| Pages:
1
2
3 |
Tomas Tierra
Super Nomad
Posts: 1281
Registered: 3-23-2005
Location: oxnard, ca
Member Is Offline
Mood: Tengo Flojera
|
|
Good question!!
| Quote: | Originally posted by tripledigitken
Does anyone know the village the fishermen were from? |
Anybody??
It couldn't have been to far south if Adella gave the couple a ride to Ensenada....
|
|
|
JZ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9310
Registered: 10-3-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
I thought it was a pretty good story-----
no reason for a "May-Day".
So, we all don't see things the same way, do we. |
Barry, no we don't!
Let's see:
- the engine was gone
- the mast was down
- they were drifting towards the rocks
- the sea anchor wasn't holding
- waves were 20 feet
- they thought they were going to die
- they were shooting off flares
A pan would not be used in those conditions.
[Edited on 2-16-2007 by JZ]
|
|
|
Tomas Tierra
Super Nomad
Posts: 1281
Registered: 3-23-2005
Location: oxnard, ca
Member Is Offline
Mood: Tengo Flojera
|
|
I read that just the mainsail was down/busted not the mast. It was sticking out of the water in the middle of the bay...
Who is listening for a mayday or pan pan halfway down Baja??
|
|
|
Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
|
|
Oxxo------
-----good point on the distress calls-----I stand corrected. 
|
|
|
oxxo
Super Nomad
Posts: 2137
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
Member Is Offline
Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
|
|
| Quote: | | Originally posted by Tomas TierraWho is listening for a mayday or pan pan halfway down Baja?? |
When cruising there, I do. There are lots of boats cruising up and down the coast at any time of year. Most of them should be monitoring channel 16.
|
|
|
oxxo
Super Nomad
Posts: 2137
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
Member Is Offline
Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Barry A.
-----good point on the distress calls-----I stand corrected. |
No Barry, I stand corrected. I just reviewed my notes for proper distress calls.
Securite = experiencing problems, no assistance required
Pan Pan = experiencing problems, assistance required
Mayday = life threatening problems, immediate assistance required
Therefore if the folks in question just needed a tow because they were drifting toward shore, they would issue a Pan call.
If they were almost on the rocks, they would issue a Mayday call.
It all depends on when they made that distress call. There just isn't enough information in the article.
I will say that it would be difficult to give anyone a tow in 15 to 20 seas and high winds. I know I would not be able to do it with my boat without
endangering the safety of the boat and crew. I certainly would not be able to launch my dinghy in those conditions. I probably would have put one of
my crew in a harness with rope tether and PFD and have them swim over to the stricken vessel to take these folks off one at a time over water. But
I'm not sure that is the prudent thing to do. What would you folks do?
|
|
|
JZ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9310
Registered: 10-3-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
Do guys have any idea how big 15 foot waves are. I wouldn't take a panga out in 5 foot waves.
|
|
|
oxxo
Super Nomad
Posts: 2137
Registered: 5-17-2006
Location: Wherever I am, I'm there
Member Is Offline
Mood: If I was feeling any better, I'd be twins!
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by JZ
Do guys have any idea how big 15 foot waves are. I wouldn't take a panga out in 5 foot waves. |
I wouldn't either! That's what makes the actions of the Mexican fishermen that much more heroic! In that situation, they were better men than I.
|
|
|
Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: optimistic
|
|
JZ----
Do you think they meant "15 foot waves" (breaking waves?), or do they actually mean a "15 foot swell" (trough to crest is 15 feet)? I have had my
Gregor 14 foot tin boat out in 15 foot swells with a high pucker factor but it certainly is doable.
15 foot breaking waves would be impossible tho------with that I certainly agree------I would not even surf 15 foot waves, but I am a coward.
Thanks Oxxo for the clarification-------bottom line it was a horrible experience for them, and I can just barely understand their fear at the time.
|
|
|
BajaBruno
Super Nomad
Posts: 1035
Registered: 9-6-2006
Location: Back in CA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy
|
|
Sailing looks easy when you are sitting in a fancy lounge on San Diego's waterfront, and sailing down the coast of the California's seems romantic
when you are cozy next to the fireplace in your land home, but neither are true, unfortunately. There is no three-week (or whatever) sailing school
that will prepare you for even most of the eventuallities of sailing down the coast of the Californias, especially in winter.
The minimum crew for that trip, having made it several times, is three experienced seapersons, each competent enough to get the boat to a good harbor
from wherever the worst location could be. You also need someone who knows boats--rigging, sail repair, heavy weather boat handling, engine
maintenance and repair, how to get up a mast and repair a broken halyard so you can get that mainsail back up---all that seems to be lacking on this
ill-advised trip down the coast.
It is a pity that egos and starry-eyed ambition color the way we look at very complex tasks such as sailing a modern boat down a potentially very
dangerous coast. Buddha knows, I have known a couple of guys who have gotten lucky--taken inadequate boats with inadequate skills and gotten farther
than they should have, but they simply got lucky, that's all. These unfortunate folks proved the odds and fortunately had some brave and available
pangueros to rescue them.
Wave heights, as JZ and others know, is one of the few factors in sailing to be overestimated by the inexperienced sailor. I wasn't there, so I don't
know for sure, but 15' waves would have to be produced by a very big and long-lasting storm (remember the factors of wave height: wind velocity,
duration, fetch, and water depth), not an isolated cell off the shore.
I'm happy no lives were lost, since it would have been harder to have this discussion under those circumstances, but I think there are certainly
lessons to be learned. Although "gentlemen don't go to weather," as the old saying goes, good sailors are experienced and prepared sailors, and may
be gods be with them all.
Christopher Bruno, Elk Grove, CA.
|
|
|
MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
|
|
Mayday
Although the "Mayday" call has come to include danger to person ( officially or unofficially? ), back when I was involved with teaching Boating
Classes with the U.S.C.G. Auxiliary, we stressed that the "Mayday" was reserved for danger to the vessel itself and not health issues unrelated to
grave and imminent danger to the vessel ( or station as the FCC puts it ).
If someone on board has a Heart Attack or is Bleeding to Death on a vessel sailing along comfortably on calm seas, it was not a "Mayday" situation.
On FCC.gov, they still list the definition that way. I have no idea whether International law has actually changed, but I've never heard so.
"(1) MAYDAY -- The distress signal MAYDAY is used to indicate that a station is threatened by grave and imminent danger and requests immediate
assistance
(2) PAN PAN -- The urgency signal PAN PAN is used when the safety of the ship or person is in jeopardy.
(3) SECURITE -- The safety signal SECURITE is used for messages about the safety of navigation or important weather warnings. "
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, in the current discussion, the vessel was in grave and imminent danger so the life consideration was the secondary one.
[Edited on 2-16-2007 by MrBillM]
|
|
|
Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
Member Is Offline
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
Virtually every publication or other technical advice I've seen and read stress the value of sailing the Baja (or any other such) Coast well offshore,
50 miles or more, but it is something that too many sailors can't bring themselves to do. They gain some solace from being able to see the distant
shoreline, not realizing that it could be their worst enemy. |
The entire west coast of Baja is a lee shore. 100+ miles would be more like it. From out there it's a wild ride but fantastic. More fun than just
about anything you can do... standing up. 
|
|
|
bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
Member Is Offline
|
|
I, too, have made that trip. It was a rough one. We had a following sea that knocked the stern of the boat around so much almost everyone on the
boat got a little seasick. It was such a weird motion. I fortunately do not suffer from that ailment. Unfortunately, I was on watch for double
shifts because someone was too sick to pull his watch.
A lady in Ensenada(that is where we left from) had made us killer tamales. I certainly enjoyed them...no one else did
You have to have a healthy respect for mother ocean and all that she can throw at you and I cringe when I hear stories like this one.
We met a couple who were camping in a car. When we asked why the car, they replied that they had started out from San Diego headed to San Lucas on a
32' sailboat and got so scared around Bahia Tortuga that they pulled in there, rested up and went back home. They had decided that seeing Baja by car
was a much better idea
[Edited on 2-16-2007 by bajajudy]
|
|
|
MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
|
|
Rough Seas
An avid Fishing buddy of mine and his wife took one of those Long-Range Fishing trips out of San Diego that goes out to the Islands off the tip.
On the return trip, an option was to leave the boat at Cabo and Fly home. They couldn't wait to get off that boat.
As bad as the trip South can be, the Slog North is Notorious.
[Edited on 2-16-2007 by MrBillM]
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
BajaBruno, Pretty much sums up my feelings also.
|
|
|
jeans
Super Nomad
Posts: 1059
Registered: 9-16-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Encantada
|
|
They were very, very lucky.
In the fall of '78 or '79 I was in Wyoming and had a repair call in the small town of Wilson. (I was with Mtn. Bell) In the driveway was a large
catamaran on a trailer. It was one of those brilliant, crisp autumn days. It was still warm, but as the sun sank behind the Tetons, the fall chill
and impending winter was in the air. The man with the catamaran was leaving for Baja in a few weeks...he was so excited about his trip...getting out
of the Wyoming winter to sail the warm, Mexican waters. I envied him.
A few months later there was an article in the local paper. Wreckage of his boat had been found, but his body was never recovered.
Yes...the people from Billings were very lucky...
Mom always told me to be different - Now she says...Not THAT different
|
|
|
Crusoe
Senior Nomad
Posts: 731
Registered: 10-14-2006
Member Is Offline
|
|
Hi Jeans,
Good post! I too lived in Wilson, WY in those years and knew that couple very well. They were nice people and well thought of. Their craft was an
18' Hobie-Cat. They launched in San Fillieppe in December. They sailed south and were never heard from again. The wreakage of their boat was found.
Some small plane pilots from Jackson flew their own planes to the area and conducted an extensive search as did other Mexican agencies, but found
noone. Two to three months later, the girl's body was found on the North end of Carmen Island. She was identified by a prescription bottle with her
name on it in one of her clothing pockets. Her next-of-kin were notified in Los Angeles - very tragic!
Another point of this post was to comment on Dennis and Leslie's (from Billings) experience. Again very trajic.So Sorry.This brings up another old
similar Montana peoples'sailing history. An enthusiastic couple spent eight years in Washington State building a 35' cruising boat and ended up very
soon shipwrecked on that long beach just South of Magdelena Bay near Loma Mira. Barely getting through the surf and rescued with their lives intact.
Back to Montana they go for two years, come back to Puget Sound, buy another 35' cruising boat and go North and end up shipwrecked again on the West
Coast of Vancouver Island. They come close to losing their lives and are rescued again by fishermen. Yikes you think they would have had theur fill of
it. So the cattle folk head back to Montana and lick their wounds and come back to Puget Sound in a couple years, purchase yet another 35' cruising
boat, go North, and while anchored near Hawksberry Island in Northern British Columbia, they drag ashore in a storm and yet lose another vessel! Sad,
sad, sad. They are able to laugh about it and make jokes.I really have to admire them......People will always amaze you. Especially the sailing crowd
and adventuress type......Poop Happens!!
|
|
|
Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
|
|
JZ! 15 foot waves. Agree. Wouldn't want to be in a 15' boat in anything close to those conditions. There's something not quite right about this story.
|
|
|
jeans
Super Nomad
Posts: 1059
Registered: 9-16-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: Encantada
|
|
| Quote: | Originally posted by Crusoe
Hi Jeans,
Good post! I too lived in Wilson, WY in those years and knew that couple very well. They were nice people and well thought of. Their craft was an
18' Hobie-Cat. They launched in San Fillieppe in December. They sailed south and were never heard from again. The wreakage of their boat was found.
Some small plane pilots from Jackson flew their own planes to the area and conducted an extensive search as did other Mexican agencies, but found
noone. Two to three months later, the girl's body was found on the North end of Carmen Island. She was identified by a prescription bottle with her
name on it in one of her clothing pockets. Her next-of-kin were notified in Los Angeles - very tragic!
Another point of this post was to comment on Dennis and Leslie's (from Billings) experience. Again very trajic.So Sorry.This brings up another old
similar Montana peoples'sailing history. An enthusiastic couple spent eight years in Washington State building a 35' cruising boat and ended up very
soon shipwrecked on that long beach just South of Magdelena Bay near Loma Mira. Barely getting through the surf and rescued with their lives intact.
Back to Montana they go for two years, come back to Puget Sound, buy another 35' cruising boat and go North and end up shipwrecked again on the West
Coast of Vancouver Island. They come close to losing their lives and are rescued again by fishermen. Yikes you think they would have had theur fill of
it. So the cattle folk head back to Montana and lick their wounds and come back to Puget Sound in a couple years, purchase yet another 35' cruising
boat, go North, and while anchored near Hawksberry Island in Northern British Columbia, they drag ashore in a storm and yet lose another vessel! Sad,
sad, sad. They are able to laugh about it and make jokes.I really have to admire them......People will always amaze you. Especially the sailing crowd
and adventuress type......Poop Happens!! |
Ah...memory fades after almost 30 years....18' is not very large! I had thought he was alone (his name was Judd, right?). I guess she was not home
the afternoon I was sent there. I do remember understading his exitement. My parents were "before the pavement" Baja travelers and we had boats
(childhood summers at Catalina).
Small world with Jackson & Baja...Mom met some people from Jackson camped on a beach somewhere...got to talking...I had installed a phone for
them.
[Edited on 2-18-2007 by jeans]
|
|
|
JZ
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9310
Registered: 10-3-2003
Member Is Offline
|
|
I once made the mistake of taking my boat down from San Felipe to Santa Rosalia in December, not having a clue what I was doing. Had the common sense
to not try to take it back up.
Came back a year later with a lot better plan, better gear, and a better time to the year. Made it from San Felipe to San Carlos, Sonora.
|
|
|
| Pages:
1
2
3 |
![[*]](images/xmbforum/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
