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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 12:53 AM
Localism Both in Baja and The States


I'm sure , at one time or another, we have all considered ourselves to be locals at one spot or another.
It is tribal in nature, and with the thousands of new surfers every year,
a territorial devise to keep waves to ourselves and outsiders out.

There's always a good feeling knowing your 'home'and you know what to expect out of the break. Locals have their
waves down to a pure science.

But after awhile, doesn't it seem to get a little boring, same wave over and over again?

I remember getting advise from a surfer who told me," Look, a good surfer can surf just about any type of wave, even chitty waves, those are the real test, but the important thing is, experience all different places and waves."

Which brings us back to localism. Is it a god given right ? And, doesn't it actually thwart capabilities and potential improvement? Not to mention the actual fist fights that have accompanied it.Are the Mexican surfers as agro when it come to localism in their spots, or more generous?

The ocean is suppossed to be free, for everyone.

I haven't read it yet, but Nat Young has a book out on the subject.

What are your feelings on Localism both here in Mexico and in the States.

xxxooo
xxxooo

[Edited on 5-6-2004 by Margie]




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Markitos
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 08:17 AM


I'd hate to be a local at one place. How boring! I remember as a kid being all cool local BS. Then it dawned on me there are waves all over the planet and I want to surf them. So it's the golden rule thing.You can surf here ,I can surf there:yes:



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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 09:06 AM


I live at the beach but I would never consider myself a "local". No one owns the waves or the breaks. That mindset is for doorknobs. Those people can suck the fun right out of a great experience and none of us should tolerate them. Boy, does that bring back memories......
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elgatoloco
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 11:04 AM


Localism sucks.

I grew up surfing from 'County line' in Ventura south to Baja and was taught by my mentors, parents and friends alike that the ocean and waves belong to no one and everyone. Show respect at all times and remember the whole purpose (as intened by those that 'invented' surfing) was to have FUN!

Fast forward to 2004.

When I go in the water and somone cops an attitude I am amzed but not surprised.
There are many more taking up the sport of kings everyday and that is good, even though it means amore crowded lineup. The same guy who acts like an idiot in the water is an idiot out of the water and I usually end up felling sorry for the poor sap and anyone who has to deal with them on a daily basis.
I do not let it get to me because I am ALWAYS the best surfer in the water. The best surfer being the guy having the most FUN!

I am lucky enough to live at the beach and can be in the water in 10 minutes so I do not surf on weekends, unless it's epic.

I DO take the oppurtunity to counsel the groms about ettiqutte and I always try and give away at least one set wave per session to the other guy. There will always be another wave.


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JESSE
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 12:58 PM


I am pretty cool about it, but some of my friends are definately not, some simply tell americans to get out and go to K-38, and if they refuse, you know whats coming.

Some Mexican sufers are very bitter at letting americans surf here, because they say, when you go up to surf in California, they treat you like chit.




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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 01:37 PM


Most people treat visitors like chiite only if they deserve it. Assholioness transcends borders, unfortunately. And if that's what they are saying, well, maybe it's time for a look in the mirror.

[Edited on 5-6-2004 by FrankO]
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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 06:38 PM
Localism


I think you're right, Jesse. I've heard that from alot of the Mexican surfers. Luckily, I've got an advantage, in reality probably a handicapp, in that I'm not a guy. I think they feel sorry for me, or like, I'm this crazy gringa, so they cut me some slack.

There are alot of hardships that the Mexican surfers have to endure here,for the more poor, just getting a decent board, car and gas money to make it to the spots, not to mention a wetsuit.

I think they have good reason to be possessive of their waves, we all need to be couteous and grateful, life ain't so easy down here.

And, let's face it, there were some wild ones down here 30 years ago and it left a bad taste in everybody's mouth. The association many Mexicans made about American surfers were, wild, drunk and crazy, and disrespectful. It's a steriotype
nowadays, but it takes along time to heal old wounds.



[Edited on 5-7-2004 by Margie]




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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 07:08 PM


I have yet to see Mexican surfers treated poorly. I see people who drop in and backdoor and not be considerate get vibed. But then I've only surfed from Santa Barbara to a little south of the border. I know that chiite happens in NorCal regardless of citizenship.
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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-6-2004 at 08:15 PM


Frank, I've never seen it, but I've heard it and I don't doubt it. Maybe it happened at a place that you weren't out at.

I can understand the intimidation they might feel just on a cultural level alone. All of our toys and prosperity, it can be pretty overwhelming.

You guys are tolerant and level headed, but, let's face it, there are quite a few out there who are not and do damage to the sport and it's image.

Jesse, tell us what happened exactly to your amigos, if you don't mind. and, also, what do you know about the area of beach north of Popotla where they built the Fox Studios. For years and years, that lot was empty except for an old abandoned trailer. Someone said that the beach there was ...haunted...because of a boating accident, any truth to the tale? And, is there really a lost goldmine in the hills behind Rosarito ? Whew....
(Jesse should work for the UN )



[Edited on 5-7-2004 by Margie]




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JESSE
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[*] posted on 5-7-2004 at 06:14 PM


Quote:
Originally posted by FrankO
Most people treat visitors like chiite only if they deserve it. Assholioness transcends borders, unfortunately. And if that's what they are saying, well, maybe it's time for a look in the mirror.

[Edited on 5-6-2004 by FrankO]


Frank,

Its true, i have surfed many California beaches and the locals are ass*****, it doesnt matter where you are from, they don't want you there.




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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-7-2004 at 07:41 PM
Bad Boys


Okay, so what would be the best way to ammend this, if you see it happening -
you can't just not react, any suggestions?


Maybe also taking the time to sit down and write a letter to some of the more popular surfing magazines, and getting the buzz out.

???????????



[Edited on 5-8-2004 by Margie]
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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-7-2004 at 09:26 PM


OK. Jesse, most surfers are mellow. buttcracks invite aggressiveness. So this is the way I see it. I don't tolerate buttcracks. Bear with my tale. I have watched many people intimidate people thru loud mouths and snaking actions and just waited. When they pull that chit w/me I have patiently held them underwater and watched them struggle for a breath or told them to shut the flock up or please, just beat my ass because I can't stand thier loud mouth bullchit. If they want to go for it one of us is not leaving the water. Me or them. It's the silent ones you have to watch for. I am fine w/some loudmouthed buttcrack breaking all his teeth on my fist. flock that localism bullchit. I've no tolerance for it.
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[*] posted on 5-7-2004 at 11:06 PM


FrankO

Can we go for a surf?

:biggrin:






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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 12:17 AM


So, Frank, that is how you would handle it on an individual level,
affecting you. Let's say there were some Mexican surfers out and they were being hassled. How would you handle that situation? Would you come to their defense ?

I think more of us need to come to the defense of the victims of this local behavior, I don't think I would go so far as holding someone under the water and choosing off a fight, but somewhat more on a supportive level, so when everybody leaves, they don't feel that bad and all of the surfers up there aren't getting such a bad rap.

But a non-violent example has to be set , until they get it, and practised regularly.
It seems to me, these bad boys are younger, full of energy, going through some kind of rite of passage, jumpy hormones - wouldn't it be better for them to be approached by the cool wise dad guy, who instead of saying,"no you can't do that or I'll beat the chit out 'of you", says something like,"Well, you know that's not really cool", strikes up a freindly conversation with the guy and let him talk about himself, while you give the impression of the cool daddy-o-, well balanced and strong, that he can look up to ?

Just a thought on the skinning of this cat.


Frank, you also mentioned contests and clubs. Not for me, but if people want to do that, that's okay. The Clubs nowadays have become a more powerful political lobby tool for the environment, which is great. Perhaps if any of you are envolved with clubs up there, maybe invite some of the Mexican surfers up to participate in a weekend of fun and intercultural exchange, or even if not in a club, invite them up to spend the weekend and turn them on to some hospitality, that seems like a good way to bridge this gap., end these hostilities,and to make some lifelong friends with our Mexican Hermanos.


xxxooo

[Edited on 5-8-2004 by Margie]
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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 08:24 AM


I always try the friendly approach first. That's my nature. And yes, the last hassle I got into, a few years ago, was because of two doorknobs that were dropping in on everyone, yelling and just pretty much stating ownership of the break. I surfed and watched thier total lack of etiquitte for quite some time and thought " what's good for the goose is good for the gander". Or whatever that means. So every time one of these guys started to take off I just dropped in. They flipped out. I guess I just stepped up because no one else would or was too afraid. I am not physically imposing, I just drew a line. I had been getting all the waves I wanted and shared plenty. It's just that I knew it was time that neither of those guys would have another clean ride that day since they were so unpleasant. It was unfortunate that I had to run over one guys board and drive him into the bottom of the wave. It really upset my stoke over such a perfect, well overhead day. Those things happen. And after listening to him tell me how he was going to kick my ass for two hours I was begging him to just please do it because it would have been less painful than listening to him cry. We all need to step up and "educate" our more ignorant brethren:moon: on occasion. Or, maybe I'm just another babbling knucklehead.
Like the Duke said, "Share them doggone waves!"
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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 08:28 AM


I'll have to add this. I might have been a little buzzed last night:smug:. So there was a more naked truth/statement there. And, unfortunately, those were older guys. So much for setting an example.
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Margie
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 10:29 AM


Okay. So maybe - seriously- after the summer crowds thin out, we could have a big luau down here, invite the Mexican surfers and pass the peace pipe.. It might be kind of fun.

Elgatoloco could do the hula.

I don't think it's too lame.

Sallysouth, the North Shore must have had some problems, how did you guys handle these, as far as localism is concerned.

P.S. I'm serious about the luau !

[Edited on 5-8-2004 by Margie]
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FrankO
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 11:27 AM


I think that kind of gathering would be totally cool. I want my two yet to be born kids to grow up bi-cultural surfers/travelers.
El gato, anytime, but preferably not a weekend.
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mr.jack
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 03:49 PM


Sounds good. Anyone in? When and where... ideas and suggestions?
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JESSE
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[*] posted on 5-8-2004 at 08:09 PM


Quote:
Originally posted by FrankO
OK. Jesse, most surfers are mellow. buttcracks invite aggressiveness. So this is the way I see it. I don't tolerate buttcracks. Bear with my tale. I have watched many people intimidate people thru loud mouths and snaking actions and just waited. When they pull that chit w/me I have patiently held them underwater and watched them struggle for a breath or told them to shut the flock up or please, just beat my ass because I can't stand thier loud mouth bullchit. If they want to go for it one of us is not leaving the water. Me or them. It's the silent ones you have to watch for. I am fine w/some loudmouthed buttcrack breaking all his teeth on my fist. flock that localism bullchit. I've no tolerance for it.


Unfortunatelly, me and my buddy did not stand a chance against an army of local surfers at Trestles, i don't back down from nowone myself, but i am no fool and know when its time to get out of the water and find another break.




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