE (part of Homeland security)
Darrell Issa's office (our local congressman)
Unless the murder(s?) were US citiizens or drugs were involved all they can do is pressure the Mexican gov't to produce results. And I don't know if
they're even doing that. The TJ consulate isn't much help other than referring info that the local police tell them. AND they incorrectly instructed
us on how to get my dad's body back to the States. Thanks, that was $10k my family didn't need anyhow. And I really liked the experience I had with
the Mexican "authorities", especially the dumb kid at the TJ airport that wanted to open a hermetically sealed casket. He was supposed to be a medical
examiner? scary...
Help us find my father\'s killer(s?)!!!
Description of Jeep
He was murdered on Playa Armenta, south of Mulege B.C.S. The local police say it was on the 11th, but it was probably Tuesday the 7th.
PLEASE help us to find his killers.
They stole his ALL WHITE 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
It has a large dent on the rear liftgate to the left of the license plate.
There\'s a large black roof rack, about 4\'x4\'x1/2\', made from thin, round steel tubes and rods.
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Cincodemayo
Senior Nomad
Posts: 725
Registered: 3-7-2005
Location: Pacific NW
Member Is Offline
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Barry,
Well try the State dept. for starters...READ it again and maybe something will sink in. Ambassador to Mexico,
What does it have to do with Mexico?? It has everything to do with being an American citizen IN Mexico that got brutally murderered...Think hard,
maybe you'll get it.
[Edited on 12-6-2006 by Cincodemayo]
Don\'t get mad...
Get EVEN.
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
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Anybody that takes the life of a fellow human for any reason other than self defense ought to be removed from the gene pool ASAP!
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DanO
Super Nomad
Posts: 1923
Registered: 8-26-2003
Location: Not far from the Pacific
Member Is Offline
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Wow, I just read the story linked in Grover's post. If even a tenth of that is accurate, it is incredibly troubling. This is what customs agents are
doing now?
[Edited on 12-6-2006 by DanO]
\"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.\" -- Frank Zappa
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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Cinco-------really thinking hard, but-------
----I still don't "get it".
There is no way that I am going to expect the US Government to take any action on something that happens to me (or any other US Citizen) in
Mexico-------it is a FOREIGN COUNTRY-----Hello?????? They can "look into things", but that is about all they can do, or can be expected to do, in my
opinion.
When one travels abroad, you are pretty much on your own-----that is my point, and folks should remember that.
None of this conversation detracts from the tragedy that has befallen the man killed near Conception, or the anguish of his relatives-----I feel very
sad about that. I was simply responding to YOUR apparent trashing of the US Govt., and the "idea" that people expect our Govt. to be able to "do
something" about these types of trajedies in foreign countries. Lets face it, our Govt. can barely react to tragedies in our own country-----Katrina
comes to mind-----and I certainly do not expect more. You can "hope", but don't be surprised if nothing happens.
I feel very strongly about this---------we need to take responsibility for our own situations without thinking/hoping that our "government" will
somehow make things alright. That is not their role, in my opinion.
I had a very good friend (with his girl friend), who crashed his Porsche south of Tijuana many years ago-------we were unable to recover either of
their bodies, or the Porsche-------that is the way things are-----it is a foreign country. This is one of the reasons why travel in Mexico is such an
adventure, and why I choose to no longer go there (after 53 years of Baja travel)------it is just not worth the "risk" anymore, for me, at my age
(69).
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gtx510
Junior Nomad
Posts: 34
Registered: 11-16-2006
Member Is Offline
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I wish pops felt that way 4 years ago. I wish he wasn't so disillusioned with our gov't, after working for it most of his life, that he would
purposely miss the elections by staying down there. I wish 9/11 wasn't his birthday because that made him so sad every year after that tragedy. I've
seen my dad cry twice, his father's funeral and that day. I wish he never told me stories about driving down to the mainland in his youth. I wish he
didn't like that beach and the weather so damn much. And, Barry, I wish that I didn't agree with you.
Help us find my father\'s killer(s?)!!!
Description of Jeep
He was murdered on Playa Armenta, south of Mulege B.C.S. The local police say it was on the 11th, but it was probably Tuesday the 7th.
PLEASE help us to find his killers.
They stole his ALL WHITE 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
It has a large dent on the rear liftgate to the left of the license plate.
There\'s a large black roof rack, about 4\'x4\'x1/2\', made from thin, round steel tubes and rods.
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Bruce R Leech
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6796
Registered: 9-20-2004
Location: Ensenada formerly Mulege
Member Is Offline
Mood: A lot cooler than Mulege
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
----I still don't "get it".
There is no way that I am going to expect the US Government to take any action on something that happens to me (or any other US Citizen) in
Mexico-------it is a FOREIGN COUNTRY-----Hello?????? They can "look into things", but that is about all they can do, or can be expected to do, in my
opinion.
When one travels abroad, you are pretty much on your own-----that is my point, and folks should remember that.
None of this conversation detracts from the tragedy that has befallen the man killed near Conception, or the anguish of his relatives-----I feel very
sad about that. I was simply responding to YOUR apparent trashing of the US Govt., and the "idea" that people expect our Govt. to be able to "do
something" about these types of trajedies in foreign countries. Lets face it, our Govt. can barely react to tragedies in our own country-----Katrina
comes to mind-----and I certainly do not expect more. You can "hope", but don't be surprised if nothing happens.
I feel very strongly about this---------we need to take responsibility for our own situations without thinking/hoping that our "government" will
somehow make things alright. That is not their role, in my opinion.
I had a very good friend (with his girl friend), who crashed his Porsche south of Tijuana many years ago-------we were unable to recover either of
their bodies, or the Porsche-------that is the way things are-----it is a foreign country. This is one of the reasons why travel in Mexico is such an
adventure, and why I choose to no longer go there (after 53 years of Baja travel)------it is just not worth the "risk" anymore, for me, at my age
(69). |
Berry the US gov. or state dept. will recover the body of any us citizen that dies in a foreign country.and they really dropped the ball on this one.
they did nothing that they were supposed to do.
Bruce R Leech
Ensenada
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
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Bruce-----
----that is totally news to me, but I will take your word for it.
We certainly had no luck with my friend, or his girl friend, but then the families did not try that hard-------their attitude was "there is no life or
spirit left in a body". That may sound hard, but being from a family that places no value in a "body", and has always cremated their dead, I guess I
can appreciate that.
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kellychapman
Nomad
Posts: 246
Registered: 9-19-2006
Location: Loreto CBS
Member Is Offline
Mood: heavenly
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
----I still don't "get it".
There is no way that I am going to expect the US Government to take any action on something that happens to me (or any other US Citizen) in
Mexico-------it is a FOREIGN COUNTRY-----Hello?????? They can "look into things", but that is about all they can do, or can be expected to do, in my
opinion.
When one travels abroad, you are pretty much on your own-----that is my point, and folks should remember that.
None of this conversation detracts from the tragedy that has befallen the man killed near Conception, or the anguish of his relatives-----I feel very
sad about that. I was simply responding to YOUR apparent trashing of the US Govt., and the "idea" that people expect our Govt. to be able to "do
something" about these types of trajedies in foreign countries. Lets face it, our Govt. can barely react to tragedies in our own country-----Katrina
comes to mind-----and I certainly do not expect more. You can "hope", but don't be surprised if nothing happens.
I feel very strongly about this---------we need to take responsibility for our own situations without thinking/hoping that our "government" will
somehow make things alright. That is not their role, in my opinion.
I had a very good friend (with his girl friend), who crashed his Porsche south of Tijuana many years ago-------we were unable to recover either of
their bodies, or the Porsche-------that is the way things are-----it is a foreign country. This is one of the reasons why travel in Mexico is such an
adventure, and why I choose to no longer go there (after 53 years of Baja travel)------it is just not worth the "risk" anymore, for me, at my age
(69). |
it is risky to drive in far more places then Baja.....I can appreciate not wanting to come to Baja
because of the risk....but Taco Bell scares me think about eating at. I feel horrible about what happened to his poor father...but that could have
happened anywhere. It would be wonderful if they could find who did such a horrible thing...but if one looks at unsolved murders in the USA you will
find a much higher stastistic that is for sure....no matter where you go you have to take precautions for your safety......
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
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I have to disagree with Barry A. regarding expectations. I do expect more out of my government. I pay taxes and I expect the Government to exist
mainly to protect it's citizens It enacts a Homeland Security department to "Protect us against terrorists". In theory, that's fine but I
don't like the way they are dismantling our civil rights in the process. I don't want them to protect me in that way. I'll protect myself when a
terrorist comes to my doorstep, or not. It was the same with the bogeyman communists. By the way, I am a Patriot, an American and have no love for
terrorists or communists.
I do expect my government to protect us when we are hurt or killed in a foreign country. I do expect my government to protect the downtrodden who fall
through the cracks. I do expect my government to make healthcare affordable to all it's citizens.
I am very sorry this tragedy has happened. The Mexican law enforcement and diplomats have really let this family down. Yes, it has the main
responsibility to search for the murderer(s)and to tell the truth to the family. They also have the responsibility to see that the remains are taken
care of according to the family's wishes.
Regarding the U.S. Government in this circumstance, it does have a responsibility to intervene on behalf of it's citizens, if the foreign government
does not act responsibly. Of course, time and procedure was squandered. I think our government can still diplomatically pressure the Mexican
government to pursue the case. Where the cynic in me agrees with Barry is that, based on past performance, I am not surprised. In practice, our
government has let us down before and so I have to say my expectations are unrealistic.
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kellychapman
Nomad
Posts: 246
Registered: 9-19-2006
Location: Loreto CBS
Member Is Offline
Mood: heavenly
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you have got to be kidding thinking our government will protect us wwhile traveling to a foreign country ....I am born raised Army Brat with 45 years
military between mom and dad...and the government is NOT going to come running for us if we leave the country if something horrible happens to us. It
is the responsibility of the US government to take care of the challenges it faces right now....It is the police force that should be responsible to
maintain more safety where-ever you may choose to venture off too.
if you want to travel where they have good forensics then by all means do not come to Mexico......
I think we have to take care of ourselves pure and simple....if we leave the USA........make sure everything is smooth and running, don't drive at
night, blah blah bah.....we have so many cold case files in the USA it is ridiculous and to want to find out how some horrible tradgedy happened on
the beach in Southern Mexico one star lit night....in an unprotected enviornment....anything can happen....I am sorry if this sounds cold, but to make
the US government take care of it is impossible in my eyes...I am an ex-patriot and I am responsible to take care of myself....I do not expect anyone
from the USA to come running if I should meet a horrible fate....they have enough to do as it is right now.....I know without doubt that if I chose to
stay alone on a beach without a weapon of some sort.in an unprotected enviornment...I would probably be assuslted in one form or another......and that
also applies to anyone else.....making bad choices about your safety is something we all do....but the Us government taking care of us outside it's
boarders....I just cannot go their....
I would hate to be in this situation with a family member....and mine think I am crazy.... I am.....because they think something horrible will happen to me....and it could happen anywhere is my reply......
Now if your sent here to Mexico on Government assignment then that would be different....but traveling???? Camping??? only if there were many, many,
cases....like it takes people getting killed on a corner before they put up a light....that kinda thing....use good judjement is all when on your
own...my bother-in-laws plane blew up 100 miles out of mexico city with 7 very high level executives onboard....it reamined unsolved for over 7 yrs
before finally just posting ....lighting hit on an empy fuel tank....boom....I think they finally just put that their to close the paperwork...that is
just the way it is......
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
Posts: 17368
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Hot n spicy
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| Quote: | Originally posted by toneart
Regarding the U.S. Government in this circumstance, it does have a responsibility to intervene on behalf of it's citizens, if the foreign government
does not act responsibly.
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I don't recall seeing this in the bill of rights.
I think the US government (and Mexican police) are overextended,.... and the squeeky wheel gets the grease.
Squeel if you want attention (but squeel politely).
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