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Mengano
Banned
Posts: 1238
Registered: 9-26-2011
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| Quote: | Originally posted by cielo
I spend 2-3 months in Cabo a year and aside from the events a couple of weeks ago there has been very little crime there against Americans or
tourists. |
and you know this based upon what empirical data?
http://noticabos.org/2011/11/14/detuvieron-a-frustrado-asalt...
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g152515-i84-k4858168-Sa...
http://www.oem.com.mx/elsudcaliforniano/notas/n2208461.htm
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/05/18/canadian-tourist-bouabal...
http://colectivopericu.wordpress.com/2011/07/11/y-la-violenc...
http://www.secretariadoejecutivo.gob.mx/es/SecretariadoEjecu...
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
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| Quote: | Originally posted by cielo
[
So what's your beef with Mexico? Is there absolutely nothing redeeming about the country and it's people? When is the last time you've been to Mexico?
Are there absolutely no places in the entire country that are safe? |
Mexico, and other countries with continuing criminal enetrprises, are judged publically by their most egregious faults. Tourist attractions will be
secondary, much to the chagrin of the tourism industry.
Look at Germany, for example; who, without being intimately familiar with the country, can even mention the word without thinking of genocide?
These things become unshakable flaws in the national character.
Mexico is shapeing her national identity without outside help., and as far as I'm concerned, if there's danger in Mexico, Mexico is a dangerous place.
That evaluation won't be confined to the immediate scene of the crime.
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sanquintinsince73
Super Nomad
Posts: 1493
Registered: 6-8-2010
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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I believe that Mengano should be elevated to "Special Correspondent" status on "BajaNomad" for crime in Baja. The town crier of Baja crime...I like
it.
"Los tentaculos del pulpo trancenden fronteras, compa"
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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| Quote: | Originally posted by cielo
I agree it's naive for Americans to travel to Acapulco, Mexico City, Guadalajara, Monterrey, TJ, Rosarito, Ensenada or anywhere close to the border
because we know those places are war zones now. |
The "we know" part will get you in some trouble here because many nomads are in complete denial and the NOB press and local tourism boards have
propped them up.
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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cielo
Newbie
Posts: 18
Registered: 11-18-2011
Location: San Jose del Cabo
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Thanks for reiterating my point.
The first link is a story about 2 tourist who were robbed with a broken piece of scissors? This story was actually about the good work the police did
finding the criminal and ended with the folowing quote (translated) " But the local police did an excellent job and caught the offender who attempted
to steal and could not escape the long arm of the law". I actually saw this story posted on your blog and could help but chuckle. I'm suprised you
haven't started posting stats for how many people get horrific, deadly sunburns while they're in Cabo.
The second link is a gas scam warning....Hilarious
The third link is about Americans who are scammed by local medical facilities. Not cool, I agree but no reason to fear Cabo. Also, the Gringo Gazette,
a local paper in Cabo has done at least 10 stories exposing the exact clinics in question. Really not something the media is trying to bury....nice
try though. Thank God no fraud ever occurs in the States!
Ok, the third link is valid. I have seen this all over the place on the internet. As I said, I've done research and all you and I can find is 5 or 6
instances from 2006 - 2010 within 4 vacation spots in Mexico it's doubtful you're going to be murdered on your vacation to Cancun, Playa, Cozumel,
Akumal or Cabo. Again, you have a better chance of getting struck by lightning. Here are some other links you should post on your blog.....because
you're so concerned for traveling Americans.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/150062
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,489030,00.html
http://www.haaretz.com/news/national/body-of-american-touris...
http://www.masscops.com/f38/u-s-tourist-drugged-robbed-kille...
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121834313494827509.html
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/01/26/earlyshow/main6142...
http://www.time.com/time/travel/article/0,31542,1992105,00.h...
http://articles.cnn.com/2010-07-12/justice/teen.tourist.kill...
Need I continue? If I relied only on "emperical data" like this I'd never leave the house. Again, chit happens everywhere.
The 5th link is a story about a peaceful demostrantion held by the "Women's associtation against violence towards women and Children" (google
translate) that took place amongst Mexican residents who were protesting a rise in crime within the Mexican community. Specifically, sexual assaults
against women and school children. The aim of the protest was to pressure the local government to allocate more of the budget to address crime within
the Mexican community. Nothing to do with Americans or tourism but a very worthy cause I'm sure. Thank God there are no rapists or sex offenders in
the States.
The 6th link is a graph on all crimes in Baja Sur. 18 murders out of 636,796 citizens is not an awful number. Again, how many of the 18 were AMERICAN
TOURISTS? Maybe 1?
Newsflash! Where there are human beings, there is crime, murder and the like. This includes in any and all tourist destinations around the world.
Most, if not all of these stats relate to Mexican on Mexican crime similar to your 5th link.
I don't dispute that Mexico is a mess right now and there are far more places to stay away from than there are to visit.
So anyway, you never answered my three simple questions. Where do you live and when's the last time you've been to Mexico, specifically Cabo, Cancun,
Cozumel, Akumal, or Playa.
And, what's your beef with Mexico?
By the way, my wife and I spent black Friday at Memorial City mall where she was carjacked almost 2 years ago because we still have to buy gifts for
Christmas.
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
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| Quote: | | Quote: | Originally posted by Woooosh
| Quote: | Originally posted by cielo
The narco violence sucked for everyone and we hope El Chapo will restore the peace now that he has taken over Baja. |
How can a drug lord restore peace? Do you think the Drug violence will ever end? If so, how? Some Mexicans think that once Calderon is done and if the
declared war on the cartels ends that things will go back to how they were before Calderon was elected. The situation is heartbreaking to those of us
Americans who love Mexico. I have a home in Cabo and love being there if Cabo turns into Rosarito it can sit there empty for all I care. Having to
dodge stray bullets and worry about being kidnapped is not my idea of a relaxing vacation. |
Drugs and money
have always moved through Mexico- under the surface. That's how El Chapo got to be a $Billionaire. That kind of money buys a lot of whatever it is
you want, anywhere on earth. El Chapo bought what he needed in Mexico and has already moved on to Australia and Europe. The lingering turf war in
our area will dwindle and the money, drugs and guns will go back to moving below the surface with the new players and pawns. It will cut the violence
and restore tourism everywhere in Mexico. Mexico doesn't currently have the legal system to handle the bad guys they catch now- police, prosecutors,
processes, judges or jailers. A truce for now is the best they can do. Only other option is extradite them all to the USA and make Mexico pay to
incarcerate them there. |
Of course Mexico is dangerous! Always has been. Since the advent of the Cartel turf wars and the extreme gruesome violence it has gotten much worse.
With proper precautions, you/we will probably never become a victim. Or...maybe you/we will. Fear will not stop me from going; never has; never will.
If I get capped...oh well! It has been a good life and is still worth the risk to go to Baja Sur.
Woooosh understands how the system works. Many of you will recall that I have been saying for years that this is how the violence will subside,
eventually. Reprehensible? Yes! Immoral? Yes! Looks like the Sinaloa Cartel/Guzman is taking over the country. After Calderon is out of office, it
will (as Wooosh says) "move below the surface".
Life goes on....or not!
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wessongroup
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21152
Registered: 8-9-2009
Location: Mission Viejo
Member Is Offline
Mood: Suicide Hot line ... please hold
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Good one Tone...
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Woooosh
Banned
Posts: 5240
Registered: 1-28-2007
Location: Rosarito Beach
Member Is Offline
Mood: Luminescent Waves at Rosarito Beach
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I agree with much of what has been written in this thread. Everyone has their own comfort zone for safety and are in different living/vacationing
situations. You certainly need to keep your head up at all times. The shooting near me last weekend was at 3:30pm a hundred feet from parked USA
cars and some American tourists and surfers enjoying the beach. How many of them were mentally ready for the gunshots and the murderers running past
them? The locals know to dive over the seawall for cover. We heard the shots, took cover, saw the assassins running by and just noted the amount of
time if took for the various response teams to arrive and watched what they did from a safe position. I was in my comfort zone as a resident, but I
certainly wouldn't have been if I was a day tourist!
It has been a hassle the past five years or so. I am responsible for the safety of everyone in my home and I set some firm safety rules and we
practice security drills at home and when driving. Ideal? Nope, but we don't have kids and can handle it. My Mexican family is 100% behind our
pro-active approach. My American family thinks I'm nuts but for me it is just a part of this phase of my life. "You pays your money and you takes
your chances. " I do think the security situation will get better rather soon but the world economy will be a drag on Rosarito tourism and real estate
for a long time to come. It now has to compete with what are now dirt-cheap USA retirement locations...
It is very sad to drive through downtown Rosarito and see all the empty store windows with "se renta" signs. These were the small businesses that
served the local Rosaritenses. Some closed because of Walmart- but others just moved to the newer shopping centers where the rents, I presume- are
lower. It makes the economic blight of downtown Rosarito appear worse than it is. They should try to re-locate the " touristy stall-mall booths"
into these empty storefronts and create some visible retail activity on the main drag. Business begets business. jmo.
[Edited on 12-1-2011 by Woooosh]
\"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing\"
1961- JFK to Canadian parliament (Edmund Burke)
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Bajahowodd
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9274
Registered: 12-15-2008
Location: Disneyland Adjacent and anywhere in Baja
Member Is Offline
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"It's open season on Gringos and it is not even being reported. Instead, all you hear is whining from Prince Howard about negativity. Does anybody
here think Bajahowodd cares about your well being? Does anybody here think Howard wants to make sure travelers get the information they need to make
an informed decision? Howard does not want anybody here thinking for themselves, his job is to make sure no bad news gets discussed. He also thinks
the only reason why Communism is not the predominant economic system in the world is that nobody has found the right leaders to make it work."
Inasmuch as I have no dog in this fight; inasmuch as I do not profit from a single visitor to Baja; inasmuch that unfortunately due to financial
setbacks my dream of living in Baja has been put on hold,....I do spend the equivalent of approximately three months per year in Baja....
The silly comments about Communism appear to me to be nothing more than some mouth-breathing right wing nut who absolutely fails to see how the
majority of the world's populace as it continues to grow, faces ever shrinking possibilities.
There has never been any large scale experiment in Communism. There have been a few insular and isolated attempts.
Folks need to understand that whatever that was under the Soviets, or Mao, was nothing more than a military dictatorship that they chose to claim
itself as being Communism. Communism, as it was first proposed, was very democratic.
I have no idea if it can work on a large scale. But I take exception to anyone who seeks to throw Communism as an epithet, when it really doesn't
apply.
I'm reminded of a quote I recently read from a "tea party" follower that said, "I'm perfectly willing to give up my liberties, so I can have freedom".
marooons prevail.
Since this marooonic program won't seemingly allow the word let's go with idiots.
[Edited on 12-2-2011 by Bajahowodd]
[Edited on 12-2-2011 by Bajahowodd]
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BajaRat
Super Nomad
Posts: 1302
Registered: 3-2-2010
Location: SW Four Corners / Bahia Asuncion BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ready for some salt water with my Tecate
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Desperation can bring out the worst in some. The best part of waking up is waking up. I could never imagine quitting the things I love because they
were dangerous. Id have to quit the fire service, never go in the ocean, stay out of the sun, park the car,never step in to help someone in need, give
up shellfish,skiing, surfing, flying, motorcycles, diving. Life without risk is not living. Ideally we take calculated risks, prepare the best we can
for our endeavors. Not everyone's gonna make it. Depending where you live and what you do is going to require specific preparation. The less you do
can limit your chance of success and potentially lead to disaster. Its a shame to have to take into consideration what another human being is capable
of doing to you, but that is exactly what you must. Get creative, get educated and always be prepared to give it everything you've got.
Peace is internal. Don't rely on others to provide it for you.....
[Edited on 12-2-2011 by BajaRat]
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bajabass
Super Nomad
Posts: 2016
Registered: 10-4-2006
Location: La Paz,BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Want to fish!!!
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Well stated Senor Ratone. Life is a calculated risk. Chose, and do it.
Keep your eyes on the road, and your hands upon the wheel!
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
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Yes!
| Quote: | Originally posted by BajaRat
Desperation can bring out the worst in some. The best part of waking up is waking up. I could never imagine quitting the things I love because they
were dangerous. Id have to quit the fire service, never go in the ocean, stay out of the sun, park the car,never step in to help someone in need, give
up shellfish,skiing, surfing, flying, motorcycles, diving. Life without risk is not living. Ideally we take calculated risks, prepare the best we can
for our endeavors. Not everyone's gonna make it. Depending where you live and what you do is going to require specific preparation. The less you do
can limit your chance of success and potentially lead to disaster. Its a shame to have to take into consideration what another human being is capable
of doing to you, but that is exactly what you must. Get creative, get educated and always be prepared to give it everything you've got.
Peace is internal. Don't rely on others to provide it for you.....
[Edited on 12-2-2011 by BajaRat] |
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DENNIS
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 29510
Registered: 9-2-2006
Location: Punta Banda
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by bajabass
Well stated Senor Ratone. Life is a calculated risk. Chose, and do it. |
Are you serious?? It's only a calculated risk when nothing happens to you.
When sht does happen, who here will say, "Ohhh well...we took our chances knowing this could happen. Such is life."
No one, I'm guessing.
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toneart
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4901
Registered: 7-23-2006
Member Is Offline
Mood: Skeptical
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Me!
| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by bajabass
Well stated Senor Ratone. Life is a calculated risk. Chose, and do it. |
Are you serious?? It's only a calculated risk when nothing happens to you.
When sht does happen, who here will say, "Ohhh well...we took our chances knowing this could happen. Such is life."
No one, I'm guessing. |
"With proper precautions, you/we will probably never become a victim. Or...maybe you/we will. Fear will not stop me from going; never has; never will.
If I get capped...oh well! It has been a good life and is still worth the risk to go to Baja Sur."
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bajabass
Super Nomad
Posts: 2016
Registered: 10-4-2006
Location: La Paz,BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Want to fish!!!
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I've made the mistakes, paid the prices, though reaped many more benifits, by doing what I felt was the right thing for me. Moving my life to Baja
included. Come what may, we all have the choices to make. Again, chose, and do it.
Keep your eyes on the road, and your hands upon the wheel!
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BajaRat
Super Nomad
Posts: 1302
Registered: 3-2-2010
Location: SW Four Corners / Bahia Asuncion BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ready for some salt water with my Tecate
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DENNIS
| Quote: | Originally posted by bajabass
Well stated Senor Ratone. Life is a calculated risk. Chose, and do it. |
Are you serious?? It's only a calculated risk when nothing happens to you.
When sht does happen, who here will say, "Ohhh well...we took our chances knowing this could happen. Such is life."
No one, I'm guessing. |
Yes I'm serious Dennis. Come on my friend, you did that if you took a prescription this morning. Will I make it from El Rosario to Guerrero Negro on
this tank of gas?I prefer not to be that poor compadre on the side of the road. Si or No.............
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BajaRat
Super Nomad
Posts: 1302
Registered: 3-2-2010
Location: SW Four Corners / Bahia Asuncion BCS
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ready for some salt water with my Tecate
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P.S. Happy travels, stay thirsty my friends,
and always get more ICE!
[Edited on 12-3-2011 by BajaRat]
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Bajafun777
Super Nomad
Posts: 1103
Registered: 9-13-2006
Location: Rosarito & California
Member Is Offline
Mood: Enjoying Life with Wife In Mexico, Easy on The Easy
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OK, I know it has been said a thousand times or more but when you use good common sense when traveling in Mexico or any foreign country your odds of
staying safe are good. We never drive at night anymore but we do start our trips at 6:30am driving until about 4:30pm, only if we need a long day of
travel. WE make numerous stops on the way for "walking it off travel time" for our backs and legs along with checking out roadside fruit stands. We
use the toll road systems as much as possible, in other words if it is there we USE IT since the costs are cheap for good travel.
WE have traveled by truck, jeep from T.J. down to Cabo, from Nogales all the way down to Puerto Vallarte. Bus from Guadalajara to Puerto Vallarte
after flying into Mexico City then catching a plane to Guadalajara, and taking plane to Cancun then renting a car and taking tour buses to all the
things we wanted to see around that area. Have even taken the Baja Ferries from La Paz over to Topolobampo then drove over to Los Mochis for several
days before driving back up to Nogales then home to Brawley, California.
We have traveled a lot in Mexico and yes we will travel even more in the years to come. Dangerous things can happen anywhere, however with common
sense tactics hopefully you will have less chance of it happening to you no matter where you travel.
I refuse to be a prisoner of my mind worrying about things that could, should or will happen. We all know when bad thing happen they do not happen to
you when you are really ready for it. Bad things happen in many different Countries including the "Good Old USA," so may God travel with you. Just
have the "Need & Urge For More Mexico Time!" Take Care & Travel Safe---"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
Member Is Offline
Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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Personal Safety NOB
Is best not expected of ANYONE else.
In our own cases it is entrusted to good judgement and the combined security of Beretta, Browning, Colt, Marlin, Mossberg, Rossi, Ruger, Taurus,
Winchester and some like lesser names.
They have never disappointed.
Unlike Law-Enforcement.
[Edited on 12-3-2011 by MrBillM]
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Santiago
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3501
Registered: 8-27-2003
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: | Originally posted by MrBillM
Is best not expected of ANYONE else.
In our own cases it is entrusted to good judgement and the combined security of Rossi......and some like lesser names.
They have never disappointed.
Unlike Law-Enforcement.
[Edited on 12-3-2011 by MrBillM] |
[img] [/img]
OK, I give up - how do you use one of the world's finest clarinets for personal protection??
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