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SFandH
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6924
Registered: 8-5-2011
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Quote: Originally posted by BajaMama  | | Once you know the law I feel it is disrespectful to intentionally disobey it (well, except for speeding....). |
Ever smoke pot when you were younger?
And if you live in Colorado, don't keep a couch on your porch.
https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/news/g4039/crazy-state...
But, I agree FMMs should be obtained; however, I'll cut some slack for day/weekend trippers to the border region.
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TedZark
Nomad
Posts: 171
Registered: 10-31-2014
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Yeah, daytripping may be a different animal. If you are on foot, shopping and eating, a different story. That's day tourism, something they want to
promote and not discourage.
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Paco Facullo
Super Nomad
Posts: 1301
Registered: 1-21-2017
Location: Here now
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Mood: Abiding ..........
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I can see it now , the entitled arrogant Gringo gets beaten down by the Foreign Cop as he yells "I HAVE RIGHTS ! I HAVE RIGHTS !
Since I've given up all hope, I feel much better
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
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Mood: Mad as hell
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| Quote: Originally posted by Paco Facullo | | I can see it now , the entitled arrogant Gringo gets beaten down by the Foreign Cop as he yells "I HAVE RIGHTS ! I HAVE RIGHTS !
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I read all the time where Gringos, claims they stand up to corrupt Mexican cops looking for a bribe. Why would they do this if they didn't have
Constitutional rights to first see a judge and not pay the corrupt Mexican cop on the spot?
Of course, I don't believe all these claims of standing up to the corrupt cops, where if I was keeping score, the corrupt Mexican cops, get nothing
about 95% of the time.
What really that probably happens is many of those gringos, pee in their pants, and offer a bribe before the Mexican cop ask for a bribe, because the
corrupt cops can't lose all the time.
But again I ask, if you really don't believe you have rights in Mexico, why would you fight a corrupt Mexican cop asking for a bribe?
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MrBillM
Platinum Nomad
Posts: 21656
Registered: 8-20-2003
Location: Out and About
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Mood: It's a Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah Day
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What's the COUNT ?
Over the last decade (and longer) on this forum, how many "blah, blah, blah" threads have been generated and debated regarding the "should/should not"
question of following Mexican immigration law ?
Informing (and changing) nothing. Including minds.
Do as you like, enjoy the benefits and accept the consequences without whining.
Personally, I never ignored any law or performed any misdeed that I didn't think Mordida wouldn't solve.
Well .......................... except (for many years) packing a (well-concealed) pistol.
[Edited on 5-12-2019 by MrBillM]
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
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Mood: Mad as hell
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Over at "Talk Baja" they have another FMM topic thread going, where Danielle, says her husband walked legally over the border, showed his passport,
and was not required to fill out a FMM, which is also my experience about 60 percent when crossing the border by foot.
Of course, you have other members like Alfred, who tells Danielle, that if her husband doesn't get that FMM, he is in the country illegally.
Then you get my favorite myth, that if you don't get a FMM and get into an accident, that the insurance company will not pay and you will go to jail!
You can always find a lot of wrong information on "Baja forums and Facebook group sites.
I also assume that Danielle, is a white American woman, because most Mexican/Latina, women, would not let their husbands cross the border by
themselves.
___________
From Talk Baja:
Danielle wrote: Interestingly, my husband walked over the border at San Ysidro yesterday, and unlike the previous two times he walked across
the border, he did not have to fill out an FMM this time. There was also a new bridge that wasn't there last time he crossed, about 6 weeks
ago.
_____________________
Alfred wrote: if he doesn’t have Temporary or Permanent status he’s in country illegally. Have to find INM to get the FMM form if agents
aren’t readily available at the walkway.
_____________
Danielle wrote: no, he entered completely legally, showed his Passport to the officials at the border, coming and going, including the same
INM people who required the FMM last time, and did not this time.
___________________
Danielle wrote: I'm well aware of that. And in fact, up until about 6 months ago, he had never had to fill out an FMM when crossing by foot.
With this new inspection of cars going South I was simply noting that enforcement is inconsistent, no matter how you cross.
___________
William wrote: Yes, crossing by foot, they will sometimes ask if you're there for more than a day, and have you fill out a FMM. Sometimes they
just make you no matter. But, I'm there quite a bit on the daily without filling out an FMM. Not a big deal.
_____________
Jerry wrote: It is all security theater. If you do not have the FMM, exactly nothing is going to happen to you in the VERY unlikely event that
you encounter immigration and they ask for it...
______
Jay wrote: I have a friend that is a Cop that works the Wine country. He told me you don't need a FMM in TJ to Ensenada and the Tecate area. I
did get one to go to San Ignacio though.
____________
Peter wrote: your friend is wrong, or just arrogant
____________
Jay wrote: What happen to the free zone?
__________
Kirk wrote: you have needed an FMM since jan q1, 20qt5. what will happen is if you get in a car accident without an FMM is your mexican car
insurance (if you even have it) will use it as an excuse not to cover you and you'll at least have to pay $$$$ and probably go to jail.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Before I add to my current trip report, let me tell you about Mexicali West this past Monday. Walked into the new, large building on the left and used
my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon exiting Mexico. The 180 day FMM does not need to be
returned. This is the same deal for the last 4+ years.
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sancho
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2524
Registered: 10-6-2004
Location: OC So Cal
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Walked into the new, large building on the left and used my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon
exiting Mexico |
Going to SF in a couple weeks, was a post here a few weeks
back, a guy crossing with a group, Mexicali West, East, can't remember which, was refused 7 day fmm's, had to get the 180,
Imm may have seen a chance for $200+ dlls. who knows,
claimed you have to go internet for the 7 day. Going to take
an internet 7 day as a back up. Haven't crossed Mexicali West
since the new crossing. DK. what blvd. did you use to get
over to Mex Hwy 5 to drive so. toward San Felipe? and did you
come back the Mex West? Thanks for your time
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: Originally posted by sancho | | Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Walked into the new, large building on the left and used my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon
exiting Mexico |
Going to SF in a couple weeks, was a post here a few weeks
back, a guy crossing with a group, Mexicali West, East, can't remember which, was refused 7 day fmm's, had to get the 180,
Imm may have seen a chance for $200+ dlls. who knows,
claimed you have to go internet for the 7 day. Going to take
an internet 7 day as a back up. Haven't crossed Mexicali West
since the new crossing. DK. what blvd. did you use to get
over to Mex Hwy 5 to drive so. toward San Felipe? and did you
come back the Mex West? Thanks for your time
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Hi Sancho,
There was no question or comment about 180 day vs. 7 day one from the officer. I think it was me who first asked for a 7-day free one of the group
that walked into INM for them. Some in the group didn't get one, perhaps because they still had a valid 180-day one?
For the pay one, the officer took the money, as well. The big bank counter was unmanned in the building.
As for the new route to Hwy. 5 from the new border: I was hoping Cameron would use the new route, but at the Tijuana highway access some distance
south of the border, he turned left and joined the original route (it joined at the bridge). Maybe he knows the rest of the new route south is
confusing and this way is faster? He did have a slick route from Hwy. 98 to the new border that misses all of Calexico!
When I download my photos onto Photobucket.com or PostImages.org (sized to fit Nomad's width of 800 pixels so Doug doesn't have to fix them as he
still does for a couple of Nomads who still can't seem to size all of their photos for here), I will show you the photos I took of the intersections
Cameron took.
On the way north, we used Mexicali East and I also took photos along that route where we followed Ken and Donna of Bulletproof Diesel, who had an easy
way (turn right at the Kenworth) before the RR track traffic circle. I took photos along that route, too!
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Bajazly
Senior Nomad
Posts: 991
Registered: 6-4-2015
Location: Goodbye Cali and Hello San Felipe
Member Is Offline
Mood: More Relaxed Everyday
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Before I add to my current trip report, let me tell you about Mexicali West this past Monday. Walked into the new, large building on the left and used
my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon exiting Mexico. The 180 day FMM does not need to be
returned. This is the same deal for the last 4+ years. |
Go figure. I was there 2 weeks ago, very same building, and my buddy was getting his FMM, I already had one. While the guy was filling out my buddies
I asked him, do the 7 day FMM's need to be returned and he kind of shrugged and said, there is not really any way to do that senior...
So David, how did you return yours?
Believing is religion - Knowing is science
Harald Pietschmann
"Get off the beaten path and memories, friends and new techniques are developed"
Bajazly, August 2019
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bajazly | | Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Before I add to my current trip report, let me tell you about Mexicali West this past Monday. Walked into the new, large building on the left and used
my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon exiting Mexico. The 180 day FMM does not need to be
returned. This is the same deal for the last 4+ years. |
Go figure. I was there 2 weeks ago, very same building, and my buddy was getting his FMM, I already had one. While the guy was filling out my buddies
I asked him, do the 7 day FMM's need to be returned and he kind of shrugged and said, there is not really any way to do that senior...
So David, how did you return yours? |
None of us who got the free ones did.
Being a passenger in someone else's vehicle... actually 5 trucks northbound here... it was not an option to go across town, look for a way to get to
the southbound border gate, then go back several blocks and get into the line, detouring several miles with everyone in a hurry to get home.
The Mexican INM department has a collection system for them at airports as you board, so they need to have a drop box you can access from the driver's
window, northbound... if they really want them back badly enough. When I last got a 180 day FMM, I asked that officer about the returning part of a
7-day one. His responce was you are supposed to but it would be okay not to, as well!
My wife and I returned them at Tecate the one and only time I got them before, just to see how the process worked and post it here on Nomad. Tecate is
not too hard to drive to the INM office from inside Mexico... still several blocks out of the way, though.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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| Quote: Originally posted by sancho | | Quote: Originally posted by David K | | Walked into the new, large building on the left and used my passport card for a free 7 day FMM. The officer stressed that it must be returned upon
exiting Mexico |
Going to SF in a couple weeks, was a post here a few weeks
back, a guy crossing with a group, Mexicali West, East, can't remember which, was refused 7 day fmm's, had to get the 180,
Imm may have seen a chance for $200+ dlls. who knows,
claimed you have to go internet for the 7 day. Going to take
an internet 7 day as a back up. Haven't crossed Mexicali West
since the new crossing. DK. what blvd. did you use to get
over to Mex Hwy 5 to drive so. toward San Felipe? and did you
come back the Mex West? Thanks for your time
|
Mexicali West southbound route: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=92781
[Edited on 5-19-2019 by David K]
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mad as hell
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Ron, over at "Talk Baja" is threatening of censorship, and banning members, if they dare to share their experience of visiting Mexico/Baja, without
getting a FMM tourist card.
Of course, "Talk Baja" takes themselves too seriously and thinks most of their members turn to the Baja group site, to get all their information about
Mexico. You would have to be a retard, to follow the advice of any one member without cross referencing the information with official sites, airlines,
and other people that you actually know.
There is also the fact although officially Mexico, says you need both a passport, and FMM, to visit Mexico, even for one day, and US customs, says the
same thing, that you need a passport or passcard to visit Mexico, and return to the US through customs.
There is the fact, Mexico has no procedures in place to check all cars coming in through the border to enforce all foreigners get a FMM, so most
people coming in for a day trip to Baja, do not bother to get a FMM, and Mexican officials don't seem to care.
On the US side, many people return to the US armed only with their drivers license, and birth certificate, and US Customs, lets them right in without
a hassle. When I walk in as a pedestrian and tell them my trip will be brief, more than 60% of the time they hand me back my passport, and let me
right in without a FMM.
So I will continue to advise anyone without a passport and who wants to visit Baja that it's still possible to do so with no problems. Not everybody
has a passport for various legal or financial reasons.
_________________________
From the heavily censored "Talk Baja"
Tourist Cards (FMM) - Mexican Immigration Law For the last time...
Mexican immigration law has changed a few times in recent years and many frequent travelers to Baja seem to hold some misconceptions about what the
current law requires for tourists entering Mexico.
Who needs to obtain n FMM?
EVERY SINGLE TOURIST from the US or Canada who comes into Mexico, be it by land, sea or air AND no matter how long their stay in Mexico, be it for a
day or 6 months.
TOURIST CARD (FMM) FACTS:
The FMM is a document issued by Mexico's INM (Instituto Nacional de Migración aka INM)
Casually called a tourist card or tourist "visa" although it is not officially a visa
Issued to U.S., Canadian and other nationalities for vacation purposes
Easily obtained at an INM office at the border or online (online still requires a stop at INM at the border for the official stamp).
Requires a valid passport or passport card
The stamped FMM is valid for land travel throughout Mexico
Cost as of January 2017, $558 Pesos (appx U.S. $28) per person; FREE if the trip is 7 days or less and you cross by land
May be issued for up to 180 days
This group is widely used as an online source for tourists seeking information concerning travel to the Baja California peninsula.
For that reason, any posts or comments recommending that people should just skirt Mexican immigration law and avoid obtaining the legally required FMM
Tourist Card will be deleted.
Repeat offenders will be removed from the group.
Thanks...
[Edited on 6-23-2019 by JoeJustJoe]
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Sounds correct from Talk Baja.
Because they do not check every vehicle entering Mexico does not mean it is okay to not do what the Mexican government asks.
It is an honor system to obey the immigration laws for tourists so that we don't have a 5-hour border line to get into Mexico.
You can drive without a drivers license too, but does that mean it is ok? Only until you are caught.
[Edited on 6-23-2019 by David K]
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mad as hell
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | Sounds correct from Talk Baja.
Because they do not check every vehicle entering Mexico does not mean it is okay to not do what the Mexican government asks.
It is an honor system to obey the immigration laws for tourists so that we don't have a 5-hour border line to get into Mexico.
You can drive without a drivers license too, but does that mean it is ok? Only until you are caught.
[Edited on 6-23-2019 by David K] |
If I was to guess, I would agree with you David K. about the honor system.
I suspect Mexico, doesn't want everybody stopping to get a FMM or the lines would be five hours long, when the majority of travelers, are probably
traveling withing 100 miles of the border, picking up prescription drugs, or doing tourists things. My favorite story to tell the Mexican officials,
is I'm only going to pick up prescription drugs, and come right back, and they usually just hand me back my passport, and let me through without the
FMM. Other times, they waive everybody through without checking anybody.
So I think it's funny how some of you jump up and down and say, it's the LAW it's the LAW, when on the Mexican side they are at times waving
everybody through without even talking to them when you enter Baja as a pedestrian.
David K. speaking of "Talk Baja" censorship, why did they ban you? I have never seen you attack or troll anybody here on "Baja Nomad, and although I
don't agree with you much of the time, but I'm at a lost on why they would ban you?
[Edited on 6-23-2019 by JoeJustJoe]
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solosancarlos
Junior Nomad
Posts: 64
Registered: 11-11-2010
Member Is Offline
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The great Bajagringo used to grace us with his infinite knowledge of Baja Mexico here years ago.
Does anyone recall the time he decided he was going to tell the Mexicans partying in the lot next to his (in SQ) to keep it down ?
And it is Hurricane season again. I really don't know what we would do without his accurate (lol) forecasting of storms impacting Baja.
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64478
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
Member Is Offline
Mood: Have Baja Fever
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Joe, it was mostly personal politics I think? I consider Ron a friend and he was a great host to my Baja Extreme Tour in 2016, even bought me a
surprise birthday cake.
He has been very busy with his aquaculture business so he has others moderating Talk Baja. When I was trying to learn ways to make Facebook more
user-friendly for people seeking Baja information and past postings, I apparently asked too many questions on Talk Baja on how to make Facebook easier
to navigate and they thought I was being critical of Talk Baja... Hardly! I am just a detail-holic and try anything to help people discover Baja, on
the Internet.
I have a ton of info posted there at one time and on Ron's previous forum, which he eliminated. In any case, Ron is dependent on his moderator doing
the forum operations when he is too busy, and naturally sided with him. I am not sure if I am banned, I think not because I have gone there and can
respond? I just don't anymore.
I have tried to contact Ron to make things whole again, but he has not replied... Too much drama for either of us, probably?
In any case, I have since created a Facebook page to highlight the missions and Baja travel (to see the missions) since then and while I thing
Facebook is a very poor format to find information, it is very easy to use, add photos to, and everyone seems to be on it, especially in Baja! https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
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mtgoat666
Select Nomad
Posts: 17289
Registered: 9-16-2006
Location: San Diego
Member Is Offline
Mood: Hot n spicy
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| Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe |
Said Ron: “any posts or comments recommending that people should just skirt Mexican immigration law and avoid obtaining the legally required FMM
Tourist Card will be deleted.
Repeat offenders will be removed from the group.”
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Ridiculous! What a tool!
If Mexico does not enforce, I think it is ok for someone to tell another (recommend) that they can enter Mexico w/o an FMM.
Pretty soon Ron will be telling everyone they must prefer coke over Pepsi or be banned!
Woke!
“...ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.” “My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America
will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.”
Prefered gender pronoun: the royal we
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Bajazly
Senior Nomad
Posts: 991
Registered: 6-4-2015
Location: Goodbye Cali and Hello San Felipe
Member Is Offline
Mood: More Relaxed Everyday
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Just one more reason Face F#&k blows!
Believing is religion - Knowing is science
Harald Pietschmann
"Get off the beaten path and memories, friends and new techniques are developed"
Bajazly, August 2019
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solosancarlos
Junior Nomad
Posts: 64
Registered: 11-11-2010
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | Joe, it was mostly personal politics I think? I consider Ron a friend and he was a great host to my Baja Extreme Tour in 2016, even bought me a
surprise birthday cake.
He has been very busy with his aquaculture business so he has others moderating Talk Baja. When I was trying to learn ways to make Facebook more
user-friendly for people seeking Baja information and past postings, I apparently asked too many questions on Talk Baja on how to make Facebook easier
to navigate and they thought I was being critical of Talk Baja... Hardly! I am just a detail-holic and try anything to help people discover Baja, on
the Internet.
I have a ton of info posted there at one time and on Ron's previous forum, which he eliminated. In any case, Ron is dependent on his moderator doing
the forum operations when he is too busy, and naturally sided with him. I am not sure if I am banned, I think not because I have gone there and can
respond? I just don't anymore.
I have tried to contact Ron to make things whole again, but he has not replied... Too much drama for either of us, probably?
In any case, I have since created a Facebook page to highlight the missions and Baja travel (to see the missions) since then and while I thing
Facebook is a very poor format to find information, it is very easy to use, add photos to, and everyone seems to be on it, especially in Baja! https://www.facebook.com/groups/bajamissions/
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What a laugh that is.
You really are away with the fairies
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