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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
Posts: 15938
Registered: 11-8-2004
Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Everchangin'
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time out
as an addendum to my Indian cartoon................
"The American Indians found out what happens when you don't control immigration."   :moon:
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Cypress
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7641
Registered: 3-12-2006
Location: on the bayou
Member Is Offline
Mood: undecided
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woody in ob. Yep! If they had only known.
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
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Mood: Skeptical
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| Quote: | Originally posted by oldhippie
| Quote: | Originally posted by Mexitron
... reverting to 1969 could be done ... |
cool, I can go to Woodstock again! |
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Al G
| Quote: | Originally posted by Packoderm
OK, where to start? The original post seems to contend that if our country doesn't experience population growth the U.S. will sputter and die? If
immigration were to be halted, how long would it then take for our population to get to where it was in 1969? I believe that was just about the point
where our population centers were rapidly spilling over into the countryside tearing up farms to make room for yet more housing and strip malls and
such. I wouldn't be totally against letting our population lower to the level of 1969 for a better quality of life instead of how crowded things seem
today.
As for economics, our Social Security taxes that actually goes toward supporting the older folks is not that big of a chunk of our incomes especially
if you omit the more nutty of Social Security's outlays. Also, it is dwarfed by what we are to pay for national security.
We could contribute a larger portion of our incomes to pay for a larger percentage of a retired population without too much real economic duress if we
decided that's what we want to do. Anyway, the old timers will die off eventually, and the fewer members of future generation's population sans the
growth due to immigrants will result in a moderation of the young/old ratio in the future.
So, the question is, what kind of America would you want your grandchildren to inherit? I do enjoy American culture; and while it will evolve due to
influences from around the globe - and that's a good thing, I would rather not see a single entity - Mexico - hijack it so thoroughly.
Downsizing seems to work for corporations, so why should it seem so automatically bad for the U.S. in general?
My proposal: Cease immigration into the U.S. until we reach a targeted, lowered level, and then, and only then, offer a limited level of immigration,
and it should be rationed fairly to all the immigration candidates around the whole world without domination from a single entity so that our targeted
population level is maintained. And this should occur only if necessary.
And one last thing, I hate to hear all this bullcorn about how we can't change something just because it has started. We can change it - and we must.
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Packoderm...Please remove your post...this thread is not meant to allow you, your liberal agenda. Your graph is totally inaccurate and you are trying
to cover up for the Democrats voting themselves enormous retirement packages and blame it on our Militery....few of which retire and suck the
Government dry.
His pie chart is from:War Resisters League program
This has nothing to do with legal/illegal immigrations or our country need for them |
Whoa, Al G!
Since when does someones political philosophy qualify a post to be deleted unless it is a personal, name calling flame? Even then, it can have a life
(if one has no life) in the Off Topic room. But I don't see where Pacoderm's post(s) warrant that ignoble fate. I don't particularly agree
with his post, but come on-n-n-n-n-n........
Al G., this string began with a lo-o-o-n-n-n-g quote from an essay by a man with a decidedly conservative agenda. Obviously you subscribe to that
agenda or your wouldn't have touted it's philosophy in your post. By the way, I analyzed and dissected Mr. Meyers essay on the first page of this
string. You and I come to the some of the same conclusions regarding immigration even though we arrive at them from completely different political
vehicles.
Immigration is certainly a hot button which gets a lot of people going, emotionally. There are some wonderful posts on this long string, many of which
(not all) deal with the topic and express the diversity of opinion that is Nomad. 
Now can I say, "vive le difference" without having you pour good French Wine into the gutters or choking on Fr-Fr-French Fries?
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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Immigration is certainly a hot button which gets a lot of people going, emotionally. There are some wonderful posts on this long string, many
of which (not all) deal with the topic and express the diversity of opinion that is Nomad.
This we can agree...and his post was not at question. Using the War Resisters League propaganda is the issue. There are plenty of charts that he can
use that are not skewed one way or another, but that won't suit his/their agenda. That graph is a off topic item....needs to be removed.
The first post was not political in nature...only an eye opener...although I am sure some thought it was. I have been very happy with all the great
responses over this important issue and it deserves all of our attention and had it. until that piece of political "OFF TOPIC" trash (graph) showed
up.
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
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About the source of the graph: I would gladly show a graph from a pro war site if it would illustrate how the total cost of wars affect us including
past wars.
I don't exactly agree with N-zi ideology, but if I needed information about at which temperatures would freeze a human to death, where else would I
look?
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woody with a view
PITA Nomad
Posts: 15938
Registered: 11-8-2004
Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
Member Is Offline
Mood: Everchangin'
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Al
i appreciate your zeal, but what does this have to do with baja?
the war was a lie!!!!! we can't leave iraq without the world becoming less secure!!!! maybe 3-5 well placed nukes would take the edge off of the
muslims extreme muscle (or lack of...) flex????
time will tell....
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
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Mood: Wondering what is next???
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| Quote: | Originally posted by woody in ob
Al
i appreciate your zeal, but what does this have to do with Baja?
the war was a lie!!!!! we can't leave iraq without the world becoming less secure!!!! maybe 3-5 well placed nukes would take the edge off of the
muslims extreme muscle (or lack of...) flex????
time will tell.... |
Woody I did not start this....I did not post an Off Topic post...I only called him on it. This thread was on topic until he posted that trash.
I do not give a rats asre what you think about the war...now lets talk about Immigration and especially are there people of Baja moving across the
border?
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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Packoderm
Super Nomad
Posts: 2116
Registered: 11-7-2002
Member Is Offline
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"Woody I did not start this....I did not post an Off Topic post...I only called him on it. This thread was on topic until he posted that trash."
"His pie chart is from:War Resisters League program
This has nothing to do with legal/illegal immigrations or our country need for them."
Ok, I'll explain this, but to what end who knows. I originally posted the first pie chart to show that Social Security is not really that big of a
chunk of our taxes. I did that because the opening post in this thread questioned whether we can support so many older Americans if our tax base was
to dwindle without immigration. If you take out the non-retiree outlays from S.S., you'll find that we easily could do that. I wasn't getting
political. I just googled "social security taxes paid" when I found that chart. I have never visited that site before that. The discrepancy between
the two graphs has to do with services rendered from social programs - some of which are things like giving money to soldiers who have been
psychologically traumatized by past wars funded by non-military programs. Discussing the war is fine and good, but in my post, I was concerned with
how to take care of our retirees without immigrants' replenishing of our work pool. All this was in response to the opening thread. Realistically, the
thread would be a good fit for the Off Topic from the thread's first post.
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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Packoderm...Your concept in and of itself seems to have some merit.
Real hard to tell using misinformation altered by fanatics.
I will U2U a site that breaks our budget to the smallest common denominator with labels of actual departments instead of skewed words to deceive
you...I am sure you can use it to make your point clear and accurate.
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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This thread is like a cat. Just when you think it's dead, it springs back to life. From one to nine, where are we now?
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Al G
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2647
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Todos Santos/Full time for now...
Member Is Offline
Mood: Wondering what is next???
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
This thread is like a cat. Just when you think it's dead, it springs back to life. From one to nine, where are we now? |
9....but I still want to know if Packoderm can make his point with a real chart...that I sent him. I hope he can use it. I really want to see which
departments he can justify eliminating.
Albert G
Remember, if you haven\'t got a smile on your face and laughter in your heart, then you are just a sour old fart!....
The most precious thing we have is life, yet it has absolutely no trade-in value.
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