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Author: Subject: The palm tree is going two feet under water
4x4abc
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 07:18 AM


how the Australians see it:

https://www.facebook.com/thejuicemedia/videos/35018150346636...




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 08:15 AM


Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc  
how the Australians see it:

https://www.facebook.com/thejuicemedia/videos/35018150346636...


:lol::lol::lol:

Good satire, an effective way to get a point across. It might work to change the minds of some of the knuckleheads out there.




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 10:09 AM


Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc  
how the Australians see it:

https://www.facebook.com/thejuicemedia/videos/35018150346636...

What they are missing is the rapid conversion from coal to natural gas that is taking place, the 50% higher efficiency of the Combined cycle over those converted nat gas thermal plants as they are replaced, and the need to find an environmentally neutral storage of wind and solar excesses.
Hydro is now out as a solution, so for times when solar and wind are insufficient we need some additional easily ramped up power. More coal fired thermal plants as is presently being built are definitely not the solution.

Then we get to the overriding need to supply additional electricity to all those electric vehicles we want to replace the 20% efficient gasoline powered vehicles.


Nuclear plants as they now exist are generating additional future problems in storage. Take a look at what's been happening at Hanford
https://www.fairewinds.org/demystify/hanford-nuclear-waste-s...

Any ideas for long term solutions?

[Edited on 9-3-2021 by JDCanuck]




A century later and it's still just as applicable: Desiderata: http://mwkworks.com/desiderata.html
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JDCanuck
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 10:33 AM


We all praised Germany for their rapid subsidized move to residential installed solar. Then they found they had excess solar at some times they couldn't sell to neighbors and insufficient power at others. The solution? Build more coal fired plants as thats the only fuel they had access to. Presently they are going instead of coal thermal plants to far more efficient combined cycle natural gas plants, with permanent carbon storage. Seems like the best temporary solution to move us forward until something better is developed.



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Bruce R Leech
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 10:38 AM


how many of us can remember the hole in the ozone layer fraud that caused the ban o Freon R12 all over the world. a lot of people got rich over that at the expense of many more

[Edited on 9-3-2021 by Bruce R Leech]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 10:43 AM


Hanford is not a fair comparison. Those reactors were hastily built in the late 1940s and 1950s to generate plutonium for weapons. Plus there was a terribly messy reprocessing plant to extract the plutonium from the irradiated uranium fuel rods. The radioactive waste was carelessly buried in tanks that have been leaking for decades. They are not power reactors. Whole different story.



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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 05:05 PM


Lencho: That's another possible solution being discussed, but some environmentalists are against hydrogen fuels at all and tend to display it as being produced with natural gas. Hydrogen Reformers are presently the cheapest way to produce hydrogen. Used for manufacture of anhydrous ammonia for fertilizers. They are also generally against new hydro sources (land use) as well as windmills due to bird kill. The protests against new tidal power sources also have their detractors. There is always some cost to energy that some will be against. It's not an easy task to satisfy everyone. Here we managed to get to 95% renewables in power generation, but it was a very hard trip. Quebec got their 97 to 99 % renewables after long battles with environmental protests and built their massive new hydro capacity a lot of whicn is sold in the US. Norway has us beat by using almost all hydro and now sell the majority of new cars as electrics, while Germany is struggling to catch up in power generation.

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 05:13 PM


IC engines even burning hydrogen at 15 to 20% power efficiency produce a whole lot of waste heat and as soon as you have any excess air you also produce Nitrous Oxides. Hydrogen combined cycle turbines would be the best solution for rapid startups of about 30 min. to online and are reaching 65% efficiencies.



A century later and it's still just as applicable: Desiderata: http://mwkworks.com/desiderata.html
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JDCanuck
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 05:37 PM


Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Hanford is not a fair comparison. Those reactors were hastily built in the late 1940s and 1950s to generate plutonium for weapons. Plus there was a terribly messy reprocessing plant to extract the plutonium from the irradiated uranium fuel rods. The radioactive waste was carelessly buried in tanks that have been leaking for decades. They are not power reactors. Whole different story.


The last time i checked Hanford was storing 40 percent of all the nuclear waste ever produced in the US (shipped as well from other areas)and the state and federal governments were still arguing over who was responsible to remediate the leaking storage as the bill grew ever larger. The second temporary containments installed are also now suspected of leaking. This one is refusing to go away.




A century later and it's still just as applicable: Desiderata: http://mwkworks.com/desiderata.html
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JDCanuck
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 05:48 PM


More recent news from 2018 of how nuclear waste is presently handled:

https://inhabitat.com/report-shows-that-contamination-monito...




A century later and it's still just as applicable: Desiderata: http://mwkworks.com/desiderata.html
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SFandH
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 07:11 PM


Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  
Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Hanford is not a fair comparison. Those reactors were hastily built in the late 1940s and 1950s to generate plutonium for weapons. Plus there was a terribly messy reprocessing plant to extract the plutonium from the irradiated uranium fuel rods. The radioactive waste was carelessly buried in tanks that have been leaking for decades. They are not power reactors. Whole different story.


The last time i checked Hanford was storing 40 percent of all the nuclear waste ever produced in the US (shipped as well from other areas)and the state and federal governments were still arguing over who was responsible to remediate the leaking storage as the bill grew ever larger. The second temporary containments installed are also now suspected of leaking. This one is refusing to go away.


All of the nuclear waste at Hanford was produced at Hanford during the production of Pu-239 for nuclear weapons. And it could be a very large percentage of all the waste there is. That is one nasty place that is heavily contaminated.

The federal government is responsible, there's no argument about that.

Production of Pu-239 (it does not exist in nature) has stopped because we have enough of the crap to destroy the world 100 times over.

Power reactor waste (spent fuel) in the US is stored on-site at the power reactors. It is not moved around.

I'm confident this is true. If you have info to the contrary, post the link. I'll take a look.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanford_Site


[Edited on 9-4-2021 by SFandH]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 07:44 PM


But here is the real challenge we are facing today. How to at least stop this growth and find realistic alternatives soon. China and then Germany top the list:

https://e360.yale.edu/features/despite-pledges-to-cut-emissi...

Chinese officials realize that the country’s renewable energy resources are insufficient — and too intermittent — to ease dependence on coal in the near future. Zhang cited recent problems with energy grid failures in Texas as a prime example of what Chinese officials don’t want to see happen in their country.

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]




A century later and it's still just as applicable: Desiderata: http://mwkworks.com/desiderata.html
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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 07:50 PM


and the palm tree?




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 07:56 PM


I never did find the link to the infamous palm tree, altho it did lead me to lots of NASA info and opened up the subject for discussion. So far I think Lencho's contribution has the most merit. Excesses of solar and wind producing hydrogen and then fuel cells maybe?

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 08:07 PM


Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  
But here is the real challenge we are facing today. How to at least stop this growth and find realistic alternatives soon. China and then Germany top the list:



An important phenomenon to keep an eye on is the thawing of the permafrost. That will release tons of methane which will be like throwing gasoline on a global warming fire. Coal-fired power plants will be trivial. I'm not optimistic.




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 08:19 PM


Palm trees, boulders, roads, boat launch ramps, etc... They all are just as far above the sea now as when they were first observed, 50, 80, 100 years ago.

Nobody is saying things are static... everything changes! Just the change is not at the rate or degree the hyper-active climate experts need to scare more dollars out of your pockets! No, they still fly around in private jets, have multiple homes, some on the coast... :lol:

Someday the palm will be sitting in water and will die... all living things will die. The reason I picked the El Coyote Beach Palm cluster is that it sits right above the normal highest tide line (inches above). Photos of it date back to 1936 and it has been on many book covers from the 1950s to today. It is still inches above high tide after 80+ years.

Boat launch ramps installed 50-100 years ago in San Diego are still being used... They are not underwater yet!

In 1953:



In 1971:



In 2016:



In 2017:




[Edited on 9-4-2021 by David K]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 08:25 PM


Lencho got me thinking and then i found this, and I thought fuel cells were a hope of the past. Maybe not after all:
https://www.energy.gov/eere/articles/how-wind-energy-can-hel...
https://www.energy.gov/eere/articles/five-things-you-might-n...

Fuel cell sales growth exceeding 38 percent per year.

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]




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[*] posted on 9-3-2021 at 08:47 PM


Contained within the reductions in cost of producing hydrogen alone by electrolysis, we would have O2 production from the same process replacing energy intensive cryogenic air separation plants for medical and industrial uses, without the need to strip nitrogen argon and trace gasses out.

[Edited on 9-4-2021 by JDCanuck]




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[*] posted on 9-4-2021 at 11:39 AM


And yet another source of pollution being tackled, in global shipping.
I'm pretty optimistic on what the future holds:
https://shipinsight.com/articles/samsung-and-bloom-advance-p...




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[*] posted on 9-5-2021 at 09:47 AM
NASA map of sea level change


This map covers 1994-2015.

Sea levels are not rising equally across the globe. The west coast of North America is one of the few places where the rise has been minimal. Baja has been very little affected by it so far.

DavidK is familiar with this map yet still continues to peddle his story about the palm tree proving there is no change in sea level. Why?

PS If you study the map you will understand why the Solomon Islands are having issues.





[Edited on 9-5-2021 by BajaNomad]

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