BajaNomad - Major Shake-Up at Loreto Migracion

Major Shake-Up at Loreto Migracion

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Don Alley - 1-12-2010 at 10:51 AM

The stub on the tourist visa is a big problem. Tourists are not always (ever?) told to hold on to these for their exit by plane. There was a rash of incidents a few years ago when many visitors didn't even remember seeing such a thing, and had to pay the fine to board. We had a problem like Marla described with a guest of ours.

This process presents a tempting opportunity for an individual official to pocket some extra cash. It's also an unfortunate regulation by the government, charging more than double the original visa fee, when a passport stamp should suffice.

djh - 1-12-2010 at 08:32 PM

Great Avatar, Don !

:-)

ncampion - 1-12-2010 at 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by djh
Great Avatar, Don !

:-)

Do you mean the shark or the ant??

.

djh - 1-12-2010 at 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ncampion

Quote:

Originally posted by djh
Great Avatar, Don !

:-)

Do you mean the shark or the ant?? .

YES !

SunnyDay - 2-3-2010 at 12:37 AM

Don't get me started, but I got me started. Long story short, with the ID I had (shoddy admittedly due to having my purse stolen 2 days before departure) the airline let me on. Nope, not good enough, had to pay a "fine" for lousey ID when arrived in Loreto. My daughter too who had all her proper ID. This was pre-passport required days, but costs us a couple hundred bucks total. They were in cahoots with AeroCalifornia somehow too -- several other stories.

Baja&Back - 2-3-2010 at 09:52 AM

I am informed by our January Wagonmaster that the employees at Loreto Migracion charged our caravan $1500 in penalties for not obtaining FMTs at Tijuana (where you cannot park 15 RVs). Not sure if the money went into the bank or someone's pocket. Seems the only ones this "shake up" has shook up (or down) is US!

More details when the caravan gets back on the 9th.
:fire:

rockman - 2-3-2010 at 10:20 AM

This could continue to happen if you do not make the effort to file a formal complaint (denuncia).

DENNIS - 2-3-2010 at 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja&Back
Loreto Migracion charged our caravan $1500 in penalties for not obtaining FMTs at Tijuana (where you cannot park 15 RVs).

Barry....Is that dollars or pesos? Just curious.

David K - 2-3-2010 at 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja&Back
I am informed by our January Wagonmaster that the employees at Loreto Migracion charged our caravan $1500 in penalties for not obtaining FMTs at Tijuana (where you cannot park 15 RVs). Not sure if the money went into the bank or someone's pocket. Seems the only ones this "shake up" has shook up (or down) is US!

More details when the caravan gets back on the 9th.
:fire:

Have you ever gotten FM-Ts for your caravans at the border before, if not there then where? Even if you do get them in advance at the Mexican consulate or Disciver Baja Travel Club... You still have to stop at the border to get them validated. Sounds like all 15 mohos need to wait there and then meet up somewhere south of Tijuana... after each gets his FM-T and then leaves to make room for the next.

He should have known better

Dave - 2-3-2010 at 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja&Back
I am informed by our January Wagonmaster that the employees at Loreto Migracion charged our caravan $1500 in penalties for not obtaining FMTs at Tijuana

Your wagon master should be staked to an ant hill and left for the Injuns.

KAT54 - 2-3-2010 at 12:56 PM

Is not the rule FMT at the border?
Did you break the rule?
Should not you pay the fine?
Should not you know better being a professional?

monoloco - 2-3-2010 at 01:03 PM

Before we had FM3's we would get our FMT's at Guerrero Negro, a couple of times there were no immigration people there and we picked them up in La Paz and were never fined.

longlegsinlapaz - 2-3-2010 at 01:15 PM

Baja&Back, I agree with Dave & others above. If you're going to lead caravans down here, you have to know & abide by the laws & rules of the country. To have failed to make sure everyone in the caravan had or obtained FMT's at the border is inexcusable. How they all got through the GN check point is mind-boggling, but they could have also obtained FMT's there for a small monetary penalty.

IMO, the wagon master created the situation which was possibly exacerbated by Loreto Immigration taking advantage of what I view as total disregard for entering the country legally. Who knows?? It MAY VERY WELL BE that the official fine for making it that far south illegally could be $100 USD equivalent per rig, though it seems more likely the fine would be imposed at an individual person level.

Regardless the situation could & should have been avoided through better planning & the caravan company/wagon master insisting that everyone in the caravan obtained FMT's either in advance or at the border at the time of entry into the country.

Baja&Back, I feel you're directing your anger towards the wrong place....UNLESS....it can be proven the fines imposed were above the legal amount imposed for this type of violation.

rockman - 2-3-2010 at 01:28 PM

I've been told that fines, like fees for FM-3s, are supposed to be paid at a bank, and the receipt shown to Imigracion.

Correct ?

mtgoat666 - 2-3-2010 at 01:49 PM

Quote:

Do you tell your customers to get their visas on their own? Or does your service include visas?
As tour operator, you should arrange visas for your customers, or clearly tell customers that is their responsibility. Lack of parking is no excuse -- as operator you need to figure out how to do it right. Either obtain in advance or cross border in small groups

[Edited on 2-3-2010 by mtgoat666]

longlegsinlapaz - 2-3-2010 at 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rockman
I've been told that fines, like fees for FM-3s, are supposed to be paid at a bank, and the receipt shown to Imigracion.

Correct ?

Correct!! Immigration personnel are NOT authorized to request/accept money for anything, this is the reason that we're required to pay at the bank & take the stamped receipt back to Immigration.

BCSTech - 2-3-2010 at 02:47 PM

When we came down with Vagabundos in 2005, at least 20 rigs drove straight through the border crossing a TJ, and the guards were waving us through. Stopped at GN two days later and had to wait for someone to come open the office. No one in the GN office seemed to mind this, and we weren't charged a fine.

Paid the FM-T fees at the bank in Loreto.

roundtuit - 2-3-2010 at 03:36 PM

2010 - 2005 = 5 time enough for many changes as Mexico has modernized with computers. Should have known better or asked some one on Baja Nomad
:lol:

Baja&Back - 2-3-2010 at 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Do you tell your customers to get their visas on their own? Or does your service include visas?
As tour operator, you should arrange visas for your customers, or clearly tell customers that is their responsibility. Lack of parking is no excuse -- as operator you need to figure out how to do it right. Either obtain in advance or cross border in small groups

[Edited on 2-3-2010 by mtgoat666]

If there WERE clear cut rules, we'd be the first to obey them. Migracion changes procedures year by year.

Migracion or the Consulates have always refused to give us 32 blank FMT forms.

At one time, we took the guests down on the Tijuana Trolley to walk thru the gates to get FMTs as a group.

One time, on Migracion officers advice, we all pulled into secondary at San Ysidro. Got told to move on or face arrest.

For 2 years, got FMTs at Ensenada. Mr. Skinny Wire Glasses would suggest a bit of something for his personal desk drawer. Finally he realized his job was much easier if he only did FMTs for yachties, and we should move on to State line.

Last 2 years, Ms. Pretty Lady at Guerrero Negro office, and her Compadres, would fill out our forms (for a fee) & I would pay at Bancomer in town.

One trip, on a Sunday, we had to go to Migracion office on the main drag in Loreto. They very happily processed 32 FMTs & insisted I pay them directly at the office.

This winter, I stopped at Stateline TWO times & verified procedures with Magdalena and her new supervisor. No problema, they said. The tour, unfortunately, arrived on a Sunday, and moved on to Loreto downtown office as per company instructions. There, officials told them rules changed Nov 30/09 & forced them to pay a $48 USD fine, as well as the $24 FMT charge.

Still waiting to find out if this "fine" was paid directly to the officials at the office & receipts issued, or what.

Based on all this, It's back to the trolley ride to TJ again for the upcoming tour. (unless the Banjercito clerk decides it's against union rules to process 32 forms at once)

... and THEY complain not enough tourists want to visit Baja. Wonder why not???
Viva Mexico! :?:

CaboRon - 2-4-2010 at 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BCSTech
When we came down with Vagabundos in 2005, at least 20 rigs drove straight through the border crossing a TJ, and the guards were waving us through. Stopped at GN two days later and had to wait for someone to come open the office. No one in the GN office seemed to mind this, and we weren't charged a fine.

Paid the FM-T fees at the bank in Loreto.

However, if you carefully read the fine print in your vehicle insurance papers .... you will find a clause that states the insurance is invalid without a visa (FMT, FM3, Fm2) as soon as you cross the border into mexico.

BCSTech - 2-4-2010 at 07:35 AM

Since it was five years ago, I could give a flip. :biggrin:

Russ - 2-4-2010 at 07:39 AM

Quote:

Good point!

CaboRon - 2-4-2010 at 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BCSTech
Since it was five years ago, I could give a flip. :biggrin:

Others might care or be impacted .... Let's try and give useful information ...

Maybe, maybe not

Dave - 2-4-2010 at 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CaboRon
if you carefully read the fine print in your vehicle insurance papers .... you will find a clause that states the insurance is invalid without a visa (FMT, FM3, Fm2) as soon as you cross the border into mexico.

While I'm technically not from Missouri, I've lived there.

Show me.

gnukid - 9-7-2010 at 02:51 PM

Oscar Castañeda Davis sentenced to 3 months in prison and a fine for Loreto Immigration corruption

http://peninsulardigital.com/?p=21747

Por exigir “mordida”, le dieron 3 meses de prisión a funcionario de Migración

Oscar Castañeda Davis, resultó penalmente responsable en la comisión del delito de cohecho, además de ser multado con 30 días de salario mínimo

Luego de acreditársele la plena responsabilidad penal en la comisión del delito de cohecho, Oscar Castañeda Davis, fue sentenciado a 3 meses de prisión y multado con 30 días de salario mínimo, cuya resolución jurídica fue emitida por el Juez I de Distrito en Baja California Sur, derivado del trabajo jurídico penal del Agente del Ministerio Público de la Federación.

Se resalta que Castañeda Davis fue notificado de la resolución dentro del proceso penal 1/2010, donde una vez desahogadas las pruebas y testimoniales se resolvió conforme a derecho, destacó la delegación estatal de la Procuraduría General de la República -PGR-.

Como se informara oportunamente en El Peninsular, Oscar Castañeda Davis, durante el pasado día 11 de diciembre del año pasado en su calidad de servidor público como oficial del Instituto Nacional de Migración -INM- con sede en Loreto, solicitó a un usuario que le entregara dinero en efectivo como pago por los trámites migratorios consistentes en el refrendo de su forma FM3, en lugar de realizarse dicho depósito en una institución bancaria.

Por ello, Castañeda Davis, quedó a disposición del representante social de la Federación con sede en esa ciudad, quien consignó y dio seguimiento al expediente de averiguación previa AP/PGR/BCS/LT/070/2009, por el delito antes indicado.

El Gobierno Federal seguirá trabajando para propiciar un ambiente de certidumbre jurídica en el que las personas tengan la certeza de que cuentan con instituciones y programas gubernamentales que garantizan el respeto a sus derechos y la preservación de su patrimonio mediante la aplicación de la ley.

-----poor translation follows

For demanding bribe, he was given three months' imprisonment for Migration official

Oscar Castañeda Davis, was criminally responsible for committing the crime of bribery, in addition to being fined 30 days' minimum wage.

After credited with the full criminal responsibility for committing the crime of bribery, Oscar Castaneda Davis, was sentenced to three months in prison and fined 30 days' minimum wage, whose legal settlement was issued by District Judge I in Baja California Sur , derived from criminal legal work of the Agent of the Federal Public Ministry.

Castañeda is highlighted that Davis was notified of the resolution within the criminal process 1 / 2010, where once again study the evidence and testimony are resolved according to law, said the state delegation of the Attorney General's Office, PGR.

As reported in a timely manner in the Peninsular, Oscar Castaneda Davis, during the 11th of December last year in his capacity as public servant as an officer of the National Migration Institute, INM, based in Loreto, a user asked to hand over cash as payment for immigration procedures consisting of the endorsement as FM3, rather than made the deposit in a bank.
Therefore, Castañeda Davis, was available to the office of the Federation representative based in that city, who recorded and monitored the preliminary investigation dossier AP/PGR/BCS/LT/070/2009 for the crime above.

The Federal Government will continue working to foster an environment of legal certainty which people are satisfied that they have with institutions and government programs that guarantee respect for their rights and the preservation of its assets by law enforcement.
Short URL: http://peninsulardigital.com/?p=21747

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