BajaNomad

Driving USA to Baja, then flying Tijuana to USA

BajaNaranja - 7-23-2024 at 07:58 AM

Hola amigos! I have a question that I think I know the answer to, but wanted to check with the Baja braintrust in hopes of avoiding any immigration entanglements...

So, a two part question:

1.) Would an FMM obtained when driving into Tijuana from San Diego be all I need to use to fly out from Tijuana to a US airport (will my passport in hand too, of course)? 

2.) For the return flight from USA back to Tijuana, would I show the FMM again, or keep that in my pocket and be issued fresh immigration materials via the usual USA -> Mex process...? If the original FMM is a 180 day version, would be "cashed in" since I used it to exit Mexico on the northbound flight, or still viable?

Muchas gracias for any relevant experience / expertise you can offer!

mtgoat666 - 7-23-2024 at 09:54 AM

Valid fmm form should get you thru exit immigration.

Every tourist air entry into mex gets new fmm-type stamp in PP. fmm is not useable for multiple entries.

cupcake - 7-23-2024 at 11:28 AM

I've not yet ever flown between Mexico and the US. However, I've crossed between the two countries many times via Baja land borders. Unless something has changed, you keep your FMM when exiting Mexico, and if it is a 180-day FMM, it can be used to re-enter Mexico, as long as your re-entry is within the period of validity for the FMM. I have done this many times at the San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing. Obviously, if there is not much time left on your FMM, it would be better to get a new FMM upon returning to Mexico. But, if you still have considerable time left on the FMM, it could save you the expense of getting a new one.

Purdyd - 7-23-2024 at 03:30 PM

When you fly from Mexico to the US, they used to take your FMM.

I don’t know what they are doing now,

The flights into Mexico include the FMM fee and when you go through Mexican immigration at the airport you get a stamp in your passport.

surabi - 7-23-2024 at 05:36 PM

Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
I've not yet ever flown between Mexico and the US. However, I've crossed between the two countries many times via Baja land borders. Unless something has changed, you keep your FMM when exiting Mexico, and if it is a 180-day FMM, it can be used to re-enter Mexico, as long as your re-entry is within the period of validity for the FMM. I have done this many times at the San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing. Obviously, if there is not much time left on your FMM, it would be better to get a new FMM upon returning to Mexico. But, if you still have considerable time left on the FMM, it could save you the expense of getting a new one.


This has nothing to do with flying in and out. OP will get an exit stamp in his passport at the INM desk when flying out. FMM no longer valid. New passport stamp entry on return to Mexico.
Also illegal to leave vehicle in Mexico when he flies out, as FMM it is tied to will no longer be valid.

[Edited on 7-24-2024 by surabi]

wilderone - 7-24-2024 at 05:11 AM

Not specifically commenting on your travel plans, but you could consider other options, such as parking in Otay Mesa instead of driving vehicle into TJ, and getting your FMM for specific flight travel at the TJ airport. IF they are still issuing FMMs - as some say, might just be a passport stamp. If you get an FMM for travel by car, issued for 180 days for additional vehicle travel in Mexico, it might be taken from you if proffered for air travel. This happened to me - I argued, but it's still good for vehicle travel, but took it anyway.

BajaNaranja - 7-24-2024 at 08:28 AM

Muchas gracias mi amigos! Really appreciate your feedback and insights!

FWIW, there are more than one of us driving south, but only one flying from TJ (I simplified the scenario a bit for clarity, in my original post).

So we'll all get 7-day FMMs southbound in the car, and then later if the person flying has their FMM snagged, then their passport stamp upon airport re-entry should have them covered.

Salud!!

AKgringo - 7-24-2024 at 08:45 AM

BajaNaranja, thanks for the added info! I may be doing the same thing this fall, with my son along for the ride south, but he would need to fly back north before I would be ready to return.

Loreto would be the airport, and it should be the same as flying from T.J., but that probably depends on local interpretation of the rules.

surabi - 7-24-2024 at 11:19 AM

Quote: Originally posted by wilderone  
This happened to me - I argued, but it's still good for vehicle travel, but took it anyway.


You were wrong- it isn't "still good for vehicle travel". There aren't different tourist permissions depending on whether you drive or fly. Tourist visas are good for one trip into Mexico. When you leave, that visa is void, regardless of whether it was good for 7 days or 180 days.

BajaNaranja - 7-24-2024 at 11:35 AM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
BajaNaranja, thanks for the added info! I may be doing the same thing this fall, with my son along for the ride south, but he would need to fly back north before I would be ready to return.

Loreto would be the airport, and it should be the same as flying from T.J., but that probably depends on local interpretation of the rules.


Gotcha - I'll report back in mid-August, in case whatever happens is helpful info for planning for your trip with your son!

mtgoat666 - 7-24-2024 at 11:58 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by wilderone  
This happened to me - I argued, but it's still good for vehicle travel, but took it anyway.


You were wrong- it isn't "still good for vehicle travel". There aren't different tourist permissions depending on whether you drive or fly. Tourist visas are good for one trip into Mexico. When you leave, that visa is void, regardless of whether it was good for 7 days or 180 days.


in baja many gringos just stop to get fmm every 180 days, and cross land border repeatedly in the 180 days. some IMM agents wink and say this is OK, but the written regs dont say this is OK. since there is little enforcement of the fmm single-crossing usage, many avoid spending money and time on extra fmms.

i can tell you that using your pre-existing fmm to cross cbx southbound is not acceptable. try that and they will say "no dice, son."

the land border crossing is not too regulated on mexican side. many gringos cross w/o PP or tourist visa, since there is general ignorance of and virtually no enforcement of mexican immigration law for gringos crossing by land, and usa cbp seems to not care too much about northbound gringos w/o PPs

cupcake - 7-24-2024 at 12:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  


in baja many gringos just stop to get fmm every 180 days, and cross land border repeatedly in the 180 days. some IMM agents wink and say this is OK, but the written regs dont say this is OK. since there is little enforcement of the fmm single-crossing usage, many avoid spending money and time on extra fmms.

i can tell you that using your pre-existing fmm to cross cbx southbound is not acceptable. try that and they will say "no dice, son."


There well might have been a change in the official rules. However, see info via this link (excerpt below):

https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa
"Is it possible to enter and exit Baja multiple times with the same tourist card (FMM)?
Yes. The INM delegate for Baja California Norte announced in September 2015 that the FMM is now multiple entry for land travel in Baja California Norte only." [updated March 2024]

I have used an (old) FMM to re-enter Mexico at San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing, and then flown from Tijuana to Mexico City with that same FMM. However, it has been a number of years since I did this.

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]

mtgoat666 - 7-24-2024 at 12:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  


in baja many gringos just stop to get fmm every 180 days, and cross land border repeatedly in the 180 days. some IMM agents wink and say this is OK, but the written regs dont say this is OK. since there is little enforcement of the fmm single-crossing usage, many avoid spending money and time on extra fmms.

i can tell you that using your pre-existing fmm to cross cbx southbound is not acceptable. try that and they will say "no dice, son."


There well might have been a change in the official rules. However, see info via this link (excerpt below):

https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa
"Is it possible to enter and exit Baja multiple times with the same tourist card (FMM)?
Yes. The INM delegate for Baja California Norte announced in September 2015 that the FMM is now multiple entry for land travel in Baja California Norte only."


https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa


Huh? According to an insurance broker’s website, an unnamed INM official said something 9 years ago…

Waiting to see “official rules.” Usually that is a written document…

I will admit to using my FMM for multiple land border entries,… but it probably only works for me because there is little to no enforecement,… except at cbx where multiple entry on one fmm was rejected by CBX agents.

cupcake - 7-24-2024 at 01:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  


in baja many gringos just stop to get fmm every 180 days, and cross land border repeatedly in the 180 days. some IMM agents wink and say this is OK, but the written regs dont say this is OK. since there is little enforcement of the fmm single-crossing usage, many avoid spending money and time on extra fmms.

i can tell you that using your pre-existing fmm to cross cbx southbound is not acceptable. try that and they will say "no dice, son."


There well might have been a change in the official rules. However, see info via this link (excerpt below):

https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa
"Is it possible to enter and exit Baja multiple times with the same tourist card (FMM)?
Yes. The INM delegate for Baja California Norte announced in September 2015 that the FMM is now multiple entry for land travel in Baja California Norte only."


https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa


Huh? According to an insurance broker’s website, an unnamed INM official said something 9 years ago…

Waiting to see “official rules.” Usually that is a written document…

I will admit to using my FMM for multiple land border entries,… but it probably only works for me because there is little to no enforecement,… except at cbx where multiple entry on one fmm was rejected by CBX agents.


I am seeing the same thing on a number of sites:

https://www.discoverbaja.com/fmm-faqs/
"Can I use my FMM for multiple entries?
While the old law said that FMM tourist permits were only valid for one use into Mexico, the INM has recently said that FMM tourist permits can be used for multiple entries in and out of Mexico, through the end date of the permit."

[Edited on 7-24-2024 by cupcake]

surabi - 7-24-2024 at 01:33 PM

Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  


I have used an (old) FMM to re-enter Mexico at San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing, and then flown from Tijuana to Mexico City with that same FMM. However, it has been a number of years since I did this.



You keep conflating things which are irrelevant. If you were allowed to walk or drive into Northern Baja with a tourist visa which you had entered on previously and which had a still valid expiry date, taking a domestic flight using that visa would not be an issue, because as far as any immigration check at the airport is concerned, they have no idea that you entered a second time on that visa- all they see is the expiry date on the visa.

And as far as official INM policy on multiple entries, while some INM agents may allow it at some border crossings in Baja, it states clearly on the FMM form that it is valid for the length of your stay (up until the expiry date). When you exit Mexico, your "stay" is over.




[Edited on 7-24-2024 by surabi]

mtgoat666 - 7-24-2024 at 01:37 PM

Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  


in baja many gringos just stop to get fmm every 180 days, and cross land border repeatedly in the 180 days. some IMM agents wink and say this is OK, but the written regs dont say this is OK. since there is little enforcement of the fmm single-crossing usage, many avoid spending money and time on extra fmms.

i can tell you that using your pre-existing fmm to cross cbx southbound is not acceptable. try that and they will say "no dice, son."


There well might have been a change in the official rules. However, see info via this link (excerpt below):

https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa
"Is it possible to enter and exit Baja multiple times with the same tourist card (FMM)?
Yes. The INM delegate for Baja California Norte announced in September 2015 that the FMM is now multiple entry for land travel in Baja California Norte only."


https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa


Huh? According to an insurance broker’s website, an unnamed INM official said something 9 years ago…

Waiting to see “official rules.” Usually that is a written document…

I will admit to using my FMM for multiple land border entries,… but it probably only works for me because there is little to no enforecement,… except at cbx where multiple entry on one fmm was rejected by CBX agents.


I am seeing the same thing on a number of sites:

https://www.discoverbaja.com/fmm-faqs/
"Can I use my FMM for multiple entries?
While the old law said that FMM tourist permits were only valid for one use into Mexico, the INM has recently said that FMM tourist permits can be used for multiple entries in and out of Mexico, through the end date of the permit."

[Edited on 7-24-2024 by cupcake]


Gotta love the unwritten, secret laws. Spoken of only by unnamed individuals, and never documented in writing.

SFandH - 7-24-2024 at 01:52 PM

Several years ago, the business owners in Tijuana that cater to American tourists walking across the border complained to the governor of BC about requiring daytrippers to get a new FMM every time they walked across, even if a short-duration FMM was free. INM rules were relaxed to enable pedestrians multiple entries on an FMM that hasn't expired. At least, that's what happened at the Tijuana pedestrian crossings. Of course, nobody checks if you're driving across. Airport rules follow a different process.

So, are you walking, driving, or flying? The rules differ, or at least the enforcement of the rules differs. I've shown the same, unexpired FMM many times walking across at San Ysidro, and have never produced it when driving across.




[Edited on 7-24-2024 by SFandH]

cupcake - 7-24-2024 at 02:09 PM

Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Several years ago, the INM rules were relaxed to enable pedestrians multiple entries on an FMM that hasn't expired. At least, that's what happened at the Tijuana pedestrian crossings.


I haven't been able to find anything official about this online, though in the past I remember seeing it. However, my personal experience has been the same as yours.

https://soniadiazmexico.com/tourist-visas/
Tourist Card - FMM
"The back of the form confirms it is for one entry; however, in Baja California it may be used for multiple entries."

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]

cupcake - 7-25-2024 at 03:11 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  


I have used an (old) FMM to re-enter Mexico at San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing, and then flown from Tijuana to Mexico City with that same FMM. However, it has been a number of years since I did this.



You keep conflating things which are irrelevant. If you were allowed to walk or drive into Northern Baja with a tourist visa which you had entered on previously and which had a still valid expiry date, taking a domestic flight using that visa would not be an issue, because as far as any immigration check at the airport is concerned, they have no idea that you entered a second time on that visa- all they see is the expiry date on the visa.

And as far as official INM policy on multiple entries, while some INM agents may allow it at some border crossings in Baja, it states clearly on the FMM form that it is valid for the length of your stay (up until the expiry date). When you exit Mexico, your "stay" is over.
[Edited on 7-24-2024 by surabi]


I haven't conflated anything, nor have I posted anything which is irrelevant. Regarding a flyer's FMM, we don't know what information is available to airport personnel. You say "all they see is the expiry date", which might or might not be true. They might have access to more information than just the expiry date, in an electronic database. Therefore, since we don't know for sure what information they have, my advising that I encountered no problems using my FMM, in the situation described, is not irrelevant.

Regarding the FMM stating on the back that it is valid for a single entry only, I know this. I even linked to a website previously that states this. However, the exception for northern Baja, i.e. San Ysidro-Tijuana crossing, where the FMM can be used for multiple entries, is not just something that is done at the whim of individual INM Agents. This was an official directive, I remember it clearly, as it was much discussed on the Lonely Planet website, back when their Thorntree Forum was still in existence. Nothing I have posted in regards to this item of discussion has been conflated or irrelevant.

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]

cupcake - 7-25-2024 at 03:48 PM

Below is a link to Nomad David K's website, Viva Baja. David thinks highly enough of Baja Bound Insurance, that he links to their website regarding FMM issues and more. This is the same company I linked to previously in this thread.

https://vivabaja.com/advice-on-driving/
"The FMM can be free for visits of 7 days (6 nights) or less. For up to 180 days, the fee is 717 pesos, about $40 (U.S.) dollars, currently. You keep the FMM until it expires, for multiple auto trips south. Unlike the flying FMM, it does not get returned to INM when you leave Mexico." [written in 2023]

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]

cupcake - 7-25-2024 at 04:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by wilderone  
This happened to me - I argued, but it's still good for vehicle travel, but took it anyway.


You were wrong- it isn't "still good for vehicle travel". There aren't different tourist permissions depending on whether you drive or fly. Tourist visas are good for one trip into Mexico. When you leave, that visa is void, regardless of whether it was good for 7 days or 180 days.


It appears to me, in the context of what wilderone described, they were correct. The FMM wilderone had was indeed usable for multiple entries at northern Baja crossings. Just as David K states on his website Viva Baja.

mtgoat666 - 7-25-2024 at 04:51 PM

Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Below is a link to Nomad David K's website, Viva Baja. David thinks highly enough of Baja Bound Insurance, that he links to their website regarding FMM issues and more. This is the same company I linked to previously in this thread.

https://vivabaja.com/advice-on-driving/
"The FMM can be free for visits of 7 days (6 nights) or less. For up to 180 days, the fee is 717 pesos, about $40 (U.S.) dollars, currently. You keep the FMM until it expires, for multiple auto trips south. Unlike the flying FMM, it does not get returned to INM when you leave Mexico." [written in 2023]

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]


If you found it on the internet, then it must be true! :lol:

mtgoat666 - 7-26-2024 at 10:01 AM

Quote: Originally posted by wilderone  
Not like the old days.

https://www.mexicotouristcard.com/

Gotta question? Email: Contact@MexicoTouristCard.com


That looks like some fishy non-govt website…



cupcake - 7-26-2024 at 12:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by cupcake  
Below is a link to Nomad David K's website, Viva Baja. David thinks highly enough of Baja Bound Insurance, that he links to their website regarding FMM issues and more. This is the same company I linked to previously in this thread.

https://vivabaja.com/advice-on-driving/
"The FMM can be free for visits of 7 days (6 nights) or less. For up to 180 days, the fee is 717 pesos, about $40 (U.S.) dollars, currently. You keep the FMM until it expires, for multiple auto trips south. Unlike the flying FMM, it does not get returned to INM when you leave Mexico." [written in 2023]

[Edited on 7-25-2024 by cupcake]


If you found it on the internet, then it must be true! :lol:



I have personally reentered Mexico at SY-TJ crossing with an old FMM and had the Mexican border agent tell me, in perfect English, "yes, these are now multiple entry."

Though it is always good to be skeptical of what you read online, if you think about it, this really does have to be a case of an official directive, probably as reported on a number of websites. There is no doubt that INM agents in northern Baja have been treating FMM as multiple entry. It does not seem possible that a group of INM agents got together and decided to do this on their own. They would be likely to lose their job and possibly face criminal prosecution, if they were doing this outside of an official directive. If it were just a one off instance of a single agent doing this, that would be one thing, but it is not. It is many agents over a lengthy period of time.

wilderone - 7-26-2024 at 06:10 PM

"some fishy non-govt website"
might be right ... I deleted my post !!

towntaco - 7-30-2024 at 10:29 AM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
BajaNaranja, thanks for the added info! I may be doing the same thing this fall, with my son along for the ride south, but he would need to fly back north before I would be ready to return.

Loreto would be the airport, and it should be the same as flying from T.J., but that probably depends on local interpretation of the rules.

My family flew out of SJD last year after we drove across at Mexicali West (where we got an FMM). Zero issues.

surabi - 7-30-2024 at 11:54 AM

Of course there weren't any issues. You got tourist cards when you entered Mexico and there aren't any restrictions anywhere in Mexico as to leaving the country by a different mode of transportation than the one you used to enter.

Purdyd - 7-31-2024 at 06:50 AM

Quote: Originally posted by towntaco  
Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
BajaNaranja, thanks for the added info! I may be doing the same thing this fall, with my son along for the ride south, but he would need to fly back north before I would be ready to return.

Loreto would be the airport, and it should be the same as flying from T.J., but that probably depends on local interpretation of the rules.

My family flew out of SJD last year after we drove across at Mexicali West (where we got an FMM). Zero issues.


Yes should be no problem but did they take it when you flew out of SJD?

That is what they used to do if you flew out of SJD.

And if you fly back into Mexico, the FMM fee is included in the airfare fees.

So even if they didn’t take it, if you fly back into Mexico you are paying the FMM fee anyway.

If you were to drive back into Mexico, I don’t see it would be a problem as long as they didn’t take the FMM.



surabi - 7-31-2024 at 10:33 AM

You always have to turn in the tourist card when you fly out of any airport in Mexico.

Purdyd - 7-31-2024 at 04:37 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
You always have to turn in the tourist card when you fly out of any airport in Mexico.


But you don’t get a tourist card anymore when you fly into Mexico, they stamp your passport.

So no tourist card to return. And they've given me 180 days written next to the stamp.

surabi - 7-31-2024 at 05:31 PM

Yes, I'm well aware they stamp passports now on airline entry into Mexico and also on exit.

This thread was about driving in, getting a tourist card at that time, and then flying out.

My point was that if you had a tourist card, it was and will be always taken from you when flying out.


[Edited on 8-1-2024 by surabi]

[Edited on 8-1-2024 by surabi]

towntaco - 8-1-2024 at 06:00 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Purdyd  


Yes should be no problem but did they take it when you flew out of SJD?

That is what they used to do if you flew out of SJD.

And if you fly back into Mexico, the FMM fee is included in the airfare fees.

So even if they didn’t take it, if you fly back into Mexico you are paying the FMM fee anyway.

If you were to drive back into Mexico, I don’t see it would be a problem as long as they didn’t take the FMM.




Mexican INM staff took each family members FMM when flying out of SJD.