BajaNomad - Stay Safe - Powered by XMB

Stay Safe

Baja Bernie - 5-6-2005 at 07:26 AM

A while back we were talking about the risks in life, but this is nuts.

Union Tribune 5-6-05

Man grabbed from upscale Tijuana club . A team of more that 10 heavily armed men, masked and dressed in black, stormed the exclusive Club Campestre and grabbed a man who was trying to elude them?????.Ernesto Santillana, secretary of public safety, said that they appear to be ex-police officers from all three levels of government??These are very professional people???..Last year Tijuana experienced 355 homicides and in the first four months of this year ---163 homicides.

Last week it from a restaurant in Rio Zone where a man was abducted in the same manner and later found beaten and strangled.

I guess the tourists don't have to worry because these guys are 'professionals.'
I no longer wander about Tijuana.

STAY SAFE Amigo?s

yankeeirishman - 5-6-2005 at 07:38 AM

You suppose most of these killings are in drug related circles? I do. The tourist is not the aim of most of these killings. Damn tweekers.

lindsay - 5-7-2005 at 04:46 AM

Unfortunately, the kidnapped man is a cousin of a friend of mine at work and the situation is obviously grim considering there has been no ransom call and recently another similar event took place that ended in a homicide. My friend does not know of any organized crime connections with her cousin but as she points out...you never know what could have been going on. In any event, whatever the circumstances, the rising violence is disturbing as the problem of being at the "wrong place at the wrong time" can and has happened to local residents during these abductions.

We'll see how this event unfolds and hope for the best...

Dave - 5-7-2005 at 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja Bernie
A while back we were talking about the risks in life, but this is nuts

Yeah, but look at the plus side:

It will now be easier to get a good tee time.

Dave

Baja Bernie - 5-8-2005 at 06:10 PM

True!!!
But they found the last guy---he was alll choked up also.

No Laughing on Mother's Day

lindsay - 5-8-2005 at 09:03 PM

So, the latest victim is found dead on the side of a busy TJ road and today, as a mom on Alta CA's Mother's Day...2 days before Baja California, I ask you to try to pause before you put humor on a missing man, now dead as his mom passes this Mother's Day in mourning. Sure, he may have been running in the wrong circles, maybe his family knew, maybe not...I don't know. I guess what I want to convey is laughing at another's crisis hit me when I read "the tee time" comment. I see my friend, a cousin of the murdered man, cope with this crisis and it's no longer a distant story so joking about it now seems cruel. Sorry to go on but when you're indirectly witness to what this one extended family in TJ is experiencing it makes you ask others for reflection about it...what if it was your relative or child??. Believe me the golf line is humorous when it's part of some fictional joke but not when it's attached to someone's life crisis. Solamente son los sentimientos sinceros de una madre..

Y que le hacemos?

fdt - 5-8-2005 at 09:38 PM

some of my personal friends are gone, they either took another route or destiny had different plans for them. Adolfo F. was my firend and so was Ivan E., but then again so was Emilio V. and Alex H. and many others. We all had fun, we all did and did'nt. Destiny sent me in another direction than that of other friends that had the same level of education, parents, money, etc. Some of my friends have high government positions or have had them, some are businessmen/women, some persued their career, some ended up working at a job. I had the opportunity to hire one of them as my employee. I have been to La Paz, were at least 32 of us were studying tourism at the time and only myself and Myrna had persued that industry. And guess what, I hav'nt been involved in tourism since Feb 2004. Funny (or not) I got into a red cab in Tijuana, the ruta fija cabs and EL Fily was the driver, what's up with that? We used to compete for the same girlfriend. Yes very traumatic when we hear the news, OH MY GOD, we all scream or we wonder why him/her, but as time goes by we figure (those close or involved), puta, que mala onda, pero ni pedo, arrieros somos y en el camino andamos. Que descansen en paz los ultimos dos. There is a song by (the now enemy combatant:lol

Cat Stevens that says "But I might die tonight"

lindsay - 5-8-2005 at 10:13 PM

I don't think any of us have an answer as to when and why our moment to leave this world happens and we all get there whether through our own choices, accidents or nature. My main feeling was I can't poke fun at another family's tragedy. My friend, a cousin of Ivan, said many of the same sentiments you expressed. She took a different route too and teaches now. She told me before his body was found that she was resigned to him already being dead. Then, she talked about being cousins in TJ, his family and his mother. She was mourning their loss and I think that there's a dignity to that. You're right, we can be done at any time and it may be the road we chose or really crappy misfortune. Last month, I helped at a accident north of Loreto where a Mexican family of 8 had a multiple-rollover crash. Everyone was thrown from the van, no one probably had a seatbelt on and when we were checking the kids, a baby was trapped under the car, already dead. Like the crime violence, we can cry why and get weary from it...and wait for it to happen again. But for each of those families, I respect their moment to mourn what was and will not be

I super respect

fdt - 5-8-2005 at 10:55 PM

I read your story here, it realy got to me , but I dont always reply. I don't remember the part about the baby under the van but in any case, we (the entire fernadetijuana family) were on that highway, and when we got back from a great trip I read your accident post. At that time I visualized the many, many, many times I was doing 90 on a 25 zone, just before Jesus Maria for example, and I rememeber the check point you mention in your story (both ways). You might not believe this, but probably because of the impact your story had on me, or maybe not, on our last trip, last Thursday for Disneyland's 50th (witch was great) on the way back at about 1 or 1:30AM, for the first time in my life other than use the restrooms, I stoped to sleep at the San Onofre rest area. Mrs. ferna had no problem with that, since she was tired too. I woke up at 4 AM and got to Tijuana safe and sound. Now I know that a few hours sleep, even if it's on the side of the road makes a big difference.
saludos

lindsay - 5-9-2005 at 07:58 AM

After I wrote my response to your posting last night, I was wondering what you may be thinking and I was surprised this morning to see that you had read my earlier posting about the accident. This past month has been a strange one for me because it's as if my Baja connections are somehow sending me messages about the value of life...after seeing that accident, it's impossible not to take pause about the "what ifs" of traveling the highway and the significance of each of the road side shrines. If reading about it gave you pause too, then both of us owe that family something I suppose. Thier misfortune has somehow made us reflect on the decisions we make everyday and their impact on those we love. So, I applaud you for stopping to get some rest on your trip back to TJ and I also appreciate your thoughts about these difficult topics. Cuidate mucho!!

lindsay

Baja Bernie - 5-9-2005 at 09:42 AM

I was not attempting to get a laugh. I was trying to get attention for this ruthless and thoughtless attack/s on civilization. As a retired cop I don't care if the victim is a crook or not---to me the offense is one against society and cannot be condoned if we wish to remain civilized.
Sorry that you took it in any other way.

I understand

lindsay - 5-9-2005 at 10:00 AM

It's OK. You did not post the tee time comment and I know that, in general, we all make flip remarks about situations when we don't have a personal connection. Your post was just about the story itself and I was just responding to another nomad posting the tee time comment that we sometimes forget there is a real family attached to this tragedy and even if we don't know them, we need to pause before we write these types of comments. That's all.

Bottom Line

jrbaja - 5-11-2005 at 09:30 AM

Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!

PacO - 5-11-2005 at 10:22 AM

:fire:

JR: "Bottom Line

Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!"

Well, not only is that out of context, it's a gosh darnn stupid thing to say.
I shall add that the "tee time" comment fits right in w/that statement.

[Edited on 5-11-2005 by PacO]

Skeet/Loreto - 5-11-2005 at 10:30 AM

JR! Its time for the Woodshed Again!!!!!

You of all people to make a Scarcastic Staement litke that is unbeleivable.
Who do you think You are??????

Q person who is hurting for a family member, trying to get some comfort has to put up with the likes of a Dumb Statement.

Well I have a "DUMB" Statement:
You have not yet learned from all those good Mexicano People "compassion". JR Are you really doing all those things or are you making them Up?
I cannot imagine being around all the good Mountain People of Baja and still being so Dumb.

It is time for you to go to Costa Rico and try someplace new, these Americanos have got your number completely!!!!!

Skeet/Loreto
The Ole Fart
Anon The Preacher

And a lot of other names put on me by BB

"In God I Trust"

Cincodemayo - 5-11-2005 at 11:00 AM

JR....always the opportune thing at the opportune time! :yes:

Safety in your own country? Did anyone see the shootout between the LA County Sheriffs in Compton Monday with the crackhead in the Suburban? The cops shot over a hundred rounds at the car and hit the guy twice...seems they need more target practice for hitting a target. Looked like a wildwest shootout!

JR?????? There you go again!!!!

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 11:08 AM

To me, your statement does not make any sense. What to you mean? I feel safer in my house----does that mean I should not go outside where I may be in an accident? What a strange statement (and belief?), at least to me.

Are we not allowed by you to say things we feel without being told by you that we are somehow dumb, or ignorant?

Our perception of our safety is something that you feel is open to your negative opinions and derogatory statements??

Strange indeed!!!!

I, for one, do not feel as "safe" in Mexico as I do in the USA, even after 50 years of going to Mexico------so, that means that somehow I am flawed?? Wow, what do I do with that? What difference does it make if my perception is not true----it is very real to me, and I would speculate it is very real to a lot of others. I live with it----why can't you? (-:

90 shots and 3 hits on the purp, is what I heard

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 11:13 AM

The adrenalin was a pumpin at that scene!!!! I can't help feeling that you don't do things like that in amongst the houses, but what do I know.

Things like that do NOT make ME feel un-safe, tho.

Cincodemayo - 5-11-2005 at 11:17 AM

Barry....it took that many shots and ONLY 3 hits? Seems like the Sheriff's Dept. needs more eye tests. Should have read 5 shots fired not 90!
But the guy was all methed out ramming cop cars...

The "range" versus the "real thing"

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 11:20 AM

I am bettin that most of those deputies shoot "expert" on the range------things get a little hectic when shooting at live folks, but I agree that 90 to 3 is a pretty sad ratio of shots to hits. I am just concerned that most of those wild shots went into houses in the background----not a good scene.

exactly

eetdrt88 - 5-11-2005 at 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jrbaja
Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!

couldnt have said it better myself....there is inherent risk in everything we do from driving cars to eating food

88---so because of that "inherent risk" we should stay home?

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 11:25 AM

Cincodemayo - 5-11-2005 at 11:29 AM

Barry...Can't deny that I'd be doing the same thing if I were one of the Sheriffs...Some crazed druggy ramming and running thru residential areas going in excess of 70mph. Too bad they didn't take him out. But like you said about all the wild rounds ending up in houses...Thank the big guy that no one's kids were hit or their parents for that matter.

Cinco----Amen to that!!!!!!

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 11:32 AM

Barry

Baja Bernie - 5-11-2005 at 11:55 AM

Take a flyswatter to a sitting fly and you have a good chance of flattening it. Try the same thing while he is flying and see how often you knock him out of the sky. Shooting expert at sitting targets is a breeze--Like someone said shooting at people is a whole different game.

When I started this thread I aluded to a previous thread about risks---Believe me I will continue to wander about Baja--BUT I will be aware of the risks as I enjoy--just as I would in certain areas of Southern California--like Los Angeles de Mexico (guess that sign has been removed).

Barry,

eetdrt88 - 5-11-2005 at 12:25 PM

just the opposite...because of that risk we should go to baja even more....being out of our own element is when we as humans begin to really feel alive,which i'm sure you already know....whether or not baja is more or less safe than anywhere else in the world is up to each individuals disgression but no one can deny that the U.S.A. has become a nation of paranoid terrorist-fearing whiners....i prefer to seek out places that are far removed from the constrictions of these paronoid drones and in doing that inevitably will end up in places where there are a different set of rules and a different way of life....that is the risk I accept

PacO - 5-11-2005 at 12:44 PM

eetdrt88:
exactly

Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!

eetdrt88:
couldnt have said it better myself....there is inherent risk in everything we do from driving cars to eating food

Wow! If that would be your best effort I am guessing there won't be many profound statements forthcoming anytime soon.
I tried but I could not read into any of the statements in this thread where anyone sounded like a "paranoid drone". A drone maybe, echoing an endless mantra, but not paranoid. Weak.

bed wetters here?

yankeeirishman - 5-11-2005 at 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jrbaja
Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!

Funny...I did not take this response (above quote) as being a smart-ass attack. It sounded like he was saying everything in life takes effort and risk...so stop wetting your panties!

88 and Yankee, et al

Barry A. - 5-11-2005 at 01:21 PM

I totally agree with the both of you, except that I took JR's remarks differently than Yankee, and maybe 88. If JR intended his "stay out" remarks the way you say, then I apologise to JR, and to those who I may have been offended by my remarks.

I go to Mexico for the reasons Yankee stated, and more.

Maybe I had better back away from this post and cut the lawn. What do you think??? (-:

To the others who responded to my remarks, I thank you, and your points were well taken.

yo pac man,

eetdrt88 - 5-11-2005 at 01:51 PM

the comments about "paranoid drones" was somewhat of a sarcastic comment,i hate to be thought of in such broad terms,so i really shouldnt talk about others that way....btw,i really wasnt reffering to anyone on this board

PacO - 5-11-2005 at 02:05 PM

No worries, I hear ya. I tend to get a little sarcastic ( a**holelike ) on occassion. I am just not very tolerant of JR's never ending bullchiite.

rpleger - 5-11-2005 at 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jrbaja
Stay in your own country if it makes you feel safer!

?What country is that?

Hey hey....over here!

yankeeirishman - 5-11-2005 at 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry A.
I totally agree with the both of you, except that I took JR's remarks differently than Yankee, and maybe 88. If JR intended his "stay out" remarks the way you say, then I apologise to JR, and to those who I may have been offended by my remarks.

I go to Mexico for the reasons Yankee stated, and more.

Maybe I had better back away from this post and cut the lawn. What do you think??? (-:

To the others who responded to my remarks, I thank you, and your points were well taken.

My lawn can use a cut :lol:

I think sometimes letters (and replys) in the posts are sort of read wrong in one's mind, and it gets twisted. It can be hard to understand one's frame of mind from the type. So dont mow that lawn...keep posting. I have jumped at good folks...reading their post and not understanding the real intent of thewords. I mow alot too...............

[Edited on 5-12-2005 by yankeeirishman]

Gotta Say This

Baja Bernie - 5-12-2005 at 10:53 AM

I started this thread out with a desire to bring people up to speed on how the Baja some of love is being attacked by a bunch of crooks who are, at least indirectly, tearing at the very fibers of a civilization we have always seemed to enjoy.
I suggested that there are risks and that we should be aware of them as we wander about the 'world' (this includes Baja).
This seemed to elicit some very good replies and then it seemed to degenerate into a macho, chest thumping, embracing of risk as one of the staffs of life with a bunch of me too'ism thrown in.
Risks--sure--but we can not ignore the fact that the actions of the drug dealers are causing untold damage in the U.S. and around the world and that they are killing a whole bunch of people in Tijuana and most other areas of what a few of us used to call "Paradise"---unfortunately paradise doesn't have corpses littering the scenery.

This one, I believe from a Mexican should make us all stop and think------

Originally posted by fdt
some of my personal friends are gone, they either took another route or destiny had different plans for them. Adolfo F. was my firend and so was Ivan E., but then again so was Emilio V. and Alex H. and many others. We all had fun, we all did and did'nt. Destiny sent me in another direction than that of other friends that had the same level of education, parents, money, etc. Some of my friends have high government positions or have had them, some are businessmen/women, some persued their career, some ended up working at a job. I had the opportunity to hire one of them as my employee. I have been to La Paz, were at least 32 of us were studying tourism at the time and only myself and Myrna had persued that industry. And guess what, I hav'nt been involved in tourism since Feb 2004. Funny (or not) I got into a red cab in Tijuana, the ruta fija cabs and EL Fily was the driver, what's up with that? We used to compete for the same girlfriend. Yes very traumatic when we hear the news, OH MY GOD, we all scream or we wonder why him/her, but as time goes by we figure (those close or involved), puta, que mala onda, pero ni pedo, arrieros somos y en el camino andamos. Que descansen en paz los ultimos dos. There is a song by (the now enemy combatant:lol Cat Stevens that says "But I might die tonight"

Sorry if I ruffled a few feathers.

[Edited on 5-12-2005 by Baja Bernie]

[Edited on 5-12-2005 by Baja Bernie]

Dice of life

Sharksbaja - 5-12-2005 at 11:54 AM

I just read the "stay safe" thread.
Our (sad) destiny may be avoided sometimes but not always. Some of us can change the way how our life unfolds, but most will not, can not or have not. Sounds almost like a crap shoot. IT is, but we must weigh the odds before one places the bet and rolls the dice of life.

WE, herein are "the lucky ones", with the ability to reach out. WE should feel blessed we are able to find solace and allies on this board. And blessed are those who travel thru life unscathed by evildoers. How few they are......

Hahahahaha

jrbaja - 5-12-2005 at 12:24 PM

And the paco bites again! :lol:

I get a kick out of what crawls out of the woodwork when I post one sentence.
Skeet my friend, get a grip. That statement shouldn't have ruffled your feathers at all.
Although I feel bad for the families involved, people get dead all the time everywhere for many different reasons. I'm just trying to cut down on the lemmings in baja by telling them to stay in their own country if it makes them feel safer.
Big deal! :lol:

Cincodemayo - 5-12-2005 at 12:49 PM

Where the heck is Charles Bronson when we need him the most???

Cincodemayo - 5-12-2005 at 12:49 PM

By the way JR...Happy B-Day!:moon:

Cincodemayo - 5-12-2005 at 12:53 PM

Did anyone catch the latest marooon who was shot by police after running from them then grabbing for his OTHER gun after he fell out of his cornered car? The cops took care of his worthless butt....Our society is going down the crapper quickly kids....and they ask if Baja is safe! A lot safer than the good ol USA. :!:

Crime in the USA is way down in last 15 years

Barry A. - 5-12-2005 at 12:55 PM

Crime in general is down roughly 33% since 1990, and violent crime is down about 60% since l993, in the USA. The probable main reason------we put them away behind bars!!!! (Yeah, I know that some thinks it is abortion that has made the crime stats go down)

So "safety" is really in the individual mind, not necessarily a reality.

I just checked how many "hits" this thread has, and it was at 975----more than any other "thread" on page 1 of the NOMADS board. That tells me something about interest in "safety" by all the lemmings (JR's term, not mine) out there in cyberspace.

It certainly is reassuring that JR gets a real kick out bringing us all "out of the woodwork" to comment on his one-liners. I still think that is a little strange, but whatever turns JR "on" must be good for the rest of us "lemmings", right???

Now I will crawl back into my wooden beam, at least for a little while. (-:

Cincodemayo - 5-12-2005 at 01:28 PM

Thomas Jefferson?

Cincodemayo - 5-12-2005 at 01:33 PM

Pompano...Just like I said in another thread where is Charles Bronson when you need him? Unfortunately he's with all the vigilantes up yonder.. :wow:

I know what you mean about the criminals having more rights than the victims but hence my slogan below.

By the way, the crime rate in Britian is......

Barry A. - 5-12-2005 at 02:08 PM

rapidly escalating "out of control" according to most reputable sources. Britian takes a much more "social" and "kinder' attitude towards their criminals, and they only have about 75,000 current inmates in their slammers.

Our prison population is about 2.1 million, and climbing----but with obvious results-----less crime. Even tho 2.1 million is a sobering statistic, IT SEEMS TO BE WORKING, and therefore is seemingly worth the expense. Personally, I think it is worth it-----do the crime/do the time !!!!

Also, it is interesting to note that about 25% of our inmates are illegal aliens convicted of serious crimes. Something else to think about. Very few come from Baja, tho. (-:

Most of this info comes from Pg 216 and 217 of the latest FORBES Magazine, if your curious.

(I just could not stay in that wooden beam----I will try harder not to crawl out)

Pomp

Baja Bernie - 5-12-2005 at 05:52 PM

"Whoever has his foe at his mercy and does not kill him, is his own enemy." by Bernie Swaim Senior--my Okie father---

he changed it a little to better fit in a modern society such as ours--"If you are gonna fight with someone beat him so damn bad that he never thinks of fighting you again."--It shore do work. I am sure that Skeet would agree but he might add--'take him into your house and make him welcome.'

Risk is a part of life but it does not have anything to do with riding a surf board or roaring off into the desert. It has to do with living life to the fullest that you are able and learning from it.

Thanks Cinco

jrbaja - 5-13-2005 at 10:17 AM

for the self portrait. Didnt know you were an artist. Does everyone in Loreto Bay look like that? Because it does remind me of Santa Margarita where they as well all look the same. Pathetic lot I might add! :lol:

Barry

Baja Bernie - 5-13-2005 at 02:52 PM

Quote by Barry--"I just checked how many "hits" this thread has, and it was at 975----more than any other "thread" on page 1 of the NOMADS board. That tells me something about interest in "safety" by all the lemmings (JR's term, not mine) out there in cyberspace."

Bernie's reply---

Just for the fun of it I checked the last 5 pages on this board and found that "Tires again" had 1447 hit and "My new Restaurant had 1243 hits so what does that tell us.

Let's spread the tea leaves out and see---

well I guess those macho guys who roar off into the desert are very concerned about the safety of their tires (smart).

On the other one I think it just means that a bunch of us like a Mexican guy by the name of Jessie whom a lot of us have not even met.

It is sad, but I think we would have far more posters with some very interesting things to say if they felt 'safe' in exposing themselves when posting here.

Waa wa wa

jrbaja - 5-13-2005 at 03:01 PM

They must be gringos then! :lol:

JR

Baja Bernie - 5-13-2005 at 03:52 PM

I love you but please note that I said they might have something interesting to say and Wa Waaa ain't what I was taking about.

Dave - 5-13-2005 at 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja Bernie
It is sad, but I think we would have far more posters with some very interesting things to say if they felt 'safe' in exposing themselves when posting here.

And just what might they be afraid of?

<said the spider to the fly> :biggrin:

PacO - 5-13-2005 at 07:34 PM

Afraid? Surely you jest. Tired of ashholes and thier predjudiced, ignorant comments? No doubt. On the ol'giveafookometer I would rate "exposing" myself at about 0.

Paco

Baja Bernie - 5-13-2005 at 08:03 PM

Look at your signature==I'm sure you know what it is.

PacO - 5-13-2005 at 09:01 PM

Bernie,
you're right. There's something a bit more important. Hopefully you're not being sensative. Everything I commented on in this post is all inclusive.

[Edited on 5-14-2005 by PacO]