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Coatlallope
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Posts: 23
Registered: 8-27-2008
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4 Los Cabos police arrested for murder of American
An American from oregon, Sam Botner, was arrested at the La Jolla condominimums in Cabo. The cops took him to the police station, handcuffed him, and
beat the crap out of him, leaving him on the jailhouse floor where he drowned in his own blood. Videotapes at the jailhouse have been erased or
blocked out. Some evidence was destroyed. The state attorney general's office is investigating and the US Embassy has asked for information on the
matter.
http://www.tribunadeloscabos.com.mx/newpage/index.cfm?op=por...
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CaboRon
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And The Hits Just Keep On Commin'
I am just contunuely amazed at the low lifes that inhabit the police departments in Mexico.
Was there ever any attempt to train or screen these cave men BEFORE they were hired ??
Where is the accountability ?
CAboRon
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woody with a view
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Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
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becoming a cop in mexico is a surefire way to double the size of your chilito. you know, machismo...
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Hooker33
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From the article in the Tribuna I was not able to translate the cause for the arrest of Mr. Botner. Can you help me out? This is another example of
the problems we face as residents in Los Cabos.
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Cardon Man
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Location: Thetis Bank
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Mood: !Al Chingaso!
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I have yet to have a problem with the small town cops in Baja Sur. But the police in La Paz or Los Cabos are to avioded at all cost in my experience.
Interactions with them often result in mordida...or worse. The last thing decent folk in Los Cabos need is a horror story like this. "Low Season"
will be hitting all time low's.
[Edited on 8-31-2008 by Cardon Man]
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Cardon Man
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Hooker33
From the article in the Tribuna I was not able to translate the cause for the arrest of Mr. Botner. Can you help me out? This is another example of
the problems we face as residents in Los Cabos. |
As I translate it...Botner was involved in a fight with another guest at La Jolla resulting in arrest.
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bajajudy
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Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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I am trying to get more info on this incident
And, yes, this is all we need. Can you say "mas bajo de todo"?
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baja Steve
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Sam is a known drug dealer in his home town in southern Oregn. I feel sorry for his family but maybe the cops should get a promotion
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oxxo
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| Quote: | Originally posted by baja Steve
Sam is a known drug dealer in his home town in southern Oregn. |
I believe you, but how do you know this?
It was Ronald Reagan who said, "trust but verify."
[Edited on 8-31-2008 by oxxo]
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Lee
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More defense of the MX cops doing their job
When cops are painted in ''broad strokes'' and sweeping generalizations and stereotypes, especially Mexican cops, I'm always puzzled. Who are the
people making these inaccurate and unfair accusations?
In EVERY police department, including the New Orleans police department, there are a handful of bad cops -- guys who will take money, turn their back
on someone needing help, and even using their authority and power to line their pockets.
I've heard the number is 10%. At the LAPD, that's about 1,000 ''badges''. Being F-over by one of these scumbags is luck of the draw.
Generally, and I write that word in loose terms, there are more honest and decent cops in Mexico (Baja) than there are bad ones. There might be
some ''stations'' that have MORE than 10% bad cops, but that too is luck of the draw.
The problems might be ''regional'' as well. DF being one of the problem areas -- just as New Orleans has had it's problems.
I think it's the nature of police business. Good guys move on or up (lateral moves) and bad guys stay on and get hardened and calloused.
When you're in trouble and/or need help, who you gonna call?
If you're innocent and have committed no crimes, you have nothing to worry about.
US Marines: providing enemies of America an opportunity to die for their country since 1775.
What I say before any important decision.
F*ck it.
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Woooosh
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Lee
When cops are painted in ''broad strokes'' and sweeping generalizations and stereotypes, especially Mexican cops, I'm always puzzled. Who are the
people making these inaccurate and unfair accusations?
In EVERY police department, including the New Orleans police department, there are a handful of bad cops -- guys who will take money, turn their back
on someone needing help, and even using their authority and power to line their pockets.
I've heard the number is 10%. At the LAPD, that's about 1,000 ''badges''. Being F-over by one of these scumbags is luck of the draw.
Generally, and I write that word in loose terms, there are more honest and decent cops in Mexico (Baja) than there are bad ones. There might be
some ''stations'' that have MORE than 10% bad cops, but that too is luck of the draw.
The problems might be ''regional'' as well. DF being one of the problem areas -- just as New Orleans has had it's problems.
I think it's the nature of police business. Good guys move on or up (lateral moves) and bad guys stay on and get hardened and calloused.
When you're in trouble and/or need help, who you gonna call?
If you're innocent and have committed no crimes, you have nothing to worry about. |
It's the vitims fault... It's a media problem... The security problem is only in Baja Norte... Tourists aren't the intended victims...
Mexico indeed has a death penaty- just no trials leading up to them. There must be a box on the police application that asks if they tortured their
pets when they were young. It's the same sick menatality that is pervasive in the police, army and narcos.
After the decaps near Cancun, the shootouts in TJ and now police murders in Cabo- there's little reason for tourists to visit Mexico.
Mexico is just stuck on stupid- it's the only explanantion. It needs to wipe itself and flush twice.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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bajajudy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6886
Registered: 10-4-2004
Location: San Jose del Cabo,BCS
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Mexican authorities investigate death of Oregon man
By Serena Markstrom
The Register-Guard
Published: August 31, 2008 12:00AM
The Mexican equivalent of the Attorney General’s office is investigating the death of an Oregon tourist who was beaten by local police while
vacationing in San Jose del Cabo, a beach town near Cabo San Lucas on the Baja Peninsula, according to Mexican media reports.
Mexican news outlets have reported that the death appears to be aggravated murder, and the United States consulate in Mexico has intervened on behalf
of the tourist, Sam Botner, who died Aug. 27 at a jail.
Botner died after four officers allegedly beat him, an assault that a local paper, Tribuna de los Cabos, says was caught on jail video and witnessed
by other police and inmates.
No English language accounts of the death or subsequent investigation were available, but according to Spanish language papers, police involved in the
death are being investigated for negligence and “golpe,” which translates to “beating.”
Classmates.com lists a Sam Botner as attending Yoncalla High School from 1984 to 1988. Mexican newspapers report that Botner was 38 and was from
Oregon. Attempts to reach Portland resident Kim Botner, which one newspaper said was the name of the victim’s wife, were unsuccessful Saturday.
El Sudcaliforniano, another paper in Baja California, reported on Aug. 29 that Sam Botner’s wife, Kim Botner, identified the body.
The pair apparently was staying at a condo where police responded to a woman’s call that she was being robbed by a man. Three agents and a commander
arrived and beat Botner, the presumed robber, both at the condo and later at the jail, the newspaper reports. Botner was pronounced dead on arrival at
a Mexican clinic.
The four police involved were detained the night of the incident, but three disappeared by Friday, the Tribuno reported.
The paper reported Saturday that the jail surveillance tapes had been tampered with, prompting investigators to quickly secure other evidence from the
scene.
Witnesses said that after the jail beating, Botner tried to sit up, but started to convulse then appeared to choke on his own blood, the newspaper
reported.
Other detainees called out for the police to help, and they came immediately but the man was already dead, the newspaper reported. Investigators found
the surveillance tapes tampered with and the cell Botner was in had been cleaned, the newspaper reported.
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Dave
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Registered: 11-5-2002
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Areyoufrigginkiddinme?
| Quote: | Originally posted by Lee
If you're innocent and have committed no crimes, you have nothing to worry about. |
I don't know if you could say that with 100% certainty anywhere but certainly not ever in Mexico. If that were the case this place
would be overrun with tourists...And all the police would starve.
As to your, "more honest and decent than bad cops" comment:
Percentage of Mexican authority taking, or has taken a bribe. What's your best guess?
[Edited on 8-31-2008 by Dave]
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Bajajack
Banned
Posts: 370
Registered: 5-20-2007
Location: Arizona
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There are no honest cops
in mexico, half of em are just plain bad and the other half either ignore it or look the other way.
\"take what you can, give nothing back!\"
We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the
American people.\'
Theodore Roosevelt 1907
We can have no \"50-50\" allegiance in this country. Either a man is an American and nothing else, or he is not an American at all.
Theodore Roosevelt
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Lee
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3455
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Location: High in the Colorado Rockies
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Redefining ''is''
| Quote: | Originally posted by Lee
If you're innocent and have committed no crimes, you have nothing to worry about. |
That's MY belief system and how I think. I've been around the block -- no reason for me to think things are going to change -- in my belief system
of cops.
| Quote: | | If that were the case this place would be overrun with tourists...And all the police would starve. |
Baja and MX isn't for everyone. Some would argue that Baja/MX is already overrun by tourists. I wouldn't.
| Quote: |
Percentage of Mexican authority taking, or has taken a bribe. What's your best guess?
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I can't guess a percentage and there's no way to accurately put a number on my statement. Everything is subjective -- so if you think all cops are
corrupt, that's how it is for you.
I don't consider a cop taking a bribe as corruption. Cartel activities and decapitated people would be corruption.
US Marines: providing enemies of America an opportunity to die for their country since 1775.
What I say before any important decision.
F*ck it.
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
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Obviously
| Quote: | Originally posted by Lee
I don't consider a cop taking a bribe as corruption.
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But it is.
Plain and simple.
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stanburn
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Posts: 145
Registered: 10-4-2007
Location: Santiago, Colima, MX
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I am just wondering, am I the only one to ever compare present day Mexico to the United States 80 - 100 years ago?
Mexican revolution ended in 1917, 91 years ago.
Think about the United States in the late 1800s and early 1900s.
Why would you think the Mexican society can advance more rapidly than the United States?
Proudly living full-time in Mexico and safer here than NOB!
Stan in Santiago
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woody with a view
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Location: Looking at the Coronado Islands
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they have a great blueprint to go by NOB. they're too dumb to want to advance any faster, obviously. the wild west is no more. 3rd world cops with
first world tourists......not a good combo.
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Lee
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My final answer
| Quote: | Originally posted by Dave
| Quote: | Originally posted by Lee
I don't consider a cop taking a bribe as corruption.
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But it is.
Plain and simple. |
Plain and simple for you. I'm happy for you.
It's not plain or simple to me, and I have my own opinion. A bribe is not corruption to me.
US Marines: providing enemies of America an opportunity to die for their country since 1775.
What I say before any important decision.
F*ck it.
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Woooosh
Banned
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Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
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| Quote: | Originally posted by stanburn
I am just wondering, am I the only one to ever compare present day Mexico to the United States 80 - 100 years ago?
Mexican revolution ended in 1917, 91 years ago.
Think about the United States in the late 1800s and early 1900s.
Why would you think the Mexican society can advance more rapidly than the United States?
Proudly living full-time in Mexico and safer here than NOB!
Stan in Santiago |
Mexico didn't get a clean start like the US did. Mexico carried on the corrupt ways of the Spanish because they didn't have the leadership to do
anything else.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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