BajaNomad - Bicyclists riding side by side

Bicyclists riding side by side

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Bajahowodd - 1-9-2010 at 01:42 PM

"Closing speeds of 100 mph or more, a foot or two separation between oncoming vehicles, no shoulders, "

And that's on the mountainous sections! :lol:

LancairDriver - 1-9-2010 at 02:17 PM

If this stupidity continues, an 18 wheeler will eventually get tired of it and take care of it. Their safety and living are being compromised.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-9-2010 at 04:04 PM

[/ALIGN]

Edit: Edit Comment and GIF!

The times that I have traveled Mex-1 I have seen bicyclists three times with saddle bags on the back of their bikes with no chase vehicle. I have always given them a wide distance between us when I pass them and never thought ill of them. This GIF in no way reflects what I think should happen to them, or the "Chivo De Satanás" but it sure could happen! Be careful out there people! I do not condone hit and run either! Thank you!

[Edited on 1-12-2010 by ELINVESTI8]

BajaNuts - 1-10-2010 at 12:23 AM

I had a scary experience just a couple months ago here in rural eastern WA.

I was driving the big-rig 1-ton work truck with the normal side mirrors.

I come around a bend are here are two cyclists! There are 2' shoulders, plenty of room to ride single file with safety...........but these two a-holes have to ride side by side!!!!!!!!!!

That put one of the riders in the vehicle lane of the highway when there was plenty of room outside of the fogline for a biker to ride single file!

And to top it all off,.......THERE'S A CAR COMING! So I have no-where to go!

Do you biker's understand "momentum" and things like "fully loaded work truck"???? I'm hitting the horn, braking, swerving, whatever I can do............

and I got home. and they got home......this time,,,,,,,,,,,,,

and I was REALLY TICKED OFF...that those stupid bikers chose to ride in the vehicle lane when there was ample room outside the fog line!

And I know they were locals because they did not have any "baggage". No saddlebags, trailers, or anything. Just stoopid people out for a toodle on a dangerous stretch of highway riding side by side.
:fire:

Don't get me wrong! I'm not gunning for bikers! But I think cyclists are stupid to believe that other motorists will automatically YIELD at the presence of a bike.

Who do you think will win??? Cyclist or drunk 18-wheeler driver?

The cyclist may have been right as he rode along- in the middle of the lane with a kiddie-tandem behind him-----
but he's still as dead, and the little one is dead also....

I feel like the bikers were lucky that it was I that was behind the wheel and looking out for hazards like........deer.........kids............BIKERS.........ice...........and not some other hack just trying to collect the paycheck.

There's a poem I heard a long time ago, think back to driver's ed, and although I don't have it quite right, here's how it goes_

This is the story of Mr. Wright
who died defending his Right-of-way,
He may have been WRight, as he sped along,
but he's still as dead as if he were wrong.

Yea, they may have a RIGHT to the highway,

but who in their right mind would trust that all the other drivers would respect that...........and furthermore.........why would you EVER entrust the lives of you CHILDREN to the (cerebral) understanding that vehicles are to "share the road"..........................................let alone share the road on MX1?!?!?!???

:fire:

fixtrauma - 1-10-2010 at 12:36 AM

[Yea, they may have a RIGHT to the highway,

but who in their right mind would trust that all the other drivers would respect that...........and furthermore.........why would you EVER entrust the lives of you CHILDREN to the (cerebral) understanding that vehicles are to "share the road"..........................................let alone share the road on MX1?!?!?!???]

Well put BajaNuts
:yes:

toneart - 1-10-2010 at 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNuts
I had a scary experience just a couple months ago here in rural eastern WA.

I was driving the big-rig 1-ton work truck with the normal side mirrors.

I come around a bend are here are two cyclists! There are 2' shoulders, plenty of room to ride single file with safety...........but these two a-holes have to ride side by side!!!!!!!!!!

That put one of the riders in the vehicle lane of the highway when there was plenty of room outside of the fogline for a biker to ride single file!

And to top it all off,.......THERE'S A CAR COMING! So I have no-where to go!

Do you biker's understand "momentum" and things like "fully loaded work truck"???? I'm hitting the horn, braking, swerving, whatever I can do............

and I got home. and they got home......this time,,,,,,,,,,,,,

and I was REALLY TICKED OFF...that those stupid bikers chose to ride in the vehicle lane when there was ample room outside the fog line!

And I know they were locals because they did not have any "baggage". No saddlebags, trailers, or anything. Just stoopid people out for a toodle on a dangerous stretch of highway riding side by side.
:fire:

I agree with this completely. And I am happy you were able to avoid them. They were lucky...and stupid!

DENNIS - 1-10-2010 at 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fixtrauma
they may have a RIGHT to the highway,

Like I have a RIGHT to walk through Watts with a sheet over my head. RIGHTS have their limitations and require discretionary interpretation.
I'll keep the sheet on but, I'll walk through Malibu instead. :lol:

mtgoat666 - 1-10-2010 at 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
Like I have a RIGHT to walk through Watts with a sheet over my head. RIGHTS have their limitations and require discretionary interpretation.
I'll keep the sheet on but, I'll walk through Malibu instead. :lol:

dennis,
i never took you for a racists type. so sad, i used to be amused at your antics, now i need to question your antics

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-10-2010 at 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

dennis,
i never took you for a racists type. so sad, i used to be amused at your antics, now i need to question your antics

MTGOAT666 YOU NEED THIS AGAIN!

DENNIS - 1-10-2010 at 10:17 AM

It's Sunday morning, Goatbladder. Why don't you try to see the light side of things for a change.

:lol:

Did you notice this thing in my post? Do you have any idea what the connotation might be? :lol:

Ron_Perry - 1-11-2010 at 12:04 AM

My two cents. I haven't heard from anyone claiming to be an avid cyclist. I have been mt. biking and road riding for over 30 years and have belonged to several cycling clubs.
First off, riding two abreast when one rider is outside a marked bike lane is a no-no, plain and simple....It's a rule stated with all bike clubs. Does it happen? Hell yes, with burro, selfcentered riders. I cringe when I see it, and it puts all cyclist in a undesirable light.
A car blocking for cyclist? WTF? Never heard of it, nor seen it in the states. IT HAS TO BE ILLEGAL IN THE US! Only in Mexico, maybe where they feel they can get away with it. That is BS, and once again, hurts the rest of us who ride within the law.
Towing your kids in a bicycle cart down highway 1 in Baja? Right off the top, I cannot think of anything more dangerous to a couple of kids. I have done a ton of touring by bike in Europe, Canada, and the US. ...Baja highway 1 has no interest for me, it is too narrow.

But cycling down highway 1 is not against the law. So let me ask all those who feel cyclist should not ride this highway a hypothetical question. Visualize the most dangerous and blind curve in all of Baja. Stalled on this turn, just out of site, is a soon to be discarded Baja junker, taking up the lane you are in. A few family member are just getting out of the car. YOU are pulling 20 fiberglass boat. An 18 wheeler is coming from the opposite direction. CAN YOU STOP IN TIME? Why not? Driving too fast?
In a real life situation, from Ensenada to La Paz, I may pass a couple of cyclist a trip. At worst, I may lose a few minutes waiting for a place to pass. Or on a straight, uncrowded stretch, I may not skip a beat. I spend more time stopping to take a pee, and smelling the desert.
Please, do not let the small percentage of burroes put a bulleyes on my back when I ride. There is a burro in every sport, hobby, and pursuit. Boater, hunters, water skiers, offroaders, mt. climbers, ALL others who, one way or another, put others at risk.

Finally!.....

Sharksbaja - 1-11-2010 at 04:05 AM

..... a valid response from an avid hiway cyclist. Thank you for weighing in without repose.

I agree with your complete statement and only wish more would adhere to your parameters.

It could maybe influence aforementioned idiots into a safer environment for the children at least, not to mention the general traffic.

Seriously, I don't think these adventurists do their homework correctly. Is the road and related hazards a part of the planning and itinerary?

I digress! Bullcaca! These "trips" are well thunk out by OCD cyclists. Their only goal is to conquer that goal. Right there with Everest summiters, they are so goal oriented and have disregard for hazards.

Anyhoo dude, keep safe. :smug:

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by Sharksbaja]

wessongroup - 1-11-2010 at 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sharksbaja
..... a valid response from an avid hiway cyclist. Thank you for weighing in without repose.

I agree with your complete statement and only wish more would adhere to your parameters.

It could maybe influence aforementioned idiots into a safer environment for the children at least, not to mention the general traffic.

Seriously, I don't think these adventurists do their homework correctly. Is the road and related hazards a part of the planning and itinerary?

I digress! Bullcaca! These "trips" are well thunk out by OCD cyclists. Their only goal is to conquer that goal. Right there with Everest summiters, they are so goal oriented and have disregard for hazards.

Anyhoo dude, keep safe. :smug:

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by Sharksbaja]

A very balanced approach... I however still have a hard time equating a "bicycle" with a vehicle

Delivered the Los Angeles Examiner for 6 years when growing up, and the first thing I learned was a car will kill me!!!

And my routes, delivery and collections were based on that simple fact.. watch out for CARS.. they are bigger and faster.. no matter what is legal!!!

I agree with the statement about driving too fast... most everyone is in too big a rush..and at those speeds proper emergency action can not be taken...

We drive the old road and the toll road a bit.. and find that most are driving way over the posted speed limit on roads not designed for these speeds.. and watching folks "blow" stop signs is, well just unbelievable .... and just reinforces our mind set to drive super defensively ...

I read the story of that bus that went off the road, due to poor brakes... and that 80% of all accidents in MX are due to poor maintenance of the vehicle ...

I had not taken into account, that the "vehicles" which are going to fast, will also have mechanical defects: steering, brakes.. and others

Has put another thing into my memory bank while riding in or driving a car in Mexico thanks

DianaT - 1-11-2010 at 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by fixtrauma
they may have a RIGHT to the highway,

Naw, Malibu would be a bad idea. There they might think you were homeless with the sheet around you and you would be arrested. Places like Malibu don't have homeless people. :biggrin:

Point well made, Dennis. Besides discretionary interpretation, rights have, or should have consequences. My son is a mountain climber and I argue with him all the time about how stupid it is for climbers to climb some mountains in the dead of winter and then rescuers have to risk their lives to save them.

But for riding a bike down Baja---please don't take the kids.

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by DianaT]

Baja12valve - 1-11-2010 at 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron_Perry
My two cents. I haven't heard from anyone claiming to be an avid cyclist. I have been mt. biking and road riding for over 30 years and have belonged to several cycling clubs.
First off, riding two abreast when one rider is outside a marked bike lane is a no-no, plain and simple....It's a rule stated with all bike clubs. Does it happen? Hell yes, with burro, selfcentered riders. I cringe when I see it, and it puts all cyclist in a undesirable light.
A car blocking for cyclist? WTF? Never heard of it, nor seen it in the states. IT HAS TO BE ILLEGAL IN THE US! Only in Mexico, maybe where they feel they can get away with it. That is BS, and once again, hurts the rest of us who ride within the law.
Towing your kids in a bicycle cart down highway 1 in Baja? Right off the top, I cannot think of anything more dangerous to a couple of kids. I have done a ton of touring by bike in Europe, Canada, and the US. ...Baja highway 1 has no interest for me, it is too narrow.

But cycling down highway 1 is not against the law. So let me ask all those who feel cyclist should not ride this highway a hypothetical question. Visualize the most dangerous and blind curve in all of Baja. Stalled on this turn, just out of site, is a soon to be discarded Baja junker, taking up the lane you are in. A few family member are just getting out of the car. YOU are pulling 20 fiberglass boat. An 18 wheeler is coming from the opposite direction. CAN YOU STOP IN TIME? Why not? Driving too fast?
In a real life situation, from Ensenada to La Paz, I may pass a couple of cyclist a trip. At worst, I may lose a few minutes waiting for a place to pass. Or on a straight, uncrowded stretch, I may not skip a beat. I spend more time stopping to take a pee, and smelling the desert.
Please, do not let the small percentage of burroes put a bulleyes on my back when I ride. There is a burro in every sport, hobby, and pursuit. Boater, hunters, water skiers, offroaders, mt. climbers, ALL others who, one way or another, put others at risk.

Another avid cyclist with 30 years or riding here, reading this thread for the first time.
Ron_ Perry, you have it 110% right in all aspects, I could have not said it better, thank you. The only item left out is that there are some who think that bikes should not be on the road no matter what and they take their wrong thinking out on the bicyclist. Bikes are legal on roads, but like some drivers, they can be jerks.
For all of those who think running over a bicyclist is OK because of their dumbass riding, no matter what the person is doing, is it worth killing, maiming or injuring another person over that?
I recently met a bicycle tourist who went into Baja. He turned around, shaken to the core. Cars and trucks were part of the problem, but he said the dogs were the worst. Unfortunately I talked to him after his experience otherwise I would have strongly advised him against it. Mex 1 is one road that is not for a bicycle.

Baja12valve - 1-11-2010 at 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DianaT

Point well made, Dennis. Besides discretionary interpretation, rights have, or should have consequences. My son is a mountain climber and I argue with him all the time about how stupid it is for climbers to climb some mountains in the dead of winter and then rescuers have to risk their lives to save them.

As a member of SAR, I have gone into the mountains to rescue others. 80% of the time the people are experienced, they just had bad luck, something went wrong. 20% of the time we are interfering with natural selection. Sorry about this, but the Boy Scouts are the worst.

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja12valve
For all of those who think running over a bicyclist is OK because of their dumbass riding, no matter what the person is doing, is it worth killing, maiming or injuring another person over that?

Hyperbole can be a big part of discussions on the board. Nobody has seriously suggested that as a real solution to the problem. It's just fantasy payback....blowing off steam, so to speak.

Bajaboy - 1-11-2010 at 10:51 AM

Some call it hyperbole, I call it poor taste. There are too many whack jobs out there to go around making such suggestions.

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Hyperbole can be a big part of discussions on the board. Nobody has seriously suggested that as a real solution to the problem. It's just fantasy payback....blowing off steam, so to speak.

tripledigitken - 1-11-2010 at 10:52 AM

Baja12valve,

Having done Mex 1 a time or two on a motorcycle, I agree that dogs can be a problem.

Agree with your post, to want to run over a bicyclist is extreme. I have cussed at a few though. Mex 1 is no place for bicycles especially with kids in trailers.

Regarding support/blocker cars behind a group of bicycles not occuring in the United States, wrong. I have seen that many times outside of big cities. Bicycle races occur on public roads that can't always get shut down. Bicycle teams practice on roads and have support vehicles trailing the group as well. Those in San Diego are familar with S2 that goes through Borrego to Ocotillo, is it used as a Bicycle course several times each year and is not shut down.

Ken

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside
we happened upon a long line of cars going real slow. We thought it was an accident or a super slow truck. After awhile when it was our turn to pass we saw what was causing the slowdown. It was two bicyclists riding side by side with a vehicle riding behind them providing protection, in essence blocking the entire southbound lane.

This is from the first post in the thread. The problem wasn't primarily the cyclists, it was the car blocking traffic.
To me, it remains the core of the issue.

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajaboy
Some call it hyperbole, I call it poor taste. There are too many whack jobs out there to go around making such suggestions.

Perhaps we need another thread on Censorship as a method of controlling what people do.

wessongroup - 1-11-2010 at 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fixtrauma
[Yea, they may have a RIGHT to the highway,

but who in their right mind would trust that all the other drivers would respect that...........and furthermore.........why would you EVER entrust the lives of you CHILDREN to the (cerebral) understanding that vehicles are to "share the road"..........................................let alone share the road on MX1?!?!?!???]

Well put BajaNuts
:yes:

perhaps a suicide pact?

k-rico - 1-11-2010 at 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

This is from the first post in the thread. The problem wasn't primarily the cyclists, it was the car blocking traffic.
To me, it remains the core of the issue.

You're right, except for, perhaps, the car was there because of the cyclists. No cyclists, no TRAFFIC BLOCKING vehicle.

Without the TRAFFIC BLOCKING VEHICLE, it's pretty easy to pass cyclists without slowing down......................

much.

How do you know?

Dave - 1-11-2010 at 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron_Perry
cycling down highway 1 is not against the law.

Not that I have any knowledge to the contrary. Just because it's done doesn't make it legal. I assume it's illegal on the toll roads because I've seen signs...But signs don't mean anything. In Mexico, they're just suggestions.

Over the years when confronted with behavior I find troubling research usually proves that there actually is a law prohibiting it. Fact is that the laws in Mexico and the U.S. are similar. It's the application and enforcement that differs greatly.

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
You're right, except for, perhaps, the car was there because of the cyclists. No cyclists, no TRAFFIC BLOCKING vehicle.

Without the TRAFFIC BLOCKING VEHICLE, it's pretty easy to pass cyclists without slowing down......................

much.

Right. Your vehicle has too many mirrors anyway. :lol:

k-rico - 1-11-2010 at 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Right. Your vehicle has too many mirrors anyway. :lol:

Hmmmmm, OK DENNIS, whatever you say. Sit down, slowly take a couple of deep breaths, relax, you'll be OK.

Bajahowodd - 1-11-2010 at 12:10 PM

This thread makes me scratch my head. Granted, the issue of hauling kids in trailers behind the bike is appalling. But after that, the rest seems ridiculous. Has no one ever pass a big rig, a bus, an RV or some wildly overloaded pick up along highway 1? How is passing a single vehicle and a couple of bicycles so much more of a challenge?

k-rico - 1-11-2010 at 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
This thread makes me scratch my head. Granted, the issue of hauling kids in trailers behind the bike is appalling. But after that, the rest seems ridiculous. Has no one ever pass a big rig, a bus, an RV or some wildly overloaded pick up along highway 1? How is passing a single vehicle and a couple of bicycles so much more of a challenge?

Oh come on, surely you see the difference.

mtgoat666 - 1-11-2010 at 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

Quote:

Oh come on, surely you see the difference.

there is no difference. slow vehicle is a slow vehicle. bikes are vehicles with same right to use the road as the slow trucks and slow RVs.

i note that many of the people here calling for banning of bikes are elderly drivers, and young folk often call for banning of elderly drivers :lol:

tripledigitken - 1-11-2010 at 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

Quote:

Oh come on, surely you see the difference.

THIS IS THE DIFFERENCE.

Define slow.

Bicycles (except race conditions) travel 5-20 mph+-

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by tripledigitken]

k-rico - 1-11-2010 at 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

Quote:

Oh come on, surely you see the difference.

Goat, how about people in wheelchairs or on skate boards?

Or, more to the point, how about clowns juggling bowling pins on unicycles?

All vehicles.

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by k-rico]

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 12:36 PM

If they were "Hands off the brakes going down to Sta. Rosalia," we wouldn't be discussing this. In my experience, they are going up hill to the Buf with little opportunity for a car to pass without just making matters more dangerous. This is a three mile grade at about three MPH.
Screw patientce. I have better things to do. What makes it worse is I'm being forced to do it. No one asked me if they could take over the only road for their private use.

CAN WE HEAR FROM THE CHICKEN COOP GROUP. NOW THAT WOULD BE ENTERTAINING!

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-11-2010 at 12:53 PM

Edit: To Add Report Button!

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by ELINVESTI8]

Is This A Mexican Standoff?

Bajahowodd - 1-11-2010 at 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

i note that many of the people here calling for banning of bikes are elderly drivers, and young folk often call for banning of elderly drivers :lol:

Baja12valve - 1-11-2010 at 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Screw patientce. I have better things to do. What makes it worse is I'm being forced to do it. No one asked me if they could take over the only road for their private use.

Just out of curiosity, how do you pass a bicycle, especially if you have had to wait more than 30 seconds? Do you blow by them hand on the horn, brushing them off the road as your "patience" wears out? Or do you give them space and consideration? I am not talking about bikes riding side by side, but a solo or small group in single file going up a hill.

wessongroup - 1-11-2010 at 01:39 PM

In my short time down in the Baja have found that things are essentially the same as they were 40 plus years ago...

Always expect the unexpected on the roads, horse or cow and now a new one, people riding bicycles on the main roads with their children ..

I just try and not get to upset with situations which tend to slow you down or cause you to say "are they got of their minds?" or something like that...

I myself would NOT ride a bicycle on a major road in any Country.. it's a risk I have considered and one which I would not take... used to ride motorcycles too, stopped riding them on surface streets too...

Call me a sissy, but had a few very close calls, and got banged up a couple of times.. you usually lose to a Car which in my book is a "vehicle". A bicycle is a means of transportation... yeah, I know.. it's defined as a "vehicle" under the Department of Transportation, but they are looking to put a "license" on anything they can for the "fees"

As I recall the Freeway system in the United States was develop for "Rapid Transit of motor vehicles".. it may not accomplish that all the time.. but, that was the INTENT... I don't recall anyone talking about riding a bicycle on the Santa Ana Freeway... or any of the other major transportation corridors across the Nation.. they were set up for cars...

I too have ridden bikes, but NEVER thought of getting out into lanes with REAL TRAFFIC.. sorry in my view the lanes are for cars, trucks, RV's buss's and the like... bicycles and horse fall into the same category, a means of transportation that still exists, but is not realist on todays Highways

I understand that this limits the ability of bike riders.. but, taken on a whole ... why should the majority be ENDANGERED for the wants and desires of few of folks trying to use the road with bicycles..

How many bikes on MX 1 per day compared to how many VEHICLES as stated above?

Seems it may be legal under an interpretation of the Department of Transportation and/or local Government.. when's the last time you found that these interpretations were real "cracker jack" ideas from OUR Government or others..

Just my 2 cents

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by wessongroup]

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by wessongroup]

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by wessongroup]

QUESTIONS

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-11-2010 at 01:50 PM

1. What is the law regarding bicyclists on
Mexico's main highways.

2. Are there any?

3. What are they if there is?

4. Must you ride going with traffic or against
traffic, etc. etc. etc.

5. Do any of you who ride the main highways
know?

Let us know please if you do know!

Edit: To make my question plural!

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by ELINVESTI8]

Cypress - 1-11-2010 at 01:55 PM

One thing you can be sure of. Hogging a whole lane on HWY 1 on a bicycle won't make you any friends. And friends come in mighty handy.

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja12valve

Just out of curiosity, how do you pass a bicycle, especially if you have had to wait more than 30 seconds? Do you blow by them hand on the horn, brushing them off the road as your "patience" wears out? Or do you give them space and consideration? I am not talking about bikes riding side by side, but a solo or small group in single file going up a hill.

I give everybody space...and consideration. I'm not afflicted with Road Rage. That's not to say I'm not internally enraged by this behavior because their selfish act does inspire revulsion.
I've never, in over 50 years of driving, been involved in a wreck. Not even a small one. I'm an attentive and considerate driver.
I don't blow my horn or give the finger, especially not down here when the person you're responding to could have an automatic weapon in his lap. I just pass and go on my way.That's all I want and all I'm entitled to do.
When that entitlement is denied because some arrogant a-hole has decided his activity on a public road trumps my right to progress at a legal speed, I object.

My doctors say I'm not a well person and meds have a tendency to be inconsistant so, I hope they don't fail at the wrong time. Otherwise, my new hood ornament might say, "NNIWHCS."
SALUD

Baja12valve - 1-11-2010 at 02:38 PM

Fair enough. Thank You.

mtgoat666 - 1-11-2010 at 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wessongroup
but, taken on a whole ... why should the majority be punished for the wants and desires of few of folks trying to use the road with bicycles..

you are not being "punished." bikes may slow you down occasionally (rarely), and that is something you need to learn to live with. the sum total of your delays caused by bikes is probably so miniscule as to be not measureable. if you drive the entire length of the penninsula, you will on average lose more time to slowing for animals than you will to slowing for bikes. when i drive the penninsula i am much more concerned about slow trucks, irresponsible auto drivers and keeping an eye out for those dang speed bumps. i am surprised that bikes generate such a high volume of complaints when slow trucks are more common and probably cause you 100-times more lost time.
the compaliners on this board are ridiculous.
some of the my most dangerous encounters on hwy 1 have been with gringos with trailers or pickups loaded full of ORVs and driving like they were in a sports car. your time would be better spent complaining about irresponsible drivers of cars and trucks as they cause many more accidents per vehicle mile traveled and they pose a bigger danger to you.

toneart - 1-11-2010 at 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
My doctors say I'm not a well person and meds have a tendency to be inconsistant so, I hope they don't fail at the wrong time. Otherwise, my new hood ornament might say, "NNIWHCS."

maybe it is time for you to stop driving. sounds like you are a danger to everybody (cars, trucks, dogs, bikes, cows, pedestrians and coyotes) on the road

let your wife drive, hire a driver or take public transport.

MtGoat,
Sometimes you make good points and then you lose credibility by being obnoxious.

Who is going to comprehend your intended message, or does this type of post reflect your real intention. If you are indeed a Liberal, drop the Ageism schtick. You are prematurely crabbier than most old people, and getting old will hit you sooner and harder.

wessongroup - 1-11-2010 at 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Originally posted by wessongroup
but, taken on a whole ... why should the majority be punished for the wants and desires of few of folks trying to use the road with bicycles..

Stand corrected, the word I should have used was ENDANGERED, my mistake... thanks for catching it... if one "bike" rider causes one death through their inappropriate use of a thoroughfare designed for motorized vehicles, then it shows a complete disregard for common sense.. AND THE PUBLIC SAFETY

When I was growing up, you WALKED your bicycle across the cross walk and you rode on the sidewalk.. not making left turns from the "left turn lane" like a car, as you are not one, when you are riding a bicycle.. so get used to it...

And the question still stands.. how many bikes on Mex 1 compared to motorized vehicles per year.

Do we change all for 10 people a year on bikes? or do we tell those 10 people they must alter their plans for their trip?

The old minority argument is getting a bit worn out... what's next "yelling fire in a crowed theater"?

[Edited on 1-11-2010 by wessongroup]

Bajahowodd - 1-11-2010 at 05:31 PM

Hats off to El Chivo Diablo. Not everyone around here can tweak as well as you.

And, Dennis, either take your culo down to Sharkey's or take a pill. :lol:

DENNIS - 1-11-2010 at 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
And, Dennis, either take your culo down to Sharkey's or take a pill. :lol:

Seems you're taking sides. The only thing I have that would be considered long is my memory.
I think you and your Bota Bag will be my new hobby.
Are you ready for this?
I am.
Shame on you for your bad choice of ally. A loser. If I were to sidle up with anybody, it would be a winner with a track record.

Anyway, Howard,........it's on with us. Oh,yeah....your idol too.

You boys sleep well.

David K - 1-11-2010 at 06:26 PM

There were billboard size signs posted along Hwy. 1's newest section in 1974 saying that the highway was built for Economic Development, Not High Speed Driving. The last of those signs was near Punta Prieta I recall... I will post a photo later.

Anyway, those signs address both concerns: 'Economic Development' means tourists in RVs and cars, trucks and busses... Certainly not ex-hippies on bicycles. The not for high speed driving part covers MtGoat's shouts to go slow... Well, maybe don't go slow... but hot HIGH SPEED, anyway!

Progress is coming in widening the road between San Quintin and La Paz, but until the Transpeninsular Highway has shoulders for bikes to travel safely and not interfere with the automobiles the highway was built for... It is NOT safe for bikes. Do what you will, you've been warned! :lol:

BajaNomad - 1-11-2010 at 06:33 PM

Do Mexican Federal Highways have a minimum speed requirement for "vehicles" traveling upon them?

Just curious...

desertcpl - 1-11-2010 at 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
There were billboard size signs posted along Hwy. 1's newest section in 1974 saying that the highway was built for Economic Development, Not High Speed Driving. The last of those signs was near Punta Prieta I recall... I will post a photo later.

Anyway, those signs address both concerns: 'Economic Development' means tourists in RVs and cars, trucks and busses... Certainly not ex-hippies on bicycles. The not for high speed driving part covers MtGoat's shouts to go slow... Well, maybe don't go slow... but hot HIGH SPEED, anyway!

Progress is coming in widening the road between San Quintin and La Paz, but until the Transpeninsular Highway has shoulders for bikes to travel safely and not interfere with the automobiles the highway was built for... It is NOT safe for bikes. Do what you will, you've been warned! :lol:

I will go with this,, I have been up and down many times on MX 1,,, it is not made for bikes , that is insane

David K - 1-11-2010 at 08:39 PM

Quote:

Okay, found a photo of one in Paul Fischer's 'Adventure to Land's End' (1975):

Pompano - 1-11-2010 at 09:10 PM

Some info on The Baja Highway. (Mex 1)

Here's some background that all Nomads know only too well, but still may help the neophyte Baja Road traveler.

Many people travel from the USA and Canada to Baja by car, RV, motorcycle or bicycle.

The Transpeninsular Highway is well maintained, but it is very narrow and winding in many places.

The middle section is the most remote and desolate. Driving it alone can be a serious challenge and driving at night is not recommended. Horses and cows, in addition to other wildlife often cross the road or stray right into the road! This is a serious hazard.

The other major hazard are the driving habits of Mexican nationals, who can be very reckless at times. Trucks in particular are very dangerous and be alert whenever anyone is passing, or head on collisions may result. This is a fact of the Baja Road..accept it or put yourself at deadly risk.

Severe rollover caused by speeding drunk driver.

Common sense rules. This curve near Santispac has taken 7 lives that I personally know of in the last 35 years. No shoulders...abrupt dropoffs.

Short story: A long time ago, maybe 1986-87 or so, a friend towed a very wide load down the entire length of the Baja Highway..actually all the way from Nevada.

It was a large 31ft flybridge fishing boat...a 31' Bertram...11 feet 2 inches wide plus the wheel wells on the trailer. Took him 5 days from the border with many turnouts for safety and a scout-support vehicle. No accidents. It can be done..but with extreme caution.

The largest and widest load I ever witnessed was around 1976 or so when 4 large-large rigs hauled down HUGE generators to La Paz. These rigs were traveling very slowly and jammed traffic completely...maybe 14 feet wide or so. They covered the entire road and you had to wait for clearance from their support vehicles..both directions.

That convoy took 2 weeks to make it from Tijuana to La Paz.
All traffic was held up northbound and southbound. You learned the meaning of patience.

Baja By Bicycle:

We as a society are trying to promote biking as a healthy, active alternative to driving. This is good and sensible endeavor.

Therefore, it is a given that we need bike lanes, safer routes and better educated drivers/bikers.

I am stating personal observations and posting photos I have taken of biking events chanced upon in my travels, not presenting a point of view. If it looks like I am presenting a point of view, that was not the intent. Sides, I am having martinis.

You must make your own decision if considering a bike trip down the Baja peninsula.

Biking the Baja Road today as compared to yesteryear.

There seems to be little bicycling down the Baja peninsula these days. Most of the big races involving thousands of Mexican and a few American contestants have long since disappeared because of the new high volume of traffic due to Baja 'improvements'. It peaked around the early 90's I would think. Today you see very few singles or small groups. The word is out...the road is too dangerous now.

The early 70's-80's were full of adventuring bicyclers. I made many, many trips in that time period. Because I realized the limitations of that poorly contructed and narrow highway, I personally never had any problems with them, and quietly wondered at the stamina to make such a trip.

But...having made frequent trips on that highway and having had my share of close calls from passing, overtaking, on-coming, and stalled vehicles, I will simply state the dangers inherent on the Baja Road...which to me is from San Quentin to Cabo. The dangers are there for bicyclists and motorists alike. Here is the highway....you may draw your own conclusions as to how to drive it safely.

The Baja Highway
Width of the pavement: 19 feet
Width of the shoulder: 0 feet

Width of a truck/bus/RV: 8 feet
Added width for mirrors: 1 foot
Width used by two passing trucks/etc: 18 feet

Safety separation used by
two passing trucks/etc: 1 foot

Room left for a bicycler: 0 feet

In 1971-73 The Baja Road was constructed to just accommodate two passing 8-foot vehicles, and no more! Many of the roadsides drop off anywhere from a few feet to a few hundred feet (in these extreme cases, there will usually be a low guard rail right at the edge of the pavement). Also, the edge of the pavement will often have chunks broken off or washed away, leaving "edge potholes" which have to be dodged.

Mostly the Road has been repaired, renewed, and re-engineered so many times by now, it is hard to get a figure on it's average width today...2010. Mostly it is still TOO NARROW..so stay on your toes when pulling your rig, dribing your VW, or pedaling your bike.

There you have it....bien viaje.

IF YOU DO BIKE THE BAJA HIGHWAY:

There is still a slow but steady trickle of travelers riding their bicycles in Baja. On the Transpeninsular Highway this is fairly straightforward.

What to ride: A traditional touring, or hybrid bike is an excellent choice for the Transpeninsular. The middle stretch of the road and the peninsula present regions that are both very mountainous and desolate. Riding a bike on the numerous other roads would certainly require a mountain bike, and would be preferable with a support vehicle due to the difficulty in acquiring basic supplies (the main concern being water) and the difficulty carrying baggage on rough roads.

Trying to travel by bike unsupported off the Transpeninsular is for those who don't distinguish between masochism and adventure. Either on or off the Transpeninsular, good quality tires, lots of patches, spare tubes, and other puncture resistant measures are important, due to the large numbers of vicious thorns.

Drivers on the Transpeninsular Highway are often very reckless, however most drivers treat cyclists with more respect (perhaps due to their novelty) then cyclists get elsewhere in North America. If one chooses to bike in what is normally a very hot climate and incredibly remote region at times, the whole endeavor should only be undertaken with much prudence and planning.

Like a Boy Scout...be prepared. Biking in Baja is a little different than elsewhere:

NOT BAJA

The Oregon Coast Highway bike lane is super fun for bikes.

Oceanside - Carlsbad bike path is unbeatable

One of the best bike highways in the world...going from west to east on the Highline Highway. US 2 across Montana. Prevailing winds push you right along.

Biking the Yukon is an unforgettable experience. Note to self: next bike trip to Yukon bring bigger bear gun.

Yes, I like to bike, too.

elgatoloco - 1-11-2010 at 10:07 PM

Pompano - nice post and pics, however, that is NOT Oceanside - it's Mission Beach. We ride that stretch from our house every Wednesday while circling Mission Bay followed by a pint or two of hand crafted beer at PB Ale House. :yes:

BajaNuts - 1-11-2010 at 10:50 PM

Thanks- 12valve for chiming in. (and the other biker also)

I'm not against bikers...........I'm just against bikers who deliberately put themselves........or their CHILDREN...........in grave danger. Especially when there was room for safety, in my incident. Thanks for sharing on that topic.

I also realized early on in my cycling days that in a car-v-bike accident..........the bike loses!

Bajahowodd-
one difference I might point out between slow trucks/RV's/etc and cyclists is the protection of a vehicle. Yes, when you round a blind corner and a vehicle is broke down in the road, there is a good chance for impact. But what are the chances of survival for a person inside a vehicle that is hit by another vehicle going 60kph vs a person on a bike that is hit at 60kph?

I have friends who took off on an adventure a few months ago and posted blogs as they went. Dad and Mom (in their 40's) and son (10 yrs old) rode bikes and wilderness camped from north central WA, over to ID and down to Moab. They took great care and planning to research the roads they would be traveling and for most of the route, they enjoyed a peaceful safe ride. One section of road...and it had decent shoulders (sorry, can't tell you how wide but if someone really wants to know I can find out how wide they were)..had a lot of logging truck traffic on it and that was the worst, most unsafe section of road they traversed.

I'm wondering...how safe do the cyclists who travel MX1 feel? I wonder how that family with the children feel at the end of the day? Do they realize how much danger they are in?

and by "safe" I mean safely traveling on the road, apparent dangers, etc. not any other non-traffic threats. Do they feel safe while riding or are they oblivious to the dangers?

I guess we'll never know unless they chime in here. just wondering........

Yup..Mission Beach it was.

Pompano - 1-12-2010 at 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by elgatoloco
Pompano - nice post and pics, however, that is NOT Oceanside - it's Mission Beach. We ride that stretch from our house every Wednesday while circling Mission Bay followed by a pint or two of hand crafted beer at PB Ale House. :yes:

Thanks for jogging my poor memory, elgatoloco. I kinda figured I was wrong when I wrote Oceanside, but didn't think it was that important. Southern California coast towns kind of run together after a while. I recall now that we rented the bikes in Mission Beach. And wrote a photo story about following the tracks made by the Mission Beach cutie below.

We had a lot of fun and enjoyed biking the beach communities of SoCal. The people watching is top notch!
And I love the oriental salad at the Cass St. Bar and yakking with Baja oldtimers...Hennessys for a cold one, back up to The Chart House, down to The Green Flash for Oysters Rockerfeller, etc, etc. Fun places to bike around...but really makes you appreciate the wide open countyside Up North!

Keep biking. Just think hard about doing the Baja Road trip.

elgatoloco - 1-12-2010 at 06:58 PM

Pompano - next time you are in town give us a shout! We have extra bikes and our rates are very reasonable. :yes:

I road up Hwy 1 last Sunday! PCH that is, La Jolla to Swami's and back. I have no desire to ride Baja 1 any time soon.

Baja12valve - 1-12-2010 at 08:38 PM

To the chick. If you got it, flaunt it. .......... and she did!!

toneart - 1-12-2010 at 10:36 PM

Quote:

"ex-hippies on bicycles"- Oh oh. So they are the ones causing all the trouble, huh?.

Why, I oughtta...Where can I find the head of this subversive group? Where do we direct our complaints? Who's in charge? Surely we can contact their Union Hall. They must be organized, doncha think?

I'll ask my friend, Margo St. James, the founder of C.O.Y.O.T.E. (Call Off Your Tired Old Ethics), the San Francisco Hookers' Union. If she has DK in her little black book, then we could get something done about this "ex-hippies on bicycles" outrage. :fire:

She and her roadside tactical engineers will help us get to the bottom of this assfault assault. They are very accomodating. :bounce:

Never again will the "ex-hippies on bicycles" be able to attain "hot HIGH SPEED"!.

wessongroup - 1-13-2010 at 05:46 AM

You are too much Toneart :lol:

Latter Day Hippies

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 06:17 AM

Do these fine folks look like they could peddle their butts to Cabo? The only thing they're peddling is their perfected hydroponic indica. Besides, they wouldn't go far from their medical marijuana store front. NORML has succeeded after 40 years of effort. They'll stay home and enjoy the victory.

And wearing skimpy spandex costumes with aerodynamic plastic hats? Forget it.

[Edited on 1-13-2010 by k-rico]

old_hippie.jpg - 33kB

wessongroup - 1-13-2010 at 06:23 AM

Better yet :lol:

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-13-2010 at 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
Do these fine folks look like they could peddle their butts to Cabo? The only thing they're peddling is their perfected hydroponic indica. Besides, they wouldn't go far from their medical marijuana store front. NORML has succeeded after 40 years of effort. They'll stay home and enjoy the victory.

And wearing skimpy spandex costumes with aerodynamic plastic hats? Forget it.

[Edited on 1-13-2010 by k-rico]

This Old Hippie Dude Needs One "Just Because!

David K - 1-13-2010 at 10:22 AM

toneart?: HOT high speed?... that was a typo... It should have been 'NOT high speed'

Anyway... if you read closely, I don't have any personal rage or cares about bike riders... I am just posting caution to any fool who risks himself or others by riding on ANY highway without shoulders.

If anyone cared about human life, I would think they would advise others to never ride where it is unsafe.... RIGHT?

[Edited on 1-13-2010 by David K]

DENNIS - 1-13-2010 at 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pompano

I wonder if she drives her car like that?

Baja12valve - 1-13-2010 at 12:29 PM

Quote:

WOW!!! Nice attitude. No, those folks do not look like those who could pedal to Cabo, and they won't so don't worry about them. If others want to dress and live like them why do you care? They won't be bothering you on bit. A bit tribal, are we?
For your personal knowledge as for spandex, and plastic hats there is a reason. HELMETS protect you, believe it or not. The shorts protect you from rash. Loose shirts flap in the wind.

tripledigitken - 1-13-2010 at 02:05 PM

Baja12valve,

Sounds like your "handle" should be Baja12speed! :lol:

I agree there's room for aging Hippies, in fact there are a LOT of them that are Baja Nomads.

Ken

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja12valve

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
Do these fine folks look like they could peddle.....etc.

WOW!!! Nice attitude....etc.

Oh come on, I was just kidding. Jeez.

But, about those tear drop shaped, drag coefficient lowering, plastic bonnets. Does your head weathervane in a crosswind? :spingrin:

toneart - 1-13-2010 at 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
toneart?: HOT high speed?... that was a typo... It should have been 'NOT high speed'

Anyway... if you read closely, I don't have any personal rage or cares about bike riders... I am just posting caution to any fool who risks himself or others by riding on ANY highway without shoulders.

If anyone cared about human life, I would think they would advise others to never ride where it is unsafe.... RIGHT?

[Edited on 1-13-2010 by David K]

Right, David!

DENNIS - 1-13-2010 at 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

But, about those tear drop shaped, drag coefficient lowering, plastic bonnets. Does your head weathervane in a crosswind? :spingrin:

Or, spin like a top in a dust-devil? :lol:

Bajahowodd - 1-13-2010 at 03:25 PM

I'm amazed at the number of posts on this thread. After all is said and done, what I glean from the posts is--

1- That for some unknowable reason, there are Nomads that hate bicyclists.

2- There are a huge number of safety issues with highway 1 that require folks to always be vigilant.

3- Anyone who would consider biking down Baja needs to know the hazards and does so knowing the risks.

4- I am envious of anyone contemplating biking down, because I'm just too old and lack the stamina to do it.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-13-2010 at 03:26 PM

Disclaimer: This GIF in no way reflects what I think should happen to any bicyclist or “Un Chivo De Satanás" but it sure could happen! Be careful out there people! I do not condone hit and run either! Thank you!

Baja12valve - 1-13-2010 at 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
Baja12valve,

Sounds like your "handle" should be Baja12speed! :lol:

Nah. Make that a 27 speed. 6 speed freewheels went out 10 years ago, now they go up to 10, mine is a 9. Age and its related consequences made me get my first triple crankset two years ago.

Baja12valve - 1-13-2010 at 03:47 PM

Quote:

WOW!!! Nice attitude....etc.

Oh come on, I was just kidding. Jeez.

But, about those tear drop shaped, drag coefficient lowering, plastic bonnets. Does your head weathervane in a crosswind? :spingrin:

Remember that a lot of translation is lost using the written word. Hard to tell if the writing is sarcastic, joking, kidding or serious. Unfortunately many people, too many people, have a negative hostile attitude for real. Not good. That is why I flew at you.
In the Los Angeles times there is a big trial for a deliberate bicycle accident. A ER Doctor passed two bikes, got hostile, slammed on the brakes in front of them and sent one through the back window of his car, the other over it. He just got sentenced to five years.

Bajahowodd - 1-13-2010 at 03:50 PM

Road rage, plain and simple.

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja12valve
A ER Doctor passed two bikes, got hostile, slammed on the brakes in front of them and sent one through the back window of his car, the other over it. He just got sentenced to five years.

Yes, this was mentioned earlier in this thread. The only reason it made the news is because he was penalized so heavily and IMHO unjustly.

My reaction was that this should be a warning to bicycle riders.

An ER doctor, 60 years old, loses it. Here is a well educated, intelligent man who deals with stressful situations every day. A mature man of discipline performing one of society's noblest jobs. And look at what oblivious adults riding bicycles in the street caused him to do. Completely lose control. I feel sorry for the doc.

Now, if guys like that decide to take out some inconsiderate adults riding bicycles in the street, well, you see the danger the bicycle riders are subjecting themselves to.

P.S. I bet the doc gets out of jail as soon as possible. No way he's in jail for 5 years.

[Edited on 1-14-2010 by k-rico]

DENNIS - 1-13-2010 at 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
And look at what oblivious adults riding bicycles in the street caused him to do. Completely lose control. I feel sorry for the doc.

I think he snapped. Everybody has a breaking point.

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 05:07 PM

Sure he snapped. My point is that cyclists pushed him to the breaking point. I fully understand. Bikes in bike lanes are fine. I'll also cut childern some slack. But when adults riding bicycles are obstructing traffic, a lot of people get very angry.

[Edited on 1-14-2010 by k-rico]

Baja12valve - 1-13-2010 at 05:44 PM

The doctor is one person who just did not believe of think that bicycles should be on the road, period. He had other altercations with cyclists before. Weather you like it or not, bicycles are here to stay and as fuel costs rise, expect more. Gee, sorry you can't live with them. As mentioned before, they are 100% legal on the road. Yes, it is true that there are a-holes for a cyclist and the same for car drivers. So you stop suddenly in front of one, wow, what is the lesson here? Go to jail. I wish he got 10 years. His job in relation to the accident is of no importance. Would you feel the same if he were a plumber? I wonder if you would feel the same if a horse were in front of you?`
The accident was in the news long before the sentencing. I have been following it for weeks now.

Barry A. - 1-13-2010 at 05:54 PM

I have a "negative, hostile attitude" towards anybody that intentionally makes others mad, or inconveniences them, like some of these rude bicycle riders on highways "intentionally" do------------just learn to live with it.

There ARE consequences for our actions, and it cuts both ways.

Barry

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 06:05 PM

Baja12valve,

"what is the lesson here?"

When adults riding bicycles are obstructing traffic, a lot of people get very angry.

Angry people do irrational things.

Those two facts will never change.

My mentioning his profession was to reinforce my point that the anger caused by adults riding bicycles in a manner that obstructs traffic is so real that even the most sophisticated among us feel it strongly.

Bicycle riders who take the attitude that because it is legal they can ride in traffic lanes designed for cars not only put themselves in the obvious danger of an accident, but as this trial indicates, also the real danger of others intentionally hurting them. You say there will be more and more bikes on the road, well get ready for more and more irrational acts of violence. Eventually the rules will be changed, no bike lanes, no bikes.

Just because something is not illegal doesn't mean it's OK to do.

[Edited on 1-14-2010 by k-rico]

mtgoat666 - 1-13-2010 at 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
"what is the lesson here?"

i think the lesson is that nomads are impatient drivers of oversized bloated SUVs, pickups and RVs who hate bikes because they find bikes inconvenient as they DWI down route 1.

another lesson is that elvis8 is a taser-happy porno dude :lol:

wessongroup - 1-13-2010 at 06:16 PM

bloated? really.. and public safety seems more to the point

k-rico - 1-13-2010 at 06:19 PM

Goat, thanks for the comic relief.

You attributed a quote to me that 12Valve made. Can't you get anything right?

Please tell me how I can identify your bicycle.

mtgoat666 - 1-13-2010 at 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico
Goat, thanks for the comic relief.

You attributed a quote to me that 12Valve made. Can't you get anything right?

Please tell me how I can identify your bicycle.

all of my bikes are red (red bikes are fastest).

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 11:43 AM

I've been lurking here since 2004, really appreciate David K. working Google Earth like that too; watched this topic resurface a few times and can't hold my tongue any longer.

I was all over the world on a touring bike in the early 1980s and Baja was just about the safest place that I ever rode through.

You clowns make me sick.

Baja enabled me to get my nerve up for touring in mainland Mexico and I romped in Guatemala for 8 days the next year when nobody really knew who was running the country; this in an area that the Army had temporarily given up on.

I had the Pan American Highway all to myself for two days because the bridges were dynamited and the road from Puerto Angel to Oaxaca all to myself for a day because a bus had flipped over across the whole road and I was the only thing that got through. Came down to Palenque through the places that the Chiapas rebels would shut down for a decade later on too. Had the Espinazo del Diablo on Durango-Mazatlan all to myself but for one really noisy truck two years later- did the coast of Michoacan twice and the only tight spot in all of that travel was just south of Lazaro Card##as the first time down. (So the second time down I just bribed a City Mini Bus to take us all the way into Zihuatenejo instead of service his route.)

I'm also quite likely to be the first ever to ride a bike from the sea to the Observatorio unless someone else did that before October 84. At least the staff up there thought so. Just a tiny shred of it was paved.

The bottom line is that this is some of the best bicycle touring in the whole world, I saw plenty of North America, Spain and France, and prefer Mexico to any of it. And I almost prefer Baja to all of the 60 percent of the Mexican mainland that I passed through to, but for the coast of Michoacan the year after the road was built through.

I'll grant you that riding two abreast in the presence of traffic on that road is borderline insanity but I've got a news flash here:

These retards aside the Bicyclists have put as much thought into surviving the overall experience as you selfish dildoes have put into contesting their rights under the law. In a country where you are a visitor yourself? They actually realize the implications of getting run over and critically injured 600 miles south of the border with 70 miles between sources of water. On the other hand you people act as though scraping them off your grilles afterward will represent an unreasonable inconvenience? Nothing but class there?

Nobody with a full sense of hearing should ever put himself in a position to get killed in a place like that. What I was most scared of back then was when the two competing bus lines were drag racing down the highway out in the middle of nowhere. Good thing that you could hear that coming from ten miles up the road? FWIW, I caught that act just about equally on Baja as on the Mainland. I was always more than willing to get 20 feet off the road and chill out until they all passed by, I'd seen them passing each other on blind curves and read about it in Peoples Gide to Mexico before that. I didn't need to verify it any further.

There was no internet back then it would have cost somebody a $20 phone call just to get the word out that I had been greased. This wasn't a game for children back then, but apparently it is from the motorist side now?

I'll grant you that I saw Baja at a point where the tourist infrastructure was collapsing; certainly the road was more lightly traveled. Jimmy Smith was flying up to San Isidro every week to get the money into an American bank ASAP. I just walked right into those abandoned tourist camps from pre-1975 and took whatever I needed, I walked right into El Presidente hotels and asserted my sweaty gringohood for a quick hop in the pool and maybe a hot shave on the house. I slept right on the beach in downtown Cabo with about 50 other vagabond types and took a beautiful boat to Puerta Vallarta for a whopping $1.80 (including cabin) the next day- yes I get all that.

They poured out 20 Gallons a Minute from Cabo's wonderful spring right into the street back then and we filled up just like the Manilla treasure ships did. I even knew about it the same week that bicycles were prohibited between Cabo and San Jose in modern era because we had Kilometer 12 all to ourselves camping for two days on the return leg.

Regardless of what you visitors think about it, Mexican nationals are much better drivers to coexist with than the typical Winnebago dirtbag. (Who by and large never even had to get a special operators license to infest the thoroughfares with a vehicle that size, I might remind you? Ditto for the guy who is all peeed about having to slow down with his monster boat in back. When did he ever take a road test to drive an 11 foot lane?)

Moreover a cyclist is generally much safer in country that sees a lot of livestock and pedestrians and grossly underpowered motor vehicles out on the major highways. As you approach a Mexican town of any size and the traffic gets more dense there is always a cart path in the dirt along the edge too. Good luck finding that in Wyoming or Louisiana on an equally narrow road.

I had two curious encounters with Mexican law enforcement types, one near each border during times when said border was way out of control. Plus one more at an Army checkpoint in Guerrero that makes the ones that you guys post about here look like Romper Room, but never a lick of trouble with a Mexican driver anywhere, professional or amateur.

I always associated that phenomenon to the way that you can quickly end up in jail after a traffic accident down there, who knows?

So it would appear to me that YOU guys are the problem?

No wonder the Mexican Government takes your insurance situation so seriously? Oh by the way I rode at NIGHT down there, I rode a whole lot at night, (gasp.)

That's pretty much how I got through the really nasty place in Guerrero. Where they held up public buses whenever they felt like it and just took the money like a passenger train robbery.

DENNIS - 2-14-2010 at 11:51 AM

You ramble on like a gosh darn drunk, confused as to what comes first....scolding everybody here or telling us how cool you are. Personally, neither of your opinions means chiit to me.

BajaGringo - 2-14-2010 at 12:02 PM

But I do detect a familiar tone to their post...

:rolleyes:

rhintransit - 2-14-2010 at 12:02 PM

you said a mouthful, caboclassof83! way to tell it like it is/was!
the cyclists who stop at my palapa say that Americans are the only people in the world who expect shoulders on the road.
welcome and thicken your hide, though I expect it already is tough enough to survive the Nomad blasts.

LancairDriver - 2-14-2010 at 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
You ramble on like a gosh darn drunk, confused as to what comes first....scolding everybody here or telling us how cool you are. Personally, neither of your opinions means poop to me.

I'll second that opinion. Sounds like another wanabe Lance Armstrong looking to get their **s run over and achieve bicycle martyrdom defending their right to take their half of the road out of the middle.

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 01:02 PM

What's the difference between a San Diego lawyer on a $5000 touring bicycle and a Mexican native with 200 pesos to his name running a barely operational and certainly uninsured 150cc motorcycle on Highway One?

Well the Winnebago ************* who didn't even have to once prove his own competence to drive that beast on wide American roads somehow thinks that he has more right to the highway than the former?

The Mexicans and the rest of the civilized world do not.

This will really tick these WinneVegitables off- I caught the boat to Los Mochis 40 minutes after I decided to take it- that would have taken you a week at the time.

Until I got to the Yucatan with a rented car, I never had to pay out a single centavo of mordida anywhere. The Mexicans treated me like a God. And guess what, it's THEIR country too?

The cops who stopped me at gunpoint in Chihuahua ultimately changed out my money at a better rate than I would get in New Mexico and then insisted on sharing a six pack before I was "released."

Like I said, YOU are the problem.....and you have no more "right" to that road than the man on the moon does.

So enjoy your $6/gallon gas, burrobags. Mexico will be a net importer of petroleum within five years and I'll certainly be coming back.

[Edited on 2-16-2010 by BajaNomad]

DENNIS - 2-14-2010 at 01:14 PM

Why don't you just write your travelog and get it over with. Seems that's what you really want to do anyway. What's your problem? Fear of rejection? You and your self-appointed champion of the masses attitude will get you plenty of that. You should try to get used to it.
In the meantime, why don't you concentrate on your own neighborhood and save your money for your next FMT. That's the permit tourists like you are required to have, case you forgot.

vandenberg - 2-14-2010 at 01:19 PM

Tell me....you're not a returning troll. :no:

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 01:30 PM

*********************************************************************** The law is pretty clear on this point? Just about everywhere that there is pavement too.

You would have a very hard time securing a commercial drivers license for the same size vehicle in either country as well. Somehow you don't want to dispute that point?

Now what's the difference between an American and a Mexican cyclist on that highway, while we are at it? (Assuming, I guess that you found their attire equally offensive, I suppose?)

I rode (in the Rockies) with the CEO of Allis Chalmers for the entire country- he had 5700 Mexicans working for him, plus his own business airplane and multi-millionaire buddies all over Monterrey

So are you more entitled to Mexican highways than he was too?

[Edited on 2-15-2010 by BajaNomad]

DENNIS - 2-14-2010 at 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by caboclassof83
You would have a very hard time securing a commercial drivers license for the same size vehicle in either country as well. Somehow you don't want to dispute that point?

No point to dispute. I couldn't care less about qualifications to drive a motorhome or anything else.
The point is, other than your head, this thread, which you dug out of it's grave, concerned a-hole cyclists just like you riding two lane roads slowly uphill with a car running interference. Why don't you stick to the original point instead of trying to impress everybody with your road antics.

wessongroup - 2-14-2010 at 01:57 PM

As the goat so eloquently pointed out in an indirect manner... it is, actually an issue of public safety, not of personal freedom for either user of the road :saint:

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 02:01 PM

Come to think of it. how many Mexican nationals are tooling around in full size RVs this winter? In the entire Republic?

Maybe 500 or 1000?

Are they supposed to all drive like selfish six year olds just because you want to?

I bet they don't? I bet that some of them actually had to pass a road test too? On real twisty-ass Mexican roads.

Actually I'm pretty much sure of it in both cases insofar as a chofer might be involved for the kind of Mexican families that can afford it.

So, uhh, what makes you so gosh darn special?

Did you build the road yourself?

wessongroup - 2-14-2010 at 02:04 PM

Happy valentines day.. :lol:

DENNIS - 2-14-2010 at 02:05 PM

You've completly lost it. Why don't you dig up another thread and see how long you last with it. You arn't very good at this.

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 02:11 PM

Public safety was riding over the two lane bridge in New Orleans- I never did that again.

Riding into the D.F. would have been an issue of public safety as well, so I took the train instead.

If you can't coexist on Mexico One then you aren't even a primate. Seeing as you are the ones getting the regulatory free ride in the first place?

(You low-life freeloaders never have to stop at highway scales anywhere either? Why is that?)

What's the difference between people who take 50 times better care of themselves than you do wearing clothing that you despise and a domestic cattle drive that costs you two hours?

In one case you spout ignorant *********; in the other you end up driving over it?

[Edited on 2-15-2010 by BajaNomad]

wessongroup - 2-14-2010 at 02:20 PM

Are we having fun yet :lol:

this is better than a Super Bowl game.. and no commercials too

Donjulio - 2-14-2010 at 02:25 PM

Guys don't let this gentleman bother you too much. This is what happens when you spend an inordinate amount of time with a long hard thing shoved up between your butt cracks. And they call it a bicycle seat...yeah right.

caboclassof83 - 2-14-2010 at 02:29 PM

Do I need to like request your permission to maybe go down the lagoon side on a mountain bike someday?

Even though both Mexican and U.S. law clearly says that you have your head six feet up your backside?

They can't even keep U.S. cyclists off Interstates where it's the only way though, chief. Wake TF up.

Professional Mexican drivers operating bigger heavier vehicles for a living don't have a problem with flashy American cyclists on Mex One and you schlubs do?

What's wrong with this picture?

Oh that's right- someone made them prove that they could drive to begin with?

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