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SFandH
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 01:12 PM


Quote: Originally posted by motoged  


Who thinks the wall concept Trumpers support is affordable/good use of tax dollars considering the FACTS of proposed costs?



A distinct minority of Americans:

"Americans continue to oppose (62%) than favor (35%) building a wall along the entire U.S. border with Mexico."

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/24/most-america...

Interesting data. The polling further characterizes opinion holders by age, race, political party affiliation, and education.

[Edited on 9-22-2017 by SFandH]




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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 02:49 PM


Thanks for answering the question. Those who complain about gov't spending and support the wall are walking contradictions....or something like that...

There have to be better mechanisms than concrete....but Trump doesn't seem capable of conceptual reasoning....and is a concrete thinker....so that follows.... :rolleyes:

Gary....rewarding offenders is not a good idea, but a moratorium for some seems sensible.....remember when draft dodgers were offered such an opportunity....some good folks returned to the USA under that compassionate ruling....



Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Quote: Originally posted by motoged  


Who thinks the wall concept Trumpers support is affordable/good use of tax dollars considering the FACTS of proposed costs?



A distinct minority of Americans:

"Americans continue to oppose (62%) than favor (35%) building a wall along the entire U.S. border with Mexico."

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/24/most-america...




Don't believe everything you think....
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 03:17 PM


As a former Marine Lee one would think you would respect the office? Hmm you might be a POG , but will never know for sure. So i listen to your choice for eight years, never really liked anything he did, but I lived with it. So before this gets any more fun I will say have a great day.
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 03:59 PM


Are marines expected to respect a position regardless of the qualities of the person who holds it?

Blind obedience or thoughtful evaluation with a pinch of critical thinking?




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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 04:04 PM


As a grunt you forfeit all gray matter.
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 04:46 PM


Quote: Originally posted by chippy  
As a grunt you forfeit all gray matter.


Careful how you use the term 'Grunt'. I was one, but Army Airborne Infantry. We were taught our 'rules of engagement', i.e. the President is our CIC and we are at his disposal, but also taught how and when to refuse a direct order if we felt it was an affront to Military Justice rules. The Marine Corps, not so much. I applaud Lee in standing up to such an embarrassment. Show me something worth respecting, and I will. Show me someone worth following and I will. I haven't felt this 'Anti' since Tricky Richard, who almost cost me my life... and tRump, well..... sign up your kids and grandkids for the next major fiasco. And yes, Nixon WAS in on the ground floor for my experience when he was a VP that got us into that mess. The next (soonest and WORST) one will be short coming. Don't like my attitude? Well, do something about it. ENLIST YOUR FAMILY; good for jobs eh? Tired of winning yet?




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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 04:54 PM


Speaking of grunts, this week Ken Burn's Vietnam has been playing on PBS. It should be required watching for all teenagers tempted to sign up as pawns and canon fodder for usa military and egotistical politicians.



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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 07:06 PM


The Wall at the Empire Dunes is ugly...Tear down the Wall!
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 07:30 PM


WoW, You guys need a life, that was embarasin, as Joe Pesci would say
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[*] posted on 9-22-2017 at 10:20 PM


Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Speaking of grunts, this week Ken Burn's Vietnam has been playing on PBS. It should be required watching for all teenagers tempted to sign up as pawns and canon fodder for usa military and egotistical politicians.


So should "Tail Gunner Joe" starring Peter Boyle. Funny, I can't find a single source to buy this movie on ANY format. Go figger. Should be required high school and collegiate level of any curriculum.




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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 09:24 AM


Watch it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxYm02O-Ycs

Download it with Clipgrab and store file....

[Edited on 9-23-2017 by motoged]




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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 11:02 AM


1. Net immigration has been falling anyway--the last recession put a damper on it too.
2. Simply enforcing existing labor laws would have a further deterrent. For example, in Palacios, TX, a shrimping industry town, has been hit hard by labor shortages since Trump enforced immigration visa laws in that town. BTW, hardly any American citizens are showing up to replace the workers on the shrimp boats, even as wages have been raised higher to attract people.
3. It costs at least $7,500 to get a coyote to run you from TJ to past the San Clemente checkpoint--that is a huge deterrent to keeping people from returning back to Mexico, in that regard better borders make folks want to stay up here a lot longer.
4. A majority of Texas landowners, mainly ranchers and ag, and likely conservative, are against the border wall there. They've had a mutually beneficial and friendly relationship with their southern neighbors and feel its a slap in the face to them to put up a wall.
5. It will likely double in price when done--isn't that money better spent fixing infrastrucure that we all use and makes for a more efficient economy?
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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 11:21 AM


Quote: Originally posted by Mexitron  
1. Net immigration has been falling anyway--the last recession put a damper on it too.
2. Simply enforcing existing labor laws would have a further deterrent. For example, in Palacios, TX, a shrimping industry town, has been hit hard by labor shortages since Trump enforced immigration visa laws in that town. BTW, hardly any American citizens are showing up to replace the workers on the shrimp boats, even as wages have been raised higher to attract people.
3. It costs at least $7,500 to get a coyote to run you from TJ to past the San Clemente checkpoint--that is a huge deterrent to keeping people from returning back to Mexico, in that regard better borders make folks want to stay up here a lot longer.
4. A majority of Texas landowners, mainly ranchers and ag, and likely conservative, are against the border wall there. They've had a mutually beneficial and friendly relationship with their southern neighbors and feel its a slap in the face to them to put up a wall.
5. It will likely double in price when done--isn't that money better spent fixing infrastrucure that we all use and makes for a more efficient economy?


Dude! There you go again be all sensible and what not. :D
The wall is a waste of money. IMEO. :smug:




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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 03:50 PM


Would someone kindly define what attributes constitute a sovereign nation ?



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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 04:13 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Cliffy  
Would someone kindly define what attributes constitute a sovereign nation ?


It's a nation ruled by a monarch or some kind of supreme ruler. Sovereignty doesn't apply to the United States.

I love these new browsers where all you have to do is double click the word and the definition pops up. :D

[Edited on 9-23-2017 by SFandH]




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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 04:18 PM


sov·er·eign·ty


/ˈsäv(ə)rən(t)ē/


noun

noun: sovereignty




supreme power or authority.


synonyms: jurisdiction, rule, supremacy, dominion, power, ascendancy, suzerainty, hegemony, domination, authority, control, influence
"their sovereignty over the islands"




•the authority of a state to govern itself or another state.
"national sovereignty"


synonyms: autonomy, independence, self-government, self-rule, home rule, self-determination, freedom
"the colony demanded full sovereignty"




•a self-governing state.
plural noun: sovereignties





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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 04:21 PM


Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Quote: Originally posted by Cliffy  
Would someone kindly define what attributes constitute a sovereign nation ?


It's a nation ruled by a monarch or some kind of supreme ruler. Sovereignty doesn't apply to the United States.




Really? Doesn't apply to the US? "I'm embarrassed for you that you made that comment.

[Edited on 9-23-2017 by DENNIS]




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[*] posted on 9-23-2017 at 04:33 PM


Not really, a sovereign is a monarch or supreme leader. The United States is not ruled by a sovereign.



[Edited on 9-23-2017 by SFandH]




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[*] posted on 9-24-2017 at 10:19 AM


One thing for sure he knows how to shake things us and stir the pot.

We live in exciting times, rioting in the streets, nuclear war maybe, NFL players on the POTUS firing list, will we build or not build the wall. One wonders what will be next.
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[*] posted on 9-24-2017 at 02:45 PM


I've been to Guatemalan border with Mexico several times. It's either very mountainous terrain like in the Chiapas highlands where I just ambled across the border in the Lagunas de Monte Bello national park or lowland jungle along the Río Usumacinta or Río Suchiate. It's only where the Pan-American Highway crosses the border at Tapachula that provides any kind of less than very difficult crossing There's a bridge at Tapachula, but illegals cross the river in boats.

Building a wall is totally out of the question because of dense jungle and lack of roads. Problems are increasing in the Tapachula area, and Mexico is trying to restrict the flow of illegal immigrants, not just from Guatemala, but also from Central and South American, Cuba, Haiti, and even Africa and the Middle East. Most of it is headed toward the US. With the US border more difficult to cross the illegal population becomes Mexico's problem. Cubans and Haitian no longer get automatic entry into the US.
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