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BajaBill74
Nomad
Posts: 253
Registered: 1-27-2014
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Mood: Beyond Extatic!
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Closing the Border?
At about 8:45 am Trump Tweeted.
If Mexico doesn’t immediately stop ALL illegal immigration coming into the United States throug our Southern Border, I will be CLOSING.........the
Border, or large sections of the Border, next week. This would be so easy for Mexico to do, but they just take our money and “talk.” Besides, we
lose so much money with them, especially when you add in drug trafficking etc.), that the Border closing would be a good thing!
Hope that doesn't include TJ crossing!
What I'm doing at work is so secret, even I don't know what I'm doing!
One should believe in God, because even Google doesn't know everything.
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chuckie
Elite Nomad
Posts: 6082
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Location: Kansas Prairies
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Hopefully just more bluster and hot air.....
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caj13
Senior Nomad
Posts: 998
Registered: 8-1-2017
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Kind of puts David in a bit of a bind - no?
Unless Trump means he will stop all southern brown people, but let northern white people pass freely through the border?
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
Posts: 21045
Registered: 9-9-2010
Location: Occupied Aztlan
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Mood: Mad as hell
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Not only is Trump, racist, but he is also a compulsive liar.
I would not believe anything coming from Trump's mouth.
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Enrique2012
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Posts: 105
Registered: 4-19-2012
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Just in time, a new thread for the resident clowns to feed on...
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fishbuck
Banned
Posts: 5318
Registered: 8-31-2006
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If he closed the border does that stop Southbound traffic?
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for." J. A. Shedd.
A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it. – Albert Einstein
"Life's a Beach... and then you Fly!" Fishbuck
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David K
Honored Nomad
Posts: 64490
Registered: 8-30-2002
Location: San Diego County
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Mood: Have Baja Fever
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The "border" is the line that separates two countries... Most of our borders are OPEN so anyone can just cross it if they are unconcerned with
violating a nation's laws. Closing the open border has nothing to do with existing legal ports of entry into the United States. It does mean
installing a physical barrier as far too many people have no problem with breaking the border law and not waiting in line like all our relatives from
other countries did.
Did I really need to explain this to you guys?
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by David K]
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JoeJustJoe
Banned
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Mood: Mad as hell
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Quote: Originally posted by David K  | The "border" is the line that separates two countries... Most of our borders are OPEN so anyone can just cross it if they are unconcerned with
violating a nation's laws. Closing the open border has nothing to do with existing legal ports of entry into the United States. It does mean
installing a physical barrier as far too many people have no problem with breaking the border law and not waiting in line like all our relatives from
other countries did.
Did I really need to explain this to you guys?
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If it's so easy to cross the border as an undocumented Mexican workers, how come coyotes, charge up to $5000 dollars to sneak someone over the
border?
David K. what's Trump, going to do with all that trucker commerce that cross the border daily?
Do you really think Trump, is going to cause multinational corporations lose millions of dollars while the border is closed?
If you really believe this I have bridge I would like to sell you?
If I was a Mexican national without high tech skills, without money in the bank, without contacts in the US,and I heard there are good jobs up north.
I sure would not wait in an unfair line or play immigration lotto, where the game is fixed. Screw that, especially if there are good jobs in the US,
and the US companies make it real easy to live in the US and work.
And finally, if I was a Mexican immigrant I would not think it's fair that David K. could come to my country anytime he wants, but I could not come
to his country anytime I want.
It's campaign time, and Trump, is getting ready for 2020 by playing to his base and faking a temper tantrum about closing the border.
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by JoeJustJoe]
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sancho
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 2524
Registered: 10-6-2004
Location: OC So Cal
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It encourages me to read posts from BN's that have logic,
empathy, only 1 or 2 in that low info category. Amigo
you are WAY over your ski's, to to arrogantly suggest that any
of us need an explanation from you
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by sancho]
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4410
Registered: 7-2-2006
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| Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe | | Quote: Originally posted by David K | The "border" is the line that separates two countries... Most of our borders are OPEN so anyone can just cross it if they are unconcerned with
violating a nation's laws. Closing the open border has nothing to do with existing legal ports of entry into the United States. It does mean
installing a physical barrier as far too many people have no problem with breaking the border law and not waiting in line like all our relatives from
other countries did.
Did I really need to explain this to you guys?
|
If it's so easy to cross the border as an undocumented Mexican workers, how come coyotes, charge up to $5000 dollars to sneak someone over the
border?
David K. what's Trump, going to do with all that trucker commerce that cross the border daily?
Do you really think Trump, is going to cause multinational corporations lose millions of dollars while the border is closed?
If you really believe this I have bridge I would like to sell you?
If I was a Mexican national without high tech skills, without money in the bank, without contacts in the US,and I heard there are good jobs up north.
I sure would not wait in an unfair line or play immigration lotto, where the game is fixed. Screw that, especially if there are good jobs in the US,
and the US companies make it real easy to live in the US and work.
And finally, if I was a Mexican immigrant I would not think it's fair that David K. could come to my country anytime he wants, but I could not come
to his country anytime I want.
It's campaign time, and Trump, is getting ready for 2020 by playing to his base and faking a temper tantrum about closing the border.
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by JoeJustJoe] |
JJJ are you really serious or trolling again? If you are serious you are clearly ignorant of border cartel control, though it appears you are
feigning ignorance to confuse the message.
Cartels in collusion with a variety of corrupt politicians, law enforcement and military "control" and tax all traffic through the region. Coyotes are
human traffickers who run exploited people through a system and place a bounty on their head they then are responsible to pay through either cash or
servitude.
Many/most people are selected to be tarfficked, they don't willingly choose to be pit in danger and exploitation, abuse and slavery.
The entire border is full of corruption, both in the open areas as well in the controlled points of entry. Everybody pays and a few profit.
Closing the entire order with National Guard and actual lawful enforcement would protect all those men, women and children and end the money train of
cartels and their networks. If cartels didn't profit on every trafficked person as well as goods and materials, they would be out of business and
endless lives would be saved.
The problem is the money is too good to stop this money flow. Everybody profits off the backs of trafficked humans which is why everyone wants it to
continue, JJJ included, who is apparently a mouth piece and promoter for the messaging of cartels.
Banks profits off money laundering, prisons profit off prisoners, police get paid to police criminals, military and federal agencies justify their
existence due the need for protection from rampant lawlessness and corruption. CBP, ICE, etc they all profit by justifying both the need and adding
corruption on top to grease their profits even more. Agriculture, institutional corporations all profit from down forcing wages with the added
pressure from an illegal work force.
Promoting illegal human trafficking as you do, JJJ is direct support for human exploitation, prostitution, drug and arms trafficking, and the result
is the destruction of lives. It's absolutely horrifying that you come here to Baja Nomad and promote this abuse using your feigned ignorance and
intentional misrepresentation of facts. Based on your behavior it would not be a surprise if you a full time paid schill for corrupt cartels and their
networks.
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by gnukid]
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John Harper
Super Nomad
Posts: 2289
Registered: 3-9-2017
Location: SoCal
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by gnukid | | Closing the entire order with National Guard and actual lawful enforcement would protect all those men, women and children and end the money train of
cartels and their networks. |
What is your plan for achieving this? How much taxpayer money do you propose we spend? How are we going to finance this project? How many more law
enforcement careers are we going to create and have long term pension and health obligations? How do you plan to continue maintenance and operations,
and how much will it cost taxpayers?
Drugs come across well monitored borders daily. What do you propose we do differently to make sure no drugs come across legal POEs? Please
elaborate.
Please, give us a plan with some financing and cost/benefits of your proposal.
We all look forward to a well prepared plan of attack. Are you up to the task?
John
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DaliDali
Super Nomad
Posts: 1132
Registered: 4-21-2010
Location: BCS
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I'll be danged.......enforcing the law is somehow racist.
Damn that Obama......full on RACIST for being the "deporter in chief"
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4410
Registered: 7-2-2006
Member Is Offline
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Identifying a problem does not obligate one to solve it. Moreover, a lack of clear solutions does not negate the obvious problem. To argue that one
must solve a problem in order to identify it is a logical fallacy.
Clearly the cost to all from corruption and human trafficking is immense that affects everyone, the costs are added to every item that is transported
and the labor as well.
In the US as you are likely aware, 40% of every dollar goes to funding the government institutions that exist to "protect" us while in fact they are
integral to the corruption problem.
The profits are too great for institutions to stop corruption or self govern.
When we do reduce corruption, such as our support for human trafficking and all it entails both Mexico and USA would be vastly more wealthy, each
citizen would benefit from reduced costs and increased profits, everyone would have more opportunity and lower barriors to succeed. Cartels would not
have an endless money flow to afford to further fund their networks to traffic synthetic drugs and all of their exotic interests.
A simple analysis shows that as communities of lawful citizens we can not expect anyone but ourselves to advocate for and develop safe thriving
communities without corruption.
We can not accept excuses such as the costs are too high to be lawful, or we can't afford to live free of corruption, while the truth is we can not
afford not to live free f corruption and we can not expect anyone but ourselves to ensure our communities are lawful.
Be aware there are sophisticated arguments by social agents whose full time role is to confuse the facts and disrupt community collective and
independent action. Keep in mind we are paying for these agents and the corruption to create disruption on our lives in the form of taxes and hidden
costs.
Ask yourself who pays the cartels, its you and me. The moment you stop paying them and stop supporting the systems. they use against us they are
done.
First step is stop all trafficking at the border using the resources we already paid for, National Guard and Military. Use tools and resources we have
available, radar, heat maps, satellites, and both federal and state forces with community oversight.
We have sophisticated technology available to us and we are not using it, while instead we send mass resources to other locations in the word while we
are allowing this chaos at our doorstep that hurts everyone of us, why allow it continue even one more day. Even if you felt you weren't harmed can
you empathize with those who are harmed, can we save 1 life at a time.
The truth is far more horrific than anyone one of us want to know or imagine, but the truth is annually is there is a long list of victims, in the
millions, men, women and children who are being harmed as a derivative result of the lack of secure border between USA and Mexico, and many do not
escape, many of us harmed, many die in the process, many are murdered, all for profit. It's basic good vs evil, which side are you on?
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by gnukid]
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norte
Super Nomad
Posts: 1163
Registered: 10-8-2008
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | The "border" is the line that separates two countries... Most of our borders are OPEN so anyone can just cross it if they are unconcerned with
violating a nation's laws. Closing the open border has nothing to do with existing legal ports of entry into the United States. It does mean
installing a physical barrier as far too many people have no problem with breaking the border law and not waiting in line like all our relatives from
other countries did.
Did I really need to explain this to you guys?
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by David K] |
What needs to be explained is that DT (hmmm kinda like DK) is talking about shtting down poe's and commerce. Quit tqaking this off-topic DonaldK
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4410
Registered: 7-2-2006
Member Is Offline
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What really irks me is that this problem is easily solved, even by a group a children, the Boys and Girl Scouts of America and Mexico could easily
develop a plan for surveillance and reporting all along the border using modern solar powered IOT devices in a virtual network that could provide 24/7
data and identify those involved with signature imagery, from the actual people to the products being trafficked and the entire corrupt system could
be shutdown in one day, we simply have to decide to do it.
There are solar powered mini HD cameras that send and transmit data 24/7 including programmable flags /email/sms, night vision microphone and speaker
and built in cell that have a computer and software that can identify common recurring objects and people and flag them. down to body movement, each
person has a biophysio signature the camera can identify every time. I bought some of these "silly toys" for under $100 each and connected them and
what I saw was the most frightening thing I could imagine, mass collusion with institutions working together by threat or willingly to traffic, 24/7,
same people all interconnected all profiting off our backs and hurting us for their profit.
Worse many of those who profit don't even do any work, they simply charge a tax by using this same technology to be aware of movement. Meaning every
liter of gas, water, Kw of power, every illegal alien person is taxed regardless of how it crosses the border through a form of intimidation, just
like Mafia in Vegas or any port, New York, Jersey, Etc. Everybody pays because we allow the system to continue, and many people buy into and chorus
the arguments to support their own demise, as you see here like JJJ, why?
The truth is that corruption requires corruption, thieves need a network of thieves, police need criminals, military needs missions, and cartels need
trafficking but they don't need to be sophisticated at every point, they need chaos, messed up systems, people getting caught, fringe people who are
barely connected to serve to fuel the system. Cartels use children sicarios who earn anywhere from $5-50 dollars to kill and if they refuse to do it
they are killed. Sadly, I know many people who have died. I hear the high power weapons at night in Mexico, you know the ones provided to Mexican
Cartels by USA White House official programs Fast and Furious and Gun Walking under Obama/Holder that just got "out of control" right? You remember
right? The USA Attorney General resigned because of being unwilling to answer questions about it?
How about Iran/Contra, "I didn't know", these are not one time programs, it continues. Our people die at the hands of weapons we provide to Cartels,
its all connected and its global and we pay for it and it hurts everyone of us, and we all turn a blind eye, some, like JJJ, promote the corrupt
system through attacks and hyperbole that is tiring to dismantle. We lose energy to fight him and the issues and allow it to continue.
Should we allow or not allow rapid high power 40 caliber fire around the block to kill two kids you know, your friends, for refusing to follow the
orders of a cartel. Should we allow human trafficking of young woman and children into sexual slavery since it seems hard to stop it?
There is an old saying that applies here, the massive trafficking across our border is not being done by a guy named Jose in a van, its done by
institutions in mass cooperation in a highly organized network of people, activities, vehicles, boats, planes, and touches every one of us. To suggest
that it is occult is to be blind to the world in front of you, let's open our eyes and start being honest with ourselves, it starts with a simple
conversation and moves to action.
All we have to do is stop it and it starts with one action- one day, it starts with a lawful border and the "cartel network" goes out of business.
[Edited on 3-30-2019 by gnukid]
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4410
Registered: 7-2-2006
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| Quote: Originally posted by norte |
What needs to be explained is that DT (hmmm kinda like DK) is talking about shtting down poe's and commerce. Quit tqaking this off-topic DonaldK
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Absolutely not, this is wrong, simply put, there will be order on the border enforced and it be slow going at first, like moving through an airport.
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azucena
Nomad
Posts: 192
Registered: 8-25-2012
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Until the causes of mass migrations are addressed the problem will remain.
If we spend mass amounts to seal the border , the humanitarian suffering will continue and increase for our southern neighbors, do we want that?
Or maybe money is better spent to address the root causes : poverty, insecurity, and hopelessnes and use our resources to help our neighbors become
more productive?
Americans sure love to complain, but seem to be blind to how much better off we are than most of the world.
People using their minds and hearts can accomplish a great deal, instead of building walls that both physically and metaphorically create isolation
and conflict?
No disagreement that the US cannot continue to absorb masses, and I am as anti Trump as they come. But if we can create a situation that mitigates the
need for asyulm, then we treat the cause, not the symptom.
And if we look at history, what man made wall has not come tumbling down?
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gnukid
Ultra Nomad
Posts: 4410
Registered: 7-2-2006
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Causes of mass migration? You mean institutional support for global repopulation to dismantle strong communities based on common beliefs and values
and foment chaos and destabilization all for control and profit?
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azucena
Nomad
Posts: 192
Registered: 8-25-2012
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Seriously dude? These communities in Central America are not stable or flourishing! But hey, you want to support a wall that will cost us forever and
accomplish nothing, that is your opinion. I would like to look at more lasting and intellegent solutions. PS: The US has been responsible for
destabilization in Centro America for years upon years by corporate and military abuse. I highly suggest you take a visit there to SEE what life
there looks like.
I have, and it is very sad.
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caj13
Senior Nomad
Posts: 998
Registered: 8-1-2017
Member Is Offline
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| Quote: Originally posted by David K | The "border" is the line that separates two countries... Most of our borders are OPEN so anyone can just cross it if they are unconcerned with
violating a nation's laws. Closing the open border has nothing to do with existing legal ports of entry into the United States. It does mean
installing a physical barrier as far too many people have no problem with breaking the border law and not waiting in line like all our relatives from
other countries did.
Did I really need to explain this to you guys?
[Edited on 3-29-2019 by David K] |
yes please, could you explain the USA law on people coming from other countries and requesting amnesty? Because if we are a nation of laws, we
surely should be following that law - correct?
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