BajaNomad

Yes

weebray - 2-26-2019 at 07:46 AM

https://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/antioxxo-wants-the-stores-b...

BajaBlanca - 2-26-2019 at 09:42 AM

At the very least, the oxxo's could move into existing buildings thus preserving the colonial architecture.

In Ocean Beach, a community in San Diego, no big business was allowed inside the neighborhood so that small ma and pa shops could survive. Even the gas stations are one of a kind. At the entrance to the neighborhood is a JACK IN THE BOX....which has been there forever and was probably the impetus to keep O B (Ocean Beach) so different from other parts of the city.

Amazingly, there is an organic food cooperative that has been there since the 70's when I went to college at UCSD. Unfortunately, in recent years there has been a huge impact with homeless there too.

Oaxaca is such a special place, I do wish the locals luck in preserving that special feel it has.

Thanks for sharing weebray!!

AKgringo - 2-26-2019 at 10:14 AM

I wonder if Oxxo stores are company owned, franchise operations, or a mixture of both?

It is hard to imagine a business model that would put two or three stores in direct competition with each other.

John Harper - 2-26-2019 at 10:37 AM

My roommate told me the new CaliMax opened in Puerto Nuevo. She said it was packed with customers. That's probably going to hurt some of the local small businesses as well.

John

TMW - 2-26-2019 at 11:18 AM

The story of hurting the local mom and pop stores when a chain store moves in has been around for a long time. That was the knock on Walmart yet go into any Walmart and they are packed with customers, probably the same people complaining about them. People like a good bargain, they like to save money. The union tried to stop a Walmart from being opened here in Bakersfield, the one at 99 and Panama Lane, and after several years it finally opened and they always have a lot of shoppers especially when the welfare checks arrive.

Interesting thing about prices at Walmart and Sams Club. My printer uses a #61 set of cartridges. At Sams Club a combo set is like $51, at Walmart it is $43, been that way since I've had the printer about 5 years now.

4x4abc - 2-26-2019 at 11:26 AM

OXXO is owned by FEMSA (Coca Cola)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OXXO

opening stores close to each other is a proven strategy to keep the competition away

weebray - 2-28-2019 at 08:17 AM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaBlanca  
At the very least, the oxxo's could move into existing buildings thus preserving the colonial architecture.

In Ocean Beach, a community in San Diego, no big business was allowed inside the neighborhood so that small ma and pa shops could survive. Even the gas stations are one of a kind. At the entrance to the neighborhood is a JACK IN THE BOX....which has been there forever and was probably the impetus to keep O B (Ocean Beach) so different from other parts of the city.
Amazingly, there is an organic food cooperative that has been there since the 70's when I went to college at UCSD. Unfortunately, in recent years there has been a huge impact with homeless there too.

Oaxaca is such a special place, I do wish the locals luck in preserving that special feel it has.

Thanks for sharing weebray!!


Good ideas here Blanca, thanks. If some effort was made to integrate it would be helpful. "Oxxo is not a franchise. Most stores are operated under a commission contract and others directly, for the purpose of maintaining absolute control over products and service." This "control" includes an attempt to control the market and I cannot feel all warm and fuzzy about the Coca Cola company controlling the market. They already control more deaths of Mexicans than illegal drugs do.

JoeJustJoe - 2-28-2019 at 10:18 AM

Quote: Originally posted by weebray  


Good ideas here Blanca, thanks. If some effort was made to integrate it would be helpful. "Oxxo is not a franchise. Most stores are operated under a commission contract and others directly, for the purpose of maintaining absolute control over products and service." This "control" includes an attempt to control the market and I cannot feel all warm and fuzzy about the Coca Cola company controlling the market. They already control more deaths of Mexicans than illegal drugs do.


Weebray, I didn't look up the requirements of an Oxxo franchise, or whatever you're calling it, but your quote, " for the purpose of maintaining absolute control over products and service," is pretty much the very definition of a franchise, and something that a company like McDonald's, 7-Eleven, and I suspect Oxxo, does using the same cookie cutter to keep their businesses running the same way no matter where they are.

Coca Cola, is not controlling the market in Mexico, FEMSA, is a wholly owned beverage company in Mexico, Coke, Coca-Cola FEMSA, is a subsidiary of FEMSA, which is also the largest franchise of Coca-Cola, and bottler operation.

Exactly how is Coca Cola, controlling more deaths of Mexicans than illegal drugs? Oh let me guess, it's makes then porkers? If so I suspect Coke isn't the only drink or food to blame.

Well I applaud some cities cracking down on Walmart, Amazon, and OXXO, for asking for corporate welfare, and only offering slave wages in return.

It's just sometimes I can't stand those small markets and small restaurants, that offer a limited supply of over prices items, and sometimes I have have the big chain stores and restaurants, so hopefully these cities can find a nice balance.

I'm also more addicted to Diet Coke, than I am to liquor. If I go more than 2 days without a Diet Coke, I'm crawling the walls.

TMW - 2-28-2019 at 01:05 PM

I looked up Oxxo in CA and wow we have one in Buttonwillow west of Bakersfield. I think I'll drive out there and check it out.

AKgringo - 2-28-2019 at 01:33 PM

TMW, you might want to check out the business from a distance before you drive out there. There is a chain of cleaners using that name.

ncampion - 2-28-2019 at 01:35 PM

We were concerned a few years ago when a Super Ley opened in Loreto that it would put all the little places out of business. Turns out that the other places "upped their game" with cleaner stores, more items and good service. Now everyone is doing fine. Competition and a free market place does work.

JoeJustJoe - 2-28-2019 at 02:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ncampion  
We were concerned a few years ago when a Super Ley opened in Loreto that it would put all the little places out of business. Turns out that the other places "upped their game" with cleaner stores, more items and good service. Now everyone is doing fine. Competition and a free market place does work.


Your post sounds more like an advertisement for Milton Friedman, free markets, or Chilean economics, than it does for what typically happens when big box corporations like, Amazon, Walmart, McDonald's, or the example here,Oxxo moves into the city with the predatory practices of putting other smaller mom and pop stores out of business, and polluting the landscape with their ugly buildings and logos.

Maybe, free market economics works in Loreto, but I doubt it works in most cities around the world, especially in Mexico, with their monopolized prices on many goods and services.

I'm just looking for balance, and I don't want to see the small stores put out of business, but I also like the convenience of an Oxxo or the cheap prices of Walmart, but cities should limit them, and never give these companies corporate welfare.





StuckSucks - 2-28-2019 at 02:34 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ncampion  
We were concerned a few years ago when a Super Ley opened in Loreto that it would put all the little places out of business. Turns out that the other places "upped their game" with cleaner stores, more items and good service. Now everyone is doing fine. Competition and a free market place does work.


EXACTLY -- competition is good for us consumers. I'm not interested in subsidizing an inferior product or service.

weebray - 2-28-2019 at 04:30 PM

Competition hogwash. You are entitled to your uninformed opinion but I hate to break the news to you this has nothing to do with fair competition. Shed the stars and stripes diaper and come to the party. Sheesh.

weebray - 3-1-2019 at 08:25 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
Quote: Originally posted by weebray  


Good ideas here Blanca, thanks. If some effort was made to integrate it would be helpful. "Oxxo is not a franchise. Most stores are operated under a commission contract and others directly, for the purpose of maintaining absolute control over products and service." This "control" includes an attempt to control the market and I cannot feel all warm and fuzzy about the Coca Cola company controlling the market. They already control more deaths of Mexicans than illegal drugs do.


Weebray, I didn't look up the requirements of an Oxxo franchise,



Interesting, you first tell us you don't know what the hell you're talking about, then you tell us how it is.

DaliDali - 3-1-2019 at 04:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by weebray  
Competition hogwash. You are entitled to your uninformed opinion but I hate to break the news to you this has nothing to do with fair competition. Shed the stars and stripes diaper and come to the party. Sheesh.


Uniformed opinion?
Campion LIVES in Loreto.....on the ground...owns a home here.
YOU DON'T....

The mom and pops stores in Loreto ARE JUST FINE, cleaner stores, fresher produce, competive pricing.

If YOU lived here, you too would know this.


JoeJustJoe - 3-1-2019 at 06:42 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Freedom & Capitalism works, always!
Controls & Socialism fails, always!


Your argument would be stronger if you just said, " survival of the fittest," because the "free market" system, is pretty much a myth when the big boys start playing in the field in either the US or Mexico.

How does a mom & pop store, compete with a Walmart, Amazon, or even convenience stores, like Oxxo, when the big boys, are paying legal and illegal bribes, get corporate welfare, and other sweetheart deals to come into the cities and then pay slave wages. Where is the level playing field?

If the US and Mexico government is not careful, a store like Oxxo, will spread like cancer, and dot the landscape with ugly companies logos. There goes the charm of a beautiful unique city, that now looks like all the other cities with the same franchise operations.

A store like Walmart, will crush the local competition by selling a popular item at a lost until it puts it's competition out of business, and then it will raise the prices.

Thank God, strong US Leadership, broke up the robber barons monopolies last century, and who could forget what Mexico President Lorenzo Cárdenas did to Standard Oil Company. It's the pride of Mexico, when they think back when Mexico nationalize its oil industry!

I guess I'm not as radical, as Weebray, who sounds like he wants to regulate CocaCoca, because he thinks they are killing people, but if companies are not careful, Amazon, may be the next company that gets broken up after his ex-wife gets through with Bezos, and stores like Oxxo, better control their growth, or they will get regulated and kicked out new cities they want to move into.



David K - 3-1-2019 at 06:52 PM

Did you not read what the Loreto resident said... they are doing fine, and improved their service to consumers because of the competition.

Hurray for the people!

JoeJustJoe - 3-1-2019 at 07:18 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Did you not read what the Loreto resident said... they are doing fine, and improved their service to consumers because of the competition.

Hurray for the people!


You mean that's what they claim, don't you?

This is why I don't always go by so-called anecdotal personal experiences that may very well be clouded through their personal lens or agenda.

The fact is these big box companies not only put the mom and pop stores out of business, all over the world, they even put stores like Sears out of business.

So lets go by the averages of different cities, than just one city in Mexico, that may or may not be accurate.

mtgoat666 - 3-1-2019 at 08:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Freedom & Capitalism works, always!
Controls & Socialism fails, always!


Your argument would be stronger if you just said, " survival of the fittest," because the "free market" system, is pretty much a myth when the big boys start playing in the field in either the US or Mexico.

How does a mom & pop store, compete with a Walmart, Amazon, or even convenience stores, like Oxxo, when the big boys, are paying legal and illegal bribes, get corporate welfare, and other sweetheart deals to come into the cities and then pay slave wages. Where is the level playing field?



Walmart and amazon can pay low wages because their employees can go on food stamps to get their meal money.
True.
Most Walmart and amazon warehouse workers are forced to be PT and not receive benis, and so they are on food stamps, get health care subsidized from govt, get sec 8 housing, etc.
Walmart is the prime example of socialism, the family is filthy rich because taxpayers pay the living wage that Walmart does not pay.
The USA is not capitalist. It is a quasisocialist system where corporations are taking all the govt handouts.

I a all for the green new deal, and am all for burning down the system run for corporate America.

Revolution now!

Gots to cleanse society of the corporate leaches and the low-income dumb bunnies that support GOP. Send ‘em all to Mexico!

[Edited on 3-2-2019 by mtgoat666]

mtgoat666 - 3-1-2019 at 08:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Freedom & Capitalism works, always!
Controls & Socialism fails, always!


Why is the “capitalist” USA a flocking mess, and socialist northern Europe and Scandinavia doing better for their people?

David K - 3-2-2019 at 12:36 AM

CNN is your only view of the world or is it MSNBC? LOL
I like to hear the news and not be told what I am supposed to get from it. Try getting news that doesn't have an agenda.
You know, like Fox News, LOL!!!

wilderone - 3-2-2019 at 10:33 AM

I just got back from Oaxaca and stayed in the historic centro. There was a small OXXO two doors down from my hotel. The OXXO had a dozen choices of coffee - hot and strong. This was the only place I could get a decent cup of coffee - otherwise served tepid and weak and cost more than OXXO. I would strongly oppose tearing down a historic or significant building in a World Heritage Site to install an OXXO, but on the other hand, there are plenty of other shops like chain appliance and smart phone stores, modern shoe stores in the same neighborhood, their storefronts contrasting greatly to the old world façade of the adjacent shop. The historic centro area is definitely unique but I don't think too many vendors are being displaced by competing wares at OXXO. E.g., I definitely would not buy pasteles at OXXO, rather, at the panaderia. The OXXO was selling a lot of lottery tickets I noticed. They're not selling crafts, and the hot dogs are inferior to the ones found on the street.

TMW - 3-2-2019 at 12:42 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Freedom & Capitalism works, always!
Controls & Socialism fails, always!


Why is the “capitalist” USA a flocking mess, and socialist northern Europe and Scandinavia doing better for their people?



When people pay 50% of their income in taxes and the country only has a few million people in a small area the size of LA county things can be much better than a country with 300 million spread out over nearly 4 million sq miles. If capitalist USA is so bad why are so many trying to come here?

DaliDali - 3-2-2019 at 01:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Did you not read what the Loreto resident said... they are doing fine, and improved their service to consumers because of the competition.

Hurray for the people!


You mean that's what they claim, don't you?



Claim?.....Campion and I both live here, we go to these stores often.
We personally witness the upgrades in the cleanliness, fresher goods, more order and less stuff packing the aisles.

If you actually lived in Baja, you too would notice the difference.

John Harper - 3-2-2019 at 01:28 PM

I would think product distribution networks have also improved, which might allow for some of this change as well.

John

DaliDali - 3-2-2019 at 01:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by TMW  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Freedom & Capitalism works, always!
Controls & Socialism fails, always!


Why is the “capitalist” USA a flocking mess, and socialist northern Europe and Scandinavia doing better for their people?



When people pay 50% of their income in taxes and the country only has a few million people in a small area the size of LA county things can be much better than a country with 300 million spread out over nearly 4 million sq miles. If capitalist USA is so bad why are so many trying to come here?


Not only do these countries pay a high income tax.....

"Sweden’s top marginal tax rate of 56.9 percent applies to all income over 1.5 times the average income in Sweden. Norway’s top marginal tax rate of 39 percent applies to all income over 1.6 times the average Norwegian income"

And if that's not enough.....

"Denmark collects about 9.6 percent of GDP through the VAT, Norway collects about 7.8 percent, and Sweden collections about 9 percent of GDP. All three countries have VAT rates of 25 percent"And if that's not enough.....

Gas price in Sweden......$6.27 a gallon
Norway...$7.03
Denmark...$6.57
Finland....6.08

Pay over half your income to the government, so they can take care of you and make some of your spending decisions for you.

Or...you keep more your earned money, so you can make your own decisions on how you wish to live, with your money.

Make that call....is this the "utopia" were looking for?


[Edited on 3-2-2019 by DaliDali]

mtgoat666 - 3-2-2019 at 01:54 PM

Quote: Originally posted by TMW  

If capitalist USA is so bad why are so many trying to come here?


Refugees and immigrants are trying to go to many countries, not necessarily USA.

There are many more people NOT trying to come to USA relative to those trying to come to USA.

Don’t be fooled into thinking USA is best. Economic and military power of a country is not a measure of quality of life. There are better places in the world.

Getting What You Pay For

MrBillM - 3-2-2019 at 02:04 PM

When discussing the relative merits of the U.S. system versus the various European models, the only pertinent comparisons would be comparable standards of living.

Does their regulatory and taxation system provide the vast majority of their residents with a better overall standard of living ?

Or does the U.S. ?

TMW - 3-2-2019 at 04:14 PM

I have no doubt there are many countries that are good places to live whether it's an island, a land locked country or along the coast of an ocean. But when it comes to paying a fare share for common interest things like the UN, NATO and the world bank why does the USA foot the largest share?

DaliDali - 3-2-2019 at 04:34 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by TMW  

If capitalist USA is so bad why are so many trying to come here?


There are many more people NOT trying to come to USA relative to those trying to come to USA.



Fun FACTS on USA immigration....Millions are coming to the USA...WAY more than ANY other country.

The USA has 19.8 percent of the worlds foreign born population.

The nearest one is Germany, with 4.9%

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_and_d...


"How many immigrants enter the US each year?
Since 2000, legal immigrants to the United States number approximately 1,000,000 per year, of whom about 600,000 are Change of Status who already are in the U.S. Legal immigrants to the United States now are at their highest level ever, at just over 37,000,000 legal immigrants"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_the_United_Stat...

JoeJustJoe - 3-2-2019 at 06:35 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DaliDali  


Claim?.....Campion and I both live here, we go to these stores often.
We personally witness the upgrades in the cleanliness, fresher goods, more order and less stuff packing the aisles.

If you actually lived in Baja, you too would notice the difference.


Yes "claim" is the right word.

I don't like to go around and call BS on people, and perhaps Loreto, is some kind of Mexican free market, utopia, that when monopolistic big box companies and the franchises type businesses move in, that instead of putting the mom & pop stores out of business, it instead lifts all boats, and businesses, including the Mom & Pop stores.

Maybe, the chupacabra, is also very active in Loreto, who knows? I haven't been down to Loreto, in over 10 years.

But what I do know for sure, after living in both Mexico, and the US, is that usually when the big companies like WalMart, Amazon, McDonald's or Oxxo, moves it, the Mom & Pop stores go out of business, unless ordinances are put in place to stop the growth, and save the same companies.

I'm also a student of economics, and what you are describing usually doesn't happen due to many economic factors.

Then again, there is sometimes synergy from places like restaurant row.



DaliDali - 3-2-2019 at 07:36 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
Quote: Originally posted by DaliDali  


Claim?.....Campion and I both live here, we go to these stores often.
We personally witness the upgrades in the cleanliness, fresher goods, more order and less stuff packing the aisles.

If you actually lived in Baja, you too would notice the difference.


Maybe, the chupacabra, is also very active in Loreto, who knows? I haven't been down to Loreto, in over 10 years.




This says it all....you just don't know.