BajaNomad - How have your experiences in Baja changed your view of the world?

How have your experiences in Baja changed your view of the world?

oxxo - 6-13-2024 at 06:13 AM

I have noted in various member's posts that their experiences in Baja run from basic, outback camping to owning 1st world type accommodations. How have those experiences changed your personal view of how you see your life in your current or former country where you spent your initial formative years compared to your experiences in Baja?

This thread may refer to some personal political viewpoints, in a general way. Please choose your words carefully when referring to another person's viewpoint. Por favor, do not name call. Everyone here probably has a different perspective and just maybe we can learn something from that perspective. Gracias a ti.

AKgringo - 6-13-2024 at 08:14 AM

I really can't say how my Mexico adventures have "changed" my view of the world since my view was shaped partly by visits since 1957 with my parents.

Sometimes it was ten or more years between visits, but I have watched things change there as I also changed over time.

oxxo - 6-13-2024 at 09:17 AM

Yes, I was thinking about your total experience, from 1957 to the present. I can't remember when my first visit to Tijuana/Ensenada was. I do know that my first visit to mainland Mexico was in 1966 and I know my introduction to Baja was prior to that. My experiences on the mainland were much different than in Baja. I much prefer the Baja experience to the mainland experience. It has been probably 40 years since I have been to mainland Mexico.

David K - 6-13-2024 at 09:28 AM

Like AKgringo, Baja California has been part of my life for decades, beginning in 1965.

My 'view' of the world was formed not in Baja, but mostly when my dad and I went to Australia for 6 months, when I was 12 (1970). There I learned how important America was to the Free World and how bad socialism (government run businesses, etc.) is for the people forced to have it.

Baja was always a breath of fresh air and made me feel whole. I have a connection with the history there (past life experience, perhaps?) and driving off-highway vehicles has been mandatory for me since I was 16.
The family of Baja enthusiasts who are on the Internet (Amigos de Baja at first then Baja Nomad) became my extended family to share fun times with, to help, and to share my discoveries with.

My view of the world was not so much changed by Baja, but how the world views me has! Find me and my Baja passions on the Internet, in Books, on TV shows, in a Film, and on YouTube!

mtgoat666 - 6-13-2024 at 11:18 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

Like AKgringo, Baja California has been part of my life for decades, beginning in 1965.

My 'view' of the world was formed not in Baja, but mostly when my dad and I went to Australia for 6 months, when I was 12 (1970). There I learned how important America was to the Free World and how bad socialism (government run businesses, etc.) is for the people forced to have it.

I am unfamiliar with Australia being socialist in the 1960s or 70s. What scary socialism did you see in Australia?

JDCanuck - 6-13-2024 at 11:47 AM

There were a few things about Baja and Mexico in general that impressed me.
The first was the Ejido situation where the homeless or extremely poor were offered a way to survive with minimal government support. Free land, build pretty much whatever you could for shelter without being chased off by regulatory restrictions, and opportunities to make some sort of living in a cooperative agricultural endeavor.
Here in our country we regulate the extremely poor into even poorer situations with the promise that we will "look after their basic needs", taking away their ability to look after themselves without harassment.
The second was the willingness to subsidize the fuel cost at the pump with higher excise taxes received by the gov't when oil costs went extremely high and also to subsidize the very lowest CFE users. Both those socialist actions seemed to me to help the very poorest survive through cost increase extremes without making them even more dependent on the government for handouts.
In my country we added additional climate taxes to fuel costs, increasing food and any other transportation dependent costs right when oil pricing hit new extreme highs in addition to adding more taxes to power costs at the same time Punishing the poorest seems to be our way of life here, so the wealthiest can make even more gains.
Just my opinions, I am neither Socialist nor Capitalist but I think if we look after our poorest, we all benefit

surabi - 6-13-2024 at 12:21 PM

The US Homestead Act of 1872 was similar to the ejido concept. It was repealed in 1976, but there are actually still places where you can get free land under certain conditions. Of course, that doesn't help if you are too poor to build or develop anything on the land.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/free-land-us-2023-133101891.h...

As for looking after a nation's disadvantaged, that is definitely in the interests of society apart from it being a humane thing to do. It is well-documented that poverty and lack of education are the leading causes of crime.

Sandlefoot - 6-13-2024 at 12:44 PM

I am unfamiliar with Australia being socialist in the 1960s or 70s. What scary socialism did you see in Australia?[/rquote]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_Australia

volcano3 - 6-13-2024 at 04:18 PM

In 1975, having finished college, I spent 6 months in Mexico and Central America. It was a fantastic lesson in how little you really need to get by.....all the extra trappings.. are just that. I am thankful that I started my adult journey with this eye opener. You don't need 3 cars, every latest appliance.. etc, etc.... Today my cabin in Baja is very different than most.... off grid.. my only appliance is a fridge, run by 2 solar panels. Our water is heated by a batch solar system, home made. I did not come here to live the high life with maids and gardeners.

JDCanuck - 6-13-2024 at 04:25 PM

I really believe Baja has a better future outlook than the two much wealthier countries north of it. If they can deal with the present corruption, the underlying people still have that personal respect for others at a humanity level that we used to have and is being destroyed by our material wealth focus.

AKgringo - 6-13-2024 at 05:00 PM

My last mainland visit was in late 2007 to Melaque, near Manzanillo, Colima. The main difference I noticed over time is the rise of a middle class.

It is even more pronounced in Baja, probably because there is a larger percentage of us Gringos and Canucks bringing dollars into the economy.

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by AKgringo]

oxxo - 6-13-2024 at 05:04 PM

We are starting to drift off the subject when we talk about Socialism, National Debt, etc. That would be the subject of a different thread if someone desires. Statistically, Mexico is more Socialistic than some countries and less Socialistic than others.

My first foreign country experience was in Mexico a long time ago with the book, "Mexico on $5 a Day." I'm sure some of you remember that popular book at that time. I loved the experience and made me look at my formative years in California from a new perspective. It gave me the thirst to experience other cultures in other foreign lands and that resulted in my living in another foreign country, far away from California, for two years. My stipend was $25 per month total for my wife and I, when the entry wage for a white collar job was around $600 and minimum wage was about $1.75. At our location, UNFERTILIZED eggs were $1 EACH (fertilized eggs were essentially free). We had no electricity, no running water, no transportation, and no other conveniences. Pineapples, coconuts, and bananas were free to pick as needed and fish were plentiful if I could spear one. We lived in a 10 x 20 thatched hut like all the other villagers. It was basically a socialistic society because the villagers had nothing of financial value, so they helped each other by sharing whatever they did have. At $25 per month, we were probably the wealthiest people in the village! But the experience was cathartic to us. When we looked at the US from the outside, looking in, we began to realize what a privileged life we had in the US. Once we returned, we never took for granted all the benefits we enjoy in the US today. The experience changed our lives immeasurably and changed our view of the world!!!

And that experience led me to become a Residente Permanente in Baja where our transformational change was further strengthened. The 20 years that I have lived in Mexico has indeed continued how I view the ever changing world. Although I don't live in the squalor that I did at one time in my life, I still appreciate and sympathize with the poor in Mexico and their struggle for dignity and well being.

I will always be grateful to the Mexican people of Baja California for all the kindness they have shown to me. Yes, it has further changed how I view the world, thanks to them.

JDCanuck - 6-13-2024 at 06:27 PM

How Baja has affected me will always be related to the differences there from where i come from and the changes I have observed in just a few years. While some is affected by the economic differences, most is affected by the nature of the people as they move through an increasingly improved economic situation. Local people I know worked 7 days a week to survive when I first started going there. Now those same people work 5 days for an employer, 1 for themselves and one is spent with their family. A big change and a rising standard of living. Ejidos on the other hand are very slowly receiving more services and there has been much slower improvements.

Secondly I watched how they treat the elderly and disabled, helping them cross roads, getting chairs for them to sit in, and numerous other statements of caring and respect they show to individuals who are poorer than they. This does have an affect on my actions whenever i get back here.

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by JDCanuck]

oxxo - 6-13-2024 at 07:30 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

How Baja has affected me will always be related to the differences there from where i come from and the changes I have observed in just a few years. While some is affected by the economic differences, most is affected by the nature of the people as they move through an increasingly improved economic situation. Local people I know worked 7 days a week to survive when I first started going there. Now those same people work 5 days for an employer, 1 for themselves and one is spent with their family. A big change and a rising standard of living. Ejidos on the other hand are very slowly receiving more services and there has been much slower improvements.

Secondly I watched how they treat the elderly and disabled, helping them cross roads, getting chairs for them to sit in, and numerous other statements of caring and respect they show to individuals who are poorer than they. This does have an affect on my actions whenever i get back here.

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by JDCanuck]

surabi - 6-13-2024 at 10:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck

Secondly I watched how they treat the elderly and disabled, helping them cross roads, getting chairs for them to sit in, and numerous other statements of caring and respect they show to individuals who are poorer than they. This does have an affect on my actions whenever i get back here.

To add to that, they also don't ship Grandma and Grandpa off to an assisted living center or nursing home. They take care of the elderly at home.

Once in Canada, my dad and stepmom, who were seniors, had come from the UK, where they lived, and were visiting and staying with my oldest daughter. She and her husband gave them their master bedroom and moved into the guest room. I was about 55 at the time, and said somewhat jokingly, "So when I get to be that age and come to visit are you going to give me the master bedroom?"

My daughter turned to me and said, quite seriously, "No, you'll be in a nursing home". When she saw the look on my face, she backtracked a bit and asked somewhat sheepishly, "Well, what do you want us to do with you?"

I told her if I was so far gone that I needed to be in a nursing home, she could kill me.

Unless they have some serious medical issue, the elderly in Mexico, by and large, seem to live to a ripe old age, and I am sure that continuing to live with their grown children, with their grandkids and great-grandkids around, has a lot to do with it.

It dismays me that middle-aged people up north seem to feel that having their elderly parents live with them, when they can no longer live on their own, (as long as Grandma isn't the kind of person who is hard to get along with) is an unwanted burden that will cramp their lifestyle. Not because I am in my 70's myself, but because I think it reflects poorly on our society and is sad.

An senior Mexican woman I know once asked me if my grown children help me out financially. When I said no, they have their own families to support, she said "But they're supposed to help you out- you paid to raise them all those years and then it's their turn to help pay your expenses, that's how it's supposed to work".

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by surabi]

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by surabi]

oxxo - 6-14-2024 at 06:01 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi

Unless they have some serious medical issue, the elderly in Mexico, by and large, seem to live to a ripe old age, and I am sure that continuing to live with their grown children, with their grandkids and great-grandkids around, has a lot to do with it.

I was watching a documentary on Netflix recently. Statistically, elderly who live at home with their family live a minimum of 6 years longer than living elsewhere (rather than at some elderly facility). So yes @Surabi, Mexico does have a better system of elderly care than most other developed and undeveloped countries in the world. Now if I could only get some young Baja Mexican family to adopt me! :light:

AKgringo - 6-14-2024 at 07:10 AM

When I was 60, I left Alaska on what was going to be a long vacation exploring the country of Chili. My first stop was in California to spend some time with my dad, who was stil living in the house he bought in 1947.

He had some serious medical issues develop while I was there, so the trip was cancelled and I spent the next couple of years mostly in CA with frequent trips to AK to take care of loose ends.

I never did return to work as his cognitive state started to decline along with his physical condition. He did wind up in an assisted living facility (which he actually liked) but he wanted me in the house.

I had a good position with a company that kept me busy, and a couple of more years of construction would have fattened my retirement savings as well as my pension and social security, but family comes first!

I have an older brother and sister, but they were not able to accommodate Dad's needs without major disruptions to their own lives. It was a challenge, but it did bring me closer to my dad than I had ever been.

oxxo - 6-14-2024 at 09:08 AM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo

When I was 60, I left Alaska on what was going to be a long vacation exploring the country of Chili. My first stop was in California to spend some time with my dad, who was stil living in the house he bought in 1947.

He had some serious medical issues develop while I was there, so the trip was cancelled and I spent the next couple of years mostly in CA with frequent trips to AK to take care of loose ends.

I never did return to work as his cognitive state started to decline along with his physical condition. He did wind up in an assisted living facility (which he actually liked) but he wanted me in the house.

I had a good position with a company that kept me busy, and a couple of more years of construction would have fattened my retirement savings as well as my pension and social security, but family comes first!

I have an older brother and sister, but they were not able to accommodate Dad's needs without major disruptions to their own lives. It was a challenge, but it did bring me closer to my dad than I had ever been.

wilderone - 6-14-2024 at 03:20 PM

Good topic. I think I can say now, with the benefit of hindsight, that my Baja experiences, starting around 1977, helped me realize my undefined je ne sais quoi quest for adventure and exploration. Baja was close, it was easy, I went time after time, developing my inner Bear Grylls. I've been blessed.

oxxo - 6-14-2024 at 03:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by wilderone

Good topic. I think I can say now, with the benefit of hindsight, that my Baja experiences, starting around 1977, helped me realize my undefined je ne sais quoi quest for adventure and exploration. Baja was close, it was easy, I went time after time, developing my inner Bear Grylls. I've been blessed.

geoffff - 6-15-2024 at 04:09 PM

I came across freedom (especially freedom to travel) like I had never experienced in the USA. A freedom that appears as lack of rules (or at least informal rule-bending or even rule-ignoring) everywhere. A freedom that only works until too many people and money turn up and regulations start being enforced.

(At least from my privileged gringo perspective.)

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by geoffff]

David K - 6-15-2024 at 05:38 PM

Personal freedom to do what you choose (as long as it doesn't harm anyone else) in the open country, connect with God, Nature, or your inner soul, is a huge attraction to going into Baja.

oxxo - 6-15-2024 at 06:42 PM

Quote: Originally posted by geoffff

I came across freedom (especially freedom to travel) like I had never experienced in the USA. A freedom that appears as lack of rules (or at least informal rule-bending or even rule-ignoring) everywhere. A freedom that only works until too many people and money turn up and regulations start being enforced.

(At least from my privileged gringo perspective.)

Thank you for your perspective, it is helpful to the subject of this topic.

oxxo - 6-15-2024 at 06:44 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

Personal freedom to do what you choose (as long as it doesn't harm anyone else) in the open country, connect with God, Nature, or your inner soul, is a huge attraction to going into Baja.

LIKE, as long as you are not doing harm to anyone else, which is subject to reasonable dispute.

surabi - 6-15-2024 at 07:01 PM

No rules works fine if everyone is respectful of others, including the fauna and flora and the environment and has common sense. Unfortunately that's often not the case.

oxxo - 6-15-2024 at 07:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi

No rules works fine if everyone is respectful of others, including the fauna and flora and the environment and has common sense. Unfortunately that's often not the case.

AGREE. Some people want personal freedom without considering how that might impact others including floa and fauna. It becomes a philosophical decision that "I am more important than anything else." No rules is the classic definition of "anarchy." That philosophy has never been successful in the history of the world since we are an interdependent society of humanoids, plants, and animals.

shari - 6-16-2024 at 12:14 PM

Where to begin....Baja & its people have made me a better all round person with the lessons I have learned like patience, understanding, not judging, cooperation, respect, how little one can be happy on, ingenuity, more patience, admiration of how people are treated equally and how they all look after each other especially the elderly, unfortunate souls, incapacitated etc. It takes a village.
All of this has molded me into a new more compassionate, patient human with a more positive outlook on life and the world.

David K - 6-16-2024 at 12:26 PM

That is very nice, Shari. Thank you for sharing!