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BajaTed
Senior Nomad
Posts: 859
Registered: 5-2-2010
Location: Bajamar
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Where is the indignation?
Five governors and one A.G. busted by the U.S. for drugs is the current count going right now.
Why is it as the social institutions come apart at the seams there is no indignation and just endless resignation to more of the status quo by the
citizenry.
Is Plumo or Plata that efficient???
Why can't the good old capitalisim concept for everyone win the battle?
Es Todo Bueno
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bajaguy
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9247
Registered: 9-16-2003
Location: Carson City, NV/Ensenada - Baja Country Club
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Mood: must be 5 O'clock somewhere in Baja
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Just business as usual
Quote: Originally posted by BajaTed  | Five governors and one A.G. busted by the U.S. for drugs is the current count going right now.
Why is it as the social institutions come apart at the seams there is no indignation and just endless resignation to more of the status quo by the
citizenry.
Is Plumo or Plata that efficient???
Why can't the good old capitalisim concept for everyone win the battle?
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1855
Registered: 3-9-2009
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Capitalism as the answer? Well, as far as I know the mafia, organized crime, the drug trade...they are all motivated by the profit motive...the same
profit motive that is behind legal and legitimate business. Widely known that owners of crime business enterprise have been the very same people that
also own legal legitimate businesses. Not a mystery as to why they own both types, legal and illegal...they do it for money.
Don't remember ever seeing it written anywhere that capitalism's theory is restricted to lawful endeavors only. Self-interest, that is the common
thread. That is why it is necessary to regulate business to keep capitalism activity LAWFUL. That's not the only reason for business regulation,
though. Notice that those that are against business regulation always say that "regulation is bad for business". You never hear those people make
distinctions between good regulation and bad regulation, because, they really don't care. They just want to further their 'self-interest' pursuit to
make more money no matter what.
Self-interest alone is, in and of itself, amoral. So don't look to capitalism to cure immorality, especially when there is ample historical and
current evidence of malfeasance by capitalists everywhere.
[Edited on 3-31-2017 by MitchMan]
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chuckie
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6082
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Location: Kansas Prairies
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And, in the good old USofA, every day another Washington staffer goes under investigation or inditement (sp) ...AND we sit and take it...MM is
correct, it almost seems as if the highest form of capitalism is on the dark side...
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norte
Super Nomad
Posts: 1163
Registered: 10-8-2008
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Come on. There is a lot of indignation out there. Just not on this site.
This site is not for telling anybody about what is out there, the theft, drug use , murder etc.
This a feel good site for trip reports, photos, pats on the backs and occasional family spats.
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chuckie
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6082
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Location: Kansas Prairies
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I think, actually, that folks who are overinvested in Baja don't want to talk about a lot of these problems for fear of their property values and
resale abilities dropping...
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Bubba
Senior Nomad
Posts: 957
Registered: 2-17-2009
Location: Pismo Beach, Ca.
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| Quote: Originally posted by norte | Come on. There is a lot of indignation out there. Just not on this site.
This site is not for telling anybody about what is out there, the theft, drug use , murder etc.
This a feel good site for trip reports, photos, pats on the backs and occasional family spats. |
You are pretty much spot on with this. Promotion and rose colored glasses.
Making America Great Again
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
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Location: Redding, Northern CA
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"Capitalism" is tolerated and venerated because the alternatives are worse. MitchMan is correct in that some regulation is a good thing, but often
the concept of regulation is taken too far, to the detriment of big and small business, and thereby us all. Seldom is "greed" for wealth a personal
thing among good people, but rather to secure the security and prosperity of Family, and extended Family, and even community, which is of course
"tribalism" of a sort----it's ingrained in most of us. Until we come up with something that works better for the majority we are stuck with
Capitalism, in my opinion, and I kind of like it anyway so am more tolerate than I should be of the ills of man. If people exercise personal
responsibility for taking care of the system, most of the ills would disappear.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64479
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bubba | | Quote: Originally posted by norte | Come on. There is a lot of indignation out there. Just not on this site.
This site is not for telling anybody about what is out there, the theft, drug use , murder etc.
This a feel good site for trip reports, photos, pats on the backs and occasional family spats. |
You are pretty much spot on with this. Promotion and rose colored glasses. |
Bubba, norte= The purpose of (my) trip reports are to share, to give something back, to help the locals by letting other tourists know what a Baja
trip is really like and not what CNN or the New York Times says it's like.
Drug use is not in a trip report because it is either not done in the trip or not witnessed. Crime or harassment is in trip reports. I have yet to be
murdered or see a murder, so that is also not in my trip reports.
Barry A. = LIKE
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bajabuddha
Banned
Posts: 4024
Registered: 4-12-2013
Location: Baja New Mexico
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Mood: Always cranky unless medicated
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Bubba, norte= The purpose of (my)
trip reports are to share, to give something back, to help the locals by letting other tourists know what a Baja trip is really like and not
what CNN or the New York Times says it's like. |
.../AND the occasional quasi-political rant and barb thrown in to enlighten this forum with the usual Special K BULLCHIT POTLICKS..... er, politikkks
(a.k.a. FAKE NEWS). 
I don't have a BUCKET LIST, but I do have a F***- IT LIST a mile long!
86 - 45*
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64479
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Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Fox News also... it doesn't matter. This is about Baja.
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norte
Super Nomad
Posts: 1163
Registered: 10-8-2008
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From indignation to arrogance. How do trip reports help local Mexican families?
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Bubba
Senior Nomad
Posts: 957
Registered: 2-17-2009
Location: Pismo Beach, Ca.
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Quote: Originally posted by Bubba | | Quote: Originally posted by norte | Come on. There is a lot of indignation out there. Just not on this site.
This site is not for telling anybody about what is out there, the theft, drug use , murder etc.
This a feel good site for trip reports, photos, pats on the backs and occasional family spats. |
You are pretty much spot on with this. Promotion and rose colored glasses. |
Bubba, norte= The purpose of (my) trip reports are to share, to give something back, to help the locals by letting other tourists know what a Baja
trip is really like and not what CNN or the New York Times says it's like.
Drug use is not in a trip report because it is either not done in the trip or not witnessed. Crime or harassment is in trip reports. I have yet to be
murdered or see a murder, so that is also not in my trip reports.
Barry A. = LIKE |
I wasn't necessarily referring to this site or all posters here. The typical biased mainstream media does a fine job already.
Making America Great Again
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BajaTed
Senior Nomad
Posts: 859
Registered: 5-2-2010
Location: Bajamar
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On April 11 local indignation might be something to behold as it relates to the fate of the Vaquita in the Northern SoC.
Suggest some darker glasses going forward as the degrees of separation become smaller and smaller
http://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/fishermen-protest-in-sonora-...
Es Todo Bueno
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Udo
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6321
Registered: 4-26-2008
Location: Black Hills, SD/Ensenada/San Felipe
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Mood: TEQUILA!
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Udo
Youth is wasted on the young!
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MitchMan
Super Nomad
Posts: 1855
Registered: 3-9-2009
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| Quote: Originally posted by Barry A. | | "Capitalism" is tolerated and venerated because the alternatives are worse. MitchMan is correct in that some regulation is a good thing, but often
the concept of regulation is taken too far, to the detriment of big and small business, and thereby us all. Seldom is "greed" for wealth a personal
thing among good people, but rather to secure the security and prosperity of Family, and extended Family, and even community, which is of course
"tribalism" of a sort----it's ingrained in most of us. Until we come up with something that works better for the majority we are stuck with
Capitalism, in my opinion, and I kind of like it anyway so am more tolerate than I should be of the ills of man. If people exercise personal
responsibility for taking care of the system, most of the ills would disappear. |
There is definitely a better system than capitalism; simply stated, a balanced hybrid of certain socialistic applications and the rest capitalism
with appropriate level of regulation.
For example, health care, in the USA, should entirely be converted to Medicare for every single individual in the USA. That includes the ability to
bargain with the pharmaceutical companies. Doing the conversion will cover every person with complete comprehensive insurance with no life time
limits, no pre-existing conditions, etc. And, the cost of healthcare in the USA would be cut in half. Given that our current healthcare is twice as
expensive as the rest of other advanced countries without covering everyone in the USA, massive improvement to the nation's health and economic
benefits galore. Win, win. That's just one example.
Broadly stated, for the important necessities, (healthcare being just one) should be much more regulated than other commodities.; more socialistic if
you will. Important necessities are, well, necessary. The acquisition of other commodities can be less regulated and more exposed to market based
capitalism. These less regulated commodities need regulation to preserve fair and continuing competition, to remove moral hazard, and to preserve
public and environmental safety and reduce society's exposure to harmful 'externalities'. In the case of dire necessities such as healthcare,
regulation keeps the necessities much more affordable. In the case of other commodities, proper regulation leaves those industries to a higher degree
of exposure to market based capitalism. That's a really good thing.
All regulations need to be properly evaluated for cost-benefit in order to determine the optimal extent of regulation.
Market based capitalism per se has the ability to guide production to where it is needed most and eliminate commodities that are not economically
viable. That is good as it can prevent waste and promotes efficiency.
Unfettered, unregulated, laissez-faire capitalism doesn't do this in the long run, and, often not even in the short run. That is the mistake that
most all people have when they think of capitalism. They naively, ignorantly and mistakenly think that unfettered, unregulated, laissez-faire
capitalism is in and of itself an economic and societal panacea and that it works every where, all the time, every time. There have been Nobel Prizes
awarded to many economists who have all but proven otherwise.
A hybrid of capitalism and socialism in just the right proportion would be optimal. Most of what would go into the GDP would be sourced in market
based capitalism. We can have both. We are smart enough as a country; we have the technology; so far we haven't been "wise" enough as a people to do
it.
Wise up, dammit!
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El Jefe
Super Nomad
Posts: 1027
Registered: 10-27-2003
Location: South East Cape
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Vary well said MitchMan.
No b-tchin\' in the Baja.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64479
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Reading some Karl Marx, are you?  
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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Mitchman------------It's that "balanced" business you mention in your first sentence above that worries and confounds me. How do you maintain the
"proper balance" between Capitalism and Socialism? If we could, I probably could agree with you. The history of most Government-run systems is not
encouraging. I must admit, however, that Medicare seems to work pretty well for we old-timers, so you may be on to something here. (he said
optimistically while being pessimistic about our actual chances of making it work well).
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BajaTed
Senior Nomad
Posts: 859
Registered: 5-2-2010
Location: Bajamar
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When the commodity is the mordiba, patrimony, human smuggling and drugs, Its Plumo or Plata and NOT K. Marx at work
I was taught; "Corporations are only allowed to exist by the grace of the societies they operated within".
BTW, Kaiser healthcare is a relic of those times when corporations cared.
Seems times have changed.
Es Todo Bueno
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