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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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ON-DEMAND GAS WATER HEATERS - NOT
At Rancho la Aguja, I have just thrown the last Bosch/Kruger instant propane water heater into the garbage.
For 5 years they have made life miserable - temperamental pilot flames, sensitive to water pressure (at the low end of the water cycle, the gas would
shut off due to perceived lack of water pressure, leaving the victim shivering), sensitive to salt breezes (that's us!) and expensive as well.
The last straw was the purchase of a new unit in La Paz ($300US+), which lasted 5 months before refusing to light. There is no service in La Paz and
we discovered the Bosch distributor service in Cabo is a joke.
I have installed Rheem electric tank heaters - cheap and simple. I can buy two of them for the cost of a Bosch.
We also considered on-demand electric water heaters, but that amp draw is LARGE, and our cottages have relatively small monophasic systems.
Up at Conquista ejido, where the fishermen squeeze pesos til they scream, they are all switching to electrical units - they say they are cheaper to
run than propane!
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
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I recently installed a Bosch on-demand propane water heater. Just under M$2000 at City Club in La Paz. The first unit was the unit with the pilot
light. Could not keep that pilot lit. Ended up returning it within the 30 day return time period and bought the pilotless model. Was about M$2200.
That's much less than the demand heaters I've seen sold in the U.S.
So far, very happy with it. Not too thrilled that this 'Bosch' product is made in China though so we'll see how long it lasts. No issues with water
pressure, temp swings or electronic ignition.
I think the world is run by C- students.
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8807
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
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Mood: Full Time Residents
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same thing here...
i replaced the propane tankless heaters with small conventional units...
i was having the same problem with the tank shutting off when the pump turned on...
at that time the pressure dropped and the tankless unit turned off...
i routed the tankless to the conventional tanks to provide hot water for the showers...the incomming water to the conventional unit is pre-heated now
and mixes with the conventional hot water for a comfortable shower
now if the tankless goes out the conventional tank has enough to provide a hot shower
of course...in a couple of months we will ONLY need COLD water
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aha baja
Nomad
Posts: 221
Registered: 1-19-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: wherever you go, there you are...
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You might investigate the Takagi T-K3 propane tankless waterheater. When operating they will use between 11k and 199k b.t.u. depending on demand. One
factor to longevity is the quality of the water flowing thru the unit. If it is high in mineralization (calcium magnisium, sulphur ,etc) it will wipe
out ANY water heater quickly. Electric are worse because the minerals will tend to build up arround the electric element(s) as they heat. My cost as a
plumbing contractor is arround $950 U.S.but they can be periodicaly put thru a de-scaling process regularly to help remove mineral buildup
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CortezBlue
Super Nomad
Posts: 2213
Registered: 11-14-2006
Location: Fenix/San Phelipe
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I was at a construction overstock place and bought a brand new Rannai hot water heater for only $250 bucks. When I bought it they were selling for
1300 bucks or more. I almost sold it to a friend becuase I as concearned with the water hardness and water pressure. But at the last minute
installed it and man am I glad I did. It is awesome. I can get to our place from our long drive and take a hot shower without waiting for hot water.
The only thing that I did that was recommended to me by a plumber was installing valves that allow me to recirculate vinager through the system to
help remove water hardness buildup.
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8807
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
Member Is Offline
Mood: Full Time Residents
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man...
if i was going to have to service those things all the time...
i'm glad we got rid of them!!!
the ONLY problem we experienced was that they shut off all them time and...
when you're taking a shower in the winter it's NOT FUN!!!
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tripledigitken
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4848
Registered: 9-27-2006
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If never ceases to amaze me how things we take for granted in the US can be such a major source of frustration living in Baja.
Water heaters, space heaters, septic systems, having 110v power, concrete sand, structural lumber, even water to name just a few!
I'm sure Nomads could add many more to the list.
I'm taking notes for when we build south of the border.
Ken
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vandenberg
Elite Nomad
Posts: 5118
Registered: 6-21-2005
Location: Nopolo
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow
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Installed 2 conventional Reliance 501 40 gallon propane water heaters in 1991 and they're still running strong. Live here year around and water is
very hard. Never had them flushed either. Only thing I noticed, with the one we use most, that it must have a large build up of minerals inside, since
the amount of water used before the gasflame comes on is getting less.
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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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Bob - that's an interesting solution to guest hot water needs! I was looking at a roof solar water heater - did you check those out?
BMG - yes, the tankless electric heaters are EXPENSIVE! They are still my first choice - maybe in another life. I saw an electric showerhead in
Plomybanos (La Paz) for $200 pesos . . don't know whether I'd trust them at that price.
Lencho - I have one 220v Rheem installed in the laundry (which has full 3-phase service - another story). The cost of 3-phase is HIGH, so we keep the
heater switched off except for the occasional guest and laundry day. We leave the 110v home one on.
At Conquista they turn on the heaters 30 mins before a shower, then switch them off again.
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by rob
I saw an electric showerhead in Plomybanos (La Paz) for $200 pesos . . don't know whether I'd trust them at that price. |
My father-in-law put one in at his beach house.
No problem as long as you don't touch the faucets  
He said, "Esteep (he still can't pronounce Steve), just turn the water on and off from outside the shower." I told him that I would but I just take
cold showers there.
The tankless water heaters that I have most experience with are the Renai. Last for many years and no problems. I'm hoping the Bosch is as good but
not holding my breath. I can say that the one that I installed in the photo above is working flawlessly but then it's only a few months old.
I think the world is run by C- students.
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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My Nomad neighbor, durelllrobert, just went through hell with his US purchased Bosch unit. Turned out the exhaust, pipe length etc., is crucial to
succesful operation. U2U him if you want particulars.
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Stickers
Senior Nomad
Posts: 571
Registered: 4-12-2006
Location: SoCal
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I just roughed in for a tankless heater on a guest house I just built here in Socal. My plumber insisted on a 1 1/4" pipe for the gas supply. He
claims inadequate gas volume screws up many installations. (that is a big pipe) 
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Bob and Susan
Elite Nomad
Posts: 8807
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Mulege BCS on the BAY
Member Is Offline
Mood: Full Time Residents
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stickers i think he may be correct...good plumber
just got my pool heater to work with a bigger propane regulator
the manuf never even thought od that
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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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Lencho - for the 220v heater at the laundry, the plumber just picked off one leg of the 3-phase. The 3-phase services have seperate meters to the
(monophasic) domestic services. We actually have two 3-phase services at the ranch:
- agricultural (ranch well for irrigation) which is CHEAP
- service to the laundry/workshop where tariff is WAY higher - it's a commercial tariff (I don't think there is such a thing as a domestic 3-phase
tariff, but someone will point out I am incorrect . . ). The commercial 3-phase STARTS at $70US a bi-month before you use anything, and goes up from
there. The only reason I keep it is a distant dream of using a heavy welder at the shop.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
Member Is Offline
Mood: Inquisitive
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I've often read that propane in Mexico is very dirty propane that clogs regulators, orifices, etc., much faster than in the US.
Since the on-demand heater is refusing to stay lit, yet it worked for a time, maybe the pilot orifice just needs an occasional cleaning, if it is
accessible. If the volume of the delivery pipe is the issue, why would it have worked in the first place>
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rob
Senior Nomad
Posts: 509
Registered: 10-19-2004
Location: Pacific Coast, BCS
Member Is Offline
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Before embarking on an expensive replacement project, you can bet that we tried everything INCLUDING cleaning the pilot jet orifices AND taking the
units down to Cabo to the distributor "service". The units were returned as repaired in precisely the same condition they were given - nonworking . .
The water volume issue was certainly less noticeable 5 years ago - maybe the pressure tank has become less efficient, maybe the heater water volume
sensor is less sensitive - quien sabe?
All I know is that for the first time in 5 years I can take a hot shower without fiddling with the hot water tap, tracking where the pressure
tank/pump is in its cycle and being constantly poised to leap out of the way of freezing or scalding water.
Life is great.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
Member Is Offline
Mood: Inquisitive
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Rob, thanks for taking the time to let us know of your experiences. I will have to make a decision like you in the next year.
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Vince
Nomad
Posts: 445
Registered: 10-17-2006
Location: Coronado
Member Is Offline
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I'm on my 3rd standard Mexican water heater in 36 years @ Coyote Bay, which speaks well for keeping it simple. The on demand sure has to prove itself
before trying it in those harsh conditions where the water is a bit brackish.
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durrelllrobert
Elite Nomad
Posts: 7393
Registered: 11-22-2007
Location: Punta Banda BC
Member Is Offline
Mood: thriving in Baja
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| Quote: | Originally posted by BMG
bought the pilotless model. Was about M$2200. That's much less than the demand heaters I've seen sold in the U.S.
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My Bosc was bought in US for $1100 + another 200 for stainless steel flue pipe. It has electronic ignition using 110 + transformer. I hear the battery
powered ignition units they sell in MX eat batteries. Also, based on photo you really need to extend flue pipe. Bosc says min length is 4 foot and cap
needs to be 1 foot higher than anything within 10 foot around it.
Bob Durrell
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BMG
Super Nomad
Posts: 1776
Registered: 6-10-2007
Location: La Paz / Bahia Asunci�n / Away from home
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by durrelllrobert
My Bosc was bought in US for $1100 + another 200 for stainless steel flue pipe. It has electronic ignition using 110 + transformer. I hear the battery
powered ignition units they sell in MX eat batteries. Also, based on photo you really need to extend flue pipe. Bosc says min length is 4 foot and cap
needs to be 1 foot higher than anything within 10 foot around it.
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So what is the reason for extending the flue pipe? Seems to be working great as it is. No discoloring on the paint yet.
I can't even remember now if it takes 1 or 2 'D' cell batteries. I have no idea how long it or they will last.
I think the world is run by C- students.
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