BajaNomad - Tolerance in Baja

Tolerance in Baja

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DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 12:21 PM

Thanx motoged. That image says it all...

DENNIS - 11-16-2013 at 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged
Dennis,
You now seems to be defending your position by name-calling and swearing....such a deterioration of intellect....

Whatever the situation calls for.
I'll replenish my intellect watching you and Skeet figure it all out with your pithy duel of bon-mots and witless witicisms. Might even take the time to jot down a few new words. Hopefully, you and your "partners in the absurd' won't accuse me of blatant plagiarism or copyright infringement.

motoged - 11-16-2013 at 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.

Now THAT is funny!!!! :lol:

In probable frustration, Dennis uses Liberal-tactics and the Libs are horror-struck, and lash out!!! :lol:

Barry

Barry,
Please don't give the Libs all the credit for such low-brow tactics :lol:

It's past the point of horror.....Dennis is starting to sound like our latest Canadian embarrassment with his defensive rants ...it is getting humorous :lol:

...in a pathetic kind of way:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2013/11/07/mayor_rob_ford_caught_in_video_rant.html

[Edited on 11-16-2013 by motoged]

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 12:38 PM

Just keep an eye on your BP amigo...it all ain't worth becoming a turnip for...

DENNIS - 11-16-2013 at 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
Just keep an eye on your BP amigo...it all ain't worth becoming a turnip for...

Mine? Sheit....I gotta long way to go. can't seem to get it above 100/50 in the evenings.
You do, however, give the meandering, confused opposition something [albeit, false] to hope for. Freakin' mowrauns couldn't make a point with a pencil sharpener.

Cisco - 11-16-2013 at 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
Mogoat:...I had to be very Tolerant as the Fishing was Fantastic.
Ole Gezzer

Skeet,

Ahhh, the price of admission.... :saint:

What kind of fishing do you get to do these days?
I have yet to fish in Baja. While not interested in going for billfish and that sort of thing, I would like sometime to go out and try to catch something to eat, or just throw back into the chuck.

Years ago in Oaxaca state (Puerto Angel) I was invited to go out in a fisherman's panga with a gentleman and his son at 6:00 A.M. I spoke very little Spanish, sat in the front of the panga for several hours while they trolled for whatever (caught some kind of tuna about 15-24" long on a simple uncolored wood plug w/ hook....maybe some bait?).

I felt honoured to have been invited the day before simply by sitting on the pier and showing an interest in their work....

I watched the sun rise over the ocean, saw rays jumping/flying in the distance, saw turtles, and felt the kindness of the fisherman's invitation.

He was tolerant of this young gringo who couldn't speak the language....but opened up an experience for me I will never forget.

I was tolerant of the swells and didn't get seasick ...as I have been sailing off Vancouver Island in a 30' double-ender that had been built by a Canadian fisherman of Japanese descent (and whose boat was confiscated during WWII).

So many things to encounter in life that requires one form of tolerance ....or not.....as I realize that intolerance is on the continuum of tolerance.

"Mogoat" .....I still like that better than "Motgeo" :saint:

Ged:

Appreciate your posts on this subject done with great tolerance and lack of rancor. Thank you.

Excellent book I just finished regarding the dismal conditions and appropriations of property of the Japanese by the Canadians during WWII.

Much worse than the treatment of these folks in the U.S.

I was quite interested in the history of the camps and made a project out of visiting just about all of them in the western U.S.

A real eye opening experience...hope we talk about it sometime, pretty bad.

"Obasan", Joy Kogawa.

Her uncles boat, hand made and beautifully carved was appropriated and your comment prompted my writing you.

Hope your ankle is O.K. and not bothering you, I still recall the photo with all the staples...yuk!

Buena Suerte Amigo

wessongroup - 11-16-2013 at 12:55 PM

"above 100/50" ... :lol:

Haven't seen those kinda numbers in "decades" ... just saying :biggrin:

motoged - 11-16-2013 at 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cisco
.....
Ged:
........Excellent book I just finished regarding the dismal conditions and appropriations of property of the Japanese by the Canadians during WWII. .....Much worse than the treatment of these folks in the U.S.
.....Hope your ankle is O.K. and not bothering you, I still recall the photo with all the staples...yuk!
Buena Suerte Amigo

Cisco,
Gracias por las amables palabras :cool:

Yes, the ankle has healed but is stiffer and weaker than the other one

....but I am back riding a fair amount.....will be back in Baja with the 690 for a month soon....maybe hook up with some Nomads....as long as we don't talk politics :biggrin:

motoged - 11-16-2013 at 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
..... I'll replenish my intellect watching you and Skeet figure it all out with your pithy duel of bon-mots and witless witicisms. Might even take the time to jot down a few new words. ....

Sounds good....as I had mentioned in a previous post....we could make room for you on the bench. But if you keep farting out of your pie-hole :lol:

...we might ask you to move down a bit :lol:

There is room in the sandbox for all....many bullies learn how to play nice :biggrin:

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 01:18 PM

Where's my claymore?

DENNIS - 11-16-2013 at 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged
But if you keep farting out of your pie-hole :lol:

...we might ask you to move down a bit :lol:

Mind if I use that sometime? I'm always in need of fresh, poetic inspiration.

Here's some "racial tolerance" to brighten your day:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3dVc2btTSQ

Skeet/Loreto - 11-16-2013 at 01:26 PM

Tolerance!!!

In Tolerance by very Preety Women who look Sexy, Act Sexy, make all the good Pre-Moves and then when you get down to the Nitty -Gritty they a LIMP!!

That is the only time I recall being In tolerant.
I am reminded of my 147 Different Women and appreciate the Fact that I was not In torlant too many times!!

Ole Gezzer

Barry A. - 11-16-2013 at 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.

Now THAT is funny!!!! :lol:

In probable frustration, Dennis uses Liberal-tactics and the Libs are horror-struck, and lash out!!! :lol:

Barry

Barry,
Please don't give the Libs all the credit for such low-brow tactics :lol:

It's past the point of horror.....Dennis is starting to sound like our latest Canadian embarrassment with his defensive rants ...it is getting humorous :lol:

...in a pathetic kind of way:

You are right, of course, and both sides do it-----I think because they simply don't listen, or read, what's actually there for reasons I don't understand.

In probably Dennis's (and certainly my) case, what we are saying is so simple and narrow (stop flaunting your sexuality in less than appropriate ways), and yet many here want to make HUGE inferences, and imply all sorts of things that simply are NOT true, or in the text---------and it happens all the time. I think that's incredibly ignorant and intolerant!!! and to me displays lazy-thinking.

Barry

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 02:06 PM

Young Mexican women are some of the most provocatively dressed, provocatively acting conservative and prudish women in the world. They strut, wiggle, flash and jiggle in public. They act angry and snotty when they hear a piropo but they get a whole hell of a lot angrier if they don't hear one. They know exactly how to taunt and drive a macho male to near suicide grade bravado. The sexual culture is one sick puppy yet not one gringo seems to notice. "Tolerance To Gays" is a misnomer. Mexicans are so wrapped up in Freudian Faux Paus most haven't got time to devote to a competing social issue. If you ever work up the courage, visit a Mexican house of ill repute. Not as a customer, as an observer. You'll see machos at the bar overflowing with braggadocio. They are customers either, not of the ladies. They'll sit at the bar drinking four dollar mini cans of cerveza or downing four dollar shots of brandy and boasting how rich, famous, and how many casa chicas they have around the area. When they have squandered the family budget for the week, they crawl home to face an awful reality. You'll see a lot of I Love Lucy hairstyles, and chrome dresses. Wotta hoot.

DENNIS - 11-16-2013 at 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
I am reminded of my 147 Different Women and appreciate the Fact that I was not In torlant too many times!!

Ole Gezzer

Jeeezo, Skeeter......you're a regular "Wham Bam, Thank you ma'am" Wilt Chamberlain. :lol:

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 02:19 PM

Forty nine an hour don't sound too cool.

motoged - 11-16-2013 at 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.
..... I think that's incredibly ignorant and intolerant!!! and to me displays lazy-thinking. Barry

Barry,
I agree that when any of us shoot from the lip we are being reactive rather than pro-active. I know I do that at times...and the comments coming from me when I operate that way are angry, hurtful, and insulting to one degree or another.

I am not trying to put myself on any self-righteous pedestal (although the "optics " of that are there :biggrin

) as much as I want to challenge thinking....or, more appropriately...."invite" folks to consider a different other possibility.

When I zip my lip, plug in my brain, and have some self-regulation going on internally....I can appear to be a decent fellow.

When I am not doing so, ......well....you have seen some of me "in action" :rolleyes:

I heard a phrase a while ago that sticks in my mind....and sometimes sticks in my eye/heart like a fork:... "Hurt people hurt people."

I try to hurt people less these days just because I may be "hurting" (ie. upset or whatever).

I am better at that some times more than other times.

[Edited on 11-16-2013 by motoged]

[Edited on 11-16-2013 by motoged]

DENNIS - 11-16-2013 at 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.
In probably Dennis's (and certainly my) case, what we are saying is so simple and narrow (stop flaunting your sexuality in less than appropriate ways), and yet many here want to make HUGE inferences, and imply all sorts of things that simply are NOT true, or in the text---------and it happens all the time. I think that's incredibly ignorant and intolerant!!! and to me displays lazy-thinking.

Barry

Ahhh Barry.....thanks for the effort, but although they may hear what you're saying, they aren't going to listen to it. These people have been brow-beaten by the various gay factions so long and so effectively, they actually suffer from "straight guilt."
Same with the color issue. These guys are buried in "White guilt" because so many Blacks have told them it's all their fault. Every problem the Black community has is all the White Man's fault.

Here.. :fire:

...this is me burning all of my cotton shirts. :lol:

Anybody want to see a little more Chris Rock?
I'll see what I can find. :lol:

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 02:39 PM

When Irish Eyes Are Smiling
All The World Seems Bright And ...

....ratta tat tat, ka-pow, zing!

Well, there's another perfectly good word down the old ------

25 years ago when the Burlingame chapter of The Sierra Club hiked into my camp for a invitation to tea, I made a boo boo. My campfire was dying down and I had gathered dead knots of fallen firs to pile on when needed.

"Say, could you toss a faggot onto the fire?"

Dead silence.

A perfectly innocent remark twisted and distorted to whatever agenda fitted it.

I get so tired of it.

JoeJustJoe - 11-16-2013 at 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
Young Mexican women are some of the most provocatively dressed, provocatively acting conservative and prudish women in the world. They strut, wiggle, flash and jiggle in public. They act angry and snotty when they hear a piropo but they get a whole hell of a lot angrier if they don't hear one. They know exactly how to taunt and drive a macho male to near suicide grade bravado. The sexual culture is one sick puppy yet not one gringo seems to notice. "Tolerance To Gays" is a misnomer. Mexicans are so wrapped up in Freudian Faux Paus most haven't got time to devote to a competing social issue. If you ever work up the courage, visit a Mexican house of ill repute. Not as a customer, as an observer. You'll see machos at the bar overflowing with braggadocio. They are customers either, not of the ladies. They'll sit at the bar drinking four dollar mini cans of cerveza or downing four dollar shots of brandy and boasting how rich, famous, and how many casa chicas they have around the area. When they have squandered the family budget for the week, they crawl home to face an awful reality. You'll see a lot of I Love Lucy hairstyles, and chrome dresses. Wotta hoot.

It's interesting DavieE that you're visiting Mexican houses of ill repute, not as a customer, but as an observer. You ought too see how some of the gringos act in those same type of bars. They give the term ugly American a new meaning, and while they are berating the girls, as only having a six grade education, these same "ugly Americans" think the girls are in love with them, that is until their bank account runs dry, and the love suddenly ends. Of course that behavior by Mexican girls, doesn't only happen in Mexican bars of so-called "ill repute. Gold digger is a term from the USA.

So only Mexico has the sexual culture? I would think they learned that from the US, mass media that glamorizes youth, beauty, and sexuality.

motoged - 11-16-2013 at 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JoeJustJoe
.....So only Mexico has the sexual culture? I would think they learned that from the US, mass media that glamorizes youth, beauty, and sexuality.

Joe,
All countries will have a sexual culture of one form or another. A female friend told me years ago her view of this "contradiction" of "dressed up and unavailable" was that it was an outcome more of the Catholic message of expected good behaviour vs. human needs and drives.

I dunno....it's just a crazy world :?:

wessongroup - 11-16-2013 at 04:09 PM

Must say JOe, you'er starting to show improvement ... in some areas

[Edited on 11-17-2013 by wessongroup]

DavidE - 11-16-2013 at 04:19 PM

It started out as

"Wanna see something interesting?"

Every culture has its mean, nasty, ugly quotient. I never encountered racism so prolific, so rife as I did in Japan. If you think "Americans" are the "king" of any social malfunctioning, you must not be a world traveler.

We have a segment within our society with a masochism so pervasive and intense, they cannot hold it within themselves. The only way they can exorcise the poison from their system is by accusing everyone else of being more poisonous yet. The only way to fix something is to destroy it. Such individuals would have made for perfect participants during the Spanish Inquisition. Or McCarthyism. Doesn't matter the subject matter or even gaining a point if there is one - the goal is to point fingers and blame. Accuse. If you aren't 100% on our side, you MUST BE 100% on the opposite side. Our enemy. Let's reach a call you A PUBLIC ENEMY. You have to be on the other side so that absolutely means I am mainstream, therefore correct. All I have to to is point a finger. Buzzwords do the rest. I won't bother to list them.

By rationalizing everything, campaigners of the politically correct elite manage to corrupt perspective, and fringe on distorting reality itself. Ask them a question and they hyperventilate their disapproval. They do not attempt to answer the question, which would be educational.

They play or should I say, attempt to play mind games. Those members of society who tire of banal subject matter quickly usually bail out and deal with the issue from a distance. A quite wide distance if I do say.

When an individual goes through life, minding their own business yet gets assaulted with politically correct diatribe (the issue is one of aggression) then they feel like they have been targeted. A pigeon. Someone to trod upon. Sorry but I tired of gringo mind games long ago. The world is too full of wonderful miracles, and challenges where even the most debilitated individual can plunge in and help. To become one of the mindless masses who demand social conformity "or else" is not my bag (or anyone else's).

Lee - 11-16-2013 at 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
When an individual goes through life, minding their own business yet gets assaulted with politically correct diatribe (the issue is one of aggression) then they feel like they have been targeted. A pigeon. Someone to trod upon. Sorry but I tired of gringo mind games long ago. The world is too full of wonderful miracles, and challenges where even the most debilitated individual can plunge in and help. To become one of the mindless masses who demand social conformity "or else" is not my bag (or anyone else's).

Assaulted politically? I'm apolitical but felt assaulted every time Palin opened her pie hole. Now it's Cruz and the Tea Partiers -- that would be Republican Tea Party Members. Let's not forget the ''mindless masses'' demanding social conformity.

I'll take Ru or Liberace any day to baby sit children. Won't risk a het pedophile.

Now back to Dennis. Hey, don't care how ugly you'd be in a dress -- I'd still like you (as a Bro, of course).

BajaRat - 11-16-2013 at 09:43 PM

ahhhhhhh, when the towing gets tough, the tough get going.

Come ON ! Wheres the hate........ :lol:

wessongroup - 11-16-2013 at 10:34 PM

An interesting "take" on things ... which could lead to a bafa trip

Barry A. - 11-16-2013 at 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.
..... I think that's incredibly ignorant and intolerant!!! and to me displays lazy-thinking. Barry

Understand, and appreciate your comments. In mysterious ways we are all friends, one way or another. Baja does that. :spingrin:

Barry

Barry A. - 11-16-2013 at 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wessongroup
An interesting "take" on things ... which could lead to a bafa trip

What's a "bafa trip", Wiley?

Kgryfon - 11-17-2013 at 02:56 PM

I wasn't going to comment on this thread again, but just saw this interview with RuPaul. Apparently, he considers his "over the top, in-your-face" shenanigans that some find offensive just a job, and in real life he's been in a relationship with the same man (a rancher in Wyoming) for 19 years. check it out:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/12/rupaul-partner-boyf...

Interesting side note...I recognize that this is from Oprah via Huffpost, but it's his own words about his lifestyle.

[Edited on 11-17-2013 by Kgryfon]

DENNIS - 11-17-2013 at 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kgryfon
check it out:

Why???? Who could possibly care enough to spend time on it....'cept you, of course.

Quote:

Interesting side note...I recognize that this is from Oprah via Huffpost, but it's his own words about his lifestyle.

And ol' Ru...who makes millions with the concept of living a lie....and fantasy, is all of a sudden a pillar of truth?? And with Oprah????? :lol:

You do live underwater...doncha.

.

[Edited on 11-17-2013 by DENNIS]

DENNIS - 11-17-2013 at 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kgryfon
I wasn't going to comment on this thread again, but just saw this interview with RuPaul. Apparently, he considers his "over the top, in-your-face" shenanigans that some find offensive just a job, and in real life he's been in a relationship with the same man (a rancher in Wyoming) for 19 years. check it out:

OK....now I'm beginning to get it. The traitorous Jane Fonda was dumped by Ted Turner for Ru Paul. It's all becoming clear now.
Yep....clear as the little bells on Ru's shoes. :lol:

Cisco - 11-17-2013 at 04:52 PM

12 Celebrities To Come Out As Bisexual

Too long to print AND there are lot's of photos, so hope you enjoy Boys and Girls and....

http://www.etonline.com/gallery/130714_Bisexual_Celebrities_...

DENNIS - 11-17-2013 at 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cisco
12 Celebrities To Come Out As Bisexual

Too long to print AND there are lot's of photos, so hope you enjoy Boys and Girls and....

Again....who effing cares? Why don't you put it up on your for-him?

Lee - 11-17-2013 at 05:25 PM

The hits just keep on coming. Read an article in Rolling Stone yesterday about Ru who stated if he never did drag again, that would be OK. He was wearing a suit in the photo and looked good. Very dashing.

Also watched about 30 seconds of Ru Paul: Lost Season to see what Dennis has been reacting to. Queer's dressing as women which seemed silly and theatrical.

Now Dennis writes that Ru has a ''freak show.'' I didn't think the queer's looked like women at all. But like men doing drag.

Is it the cross dressing (drag) he objects to or the effeminate gay men looking very stylish? Does Barry or David have an attraction to this sort of theater?

Barry A. - 11-17-2013 at 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lee
The hits just keep on coming. Read an article in Rolling Stone yesterday about Ru who stated if he never did drag again, that would be OK. He was wearing a suit in the photo and looked good. Very dashing.

Also watched about 30 seconds of Ru Paul: Lost Season to see what Dennis has been reacting to. Queer's dressing as women which seemed silly and theatrical.

Now Dennis writes that Ru has a ''freak show.'' I didn't think the queer's looked like women at all. But like men doing drag.

Is it the cross dressing (drag) he objects to or the effeminate gay men looking very stylish? Does Barry or David have an attraction to this sort of theater?

I don't know------never watched (by mistake) any of it more than a few seconds as no interest-------the beauty of "delete" or "exit" button. I'm partial to the "FoxNews girls" myself, as ALWAYS worth watching.

Barry

DENNIS - 11-17-2013 at 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lee
Also watched about 30 seconds of Ru Paul: Lost Season to see what Dennis has been reacting to. Queer's dressing as women which seemed silly and theatrical.

Who said they were queers? WTF is a queer?
I always thought a queer was a person craving the companionship of another person of the same sex.

I have no freakin' idea what these sexually blended people on the Ru paul show are and it seems they don't either.

.

Quote:

Is it the cross dressing (drag) he objects to or the effeminate gay men looking very stylish?

Ohhhh Lee sweetie....doncha know.... it's the absence of sassy stylish attire that just makes me cringe. Your new heroine, Ru, should be able to point this out to you.....maybe on an awakening sojourn to the Wyoming Ranchitoito.

[Edited on 11-18-2013 by DENNIS]

Bajahowodd - 11-17-2013 at 06:06 PM

So much of the "behavior" that Dennis complains about is strictly for entertainment purposes and to make money. Period.

As for those who consider Jane Fonda a traitor, just think about the fact that she risked a lucrative career to call out the absolute folly of the US being involved in a civil war of a foreign nation. Then, we did all again in Iraq, Why are we offering up our young folks as canon fodder for other folks problems?

Because there is an enormous amount of profit to be made by the military industrial complex. Americans get rich from the deaths and maimings of other Americans. It's sick.

Cisco - 11-17-2013 at 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Cisco
12 Celebrities To Come Out As Bisexual

Too long to print AND there are lot's of photos, so hope you enjoy Boys and Girls and....

Again....who effing cares? Why don't you put it up on your for-him?

Sweetie, I thought you cared. You responded with a question when I posted a few months ago with the question of whether or not pink "Truck Nutz" would look O.K. on my gay friends "Smart" car.

But, I guess you have people that take care of that as your friend Janene jumped right in and cut you off on that one.

Monoloco did respond and thought they would be fine as long as they did not clash with the paint, which they did not and they do look good on that sporty little car. (It's small enough to carry in through the double doors at the "Brass Rail" in Hillcrest and ALL the boys want their picture taken with it.)

Thanks, later...

Barry A. - 11-17-2013 at 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
So much of the "behavior" that Dennis complains about is strictly for entertainment purposes and to make money. Period.

As for those who consider Jane Fonda a traitor, just think about the fact that she risked a lucrative career to call out the absolute folly of the US being involved in a civil war of a foreign nation. Then, we did all again in Iraq, Why are we offering up our young folks as canon fodder for other folks problems?

Because there is an enormous amount of profit to be made by the military industrial complex. Americans get rich from the deaths and maimings of other Americans. It's sick.

Those wierdos in the Parades are "making money"???

Jane Fonda acted and spoke in ways that resulted in harm to American Service Men held by the enemy-------sounds like "treason" to me, and total stupidity, and total arrogance, or all the above. She is dispicable in her dumbness, in my book, and deserves her reputation.

The Capitolist System is based partially on creating opportunity, and folks taking advantage of those opportunities--------FOR PROFITS! No system involving people is without controversial methods and twisted people, but Capitolism appears to be helping the most to achieve prosperity and happiness to date. Prosecuting those that break the laws is ALWAYS desired and necessary as long as we don't get carried away, and we certainly don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.. ..that would be very foolish and counterproductive.

Barry

DENNIS - 11-17-2013 at 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
So much of the "behavior" that Dennis complains about is strictly for entertainment purposes and to make money. Period.

Complain? I couldn't care less what these freaks do.

Quote:

As for those who consider Jane Fonda a traitor, just think about the fact that she risked a lucrative career to call out the absolute folly of the US being involved in a civil war of a foreign nation.

What the b-tchwoman did was give aid an comfort to those who were killing US soldiers, my friends.

Is that OK with you?

Racial intolerance?

durrelllrobert - 11-18-2013 at 11:18 AM

If you wantta be tolerated it appears that you need to be proud and put "American after your race as in Afreakan - American. So from now on I wantta be known as a Slovenian-American. Some of the other folks can be:
Gay-American
BiSexual- American
Transvestite-American
etc.....
IMHO the only folks really entitled to be a -American are the Native-Americans.

DavidE - 11-18-2013 at 11:51 AM

Uh, which ones?

The first ones?

The second wave that walked over the land bridge and killed the first indigenous?

Or the third wave that brutalized the second wave?

We need to list the slaughtering conquerors chronologically in order to fully appreciate their efforts.

Like many of the early Baja California indigenous, who lived under piles of brush, went around naked, had no intertribal trading, and spent a lot of their time painting on cave walls in the seventeenth century images that were far inferior to those of Cro Magnon man 10,000 years ago.

Bajahowodd - 11-18-2013 at 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
So much of the "behavior" that Dennis complains about is strictly for entertainment purposes and to make money. Period.

Complain? I couldn't care less what these freaks do.

Quote:

What the b-tchwoman did was give aid an comfort to those who were killing US soldiers, my friends.

Is that OK with you?

Of course that is not ok with me. But the bigger picture was that we should not have been there in the first place. It was a civil war in a foreign country. Even the French wised up to that fact and left.

We Americans were still so uptight about the fact that communism was supposedly going to engulf the world, that it was so easy for those who stood to enrich themselves by our involvement that they played the American people.

Sound familiar? Think Iraq.

That said, I will not ever downplay the awful consequences that our troops encountered. I thank them for their sacrifice. And that includes you Dennis.

DavidE - 11-19-2013 at 12:59 PM

The issues in Vietnam were complicated beyond belief. I finally got my head screwed on straight after 5 hairdressers in Stockton lectured me for two hours. I got my hair cut while waiting for a Harbor Freight Store to open.

All 5 were elderly. All 5 were middle lower class Vietnamese.

Before getting all wound-up about this I would suggest a person talk to an ordinary immigrant. Little Saigon, near Long Beach would be a good starting point.

I am not defending the insane decision of USA administrations to get involved. But as a combat veteran, when I read stuff that is pure H.S. I tend to bristle. Ho Chi Minh's army head, Vo Nguyen Giap, was a brutal zealot who authorized terrorism against hamlet and province leaders, and ordinary citizens. I was unlucky enough to see the effects of some of his policies. They gave me nightmares.

Unlike France, the USA was not interested in Colonialism. Try as I might I cannot forgive LBJ for running down to his White House Situation Room in the basement, in his pajamas and circling bomb targets. When someone high in the Defense Dept raised an issue about the viability of defeating the Viet Cong and NVA, he unzipped his pants and flopped his -------- onto a table and quipped "Only a person who has these can make this type of decision".

As a kid, I never saw or read any of the behind the scenes revelations, but the uncovering of the facts turned me cold decades ago.

College kids who dressed in Che Guevara tee shirts, carried VC flags and threw blood on returning military personnel were too stupid to realize that in a communist society they themselves would be the very first to go to a re-education camp or get a bullet in the back of the head.

I keep in mind that flush with "victory" the NVA turned on the ethnic Chinese in Cholon, and when the Chinese sent massed forces across the border several thousand more Vietnamese died.

I have a care about making sweeping statements about Vietnam. Almost all are products of a figment of the imagination and few are objective.

Lee - 11-19-2013 at 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
The issues in Vietnam were complicated beyond belief. I finally got my head screwed on straight after 5 hairdressers in Stockton lectured me for two hours. I got my hair cut while waiting for a Harbor Freight Store to open.

All 5 were elderly. All 5 were middle lower class Vietnamese.

Before getting all wound-up about this I would suggest a person talk to an ordinary immigrant. Little Saigon, near Long Beach would be a good starting point.

I am not defending the insane decision of USA administrations to get involved. But as a combat veteran, when I read stuff that is pure H.S. I tend to bristle. Ho Chi Minh's army head, Vo Nguyen Giap, was a brutal zealot who authorized terrorism against hamlet and province leaders, and ordinary citizens. I was unlucky enough to see the effects of some of his policies. They gave me nightmares.

Unlike France, the USA was not interested in Colonialism. Try as I might I cannot forgive LBJ for running down to his White House Situation Room in the basement, in his pajamas and circling bomb targets. When someone high in the Defense Dept raised an issue about the viability of defeating the Viet Cong and NVA, he unzipped his pants and flopped his -------- onto a table and quipped "Only a person who has these can make this type of decision".

As a kid, I never saw or read any of the behind the scenes revelations, but the uncovering of the facts turned me cold decades ago.

College kids who dressed in Che Guevara tee shirts, carried VC flags and threw blood on returning military personnel were too stupid to realize that in a communist society they themselves would be the very first to go to a re-education camp or get a bullet in the back of the head.

I keep in mind that flush with "victory" the NVA turned on the ethnic Chinese in Cholon, and when the Chinese sent massed forces across the border several thousand more Vietnamese died.

I have a care about making sweeping statements about Vietnam. Almost all are products of a figment of the imagination and few are objective.

Is there a reason you're giving a political viewpoint on Vietnam 101 at length? Are you showing off?

The more I hear people blame Jane Fonda about her embarrassment, the more I think she get's my forgiveness and if you didn't see combat, save your meaningless patriotism for a parade. Get over yourself! Judge yourself!

I have a Che t-shirt. Is that a problem?

Wonder how many Marines I served with were gay? Didn't know any personally.

DavidE - 11-20-2013 at 11:08 AM

Been there done that. You probably served with a similar percentage of marines as I did on the Bassac with the USN.

What I BLAME Jane Fonda for is for not simply making a clear, vigorous, and continuous statement about the war, she had to go to Hanoi and act the part of a fool and then cash that in on her celebrate status.

You have the right to wear an Idi Amin dada, shirt if you wish. You earned it. Myself I would hesitate promoting the legacy of an individual so inept Fidel and Raul booted him out of Cuba before he could wreck the economy even more. The indigenous in Bolivia utterly rejected Che Guevara.

But yeah, I read and and I study. That's my bag. When I was sweating and swatting mosquitoes I and everyone else around me knew nothing about where we were and what was going on around us.

Biut bragadoccio? I think not. Impatience with people who make brash statements with little or no understanding of what they are pontificating. I got to see first hand what the "People's Movement" did to innocent civilians on a wholesale basis. Stuff like that is not easily forgotten. Forgive me.

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