DianaT - 10-30-2005 at 01:24 PM
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/mexico/20051030-9999-1m30...
IMHO, interesting article.
Diane
bajalera - 10-30-2005 at 01:45 PM
Very interesting. Thanks, Diane.
Markitos21 - 11-1-2005 at 07:10 AM
I wonder what california would be like with no marinas.
Do you think the mega rich would let the enviormentalist stop them? Besides Cabo I dout baja will turn in to Newport Beach.
wilderone - 11-1-2005 at 12:45 PM
(1) California is not a peninsula; (2) the marinas along the California coast were built with municipal funds; (3) the California marinas were
secondary to already established populations and need - not first created and then hoped that they would be used; (4) the "mega rich" have little to
do with controlling the construction of marinas in California; (5) FONATUR definitely wants Bahia de Los Angeles to become a Newport Beach - just
look at Cancun and Akumal - but more intelligent people have already protected much of the area ; (6) the new name for Escalera Nautica is still the
same ill-conceived plan - still the same flaws, lack of solid data to support the concept; and (7) the marinas in California are primarily filled with
boats which reside there - not boats in transit. For many of the boats in transit, there are simple bouys with day fees - no dock or marina at all -
so why would a marina, in and of itself, bring more boats south. They don't come because it's a difficult sail on the return trip. That won't change.
Do you really think that people sailing south into Sta Rosallalita in their $50,000 sailboats will want to hoist them out of the water, put them on a
trailer and drive them over to Bahia de los Angeles on a narrow highway, and then hoist them into the bay over there? Do you think the hoist
equipment, the trailers, manpower to get the job done, etc. will be cheap? Why incur the extra expense? Twice (how else would they sail back home)?
If they can sail around the cape to get back home, they can sail around the cape in the first place. Who is responsible if the hoist breaks, the
trailer driver crashes into a military jeep going too fast around a corner, or if any damage at all is incurred? If Fox wants hospitals and schools
in these towns, then he should provide the funds for hospitals and schools. Hospitals and schools need employees too. Why hasn't enough support
through the Mexican government been forthcoming in the past for these poorer towns in Baja California? There is something fundamentally wrong here.
DianaT - 11-1-2005 at 12:58 PM
Ever since I heard about the project, I thought it was very ill-conceived and would not work, at least not in my lifetime.
That is why I found the article so interesting. The plan wasn't working under the old name, so give it a new name and try again!
In the future, I do believe Baja will become VERY developed, but again, not in my lifetime. 
And, IMHO this idea of build it and they will come only works well in the movies.
Wilderone,
I couldn't agree more with your last statement!
Diane
Wilderone,
Hook - 11-1-2005 at 01:02 PM
I have always been skeptical of the E. N. in it's original, grand form. But the one aspect of it that seemed to make the most sense was the land
bridge. The amount of aggrevation saved by not having to sail or motor around the cape (and back, god forbid) will probably appeal to a significant
number of people.
Of course, this is dependent on what they might charge. But if they charge too much, then the word will get out and the gringos won't come. I would
expect the free market to have a say in that.
I don't look forward to the land bridge's completion for rather selfish reasons. If it happens, there will be a tendency for those who utilize the
hauling service to want to stay in the Cortez for a significantly longer period than the average trailerboater. That is going to put a premium on the
small anchorage spots that we all love.
I predict the land bridge portion WILL happen. The string of marinas south of there are much less likely.
honda tom - 11-2-2005 at 09:32 AM
good points hook. I also think the ladder is coming, how long? the gulf is a great destination for small to medium cruisers, but the trip around the
tip is a problem. it will increase the visitors, but I dont believe it to have a large effect, just my opinoin.
JZ - 11-2-2005 at 09:54 AM
A land bridge would be awesome. I'd be the first to go from LA to San Carlos, Sonora.
bajalera - 11-2-2005 at 09:54 AM
I've always considered the Escaleras to be the marine equivalent of those white-elephant paradores along Highway One--facilities planned by Chilangos
who don't know squat about what Gringo aficionados of Baja California are looking for when they visit the place.
ArvadaGeorge - 11-2-2005 at 11:29 AM
Do you really think that enough American Boaters will put their expensive boats on Mexican trucks for a trip on Mexican roads??
It seams a shaky situation to me especially when you consider the Baja winds, roads,
, trucks and the equipment that they usually use in Baja.
To sustain this operation they are going to have to move a lot of boats
They can?t even keep a ferry running regularly, and the Motorcycle riders that use it
Say you should bring you own tie downs and tie you bike yourself.
How about tying your own boat down.
JZ - 11-2-2005 at 02:38 PM
Who said they would be using trucks.
ArvadaGeorge - 11-2-2005 at 02:47 PM
Their Plans
Well, A.G.
Hook - 11-2-2005 at 05:02 PM
Its not like their talking about driving the whole length of the peninsula. They could widen just the area between P. S. R. and BOLA. We have all seen
the new turnouts on the BOLA road; I assume that is to allow passage around the wide loads.
I think I would probably trust the service....but right now I only own boats that I am able to tow w/o a service. I thought the last I heard was that
the Grossmans (of San Carlos Marina fame) was the likely candidate for the hauling service. Based on the S.C. Marina, Marina Seca and his mainland
hauling service, I have no doubt it would be a topnotch operation. Bonded and insured and all that.
The problematic thing will be providing water at both ends of the "bridge' for the employees, for the gringos in slips and the resulting
infrastructure needed. THAT might be the biggest challenge.
David K - 11-2-2005 at 06:23 PM
Here is one of the turnouts recently installed along the 41 mile L.A. Bay highway... they are about every 3 miles.
[Edited on 11-3-2005 by David K]
Paulina - 11-2-2005 at 06:34 PM
So much for the old days of heading to Bahia, turning off the highway, looking forward to stopping to pee in a pothole.
At least if I make my own pothole there will be turn out spaces for boats to pass me by while I conduct my business for ol' time's sake...
P.<*)))><
I like a woman
Hook - 11-2-2005 at 07:09 PM
that's willing to pee in a pothole. My wife is. That was part of our unofficial marriage contract.
Can you imagine bringing a city girl to Baja and having to find her a clean john?
Many arroyos to cross.......
Paulina - 11-2-2005 at 07:56 PM
Hook,
Sounds like you have a real baja tested and proven woman.
A real baja woman won't be afraid to help fill all those arroyos in, or at least give it a fighting shot!
Saludos!
P<*)))><
soulpatch - 11-2-2005 at 08:31 PM
Akumal is no Newport Beach, maybe a small Shell Beach...... nor is Cancun. Maybe Puerto Adventuras but still way too small. But, they are all very
beautiful and much different than anything in baja.
aha baja - 11-3-2005 at 02:15 AM
I hate to sound like a cynic but avoiding Oncoming 8 ft. wide big rigs are bad enough to try to maneuver away from a head on. Now imagine the
humiliation of being RAMED by a 60MPH, 10 ft. beam sailboat on friggin' dry land!! I Don't think E.N. will ever pan out economically. Another
Mongolian cluster flock pipe dream. Typical.
aha baja - 11-3-2005 at 02:18 AM
I am however, very happy about the road improvements.
Proverb??
John M - 11-3-2005 at 05:30 AM
Not directed at you aha Baja
Bad roads = good people
Good roads = bad people
Markitos21 - 11-3-2005 at 08:01 PM
I realy do think if they finish the so called land bridge, people will use it . Folks use San Carlos all the time. 3500 dollars for a 36 ft boat back
to San Diego. It seams like alot. But if you break down the cost of powering back up the coast with the time lost at work and all the other factors.
It's cheeper and saves a bunch of wear and tear on your boat. Oooooooooooor leave the darn thing in mexico !!!!!
!
On the down side ........ every freakinig sailer (that now is afraid of Mexico) will be showing up. And all those lonley coves will be a gone.Oh yea
at one time California WAS Baja Norte. See what we've done to it?
On another note Gringos aren't the only ones with boats, I'v met lots on Mexican folks with (holley smokes look at that thing) Mega yachts. Hot tubs
and all
pappy - 11-5-2005 at 02:18 PM
statistics show that something like 90% of boaters in california don't travel more than 30 miles from their homeport.thus, i really don't think the EN
will atract a whole lotta customers.basically it comes down boating around baja is done by a few and of those, i bet a small percentage would use the
EN. another thought is just how often will a boat need to be trailered across??? one a day? a week? a month??? not enough to make it $$
substainable..... it is indeed a cluster f---.
comitan - 11-5-2005 at 02:36 PM
Sailing Cruisers by the way are known for the most part as being thrifty.
[Edited on 11-5-2005 by comitan]
[Edited on 11-5-2005 by comitan]
JZ - 11-5-2005 at 03:38 PM
It took you three tries to spit that out Comi.
comitan - 11-5-2005 at 03:43 PM
Just trying to say what I mean and be nice about it.
bajajudy - 11-5-2005 at 04:31 PM
Aw come on...you know the word.............Cheap!
Tap your elbow three times.......Same in Mexican.