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Gypsy Jan
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4275
Registered: 1-27-2004
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Mood: Depends on which way the wind is blowing
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Life in Baja; another voice heard from
OK. I'm a gringo,
but I've been living full time in the Rosarito area for a while.
Yes, we have been burgled (home invasion) more than once.
Since then, we thought out procedures for securing things and put protection in place (dogs, housesitters and just being careful about locking up and
not leaving attractive items lying around in plain view, etc.) and have not had further problems.
In regards to everyday life in Baja, I feel more connected and protected here than anyplace that I have lived in the U.S.
Recent examples:
Pemex: I gassed up in Ensenada and gave the attendant 600 pesos, based on the reading on the pump. He came back and gave me 200 pesos back, saying
that I had overpaid. I knew this wasn't correct and waited while he had a dialogue with the cashier.
Example #2, Pemex at the toll booth in Rosarito: It was about 11:00 pm on a weeknight, I needed cash, parked at the AM PM to use the teller, the
place was well lit, with guards and helpful employees. After I gassed up, I misread the pump, and gave the attendant 200 pesos too much. He brought
the overpayment back to me with my change.
Both of these encounters happened in the last two weeks.
I have much more; a treasure trove of stories that I have accumulated over the years about the honesty and integrity of the people of Baja Norte that
I cherish and bring out as often as I can (without boring the listener to tears) to illustrate that there is more than one aspect of this wonderful
place.
But, life here is exceedingly complex and multi-layered and is getting more so. Rural is rubbing up against increasing development.
There are the urban crimanal vultures cruise the highway and have laptops that can decode an electronic entry code to open up a prize SUV and drive
away with its contents alongside the local indegenous opportunist who sees an open car window or tries an open gate or house door and snatches what he
can.
Baja is what it is and it is changing and the change is accelerating.
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Mood: Inquisitive
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"Yes, we have been burgled (home invasion) more than once.......In regards to everyday life in Baja, I feel more connected and protected here than
anyplace that I have lived in the U.S."
This begs the question....just where DID you live in the States that you feel safer in Rosarito after AT LEAST two home invasion robberies?
Not sure if crime rates in Mexico are published (or can be believed) but crime in the US, especially big cities, has generally been dropping for the
last 10 years or so, especially violent crime.
I still plan on spending my retirement in Mexico, so don't think of me as a naysayer of Mexico. It's just that there are still many, many safe
communities in the US.
The legal robber barons like Enron, Big Oil and the State of California have cost me much more than the criminals.
Couldn't agree with you more about the collision of urban vs rural going on in Baja Norte.
The times, they are a'changin'.......
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BajaVida
Senior Nomad
Posts: 541
Registered: 9-1-2003
Location: Motown, Califas
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Mood: muy cool
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and you believe US crime statistics?
things are a lot worse here (and there) than they used to be
many immigrants are reluctant to report crime
No se apure y dure.
Don\'t hurry and you\'ll last longer.
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
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Mood: Just dancing through life
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Gypsy
I believe that you are talking about people just entering your home and taking a few things--Not home invasion which is the armed--forced entry with
the owners or others preesent--you know, like with a gun to your nose.
After having been a cop in San Diego for over 25 years I can tell you I always felt safer in Baja (forget TJ) than in the States. --Had a home there
for over 26 years--small campo.
I really believe that most large departments are not really reporting most of the crime brought to their attention. You are lucky to have a unit
dispatched to investigate a burglary (home invasion--yes).
Just a few weeks ago a report out of L.A. advised that investigating burglaries in Brentwood, Hollywood, and other exclusive areas were delayed at
least 8 hours even where the loss exceedded $10,000.oo--not pesos. Imagine what kind of service the poorer folk will receive.
If they report all crime then we think they are doing a bad job---not reporting allows them to slide.
Hook--Ask the Mexicans what they think of Pemex, Mexican Banks,and Telnor. The others you mentioned have a way of reaching us wherever we are.
Retirement (assuming good health) in Baja beats the hell out of being warehoused in a Senior Citizen place in the States.
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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Germanicus
Nomad
Posts: 214
Registered: 6-13-2004
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This topic reminds me very much of the
topic, although two things are very different here.
1. In this topic I see very honest people.
Stating how it really is in the U.S. talking crime.
2. Even with no gun handy, everybody who posted here feels much safer in Baja than in the U.S.
VIVA BAJA MEXICO !!!
That burglary accurs in Baja? Well, is there any place in the world where it doesn't?
Maybe my opinion is strange, but I say:
Better some china taken out of my house, than my life taken by a
gun-loving-street-gang.
I can protect my home and make it burglary-safe.
I can not protect my life against a killer.
Again: VIVA BAJA MEXICO !
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
Registered: 8-31-2003
Location: Sunset Beach
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Mood: Just dancing through life
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Germanicus
I am totally losing it! This is the first time I have agreed with you and this agreement is BIG TIME--you nailed it.
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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Arthur
Nomad
Posts: 232
Registered: 10-2-2003
Location: San Anselmo, CA
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So, Gypsy, was Bernie right -- you weren't talking about home invasions? That's a different kettle o' fish altogether.
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Gypsy Jan
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4275
Registered: 1-27-2004
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Mood: Depends on which way the wind is blowing
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Bernie is a cop
and I defer to his experience and definition of what the crime is.
The investigators, local police and the insurance investigators referred to our incident as home invasion, telling us that there was a gang of armed
thieves operating in the area initiating a series of attacks by either following people back to their residences, or laying in wait or breaking in
while the occupants were there.
We were in the latter category, and, say what you will about Mexico, but our Mexican property insurance company did reimburse for our losses.
It helped (and saved the day) that we had a detailed inventory on file with video. The Mexico City office sent out a representative to verify the
story, checking our police report. It took some time, but they did follow through.
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow mindedness.”
—Mark Twain
\"La vida es dura, el corazon es puro, y cantamos hasta la madrugada.” (Life is hard, the heart is pure and we sing until dawn.)
—Kirsty MacColl, Mambo de la Luna
\"Alea iacta est.\"
—Julius Caesar
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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Reply to Germanicus
I posted on this subject before, and I can tell you that I DO NOT feel safer in Baja than in the USA.
Even tho I have never had any crime problems either in the USA or in Baja, I do not feel as secure in Baja as in the USA, period. The main reason is
the difference in the laws, and the inability to protect myself in Baja, unlike while in the USA.
We owned a house on the cliffs above the sea, north of Rosarito at Punta Banderas, for 12 years----never had any problems. Sold it for a huge profit
25 years ago. (think what it would be worth today)
I have been going to Baja for 55 years. I deffinitely feel LESS secure in Baja these days, than in the past. Baja has changed drastically, or so it
seems to me, and is no longer as safe as it was.
I lived in Southern CA for 43 years, elsewhere for the past 20 years. I am a retired cop/special agent after 30 years on the job.
Still, after saying all this, I still love Baja, and go there fairly often, both to camp, and to stay in hotels in La Paz. (mostly camp and explore
away from any civilization). Barry
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terrybird
Junior Nomad
Posts: 37
Registered: 2-6-2005
Location: South of Minneapolis, MN
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Maybe we should all move to North Dakota? ND people are the friendiest hardest working people in the States. Land is cheap and houses are even
cheaper and, if the Indians get those wind towers done electricity will be free! Friend bought a 3bed with a little land for 10 grand last year.
Crime? of course not silly. We could vacation in Canada and if they are a problem we could invade.
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JESSE
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 3370
Registered: 11-5-2002
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Safety in Baja has a lot to do with:
1.-Where you live
2.-Your attitude
If you live near a bunch of poor Mexicans and have nice things in your property, you are asking for it. And if you are not well liked by your Mexican
neighboors because of your attitude, that might also get you into trouble.
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Mexray
Super Nomad
Posts: 1016
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: California Delta
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Mood: Baja Time
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Pompano....
I find it ironic that your casa was robbed by a bandito from that wild, Nor-Cal, 'Cow Town' - Vacaville!
A few years back, as the reigning prez of the Calif-Delta Chambers (small group of biz people in the Delta River area), I was running our annual
'Moo-B-Q' fund raiser.
As part of the event, I put the bite on a dairy farmer friend and borrowed a huge dairy cow to stroll around a fenced-in part of the lawn. I'd marked
said lawn in a grid like fashion. Numbers were assigned to each small grid, and one could buy 'chances' as to which square the cow would, em',
provide a cow-patty on! You guessed it - the 'winner' was from Vacaville!
I probably would have made more money with a 'photo-op' booth. That dairy cow was BIG, and many people hadn't been so close up and personal with one
before...they all wanted to take pictures next to the cow!
According to my clock...anytime is \'BAJA TIME\' & as Jimmy Buffett says,
\"It doesn\'t use numbers or moving hands It always just says now...\"
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tim40
Senior Nomad
Posts: 574
Registered: 3-29-2004
Location: Manhattan Beach
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Mood: There yet?
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Less the extremes, I could not agree more, that safety is largely influenced by how you approach life. I have been in some of the roughest
neighberhoods in several places (New Orleans projects and east LA as but 2 examples). In each case, because of my approach and respect for the
people, I was not only welcomed, but looked after as well. Yes, the random acts will still occur at a greater frequency, but as far as the
neighberhood treating you poorly, I have actually found the opposite to be true.
The only place I have ever been robbed was in Lima, Peru (all of my travel money was taken), but I still consider that trip to be one of the best
ever....
[Edited on 3-13-2005 by tim40]
When searching for the end of your rainbow you only have until dusk....
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Dave
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6005
Registered: 11-5-2002
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| Quote: | Originally posted by JESSE
If you live near a bunch of poor Mexicans and have nice things in your property, you are asking for it. And if you are not well liked by your Mexican
neighboors because of your attitude, that might also get you into trouble. |
At best, that's pretty unflattering.
What you are saying is that poor Mexicans can't resist the temptation to steal and that angered Mexicans steal out of spite.
My experience has been:
Regardless of economic hardship, an honest person would never steal and a thief (Mexican/American, rich/poor) will take advantage of any opportunity.
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Baja Bernie
`Normal` Nomad Correspondent
Posts: 2962
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Location: Sunset Beach
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Dave
On your side on this---The poorer the Mexican the more honest --it has always seemed to me--More than Gringos if you are friendly and helpful they
always respond in kind--Thus my saying developed after a whole bunch of years---BAJA IS ABOUT PEOPLE HELPING PEOPLE.
My smidgen of a claim to fame is that I have had so many really good friends. By Bernie Swaim December 2007
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Cyndarouh
Nomad
Posts: 237
Registered: 6-21-2004
Location: San Diego Mountains
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Dave Y Bernie,
I couldn't agree any more if I tried.
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Braulio
Nomad
Posts: 321
Registered: 11-7-2002
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My experience in Mexico is about the same as Jesse's - it seems what a lot of the people (maybe Dave excluded) is that Baja is pretty safe - as long
as your in an area without many people.
These comparisons always seem kind of silly to me - the differences in crime within each country (and that includes Germany) are much greater than the
differences between the countries taken as a whole. You've got to know where you're at.
As far as meaningful comparisons of crime statistics between countries I made a concerted effort to find some - it's tough - and not just because
governments are dishonest (which they are) - there's variation in basic definitions and data gathering techiniques etc. The best I was able to come up
with was a study that came out of UNESCO (or some other UN deal) in the early 90's. Long story short violent crime including murder in Mexico was
about double that of the US. (I'll reference if there's interest.) Since that time violent crime in Mexico has increased - and decreased in the US.
But again - that's nationwide - it really has very little relevance to where you're at at any given moment.
For me - I take a walk every night in the US after about 10pm - I wouldn't dream of doing that in any mid/big sized city in Mexico.
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bajalou
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4459
Registered: 3-11-2004
Location: South of the broder
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In all of our desire to help local Mexcian people we must be very careful not to be patronising of them and not take away their dignity. Some have
very little material things but they must retain their pride.
No Bad Days
\"Never argue with an idiot. People watching may not be able to tell the difference\"
\"The trouble with doing nothing is - how do I know when I\'m done?\"
Nomad Baja Interactive map
And in the San Felipe area - check out Valle Chico area |
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Hook
Elite Nomad
Posts: 9006
Registered: 3-13-2004
Location: Sonora
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Exclude urban areas.....
......in both Baja and California, and I think it's all a pretty low crime area. But maybe what Gypsy Jan is experiencing is the transition of
Rosarito into the urban category.
BTW, it appears that her home invasion experience was the bad type; not simply burglary.
Probably the most chilling info in this post is the ex-cops admitting that crime stats can be dickered with so readily.
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Barry A.
Select Nomad
Posts: 10007
Registered: 11-30-2003
Location: Redding, Northern CA
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Mood: optimistic
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TO POMPANO
Beautifully stated-----and so true!!!! Thanks for your inspiring post----great stuff!!!! Barry
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