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ramuma53
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Wooosh
I likeyour way of action, but, please make a letter to the person who told you that, saying in wrhting what he promised you and thanking him for doing
it, please send copy to the Semarnap Secretary and to the Mexico´s president
If he does what he promise, he will be a hero, if he doesent he will be in a hot spot
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ramuma53
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Please send your letter to Juan Rafael Elvira Quesada
Secretario de SEMARNAP, and to the same person who told you that, take that letter and make two copies, take it to SEMARNAP and ask them to sign the
copy for both authorities, the guy who told you that and the Secretary copy
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ramuma53
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I forgot the president, but include him also, If they do not want to receive the letter, just go to the mail office and mail it to them
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ramuma53
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What he should do and can do for you
He can make the promised letter, ask the marines commander to deliver it and if the marines find somebody as a squater, they can just take him to
federal custody untill he prove he has a legal right, if he do not do this, he will be just giving you the Mary go arround
Authority has to do what the law order them to do, no other way
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BajaGringo
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Woooosh gets my vote for BajaNomad with the patience of Job...
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Woooosh
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You are right, you need to pat them on the back first so you push them into action. Everyone is a trophy kid down here. I sent him an e-mail
thank-you right away, but I need to put it on paper and get it to the right people with the official Mexican stamp. Trust but verify.
The head of the Rosarito Tourist Police stopped by our house to say hello today. He said he was stationed over in Primo Talapia the past few months,
but is now back. He had two guards and a driver with him. I told him his ears must have been burning became just yesterday we were saying nice
things about him at the FRAO office. (He gave us his Nextel walkie-talkie number last year to call him direct if we ever need help and that was
appreciated). He was very happy we still supported him and shook my hand once again. He did ask about the squatter and I told him we expect a letter
from the city next week telling her to go away and stop trying to sell the land.
I'd offer to donate the squatter house to the Marinas to aid in their panga smuggling observation and intervention program but I'm really looking
forward to donating the contents to charity and tearing it down. The house is keeping us from addressing the erosion that is taking sand away.
I don't know about being patient BGringo. I'm an old rat in a big maze- it will take me a while, but I'll get to that cheese... eventually.
[Edited on 2-3-2011 by Woooosh]
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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wessongroup
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ramuma53, I'm taking notes.... thank you
Hell, BG I'll vote for him.... 
[Edited on 2-3-2011 by wessongroup]
[Edited on 2-3-2011 by wessongroup]
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ramuma53
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Now back to our Rosarito Story
The Rosarito history is very important, because, as I just demonstrated, the old titles were all issued against the then prevailing law, mainly the
1863 Benito Juarez law.
Then that mean, that all the land on the Tijuana to Ensenada coastal strip has never came out in a legal way, from the National Land dominium and up
to this day, nobody has ever been able to provide legal proof that those titles were legal and as a consequence, those titles should not be used as
precedent for any property but sadly most of the developers are trying to do just that.
The only legal titles today, are the ones based on National Land titles and as we know, there are very few of those, mainly in the El Morro area,
issued in 1951.
A lot of pressure has been put on authorities to validate those titles, they have used a lot of pseudo arguments, up to the moral owners concept but
as you see, no legal argument has ever been sustained in court that allow anybody to use one of those titles as property precedent.
There is also an argument frequently used, based on legal history ignorance, mainly used by new attorneys: that those titles are valid as long as a
Federal Judge have not issued a ruling specify ruling every specific title void.
That argument is based on the modern concept of declaring a legal act void where Inexistence is not a legal fact, there are absolute voidance or
relative voidance and both require a judge ruling to be effective, but that is true only on modern legal acts (1917 to date), you have to apply the
law existing at the time of the legal act execution and that mean, you have to apply to that 1879 title, the law being applied at that time and at
that time, Inexistence was a legal concept meaning that the legal act affected by Inexistence, has never started to exist, that concept changed in
1917, but at that time, the titles were already affected by Inexistence and never started to exist acodrding to the 27 article of the 1863 law, so, it
is impossible to argue that they exist or caused any legal act, giving ground to any property right.
Then at this point I assume everybody has grounds to know that all those old 1879 titles, were no good for any legal act or give base to any legal
property right.
These are not concepts I just invented, those are concepts issued by the Reforma Agraria office to all public officials, I gave public lectures to all
the public notaries and real estate agents in Tijuana and nobody can argue of not knowing those legal facts, all of them have already being tested in
Federal courts and have never been discredited.
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Woooosh
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Location: Rosarito Beach
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A quick update on the great help and advice I have gotten from ramuna53. His legal expert on the Baja federal zone met with us over coffee last Friday
and he agreed to take our case. I think ramuna53 may have twisted his arm a bit. lol The expert, Eng. Chavira is very nice. Beyond very nice. He
did his preliminary investigation over the weekend and came back to our house today to do some more detailed survey work and give us the update.
He has much more digging to do- but the process is interesting. The squatter is trying to get a judge to give her the land title based on her being
the occupant for many years. But what title? We already have the 2008 federal title (for 12 more years) in place, re-verified in writing by SEMARNAT
in 9/2010. There are some legal twists and turns regarding the more recent actions of the fracciamiento- and that what he is focused on. (We thought
the guy was long since dead). I asked Eng. Chavira if he would be able to fix all this so we can clear the land for the boardwalk and he said "Yes,
this is what I do." We are energized. Thanks Rafael.
I "met" Eng. Chavira last year when he was doing a survey project along the beach. Most nomads know I am passionate about preserving the beach for
the people and no one with a survey stick gets past me without a take-home kit including our fracciamiento map and a souvenir "Que es Playas de
Rosarito, sin la Playa?" DVD. When I gave Eng Chavira the map last year I talked a little to him and gave him the original survey map of the area he
was working on. Engineers/surveyors always like old maps (this one is 1975) to check them against their GPS survey toys. I gave him my spiel that
the beach should be clean, safe, accessible and free for the people. His eyes lit up when I said free and he smiled and shook my hand.
The next time I saw him was in the coffee shop Friday and we hit it off again right away. A very small world.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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Lobsterman
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I see light at the end of the tunnel.
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ELINVESTIG8R
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Rafael,
You are a great asset to Baja Nomad as I knew you would be. Thank you for giving people the knowledge they need in understand the complexities of land
ownership in Mexico.
David
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ramuma53
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Knowledge is not useful if it is hidden, the only way we can avoid making the same mistakes again and again, is by knowing the place´s history and how
we solved those same problems in the past.
I am very confident that with Engineer Chavira knowledge, the beach problem will be solved soon and fairly, I know he has several high cards up his
sleeve, just in case.
I sent the investigation we did on San Felipe to the guys with the problem there, but that is just a case where the authorities are the ones to blame,
together with the developers, who build without the needed permits.
In San Felipe the problem is a conflict between the environmental authorities who want to preserve that area development free and the crooked Estate
authorities who allow the development and then are unable to grant the development permits while the developers being over confident on their
influence on the crooked Estate officials, develop the land and then are unable to give the buyers their clear title.
All this is a clear criminal case named ¨Fraude Equiparado¨ committed by the developers against the buyers; a crime that the Estate District attorney
must prosecute, but a crime they do not want to prosecute. There is the problem.
Advise.- Hit the Estate District attorney with everything you can, until he solve the problem via prosecuting the developers or obtaining the legal
permits and granting the clear titles.
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ramuma53
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Elinvestig8r
Thank you for your comments.
Buying property in Baja is something that American people need and will do more and more in the near future.
I believe that they can do it safely if they are armed with the right knowledge that allow them to avoid becoming the usual victim to public officials
and crooked developers and I agree at this point, it is almost a sport to do that in Baja.
Just remember that when something is difficult, the ones armed with the knowledge to do it, have an advantage.
That is the case on Baja, if you know what you are doing, you can buy property safely and without future problems and when most of the buyers become
smart buyers, the crooks will have to become honest people or go out of business.
[Edited on 3-2-2011 by ramuma53]
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Woooosh
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ramuma53
Elinvestig8r
Thank you for your comments.
Buying property in Baja is something that American people need and will do more and more in the near future.
I believe that they can do it safely if they are armed with the right knowledge that allow them to avoid becoming the usual victim to public officials
and crooked developers and I agree at this point, it is almost a sport to do that in Baja.
Just remember that when something is difficult, the ones armed with the knowledge to do it, have an advantage.
That is the case on Baja, if you know what you are doing, you can buy property safely and without future problems and when most of the buyers become
smart buyers, the crooks will have to become honest people or go out of business.
[Edited on 3-2-2011 by ramuma53] |
Yes! And when everyone can buy property "safely" and smartly- everyone benefits. Mexico needs expats and investors to buy and develop land, to
become Baja residents and then contribute to the economy and society. The real estate crooks are no better than narcos- both only want easy money
regardless of the negative impact and image they present. "Clean and transparent" is the future of Mexico. It is good for buyers, good for Mexico
and good for the Mexican people. We're ready any time Mexico is.  I do hope
there is away for good people like Raphael to benefit in the long run from doing business correctly and honestly. If you had to pick a legal expert
today- who else would you choose?
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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ramuma53
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Wooosh
My benefit is a second hand benefit, I have land in Baja and most of it, is undeveloped because there are no investors around, to develop them and
that is happening, because of the bad developers who want to save pennies, while charging prices like USD$3500 dlls/m2 built, to retiring Americans. I
do not mind to do a good business, but you need to respect the customer, if you are planning to stay in business for a long time and I just saw most
of Baja commit economical suicide, just because they do not respect the customer; they thought, that they will just keep selling to those prices while
not giving the basic security, needed by the customer on their golden years retirement homes, a clear title and a safe street.
The government did not act like government, they acted like businessman, who are at the same time bad developers, they tried to hide the legal facts
on a matter, that has no time limitation and that took us, only to perpetuate a problem that need to be corrected, at the same time, they just allowed
their pockets, to be filled with drug money, expecting that the drug dealers would just keep to their business, ignoring the fact, that when you take
money from them, they own you forever and if you are obligated to give them impunity, they want impunity for every kind of crime and if they have
impunity for every crime, they will just keep criminal acts against anybody in their area, tourist and local people alike, killing every kind of
business.
Either Mexico become a safe place for business or we will turn in to a criminal State and now we are at the turning point, to make the decision, we
went as far to the dark side, as we were able, a little more and we will not be able to return, without very bad consequences for everybody, the
customers and the sellers.
Mexico need to turn around and expect only a fair return in our investment, while giving the American people, who are the Bajas development´s natural
customers, a good product, even better than in the Estates, because we have more profit, being the land a lot cheaper than in USA while the end prices
are very similar.
Business is bad in Baja, because of bad choices made by the government and developers together alike, we need to start by correcting the land property
debacle in the Tijuana Ensenada strip and from there the whole South and North Bajas.
I do not work for anybody´s money, but I have time to help others for free to avoid costly mistakes and direct you to good technical people, who do
not sell themselves to the one who pay better, they know we need to allow justice to prevail to make the good times return.
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Woooosh
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Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
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Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ramuma53
Wooosh
My benefit is a second hand benefit, I have land in Baja and most of it, is undeveloped because there are no investors around, to develop them and
that is happening, because of the bad developers who want to save pennies, while charging prices like USD$3500 dlls/m2 built, to retiring Americans. I
do not mind to do a good business, but you need to respect the customer, if you are planning to stay in business for a long time and I just saw most
of Baja commit economical suicide, just because they do not respect the customer; they thought, that they will just keep selling to those prices while
not giving the basic security, needed by the customer on their golden years retirement homes, a clear title and a safe street.
The government did not act like government, they acted like businessman, who are at the same time bad developers, they tried to hide the legal facts
on a matter, that has no time limitation and that took us, only to perpetuate a problem that need to be corrected, at the same time, they just allowed
their pockets, to be filled with drug money, expecting that the drug dealers would just keep to their business, ignoring the fact, that when you take
money from them, they own you forever and if you are obligated to give them impunity, they want impunity for every kind of crime and if they have
impunity for every crime, they will just keep criminal acts against anybody in their area, tourist and local people alike, killing every kind of
business.
Either Mexico become a safe place for business or we will turn in to a criminal State and now we are at the turning point, to make the decision, we
went as far to the dark side, as we were able, a little more and we will not be able to return, without very bad consequences for everybody, the
customers and the sellers.
Mexico need to turn around and expect only a fair return in our investment, while giving the American people, who are the Bajas development´s natural
customers, a good product, even better than in the Estates, because we have more profit, being the land a lot cheaper than in USA while the end prices
are very similar.
Business is bad in Baja, because of bad choices made by the government and developers together alike, we need to start by correcting the land property
debacle in the Tijuana Ensenada strip and from there the whole South and North Bajas.
I do not work for anybody´s money, but I have time to help others for free to avoid costly mistakes and direct you to good technical people, who do
not sell themselves to the one who pay better, they know we need to allow justice to prevail to make the good times return. |
exactly right. Mexico (and Baja in particular) is geographically desirable to Americans. There is an oversupply of housing projects built for
Americans in my area (Rosarito) because prices are just now starting to come down as much as the US housing prices have the past 5 years. I see the
eco-friendly Greenhaus development in Rosarito is now advertising town-homes for $99K (down from $149K) for example. The downside of that is no one
wants to be the last person to pay $149K or the new $99K price if they may go down to $79K. I do see some unlikely-to-be-successful condo projects
moving forward (NAOS for example). Do you think the cartels are putting their cash into these developments because their investment options are
limited (and favors are owed to them- "impunity" as you say)? Will the proposed "property forfeiture" laws of President Calderon level the playing
field? for those using narco-dollars to build? Building additional housing supply without the demand for them further hurts values?
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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ramuma53
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Woooosh
Rosarito at any price is too expensive, because you will have future problems, because all the coastal strip is National Land and most of the
developments are being built in National Land without property rights, based on old titles that under any light are Void and uanble to sustain legal
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lookingandbuying
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| Quote: | Originally posted by ramuma53
Woooosh
Rosarito at any price is too expensive, because you will have future problems, because all the coastal strip is National Land and most of the
developments are being built in National Land without property rights, based on old titles that under any light are Void and uanble to sustain legal
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Hi Ramuma53,
Been reading all of your great information. On another thread there was a question about buying a place at Club Marena condo development in Rosarito
corridor. The comment you said above that all developments along the coastal strip are on National Land and "most" of the developments are being
built on National land raises a question for me.
Is it your belief that EVERYTHING along the costal strip has problems? Is it also your belief that ALL houses and condo's in this area are subject to
the National Land problems you have made us aware of? In your opinion is there any safe way to purchase property in the areas between Rosarito and
say Ensenada??
From my readings of your posts it makes me belive that this is the case, there is not anything in this area that is safe. Scary!! I really started
to become concerned when a few years ago it was discovered that not even the Rosarito Beach Hotel and Torres had clear title on the property, after
being there since 1923, or so.
So basically, my question: is there anyway possible to buy a place along this strip and feel confident? From my understanding of your posts ALL of it
is National Land so EVERYONE that thinks they actually own something in these areas is fooling themselves. If this is the case it is a very
unfortunate situation for MANY people. And, it does not appear that a normal peson would be able to overcome this "National Land" problem if they
wanted to buy a place.
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gnukid
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With respect to Raphael, there is a bit of a problem with the idea that nothing is safe on the region.
There are higher laws that prevail, in Mexico and in many countries, possession, time of possession, history of paying taxes and guarding the property
boundary are recognized regardless of title issues. Same goes in the USA and most countries. You pay the tax, you stay there, you guard the property
limit, you own it, irregardless of who abandoned it.
Furthermore, there is natural law which Raphael may not acknowledge yet does have precedence. People have the inherent right to live on the land that
they are on, a rogue faction, government or foreign power may not supercede the individual's sovereign rights. The only way you can lose your
sovereign rights, is if someone convinces you to give it up and walk away.
One may also look at the history of Mexico, people have a much stronger relationship with land and their rights than in other regions like the USA
where very few people "own' their land. This is being demonstrated today as banks are foreclosing on property yet no one can find or produce the title
due to derivative financing. Mexico is likely among the most strong of any country in recognizing possession.
So, that said, a lawyer, even a good lawyer, can argue otherwise but the idea that everyone will lose their land that they possess, protect, pay taxes
on, it's unlikely and only could be associated with a corrupt view of property rights.
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ramuma53
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Gnukifd
You must know that National land property is not subjected to status of limitations, and that mean that time does not create a right like in private
property, you cannot acquire it by possession time or any other mean that is not a national land title, just read the 27 Constitutional article, all
lands inside Mexico´s borders is originally national land and you can take it out from that status only by acquiring it from the National land officer
and absolutely no other authority can sell or give away national land and that include any local judge, because I know you are referring to a
´Prerscripcion´, absolutely National land cannot be subjected or acquired it through prescription positiva or negativa.
That is the problem core in Rosarito and every authority knows it including Hugo Torres.
Concerning higher laws, the constitution is the highest law.
Just check article 27 from the 1863 National land law, paying taxes does not give you any right.
National land is not abandoned ever, it is the origin of property, it has to come out of National land dominium to be private property and if it isn´t
out, there is only one way to take it out, a National Land title issued by the right authority.
Here we are not talking about natural law, we are talking about Mexico´s law, because the land is in Mexico and in this world, maybe in heaven you
will be right, but you have to wait until you exist there and then we may talk about that.
Sorry but your religious legal rights will not save anybody in this world
[Edited on 3-12-2011 by ramuma53]
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