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Author: Subject: Alert for armed robberies in Laguna Hanson (Parque Nacional Constitución de 1857)
John Harper
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[*] posted on 6-22-2018 at 04:19 PM


Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
What you didn't see me do is to to some San Diego, forum, waving the alarmist bells, and asking, is San Diego safe?


I could easily put down a small rebellion in my neighborhood.

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[*] posted on 6-22-2018 at 10:37 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Maderita  
Quote: Originally posted by KasloKid  

Getting back to the original topic, is the first time anyone has heard of robberies in the park?

There was a robbery (or two?) at Laguna Hanson, approximately 1996. A gringo couple was robbed at gunpoint. The husband was hit in the head with a rifle butt and the vehicle stolen, iirc. I can't find my notes, but I believe it was the same year as an armed robbery (with a rifle fired) at the climber's basecamp at Cañón El Tajo, which was 1996.

That was a bad year or two. A moto rider was shot in the leg while pre-running in the southern Sierra de Juarez. More than one vehicle was torched in separate incidents while parked at trailheads of eastside palm canyons, presumably by marijuana growers who wanted to keep hikers out of their grows. I coordinated with a writer from The Reader, who wrote a feature article about the incidents.

Since that time, things have been relatively safe, to my knowledge. Vehicle burglary (break-ins with theft) is the only problem that I've heard. The article in the original post indicated that this is the first robbery in 20 years. Perhaps that is a round number and the reference is to 1996 (22 years)?


Thanks Maderita. Just the info I was looking for.
I remember as well, a rider being shot by a .22 and he managed to ride out on his own. The shooter was at a gate and gave no warning... the thinking was he was protecting a grow op. I think that was near Laguna Hansen or the sawmill?

Vehicle break-ins are to be expected, no matter what country you're in.

I guess I'll/we'll continue to ride hard and fast through there to Ojos in the future. If I hear of more incidents, I may have to reconsider a different route. It's been our favourite way of riding back to the USA after a Baja 1000.
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 09:44 AM


The Laguna Hanson area is on my intended route for a trip this fall. I am very interested in any information about the recent events!

Anyone have an update, or link to a recent report? I would prefer even a third hand report to the first hand opinions being offered by the off topic posts that have turned this thread into another crap storm!




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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 10:16 AM


Off topic posts sure clutter up this thread.
Dam, can't a moderator move or delete the off topic posts?

I really don't give a crap about reading crap that has nothing to do with the original topic.

I too am keeping an eye on recent events of this area in this thread.
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 10:23 AM


Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
The Laguna Hanson area is on my intended route for a trip this fall. I am very interested in any information about the recent events!

Anyone have an update, or link to a recent report? I would prefer even a third hand report to the first hand opinions being offered by the off topic posts that have turned this thread into another crap storm!


From the TJ newspaper yesterday.

https://frontera.info/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Ensenada/22062018...





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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 10:55 AM


Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
The Laguna Hanson area is on my intended route for a trip this fall. I am very interested in any information about the recent events!

Anyone have an update, or link to a recent report? I would prefer even a third hand report to the first hand opinions being offered by the off topic posts that have turned this thread into another crap storm!


From the TJ newspaper yesterday.

https://frontera.info/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Ensenada/22062018...



Google translation to English:

For the first time in the last 20 years, authorities of the National Park Constitution of 1857, a recreational area for campers and the only Protected Natural Area in the Sierra de Juárez, warned of assaults by armed men, so they recommend not to go to the park until new notice.

Two families who were camping last Saturday were assaulted by two men with long weapons, who took away cell phones, money and vehicles from the victims.

In the last 20 years there have never been any assaults, Santos Soto Jaime, deputy director in charge of the National Park office, said in an interview.

"I would recommend to the community that they refrain from going up to the National Park until they have greater security with the institutions of the three levels of Government," he said. "The Municipality, the Army and the Attorney General's Office are already aware (PGR ), there is still an operation to be done ".

He noted that there is already a person arrested, who was arrested with a vehicle stolen from a family, and who apparently carried weapons and cartridges in that same unit.

"It is an insecurity that we had never lived in the Park," lamented Soto Jaime.

The person in charge of the Park specified that a meeting is expected next week with the delegation of the Attorney General's Office (PGR) and the Second Military Region of the Secretariat of National Defense (Sedena).

The first assault was recorded on Saturday morning, a family that camped in the Hanson Lagoon, in the National Park, was affected; The second robbery took place that same day in the afternoon to another family.

"It's a situation that in the last 20 years had not happened, we had never had a situation like that, on Saturday it was a young couple from Tijuana, they were assaulted by two people, they took the vehicle," he said.

"We reported it immediately to 911, I was with the people affected, we told the Army at the federal highway checkpoint between Ensenada and San Felipe, and they said they would go up, because apparently these people (assailants) were carrying long weapons," he added. .

Soto Jaime took the family to the Public Ministry to file the complaint.

"We are going to try to make a security operation with the Army, to see if we can coordinate with them that are up (in the mountains), because it is the season of many visitors," he said.

The national park, to the South of Ensenada, only has four forest rangers, the recreational area covers 104 hectares for public use.

Relating campers bad experience
Francisco Buelna, Ensenada photographer and camper, reported that he helped the first family that was assaulted.

"We camped about 2 kilometers from the access booth, near the body of water of the Laguna, after breakfast a lady with a baby in her arms approached, about 4 years old, we thought she had been bitten by an animal," she said.

"She said that they had just assaulted them with a long weapon, the lady came with three children, one of 11, 8 and 4 years old, they were told to give them the car, cell phones, money, keys to the house and car, they say that one of the assailants was carrying an AK-47, the lady was very scared, "he recalled.

Buelna said he only observed how a white van ran full speed out of the park.

"I published this in my networks because we do recreational activities in the area and this has never happened," he lamented.




[Edited on 6-23-2018 by KasloKid]

[Edited on 6-23-2018 by KasloKid]
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ELINVESTIG8R
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 11:06 AM


Quote: Originally posted by motoged  
Quote: Originally posted by DaliDali  


...Agreed.........the American doper drives the crime...
Meth, coke and now the dreaded opioids....all smuggled in on the backs of illegal aliens....and jojo wants to give them all a pass.....all in the name of beating back racism....



DD,
Do you really believe that statement about "all smuggled in on the backs of illegal aliens".....?

I thought you were smarter than that.

I guess the vehicle, plane, and boat smuggling methods are a drop in the bucket compared to people wading across the border....not to mention that those drugs are readily manufactured in USA...

Can you get past your dichotomous "either/or" thinking and consider a response that might include the phrase "well, that depends..." ( a developmental stage of cognitive development usually evident in early adolescence: ....Piaget's fourth and last stage of cognitive development, characterized by the ability to think abstractly. Thinking abstractly gives the teen more flexible ways to manipulate information. No longer limited to the here and now, they can think hypothetically and imagine what might be. They can use symbols for symbols as in algebra. They can also imagine multiple possibilities and form and test hypotheses. Development of this stage is dependent on both brain maturation and learning experiences.).




FOR DALIDALI






On June 8, 2013, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman JoeFaggotJoe of 9067 Hermosa Drive, Temple City California invited Elinvestig8r over for coffee, but in the end, Jihad Salman was too frightened to open his front door. Elinvestig8r went over to get an apology from Jihad Salman after he put Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number. On January 5, 2016, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California was again too frightened open his front door after inviting Elinvestig8r for coffee. Prior to the visit Jihad Salman told Elinvestig8r to come at his own risk because he was armed. Facing extreme danger, Elinvestig8r went over to see Jihad Salman in the pouring rain to meet him for coffee and ask for an apology for putting Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger. It is obvious Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California is too frightened of Elinvestig8r and will never meet with him for coffee to apologize for putting his Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number! PS: JIHAD SH*T HIMSELF BOTH TIMES I CAME OVER!
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:00 PM


I will monitor Spanish language media for followup information as it is made available. But as the saying goes, good roads bring bad people. Bad roads bring Jeeps!:light:



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ELINVESTIG8R
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:04 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Ken Cooke  
I will monitor Spanish language media for followup information as it is made available. But as the saying goes, good roads bring bad people. Bad roads bring Jeeps!:light:



Thank you Mamá Espinoza for that great saying. It never gets old!




On June 8, 2013, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman JoeFaggotJoe of 9067 Hermosa Drive, Temple City California invited Elinvestig8r over for coffee, but in the end, Jihad Salman was too frightened to open his front door. Elinvestig8r went over to get an apology from Jihad Salman after he put Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number. On January 5, 2016, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California was again too frightened open his front door after inviting Elinvestig8r for coffee. Prior to the visit Jihad Salman told Elinvestig8r to come at his own risk because he was armed. Facing extreme danger, Elinvestig8r went over to see Jihad Salman in the pouring rain to meet him for coffee and ask for an apology for putting Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger. It is obvious Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California is too frightened of Elinvestig8r and will never meet with him for coffee to apologize for putting his Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number! PS: JIHAD SH*T HIMSELF BOTH TIMES I CAME OVER!
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:09 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Maderita  


Thanks Maderita. Just the info I was looking for.
I remember as well, a rider being shot by a .22 and he managed to ride out on his own. The shooter was at a gate and gave no warning... the thinking was he was protecting a grow op. I think that was near Laguna Hansen or the sawmill?

Vehicle break-ins are to be expected, no matter what country you're in.

I guess I'll/we'll continue to ride hard and fast through there to Ojos in the future. If I hear of more incidents, I may have to reconsider a different route. It's been our favourite way of riding back to the USA after a Baja 1000.


This may be a different incident but several years ago just north of Valle la Trinidad a motorcycle rider was shot while pre-running the Baja 500 course. At the time it was thought the shooter was protecting a pot farm.
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:09 PM


Quote: Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R  
Quote: Originally posted by Ken Cooke  
I will monitor Spanish language media for followup information as it is made available. But as the saying goes, good roads bring bad people. Bad roads bring Jeeps!:light:



Thank you Mamá Espinoza for that great saying. It never gets old!


Investigator,

I have not spent much time on this forum lately, but it appears you still have an axe to grind with your acquaintances from the off-topic forum from several years past. Are you okay? These .gif files and such are strange on your part. Take care of yourself.




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Ken Cooke
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:12 PM


Quote: Originally posted by TMW  
Quote: Originally posted by Maderita  


Thanks Maderita. Just the info I was looking for.
I remember as well, a rider being shot by a .22 and he managed to ride out on his own. The shooter was at a gate and gave no warning... the thinking was he was protecting a grow op. I think that was near Laguna Hansen or the sawmill?

Vehicle break-ins are to be expected, no matter what country you're in.

I guess I'll/we'll continue to ride hard and fast through there to Ojos in the future. If I hear of more incidents, I may have to reconsider a different route. It's been our favourite way of riding back to the USA after a Baja 1000.


This may be a different incident but several years ago just north of Valle la Trinidad a motorcycle rider was shot while pre-running the Baja 500 course. At the time it was thought the shooter was protecting a pot farm.


TW, I believe that incident took place in the Valle Trinidad region, opposite side (south) of Hwy 3 from where this carjacking/brazen robbery took place. Both equally chilling incidents in what is considered otherwise peaceful locales.




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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:21 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Ken Cooke  
Quote: Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R  
Quote: Originally posted by Ken Cooke  
I will monitor Spanish language media for followup information as it is made available. But as the saying goes, good roads bring bad people. Bad roads bring Jeeps!:light:



Thank you Mamá Espinoza for that great saying. It never gets old!


Investigator,

I have not spent much time on this forum lately, but it appears you still have an axe to grind with your acquaintances from the off-topic forum from several years past. Are you okay? These .gif files and such are strange on your part. Take care of yourself.


Don't worry Ken I'm still the same loveable David Elinvestig8r M.arston to those who treat me well. Those who don't can stand by. Thank you for your concern.




On June 8, 2013, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman JoeFaggotJoe of 9067 Hermosa Drive, Temple City California invited Elinvestig8r over for coffee, but in the end, Jihad Salman was too frightened to open his front door. Elinvestig8r went over to get an apology from Jihad Salman after he put Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number. On January 5, 2016, Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California was again too frightened open his front door after inviting Elinvestig8r for coffee. Prior to the visit Jihad Salman told Elinvestig8r to come at his own risk because he was armed. Facing extreme danger, Elinvestig8r went over to see Jihad Salman in the pouring rain to meet him for coffee and ask for an apology for putting Elinvestig8r’s Peace Officer son in danger. It is obvious Jihad Jay Ezzeddine Salman of Temple City California is too frightened of Elinvestig8r and will never meet with him for coffee to apologize for putting his Peace Officer son in danger by revealing his name address and telephone number! PS: JIHAD SH*T HIMSELF BOTH TIMES I CAME OVER!
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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 12:49 PM


Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
The Laguna Hanson area is on my intended route for a trip this fall. I am very interested in any information about the recent events!

Anyone have an update, or link to a recent report? I would prefer even a third hand report to the first hand opinions being offered by the off topic posts that have turned this thread into another crap storm!


AKgringo, what more did you want to know?

According to reports two familes were robbed at gunpoint while camping, and authorities are advising against camping or visiting the area until further notice.

Rarely if ever do Mexican papers revisit events first covered in in the newspapers.

In case you don't know, these kind of "fear mongering" threads degenerate into Mexico/Mexican bashing threads, that say things like Mexico is nothing but a 3rd world country, that will always remain the same, or they start talking about Mexico tourism, where the haters believe the last tragic incident in Mexico, especially if it involves a gringo, will kill foreign tourism to Mexico forever.

The fear mongering, and bashing of Mexico, gets kinda old too. When I see these types of threads, I usually roll my eyes, and say, "here we go again."

The only thing different in this thread is that Chippy, started it by bringing up Trump, and saying it's going to get real ugly too. Although I share Chippy's views on Trump, I think bringing up Trump in this thread was uncalled for. Usually, it's the ultraconservatives that lead to degeneration of the threads.




[Edited on 6-23-2018 by JoeJustJoe]







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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 01:02 PM



The only thing different in this thread is that Chippy, started it by bringing up Trump, and saying it's going to get real ugly too. Although I share Chippy's views on Trump, I think bringing up Trump in this thread was uncalled for. Usually, it's the ultraconservatives that lead to degeneration of the threads.



Yeah right. Racist racist bigot bigot




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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 01:43 PM


Thanks to SF & H for posting, and Kaslokid for translating the article. An arrest, and seizure of a firearm is a big deal!


JJJ, what I am hoping to hear from people in the area, is how the people who live in the area feel about this event, and their overall safety. Do they see this as a singular event, or something they see as a change in the local culture?

Dali Dali, check your U2U




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[*] posted on 6-23-2018 at 05:11 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Maderita  

The very few "locals" live on scattered ranches, miles apart. The nearest town (Ojos Negros) is 20 miles on dirt roads.
Knowing several ranchers of the Sierra de Juárez, I don't think that they see this a a change to their culture. This incident was likely perpetrated by a non-local, (may I guess, a drug addict from an urban area?). The first such incident in 22 years, hardly a "trend."

The "local crimes" I hear stories of involve suspected cattle rustling, a truck stolen from a ranch in the middle of the night, semi-wild dogs shot for killing livestock or "trespassing". (It's hard to blame the dogs, these ranch dogs must hunt for their meals). A ranch was torched to the ground and then abandoned. Rumor has it that they were mixed up with the wrong people (drug cartel).

There are concerns of safety in general. With guns being illegal (with a few exceptions), these isolated ranchers know that only the bad guys have guns. Army patrols search ranches and confiscate unauthorized firearms from ranchers, leaving them without personal protection. Cell service is not available through much of the sierra.

There is some drug running through the sierra, though it seems to have diminished somewhat since the 1990s. There is also some marijuana and opium poppy growing. It seems the locals know how to avoid problems with that. Some stories and the details are best not repeated...


Maderita, did you actually ask the local ranchers about the safely level in the area, and their general feelings how they feel about safety after this incident, or is this how you think they feel?

Next time you talk to the Mexican ranchers, tell them to register their firearms, and then don't let the army patrols to confiscate their firearms, because those Mexican farmers, or just about any Mexican citizen or foreign legal resident, have a Mexican Constitutional right to keep and bear arms.

Oh it's not like gun happy USA, and Mexicans can't openly carry guns like a state in Arizona, nor could legally carry around an AK-15, AK-47, or any assault type weapon, but a 12 gauge shotgun should be fine, as long as they keep it in their ranch, and use it for self-defensive. Licensed sport hunting is also available in Mexico.




















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[*] posted on 6-24-2018 at 07:01 AM


"I don't see how an isolated incident within the park would worry folks on the ranches too much."
Almost all those ranches are fenced, and of course, probably know who belongs or not. Who cares anyway - the focus would be on your safety if you plan to visit the campground. This type of crime hasn't happened around there in 20 years, one person arrested, the other one isn't going to act alone. I've camped several times in the area, NOT in the Natl Park campground - there are options.
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[*] posted on 6-24-2018 at 07:48 AM


I appreciate the feedback from you folks! I have passed through there once before, in late 2014. In fact, it was one of my first post on this forum asking about the area; http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=75575&got...

I crossed at Tecate, turned south at Rumorosa, and wound up driving through to Ojo Negro. Next time I intend to cross at Mexicali, find the old Rumorosa grade up toward the park, then search for a fun route down the south east side of the divide.


On the last trip, I had a problem that required me to spend a couple of hours on the side of the road with my load spread out. I didn't need any help, but I was pleased to find that all of the local traffic stopped to offer it!




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[*] posted on 6-24-2018 at 12:24 PM
Murder right here at Malibu Creek Campground


Here is an example of the fact that murders can occur anywhere in the world, including the good ole U.S. I think many Americans sometimes forget this.
https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Man-Fatally-Shot-Ma...
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