BajaNomad

FM3 Question??? Benefits???

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wsdunc - 8-14-2009 at 09:52 AM

Sheesh, a lot of heated discussion! Here is my situation: I bought (fideo) a lot in Baja about 4 yrs ago, plan to start building in the next couple of years. I was not required to show an FM3 at any time during the purchase through notario, bank etc. I do plan to get an FM3 just because it is not too expensive, and MAY be necessary. I certainly plan to have one before construction. I would have one today except:

My lot is in BCS. I have not been able to travel to BCS for several years, and may not til next year. I have heard that the FM3 is not "legit" until registered in the area where you (or your lot) reside. I don't know how to work around this issue.

So a few questions about registering your FM3. Do you need to do this every renewal, or only originally? Can you originally register, and then renew remotely? Is there value in my situation for an unregistered FM3 acquired through a consulate?
Thanx for your help, be gentle everyone

squid - 8-15-2009 at 02:36 PM

Why is it so damn difficult for some guys (Gringos) to comprehend that as a tourist > and coming to Mexico on a FM-T means you are a tourist - YOU CAN NOT OWN ANYTHING IN MEXICO.
No Real Estate, no lot, no house, no car, no nada!
If you think the bank (fido) is the real owner, think twice. The bank did not pay for anything. The bank is just holding the trust. The fido is in your name and nobody can take the property out of your hands.
You paid for the propert and not the bank.
It might be that you don't have to show the bank a FM-#. But that is not an immigration matter.
IS THAT SO DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND?
O.K., you *********** w/ no FM-#
Why don't you tell the Immigration quite honestly when you are applying for your first FM-3 that you own property (house, lot or what's-so-ever) AND YOU ARE ONLY HOLDING AN FM-T.
Lets see what happens.
But be aware that you might face deportation.
O.K. have the gutts and do it.

[Edited on 8-16-2009 by BajaNomad]

arrowhead - 8-15-2009 at 08:04 PM

wsdunc, you should just ignore everything squidwad said. He has absolutely no clue.

There are two separate areas of the law which he has somehow put together into one big continuum. First there is the Mexican Foreign Investment Law. That is the law that says foreigners can own land in the restricted zone under a fideicomiso. When you get a fideicomiso, the bank actually makes an application to the Foreign Ministry for permission to hold the land for you. If you have a fideicomisio on your land, then you are good to go. You do not need any form of Mexican visa to own that land. The Foreign Ministry has already approved it. Furthermore, in spite of what squidwad said, you do not actually own the land. Bare legal title is held by the bank. The bank is the owner of record of the land. You have a fideicomiso, which is really a contract between you and the bank that describes what you can do with the land owned by the bank. There is no legal requirement in Mexico to hold a visa to simply own real estate in Mexico.

Now as to the second issue: immigration. In order for you to be in Mexico, you need a visa which describes the duration of your stay and the things that you can do while there. It could be a FMT, FM3 or FM2. But that has nothing to do with your interest in your land in BCS. Furthermore, squidwad is wrong about the FMT. It is not just a tourist visa. Take a look at it sometime. It is also a business visa if you have business to conduct in Mexico, as long you are not employed down there or involved directly in operations as an employer. You can go down there on an FMT and sign contracts, attend business board meetings, and do all sorts of business related to your Mexican assets on a FMT.

Says prove your status ? FM 2 or 3----------

beercan - 8-15-2009 at 09:20 PM

http://portal.sre.gob.mx/was_eng/index.php?option=displaypag...

Here's the actual S-1 form to apply for a fideicomiso

arrowhead - 8-15-2009 at 11:36 PM

http://www.sre.gob.mx/tramites/juridico/doctos/s1.doc

Please note that it asks for what type of visa and the document number, but does not require it to be a FM3 or FM2.

Here's their list of tramites for applying for a fideicomiso.

http://www.sre.gob.mx/tramites/sociedades/tema2g.htm

You ought to know that if you ask three Mexicans what he rules are, you will get four or five different answers.

Can you find where it says you need a FM3 or FM2? I'll bet if you go into any immigartion office in Mexico and ask, they will tell you to get a FM3. Why? Fees, fees, fees.

This is Mexico, nobody is in charge.

There's a CashCow in the middle of the road

Mulegena - 8-15-2009 at 11:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
... ask, they will tell you to get a FM3.
Why? Fees, fees, fees.

Don't get hit!

wessongroup - 8-16-2009 at 06:00 AM

A bit dated, but it does touch on many points discussed in this thread and others... this link was posted as a new topic a few days back...

It is the Consular Section of Embassy of Mexico, in the United States of American and provides a direct source to the answer of many, many questions.

It is understood that when in "country" things are not always in black and white, but then it would not be Mexico if it was just like the U.S....

http://portal.sre.gob.mx/was_eng/index.php?option=displaypag...


MEXICAN IMMIGRATION RULES AND REGULATIONS

february 8, 2005
The following summary will give you an insight into the complexities of our Immigration regulations and, if in the travel business, the importance of a close relationship with our Consulates in the area where you have your residence or you operate your business.

Each individual nationality has got a set of regulations deriving from accords and treaties negotiated, or inexistent, between that particular government and our government. Those agreements deal with each individual immigration status, such as tourists, students, technical personnel, scholarship holders,retirees, company counselors, sometimes clergy, and so forth. These change from time to time according to international situations or renegotiation of certain aspects.

Some nationalities require a Mexican consular stamp or stick-on called a visa, in addition to their immigration documents; some require it in a certain status but not in others, some nationalities pay for the visa while others do not; some pay in certain categories but not in others, some can travel without a special order from Mexico, other require this special permit in certain categories but not in others, etcetera. All of this depends on reciprocity or whether that country has negotiated with Mexico a visa agreement or not, and under what terms, as those treaties or accords shed light on the applicant’s document to be issued according to the stated specific purpose of his or her trip.



GENERAL INFORMATION ON VISAE

Traditionally, Mexico has been a tourist, business and student destination for nationals of North America, Western Europe, Japan and Latin America (although some of the latter nationalities can only be documented in their respective countries of origin). These travelers do not have to apply to Mexico City for their entry permits, if they travel as tourists, students or on business. Certain Latin American countries have negotiated duty-free visae for their nationals but not their exemption. Other fellow Latins do not require a visa and can also be given the tourist card on board an aircraft carrier but some, if not legal residents in the country where the application is filed, should follow the rule of a previous okay from Mexico City.

All Western countries and some Asian countries, because of their investments and bulk of trade with Mexico, have visa exemption agreements and enjoy certain facilities in some categories, tourists being the easiest of all as they can get their tourist card from the airline. However, they need to come personally to our Consular offices for their travel documents if they intend to carry out a profitable business (ordinary business contacts can be done on the tourist card issued by the airline), or perform technical counseling for a Mexican firm; this rule also applies to students and some other categories such as foreign correspondents. They cannot accept a job in Mexico, nor engage in a paid activity without a special permit from the INM.

[Edited on 8-16-2009 by wessongroup]

squid - 8-16-2009 at 08:46 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
wsdunc, you should just ignore everything squidwad said. He has absolutely no clue.

There are two separate areas of the law which he has somehow put together into one big continuum. First there is the Mexican Foreign Investment Law. That is the law that says foreigners can own land in the restricted zone under a fideicomiso. When you get a fideicomiso, the bank actually makes an application to the Foreign Ministry for permission to hold the land for you. If you have a fideicomisio on your land, then you are good to go. You do not need any form of Mexican visa to own that land. The Foreign Ministry has already approved it. Furthermore, in spite of what squidwad said, you do not actually own the land. Bare legal title is held by the bank. The bank is the owner of record of the land. You have a fideicomiso, which is really a contract between you and the bank that describes what you can do with the land owned by the bank. There is no legal requirement in Mexico to hold a visa to simply own real estate in Mexico.

Now as to the second issue: immigration. In order for you to be in Mexico, you need a visa which describes the duration of your stay and the things that you can do while there. It could be a FMT, FM3 or FM2. But that has nothing to do with your interest in your land in BCS. Furthermore, squidwad is wrong about the FMT. It is not just a tourist visa. Take a look at it sometime. It is also a business visa if you have business to conduct in Mexico, as long you are not employed down there or involved directly in operations as an employer. You can go down there on an FMT and sign contracts, attend business board meetings, and do all sorts of business related to your Mexican assets on a FMT.


Now comes Mr. "Know it All" and states that you can do business and own assets on an FM-T.
BS BS BS etc.
A) The title of the land you purchased is in your name. The bank is holding the trust > no more.
But you are the owner
So you own something.
A1) Then you have build a house. You are owning a house on your land. Just, Mr. BS-chiter, try to tell the INM that you own property without an FM-# > 3 or 2.
Plain and simple

B) Business
Yes you can attend business meetings in Mexico. Any time you want >>> as long as you have nothing to do w/ that company.
(But which company lets you attend their meetings???)
BUT: If that company is in your name or your name is on any business papers, and you don't have a business FM after the FM-3, you are faster out of the country as you ever came in.

It is highly recommendet to all those who want to try out:::: Ask the INM before you are doing such BS.
Mr. "Know-it-All" knows nada and you better do not try any of his recomendations.
Best example: my husband (American) wanted to be my business partner in my shop. I am Mexican) It was NOT POSSIBLE >>> ILLEGAL without a business FM. And he got an FM-3

DENNIS - 8-16-2009 at 08:52 AM

What is it about Mulege and marooons? What's the attraction?

Squid....hmmmmmm

arrowhead - 8-16-2009 at 11:58 AM

Squid:
Mexicana....check
Married to a Gringo......check
Mulege.......check
Clueless.......check

You would HAVE to be Bruce Leech's wife. Say it ain't so.

toneart - 8-16-2009 at 12:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
Squid:
Mexicana....check
Married to a Gringo......check
Mulege.......check
Clueless.......check

You would HAVE to be Bruce Leech's wife. Say it ain't so.


If true, her spelling is certainly superior to Bruce's. :rolleyes:



[Edited on 8-17-2009 by toneart]

squid - 8-17-2009 at 08:53 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
What is it about Mulege and marooons? What's the attraction?


Dennis, what about your brain-tumor??????????????
It prevends you from posting to the topic and more 'under-the-beltline'.
BUT, DOES IT HURT?
:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

maspacifico - 8-17-2009 at 09:48 AM

Where's Skeet? Wheee!

CortezBlue - 8-17-2009 at 10:01 AM

You don't have an FM3 your don't have a chance in hell if you get into a legal wrangling.
It is a bit of an insurance policy

Quote:
Originally posted by bajagrouper
Squid, I own a beach house with fidecomiso and all I needed was my FMT, passport and small down payment check...
no FM3 no kidding

Quote:
Originally posted by squid
First of all: As a homeowner you MUST have an FM-3.
If you don't have one and INM gets the message, your house can be confiscated. But also a big fine might do it. Depends on the INM guy dealing your matter.
Some folks (homeowners) think as they are coming down here just for some weeks (less than 180 days), they don't need a FM-3, FMT is good enough. Think twice!
As a homeownre w/ fideocomiso you can apply for an FM-2 right away. That gives you a lot of protection in Mexico.

E.D.R.Rick - 6-6-2012 at 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by squid
First of all: As a homeowner you MUST have an FM-3.
If you don't have one and INM gets the message, your house can be confiscated. But also a big fine might do it. Depends on the INM guy dealing your matter.
Some folks (homeowners) think as they are coming down here just for some weeks (less than 180 days), they don't need a FM-3, FMT is good enough. Think twice!
As a homeownre w/ fideocomiso you can apply for an FM-2 right away. That gives you a lot of protection in Mexico.

E.D.R.Rick - 6-6-2012 at 12:28 PM

I hear now in 2012 you dont need a FM3,if you go down once a year and are a homeowner?

famous line

bajaguy - 6-6-2012 at 01:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by E.D.R.Rick
I hear now in 2012 you dont need a FM3,if you go down once a year and are a homeowner?





As Inspector (Dirty) Harry Calahan (Clint Eastwood) said in "Dirty Harry"........"Feeling lucky..........?"

E.D.R.Rick - 6-6-2012 at 02:01 PM

what do you mean"felling lucky"what do you know?I've heard that there's new changes in 2012.

Bob and Susan - 6-6-2012 at 02:27 PM

rick...with an fmt you are a tourist

when you leave the country
you abandon all your belongings
and they "can" be taken

they may "take" not but the "can" "take"

as for the fido...
in simple words...
the bank holds the deed
it's in their name
you have a "trust" (a contract) and
control the use of the land

you own nothing more than control of the land for a specified time
so...
in simple language you are the "owner"
we'll all be dead when the trust expires

bajaguy - 6-6-2012 at 02:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by E.D.R.Rick
what do you mean"felling lucky"what do you know?I've heard that there's new changes in 2012.





We have all "heard' there will be changes in 2012, but now it's almost 6 months into 2012 and no changes yet.

I would not want to risk my investment by failing to renew my FM-3/2 and just have an FMM.......after all, FMM's are for tourists and if you have a house filled with your "stuff", you are NOT a tourist.

meme - 6-7-2012 at 09:47 AM

There is much new & good info & groups discussion on this subject on :
TSFG@yahoogroups.com

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