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JZ
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| Quote: | | Originally posted by Skipjack JoeNo way would I want to be in that situation in total darkness. |
Yeah, that's a key fact and why the boat would take the wave beam to. It was dark that night. Just a sliver of a moon.
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BajaNews
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Divers could start searching for missing fishermen Monday
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_18452222
By Paul Burgarino
07/10/2011
While most of the survivors of a fishing trip-turned-deadly return home to Northern California, efforts continue to comb the Sea of Cortez to find
those that remain missing.
Divers from the U.S. Navy are being brought in from Hawaii to search the submerged vessel Erik to see if seven missing men are inside, said Alfredo
Escobedo Ortiz, civil protection director for Baja California, Mexico.
The dive team was likely to arrive Sunday and the search could begin Monday, barring any complications with customs, he said.
Search and rescue efforts continued throughout the weekend, but to no avail.
A U.S. Coast Guard aircrew searched 900 square miles near Isla San Luis, while three boats from the Mexican Navy searched on the water's surface. The
Mexican Federal Police also scoured the shores trying to find seven missing men.
The Coast Guard has searched approximately 4,600 square miles of ocean and land since the Mexican Navy requested help with the search.
In the Bay Area, family members of the lost anglers have not given up hope. They launched a website http://findourfathers.com Sunday dedicated to spreading the word about the incident and galvanizing local and international resources.
A week ago, 27 passengers were tossed into the warm sea waters about 100 miles south of San Felipe; a freak thunderstorm generating waves that
capsized their chartered fishing boat. Locals call it "El Torito," or little bull, because it packs a powerful punch.
Mexican investigators found the sunken boat last week, in about 223 feet underwater. The water is too deep for local divers to explore the ship, Ortiz
said.
"It is something I will never forget," said Gary Wong of Berkeley. Wong spent more than 15 hours floating on a safety ring and paddling to shore after
the 105-foot fishing boat sank.
In all, 19 fishermen -- mostly from Northern California on an annual Fourth of July trip -- and 16 Mexican crew members made it safely to dry land.
One man, Leslie Yee of Ceres, was found drowned on a remote island beach and seven other Americans remain missing.
Wong was among the last men to exit the ship.
"I can't believe I'm going to die a day after retiring," said Wong, who retired July 1 from his job as a senior water treatment operator for the East
Bay Municipal Utility District.
When he surfaced, Wong made his way to a raft and a large safety ring lashed together. A crew member pulled him aboard the ring.
Mexican officials said the cause of the capsizing is under investigation, and a report on the accident should be ready in about 10 days.
"We're reviewing the records of the ship, but I can tell you it had a steel hull, and it had been operating for years in this area," said Jose Luis
Rios Hernandez, a port captain in Ensenada who is helping with the investigation. "The truth is that the weather conditions (the Erik faced) could
have done the same to any boat of that size.''
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bullmello
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There is good discussion going on here regarding this tragedy. Maybe we can learn something from it. This storm could very well have overwhelmed the
most well engineered boat and best prepared crew. However, this boat was run by a less than professional operator which could have been a contributing
factor to the accident and loss of life. This is not playing the blame game. This is a logical examination of the known facts and trying piece
together the unknown to find out how to avoid a similar tragedy in the future.
If anything, I do feel a touch of blame myself for not speaking out more publicly about such a shoddy operator without much regard for the safety of
his paying passengers. (Another poster previously mentioned this and I agree for my own lack of action.) I went on a trip into the open Pacific Ocean
to Socorro Island from La Paz some years back on this same boat run by the same operator. No radar, no GPS, a sometime working marine radio, no
EPIRBS, hardly any safety equipment, no training or plan on what to do in case of catastrophe. The year was not 1492. It was my first of many trips to
Baja, my last on that boat. Holding an operator of any sportfishing outfit to a high standard of safety should not be a bad thing whether in Baja or
not.
Boating and fishing can be dangerous or even perilous and yet we still do it because we love it. It is foolhardy to ignore safety while doing so. I
have been swamped in a small boat with a friend in the SOC myself and lived to tell about it. We were about a mile offshore near a point with wind,
current, reef and waves all going different directions and we got it just a bit wrong and went in the water. If we had done things differently after
getting swamped, we might not be around to have learned something from the experience. The conditions were bad, it was the wrong place at the wrong
time and in the final analysis it was mostly our fault and our lack of experience under those conditions that caused it. At least our training served
us well and we were able to be rescued by pangeros that were onshore. We were also lucky.
Bottom line, nature can be harsh, the operator of this particular boat still cannot be trusted.
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mtgoat666
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the cause, according to one survivor
excerpt from
By DEREK MOORE
THE PRESS DEMOCRAT
Published: Saturday, July 9, 2011 at 9:22 a.m.
Last Modified: Saturday, July 9, 2011 at 9:22 a.m.
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Most of the men had gone to their cabins for the night by the time Miller, a retired electrical superintendent, headed back on deck. He and a few
others couldn't sleep because of the heat and their unease over the increasingly foul weather.
Miller and five other men, including DeLuca and Bautista, were assigned to cabin 9, which was on an upper deck behind the bridge.
Miller watched as waves struck the boat's port side and then cascaded over the top. The water began filling the fish hold, where the hatch had been
left open, as well as the interiors of the smaller fishing boats called pongas, which were left uncovered.
With each successive wave, more water stayed in the boat, until the vessel began to list to one side. Miller said that's when one of the men said they
were in trouble.
Miller said he rushed to his cabin and turned on the lights. He said his bunkmates thought he was joking when he told them to get out, but then,
realizing he was serious, they began hustling.
Miller said the last time he saw Bautista, he was rushing out the cabin door dressed only in his underwear and carrying a life vest on one shoulder.
Miller watched him leave while struggling to pull on cut-off shorts.
Below in a cabin, Tsurumoto was watching the movie “Secretariat” on his iPad when Chaddock leaned over and asked him if the boat was supposed to be
leaning so far over.
“Hell no,” Levine said. “We gotta get out of here.”
The men raced out of the room. To their dismay, they found that the boat's entire crew of 16 already was assembled on deck, wearing nice life vests.
Tsurumoto said the boat's cook handed him a life vest that had broken straps.
There was no time for complaining. Tsurumoto and the other men jumped overboard into the dark sea.
Time to get off boat
Miller was still on board and had gone to the bridge to search for a life vest. By then, the boat was at a 45-degree angle. When water broke the
windows on one side of the bridge and the power went out, Miller knew it was time to go.
He remembered seeing two large life rings attached to the top of his cabin earlier that night. He made his way to them, but was disheartened to see
that they were attached solidly with straps. Calling out for something to cut them with, Miller was handed a fish filet knife — not ideal.
He managed to cut away one strap, but as he began work on the other, the boat heaved backward for its final plunge. As the boat sank, Miller hung on,
furiously cutting away at the strap.
He was about 10 feet under the water's surface when he finally freed the straps. The rings broke free and floated away, as Miller, entangled in rope,
kicked frantically to get away. Miller discovered later that he broke a toe. The boat's metal mast also struck him, bruising his ribs.
Miller's actions turned out to be a lifesaver, as the rings supported 18 passengers and crew members. Miller's friends said he acted heroically. But
Miller dismissed the notion Friday and he feels guilt over not being able to do more.
“I was just trying to save my ass,” he said.
With lightning speed, the men found themselves in the dark and balmy ocean, naked or nearly so, riding swells they estimated to be 25 feet high. Men
could be heard screaming in Spanish and in English over the din of the wind and crashing waves.
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monoloco
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Any experienced captain would order the hatches to be battened down at the first sign of large seas. Whoever was running that ship was incompetent and
should be prosecuted and whoever hired him should be prosecuted also.
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mtgoat666
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Vengeance is mine
| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
Any experienced captain would order the hatches to be battened down at the first sign of large seas. Whoever was running that ship was incompetent and
should be prosecuted and whoever hired him should be prosecuted also. |
prosecute?
you make a big leap from incompetence to criminal activity.
what was criminal intent and act?
prosecuting someone for incompetence is silly. you punish people for willful misconduct - makes no sense to punish someone for incompetence.
of course, there are people that just seek punishment to satisfy urge to revenge...
"Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord."
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mcfez
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autopilot systems or not?
I am not going to claim to be a professional Seaman.....as some here seems to be imposing that upon us.
Ships sink. In any country, regardless of their inspections, Skippers, or whatever other reason(s).
I am surprised that no one here has questioned whether the helmsman was awake........or asleep.
Old people are like the old cars, made of some tough stuff. May show a little rust, but good as gold on the inside.
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monoloco
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| Quote: | Originally posted by mtgoat666
| Quote: | Originally posted by monoloco
Any experienced captain would order the hatches to be battened down at the first sign of large seas. Whoever was running that ship was incompetent and
should be prosecuted and whoever hired him should be prosecuted also. |
prosecute?
you make a big leap from incompetence to criminal activity.
what was criminal intent and act?
prosecuting someone for incompetence is silly. you punish people for willful misconduct - makes no sense to punish someone for incompetence.
of course, there are people that just seek punishment to satisfy urge to revenge...
"Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord."
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It's called criminal negligence.
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MrBillM
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On the Job at the Helm ?
Was the vessel underway ? Or, at anchor ?
If at anchor, there was likely not even a lookout posted, which probably wouldn't have mattered. Given how fast the situation developed, what any of
the crew were doing might have been immaterial.
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David K
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Too bad that didn't pull into Gonzaga Bay when the wind picked up... Just 5 miles away to a safe, natural harbor.
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Skeet/Loreto
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The only "Whip Storm" that I observed was the one at Loreto in the early 90's.
The morning started off pretty Normal with a few Clouds.' About 11 Am the Winds first came real strong from the West creating somewhat of a
Rotor Cloud" very low in front of Rancho Sonrisa, then the Winds started shifting from all directions and in Gusts. We started closing all the Windows
andhelping some of the Pangas with fisherman who were being blown up real high on the Beach.
Every once in awhile the Clouds would clear and I cood see a large vessel about 75 Footer riding out the Waves about a Half Mile out into the Water. I
was concerned that he would be capsized and washed ashore. In about 3 hours it was all over and all Pangas had been accounted for without loss of
Life. I had some window blown off the Hinges, and the Transformer Boxes at Hotel Oasis were blown down.
Over the 27 years I owned and operated a panga on the Sea of Cortez I had never seen such a strange storm.
I just got a feeling while reading all the reports that this Storm was one of those.
\ "Whip Storms".
For the Children who Like to be the "Blamers' of our Culture today. There is a difference in Baja Mexico and the United States of America. Their Laws
Rules and Regulations are much different, Their Social Mores are different.
I could well imagine the number of trips and possbile Overloading of that Boat.
For those children who never take a Risk because they are "Afraid" I feel far sadly.
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mtgoat666
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skeet's credo: "just do it!"
| Quote: | Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
For those children who never take a Risk because they are "Afraid" I feel far sadly. |
mo-skeeter:
everything has risk.
every risk can be reduced to probabilities, such as a number like "1 in 570,000 chance of death."
please define what is your acceptable risk, for us "children," and for yourself.
did you know that climbing mt everest has a death rate of something like 3 percent of people that try it?
makes you hesitate before adopting the skeet (and Nike) motto of "just do it!"
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Skeet/Loreto
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No Goat!! Not the "If it feels good Thingy of the Left-Leaning HillBillies that you are!!
In the ole Days we were taught to Observe, Calculate, then decide to take a Risk. Example "First time off the Cornice at Mamouth" Am I a good enough
Skier?? Is my Body in Great Condition?? If I do Fall, How far will I slid??
Then Take off and have a Great Run.
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bajaday
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Seems things have slowed down in the search dept. the last few days. The only helo we've seen for a few days has been the Marines. Yesterday they
went by us about 10:30 am but we didn't hear nor see them return north. We saw nothing go down south this a.m. About noon a Navy boat was freighting
towards San Felipe. I hope the divers are able to search soon. This has to an agonizing time for the families.
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bajatravelergeorge
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Talk about freaky.
The Friday night before the sinking I picked out a movie to watch from our DVD collection of hundreds of movies. What did I pick out? The Poseidon
Adventure.
I kid you not!
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MrBillM
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Freak Occurrences
Speaking of Dangerous Sports, one favorite Nocturnal Sport up here (especially among Young Marines) is Whacking Rural Mailboxes.
Given that the sport is usually indulged in after a preparatory bout of Liquid training, it is inevitable that execution timing problems may occur.
During one such competition awhile back, the "Whacker", apparently confused over proximity to the next goal, leaned out and LOST His Head.
Literally.
Although it continues to happen once in awhile, for each participant, it is the last such exercise.
Given that it's a loosely-organized sport without published stats, I'm unsure what the averages are, though.
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wessongroup
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajatravelergeorge
Talk about freaky.
The Friday night before the sinking I picked out a movie to watch from our DVD collection of hundreds of movies. What did I pick out? The Poseidon
Adventure.
I kid you not! |
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JZ
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Too bad that didn't pull into Gonzaga Bay when the wind picked up... Just 5 miles away to a safe, natural harbor. |
I wonder if it's deep enough there for a boat that big.
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BajaNews
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Safety of sunken fishing boat at issue
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/jul/11/safety-of-sun...
By Sandra Dibble, Michael Gardner and Ed Zieralski
July 11, 2011
Rescuers recount finding boat survivors
The allure of angling in waters teeming with game fish in the Gulf of California has drawn U.S. adventurers for many years.
Like a sportfishing trip anywhere, these voyages have their risks — from seasickness to turbulent weather. That reality was highlighted during a
sudden storm on July 3, when two large waves in the gulf capsized the vessel Erik about 60 miles south of San Felipe.
Thirty-five of the boat’s passengers and crewmen were rescued after floating for up to 16 hours at sea. Seven passengers — all Americans — remain
missing, and one has been found dead.
On Saturday, the Mexican navy, assisted by the U.S. Coast Guard, continued search operations in the gulf, also called the Sea of Cortez. A diving team
was heading from Hawaii to where the Erik is believed to be sitting more than 200 feet underwater.
It’s unclear whether the vessel was fully seaworthy and whether its crew followed proper safety procedures. Mexico’s federal Communications and
Transportation Secretariat won’t release those details because it is investigating the incident, and the boat’s owner has not responded to email,
phone and in-person requests for comment.
Some of the survivors had boarded a life raft, others tied on life jackets but said not everyone had access to a life jacket before the vessel sank.
Previous passengers, including a group of North County residents who spent a week on the boat in June, said there was no presentation or talk about
safety during their trip.
Fishing groups and Mexican and U.S. maritime officials said sportfishing vessels that spend time in Mexican waters, whether they start off in San
Felipe or San Diego, must be certified. The following are some other guidelines concerning safety:
Question: Where was the Erik ported?
Answer: The 115-foot charter fishing vessel was registered in Mexico under the name BajaTuristica S.A. de C.V. and docked in San Felipe. It was
chartered by Baja Sportfishing Inc., which lists an office in the Old Town neighborhood of San Diego. Business records filed with the state and San
Diego show that Alexander Cesar Velez is the company’s owner.
Q: Which government oversees boat safety in the Gulf of California?
A: Because the gulf is considered federal waters, any vessel in that area must abide by federal Mexican regulations.
Q: Who handles day-to-day enforcement of those rules?
A: That would be the harbor master in each location. In the case of the Erik, it would be the harbor master in San Felipe. These harbor masters work
under the federal Communications and Transportation Secretariat.
Q: What are some of the harbor masters’ duties?
A: They are tasked with registering sportfishing vessels, recording each boat’s dimensions and other characteristics, making sure it has insurance and
evaluating whether it qualifies for a Certificate of Maritime Safety. Harbormasters send inspectors to make sure vessels comply with safety standards
spelled out in that certificate.
The harbor master’s office works with the Mexican navy to ensure that safety measures are properly observed while a boat is out at sea. The Mexican
federal agency Conaspesca checks fishing licenses.
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mtgoat666
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| Quote: | Originally posted by David K
Too bad that didn't pull into Gonzaga Bay when the wind picked up... Just 5 miles away to a safe, natural harbor. |
too bad they didn't close the doors and hatches when wind/waves picked up, and too bad they did not store pangas upside down or right-side-up/tarped.
customers would have slept thru the squall w/o losing a wink of sleep.
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