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Author: Subject: The Fight for San Quintin Bay
fishbuck
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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 02:29 PM
The Fight for San Quintin Bay


Another slick PR piece regarding the bay.
Very informative and well done.
You be the judge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luYfDROR9Q

[Edited on 11-6-2017 by fishbuck]




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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 04:39 PM


So, all the land parcels in Pedregal are illegal?

Fishbuck, didnt you own in there?

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fishbuck
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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 04:51 PM


:?:



"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for." J. A. Shedd.

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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 05:29 PM


This is exactly why you pay Title Companies.
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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 05:30 PM


That is an interesting bit of historical [facts] about the San Quintin Valley.

Good thing that La Chorera is (or was) not included in the original Orendain land grab.




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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 05:39 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Pfish  
This is exactly why you pay Title Companies.


How would that help?
I've seen the titles. They either have Orendains name or the residents who have bought land there. The title transfers have never been challenged.
The titles are public record viewable online.

[Edited on 11-7-2017 by fishbuck]




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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 05:46 PM


All of that and they couldn't put a voice over on it? Terrible.

They could have gone to fiverr.com and got someone to do it for about $50.


[Edited on 11-7-2017 by JZ]
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fishbuck
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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 06:17 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Pfish  
This is exactly why you pay Title Companies.


That is a good idea. Thanks
I may take this youtube to the best title company in baja and have them run this down.
I'm sure by now they all know about this.
Who is the best?




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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 06:20 PM


Seems bout par for the course.......


Vary interesting video. Thanks for posting....
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[*] posted on 11-6-2017 at 11:29 PM


That was a cool video.

Can't understand the thinking of this group http://terrapeninsular.org/

Selling land that doesn't belong to you... in the 21st century.
In Mexico, go figure.
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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 07:11 AM


Fascinating, reads like a novel, lots of intrigues...BUT even with all of the decisions over the years, the beat goes on....Land sales continue on land with clouded titles, fisherman still have no access...Like many of these things it hasn't reached a conclusion...



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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 07:25 AM


As ever in Mexico, what good are laws without some means of enforcement?

It's simply incredible how long direct findings, from THE Federal land authority, were ignored and went unenforced.

Seems like a slam dunk for the fishermen, now, but who knows? This is Mexico.
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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 07:27 AM


Quote: Originally posted by fishbuck  
Another slick PR piece regarding the bay.
Very informative and well done.
You be the judge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luYfDROR9Q

[Edited on 11-6-2017 by fishbuck]


That’s just TalkBaja’s spin of the story.

Why don’t you post the TerraPenninsula side of the story?

One side wants to pave paradise and make a quick buck selling real estate. The other side wants to protect natural environment. Who would you like to see win?




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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 08:21 AM


Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by fishbuck  
Another slick PR piece regarding the bay.
Very informative and well done.
You be the judge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luYfDROR9Q

[Edited on 11-6-2017 by fishbuck]


That’s just TalkBaja’s spin of the story.

Why don’t you post the TerraPenninsula side of the story?

One side wants to pave paradise and make a quick buck selling real estate. The other side wants to protect natural environment. Who would you like to see win?


No Goat - that is not TalkBaja's side of the story - it is the fishermen's side of the story, including actual documentation and evidence to back up their side of the story. Terra told their side of the story with a hit piece done by a friendly journalist that made only allegations (proved false by the documented evidence of the video) and included ZERO evidence to support any of their claims. Not a single piece of evidence.

And for your information, the only one who was interested in paving paradise was Rafael Orendain. These same fishermen are the ones who lead the fight to stop him and his development company Crola all these decades when Terra peninsular was nowhere to be found. They lead and paid for that fight with their own money, often having community meetings where everyone would empty out their pockets just to pay the consulting biologist or attorney fees.

These fishermen still operate their commercial fishing operations inside and around the bay and have no interest in seeing any development that would do anything to harm the bay.

Instead of just throwing out unfounded, baseless allegations as Terra continues to do, take some time and investigate the real story behind all of this. If you take the time to do so it will likely change your mind.

Luis Maria Aguilar Morales did take that time to study the more than half century of history of the case and he along with the other 2 federal magistrates voted unanimously to overturn Orendain's injunction appeal and ordered the titles be issued to the fishermen.

Today, Luis Maria Aguilar Morales sits on the Mexican Supreme Court and is now the Chief Justice of that court.

No matter what happens with Terra's current injunction request in an Ensenada court (reportedly not going well), the fishermen are willing to push the issue all the way to the supreme court. Based on 2 of their sitting members decisions involved with this case's history, I don't suspect that will go well for Terra...





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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 08:49 AM


Thanks Baja Gringo!
I noticed the usual interesting comments by some people with out much knowledge of the situation.
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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 11:03 AM


Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by fishbuck  
Another slick PR piece regarding the bay.
Very informative and well done.
You be the judge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luYfDROR9Q

[Edited on 11-6-2017 by fishbuck]


That’s just TalkBaja’s spin of the story.

Why don’t you post the TerraPenninsula side of the story?

One side wants to pave paradise and make a quick buck selling real estate. The other side wants to protect natural environment. Who would you like to see win?


Yeah, because fishermen are such notorious land developers.

OH WAIT! :rolleyes:

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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 11:21 AM


Basic fact that must be dealt with in all aspects of life in Mexico since the revolution:
Only 6th grade educations and no such thing as a contract.
Its not about the law, its always about leverage and the maintaining of it.





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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 01:23 PM


Quote: Originally posted by BajaGringo  

These fishermen still operate their commercial fishing operations inside and around the bay and have no interest in seeing any development that would do anything to harm the bay.


but development will harm the land. every developer will tell you their real estate development will not harm the bay. i have never seen development in baja (or anywhere) that did not impact the adjacent waters.

it's a beautiful area, would be a shame to see it developed, which WILL happen if it goes back to unprotected status :no::no:

i do not profess to know the legal arguments. I just hope for preservation to win.




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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 01:26 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Hook  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by fishbuck  
Another slick PR piece regarding the bay.
Very informative and well done.
You be the judge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luYfDROR9Q

[Edited on 11-6-2017 by fishbuck]


That’s just TalkBaja’s spin of the story.

Why don’t you post the TerraPenninsula side of the story?

One side wants to pave paradise and make a quick buck selling real estate. The other side wants to protect natural environment. Who would you like to see win?


Yeah, because fishermen are such notorious land developers.



yep.
the story has been repeated in baja many, many times. when land becomes valuable, land owners cash in, and another natural area becomes unnatural.




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[*] posted on 11-7-2017 at 01:47 PM


Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by BajaGringo  

These fishermen still operate their commercial fishing operations inside and around the bay and have no interest in seeing any development that would do anything to harm the bay.


but development will harm the land. every developer will tell you their real estate development will not harm the bay. i have never seen development in baja (or anywhere) that did not impact the adjacent waters.

it's a beautiful area, would be a shame to see it developed, which WILL happen if it goes back to unprotected status :no::no:

i do not profess to know the legal arguments. I just hope for preservation to win.


Time does not stand still goat. I think fondly of when I was a child and hoped to personally drive to the tip of Baja on the same road as my parents did.

In 1973 (the year I turned 16), they constructed and paved the final 300 miles (San Quintin-San Ignacio) of highway... in a way, destroying the 'natural' environment of the central Baja desert (and bulldozing flat, millions of cardon, cirio, and other species of native Baja vegetation and animal habitat. Yet, I never hear complaints from environmentalists about paving roads (where they want to drive their cars).

Progress happens, and just because your pet area gets developed doesn't make it any more wrong than if it were someone else's.




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