BajaNomad

STING RAYS== ENCOUNTERS IN BAJA

dean miller - 10-19-2006 at 12:50 PM

STING RAYS

Recently Sting Rays have been in the news.

Today, October 19,2006, an 81 year old male was stuck by a Spotted Eagle ray that "jumped into his small boat" off Light House Point in Florida. As of this publishing he is in critical condition.

A few weeks back Steve Irvin of Australia was killed by a Sting Ray. He was swimming over the top of it and was struck in the heart.

At one time any beach in Baja was populated by wall to wall Sting Rays, a literal "Sting Ray city". As the human population has increased the population of Sting Rays drastically decreased.

HOWEVER,

EVENT #1

Twelve years ago my wife, an accomplished veteran diver, was struck just south of the populated area of BOLA. She was in ankle deep water placing her fins on her feet. She had just place the fin on her foot and placed it back into the water right on the top of a Sting Ray. It immediately went in a defensive mode, whipped it's tail up driving a barb into and though the Jet fin, the 1/4 neoprene booties and into her foot.

We immediately headed to our host's lovely white home on the point, heated water, infused with ammonia and immersed her foot in the very hot water past the punchure to her ankle. Since the poison was heat liable its potency was negatated and their was no apparent after affects.

EVENT #2

Several years later same wife, same equipment, same general area only next cove south. Had fins on, were doing the "Sting Ray shuffle." My wife some how trapped a Sting Ray under her foot and there was a repeat performance--"De Ja vue - all over again"

This time some vacationing Mexican nationals suggested the immediate application of a warm cactus poltice. Before they could locate the proper cactus my wife was making tracks for the hot water and ammonia. Once again no apparent long term after affects.

Questions:
1) Have members of this board had Sting Ray injuries?
2) What treatment was used for relief?
3) What is the Mexican treatment?

An inquiring mind wants to know

DM

Martyman - 10-19-2006 at 12:56 PM

Got nailed at Punta Chivato. Did the hot water with a tequila chaser. It hurt but three hours later it was just itchy. The mexicans camping near us said to pee on the sting... didn't try that because my friends would have enjoyed it too much.:coolup:

David K - 10-19-2006 at 12:57 PM

I do recall Doc (Dr. Abraham Vasquez) at Camp Gecko treating a guest with 'as hot as he could stand it' water... this was 5 years ago.

The water should not be so hot as to actually damage the skin.

I have been lucky... my life has been on the water (growing up on the beach in Del Mar, trips to Baja ever since) and never been hit by a ray...
Lot's of jellyfish contact (ammonia or tea tree oil for that).

Cypress - 10-19-2006 at 12:58 PM

Dean, Your wife must be a stingray magnet.:yes: Getting stuck once is very rare, twice is downright odd?:?::O

dean miller - 10-19-2006 at 01:10 PM

Quote:
Cypress
Dean, Your wife must be a stingray magnet.:yes: Getting stuck once is very rare, twice is downright odd?:?]________________________________________________

You are so correct!

Lighting never strikes twice in one place--but Sting Rays?? I assume no one informed them.

When she had the frist encouter he had about 30 years of diving experience with not even a scratch.
Now she has two small scares and a good campfire storie of Sting Rays encounters
DM

bajajudy - 10-19-2006 at 01:43 PM

On our recent sailing trip, one of the ladies got stung and we did the hot water routine, didnt add anything to it, and she was fine. I had read about that treatment here on the Nomads

When I was living in Rangaroa in the Toumutu Islands in French Polynesia, I rode a ray in what they called the Blue Lagoon. I never even thought about the barb. It was never mentioned.
Are there rays that are harmless?

BajaWarrior - 10-19-2006 at 01:47 PM

L.A. Bay, yep. 15 years ago, bringing the boat in at La Gringa, got nailed by a little guy, one footed it up to camp. My buddy immediatly put fire under the teapot, and the water got hot quick. Use as hot of water as you can stand. It works very quickly.

Also, and hand shaken strong Margarita helps with the pain.

I sat in the chair, and hot water was added to the pot I had my foot in for over an hour. Put on some Neosporin, socks and shoes, and literally forgot about it two hours after being stung. Funny, they call it a sting, but this little guy drew blood.

BajaWarrior - 10-19-2006 at 01:49 PM

Baja Judy, that was probably a Bat Ray, touched one in Hawaii this summer, no stinger, just long tapering tail.

STING RAYS

dean miller - 10-19-2006 at 02:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajajudy


When I was living in Rangaroa in the Toumutu Islands in French Polynesia, I rode a ray in what they called the Blue Lagoon. I never even thought about the barb. It was never mentioned.
Are there rays that are harmless?
________________________________________________

You possibly rode a Manta Ray (Raya Manta in Spanish).

They are not equiped with stingers or any other defensive mechanizms other than their size. They have been known to grow rather large.

There was at one time a dive operation out of La paz that took divers to the banks to ride Mantas. I do not know if it is still in operation.

dm

Bajagypsy - 10-19-2006 at 02:24 PM

On my attempted to be certified (open water course) I was doing a shore dive and steped on one (bare feet), It hurt worse than having any of my kids. Hot water is the trick. Got back to Canada, and had a massive infection (I did go to the doctor in Mulege, they gave me antibiotics), my foot started turning black, and my hubby said I was going to be a peg leg. Turned out secondary infections are pretty common. I think the barb broke off in my foot, as I can still squeeze oozy stuff out of it, and it hurts if anything rubs against the top. Anyone had a barb breake off?

BajaWarrior - 10-19-2006 at 02:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaWarrior
Baja Judy, that was probably a Bat Ray, touched one in Hawaii this summer, no stinger, just long tapering tail.


Correction, after some research, Bay Rays do have a stinger, in fact up to three. Of course they are considered "docile", till you pee them off!

dean miller - 10-19-2006 at 02:57 PM

It must be recognized that this thread is indentifing the Sting Rays by their "common name" rather than their scientic name, therefore there is a possiblity of using a common name for two very distinct and different species of Sting Rays.

The majority of Sting Rays have stingers.

The only known local Baja Ray that does not have stinger is the Manta Ray. It is quite large and never found in shallow water. Over the years they have by repeated non agressive human contact become very diver friendly, to the point allowing a submerged diver to ride them, especially on the sea mount off La paz.

The major concern is the smaller Sting Ray generally found in the shallow calm water which will be encountered by the diver and on rare occasions the surfer.

DM

Jack Swords - 10-19-2006 at 02:58 PM

Couple of years ago, my wife stepped on a sting ray spine out on El Magote in La Paz. Fishermen clean their catches and many are sting rays later sold as "Manta". There are lots of carcasses and also, then, lots of unattached sting barbs. It broke off in her foot, caused some pain (no venom). She tooks some antibiotics and our stateside doctor said it would work itself out, preferable to surgery with bones, tendons, vessels, etc. Almost a year later it started out on the opposite side of the foot. Two days later the 1 1/2 inch piece came out. So there are sting ray barbs on the dry sand on beaches. She wears sandals now, I don't (yet). So far I have stepped on two live ones ("attacked", I guess now) and just bled a lot. Waited on the beach to die, but never felt venom so apparently survived.

Cypress - 10-19-2006 at 03:19 PM

A type of saltwater catfish called "hardheads", have smaller spines(usually less than 3"s), can be very painful if you're stuck by one. :)

rts551 - 10-19-2006 at 03:23 PM

Lots of sting rays in the surf at Abreojos. One got me on top of the big toe while getting off a board. Hot water and lots of beer did the trick.

dean miller - 10-19-2006 at 03:25 PM

Bajagypsy,

My wife had 5 children in 5 years and I never had any pain! Did I miss something? Should I go step on a Sting Ray?

You were correct in seaking medical attention in Mulege. Any time in the future you have a marine type injury always obtain treatment near the occurance. A doctor located near the ocean will have seen and treated numerous sting ray patients but I would bet he never will see a moose injury.

It is very common for the Barb to break off or some how disengage and become bedded in part or whole in the flesh of the victim.

The Sting Ray does NOT inject venom, The non specific poison is contained ON the shelth of the barb. When the Sting Ray defends its self by wipping it's tail up and ove it's back and driving the barb in to the victim at that moment the barb often breaks of.

I would suspect that you have a portion of the barb still embeded in your flesh. I would strongly urge that you visit you doctor poste haste and insist that a complete X rays series be performed upon the affected foot. Should the X rays be negative for any objects I would suspect that you have a very serious infection. My med of choice would be the 7 dose Z pack as a beginning. But do it NOW!

Me? I have been baking a cake and enjoying this forum all afternoon.

Hopes this helps! Please--Do report back to the board on the Doctor's findings and treatment.

DM

tripledigitken - 10-19-2006 at 04:37 PM

Had a pair of rubber sandals on and was doing the "shuffle" at Shell Beach (vicinity of Punta Chivato) and was stung on my ankle. Again hot water, tequila and beer. No ill effects, if you don't count the hangover.

;)

aha baja - 10-19-2006 at 08:43 PM

Doc at Camp Gecko said once to "pee on it" I thought he was kidding but it turns out as some of you know that urine is sterile , warm and has some ammonia in it! (beer can't hurt) but the ammonia factor helps neutralize the toxins and reduce the pain(you may want to pop a vicoden if ya got 'em in your first aid kit.

Bajagypsy - 10-20-2006 at 07:15 AM

I will go back to the doctor this weekend, we are planning to be down in Baja next month, we leave Canada on the 9th, to spend some time at Shari's and then on to Mulege!!! Don't want my foot to fall off!!!

STING RAYS

dean miller - 10-23-2006 at 09:50 AM

Quote:
Bajagypsy
I will go back to the doctor this weekend,... Don't want my foot to fall off!!!

____________________________________________

SO?

Is your foot still attached?

What was the doctors DX &RX?

We are concerned for you health,

DM

Bajagypsy - 10-23-2006 at 11:16 AM

My foot is still attached, and am on Antibiotics (sp???) again, x-ray should something, but they didn't want to go digging around. As I'm from the praries, and no ocean for about 1000 km west, the docs here have no idea what to do:biggrin:

Cypress - 10-23-2006 at 12:36 PM

Don't underestimate infections caused by fish etc.:no:Almost lost a finger once due to "chum infection". :o:?:Real nasty and hurt like all get-out. Started out with a fin-prick. too small to locate, ended up with a finger turning black and swollen twice it's normal size.:o Antibiotics cured it. There wasn't anything imbedded. X-Rays wouldn't have shown anything.:no: Good luck with it.:(

chino - 10-23-2006 at 12:56 PM

Good word Dean,
The hot water and amonia is always good, have also used fresh urine and then un bearably hot water.

dean miller - 10-24-2006 at 07:52 PM

As one of God's Frozen people you have been blessed with socialized med program and are entitled to all the benifits the program provides. I would, in this case, take full advantage of the program and continue to pound on the treating doctor (s) until this is resolved to YOUR satisfaction not theirs.

There are several concerns,

1) is infection which apparently is being addressed with anti biotics--kind and strenght and dosage is unknown.

2) long term effects-- any time a foreign object, weather it be a wood splinter, a metal shaving or a sting ray barb, is received SQ into the bodies flesh, the body immediately takes defensive action in the form of encapusulation-- a "Cyst" is formed. Theses are the small hard objects under the skin which you must have experienced in your life. This may have already began forming in your foot.

3) best case senario would be that the sting ray barb is or has begun to desolve and is being absorbed into the body--(I doubt it)

A suggestion would be for the Canadian Attending Doctor to confer with Divers Alert Network in the US for advice and treatment protocal.

So keep on your meds and keep pounding on your doctors.

DM

FARASHA - 10-25-2006 at 11:25 AM

Would also recommend DAN www.diversalertnetwork.com for advice.No fun this kind of injury. a 2ndary infection almost cost me my Life after a dive related injury!! I developed an ERYSIPELA after my wound didn't heal.
DAN made sure I got the right treatment, and organised my evacuation!!
Best thing is to JOIN DAN as a member.Lowcost, and great benefit for every diver!!!

Bajagypsy - 10-25-2006 at 11:31 AM

Great advice thanx!!:spingrin:

sting ray punchure

dean miller - 11-2-2006 at 04:23 PM

Inquiring minds want to know--

Is your foot healed?

Asymptomatic of pain and discomfort at all times?
standing?
walking?
sitting?

What was the meds administered and in what dosage?

Your reply may help others in need of assistance.

SM

kellychapman - 11-3-2006 at 02:54 AM

now I am scared to go in the water at all....I do not want to loose a limb, suffer pain worse then childbirth...die if it should sting me in the heart......ask a stranger to pee on me...have to be evacuated (even though I work for Masa...Medical Air Service Association if I should need it....and for less then 1$ a day) carry viconden...even though I love it...tequilla to ease the pain even more....Jeeeeeezzzzzzzzzz it sounds like something out of a horror movie....and I am a serious chicken.....plud now a very paranoid one on top of it.....there goes my diving classes ....I think I will take up sewing instead. All kidding aside.....I pray your foot heals and you recover soon.....all this advice was very informative and will save me alot of money for those diving classes....anyone have a good price on a used sewing machine.....:o

FARASHA - 11-3-2006 at 05:33 AM

NO WORRIES!! Kelly, once you start diving you get to know the dangers, and if you're not as careless as this Jeff Corwin was, then you should be fine. Of course sh**t happens, but not very often!
And I for myself had NEVER a bad experience, out of this one time experience where I WAS sole responsible for this to develope. I didn't wait for the wound( a scratch) to heal up, continued diving, therefore I had a secondary infection.
So keep going, get your OWD certification, so we can dive TOGETHER!!!!:bounce::bounce::biggrin:

Bajagypsy - 11-3-2006 at 07:02 AM

Foot has healed, all there is now is a scar to proudly show off as a battle wound. NOt sure of the brand name of the meds given, just cost me $10.00 a pill (3 a day for 7 days!!!). It feels much better, and nothing comes out of it anymore. Kelly, totaly take up diving, it is the most beautiful expereince one can have, I love it, and it was my own stupidity that got me hurt in the first place!!!!

kellychapman - 11-3-2006 at 08:17 PM

Well by George...(who ever came up with that) I am totally convinced...even if I am petrified...to take diving lessons. But I can tell you for sure I am wearing my hiking boots to walk on the beach...lol...I feel horrible for all the pain and suffering one has to suffer as a result of stepping on them....in fact I felt so bad for a woman who had been stung 2 times just hours before departing from the most incrediable vacation stay (her farewell walk....:() and used all her available cash for the emergency room and cab that I gave her a ride to the airport...BAD IDEA as I ended up being fined 250 pesos as it is illegale to give anyone a ride...it cuts down on the profits for the cab drivers....and in many ways I do understand...AND I HAD TO PAY the taxi the fair he would have made for he was next in line....let just say I paid big time for my soft heart as I felt responsible for not making her aware they were even out there....yeah yeah it is stupid...but in closing I have seen so many people stung on the beaches here that they should post signs....hmmmmmmm another project to save the world....:o every little bit helps just like the fabulous information on this post.....MUCHAS GRACIAS!

Sting ray --Kelly Chapman

dean miller - 11-5-2006 at 08:55 AM

[Originally posted by kellychapman]

"...now I am scared to go in the water at all....I do not want to loose a limb, suffer pain worse then childbirth...die if it should sting me in the heart......ask a stranger to pee on me

it sounds like something out of a horror movie....and I am a serious chicken.....plud now a very paranoid one on top of it...there goes my diving classes ..."

________________________________________________

Kelly,

Please defray your fears of the UW world until you have tried it ...It is a new demension of the world and the last to be explored. It is not for every one; some like it and adapt it as a second home, while others are terrified of the brimey deep.

I would seriously doubt if you would lose a limb but bear in mind sting rays punchures or lacerations can be painful .

The sting ray that caused the death of Irvin, the croc hunter has not been Ided but was probably the "Gaint Australian Sting ray" (dasayatis brevicaudata) which is the largest ray in the world-measuring as long as 15 feet long and 7 feet wide--with excessively long barbs

The sting ray that jumped into the boat was positive Ided as a "Spotted eagle ray" (aerobatus narinari.) It is simular in configuration to the California Bat Ray (myliobatis californicus.) However as the name inplies is spotted; white spots on a back background and can also be ided by it's very long whip like tail. It is seldom seen in shallow water and I have personally observed it on numerous occasions leaping out of the water.

The ray most involved in the accidents in this thread is the very common "butterfly ray" (gymnura marmorta) which are found in the shallows of bays and coves from nothern California to the tip of Baja.

I can not attest to the classes taught by the current fuzzy faced profit motivated dive instructors but I would assume they would address and insist that the student be aware of dangerous marine animals; to ID them, to avoid them and to RX incase of an encounter.. You also deman that your instructor cover this area to your satisfaction--if not demand a refund.

Urine is a mild acid. As an acid it has certain theraputic value and has been used in medical treatment since the beginning of time.

Ask any WW11 or Koren Vet--the RX for athetes foot was a carefully aimed stream of urine while taking a shower. And it still is being used by some, especially in the oldy moldy showers of Baja

One danger in the water is the common sea urchin--more diving wounds are caused by sea urchins punchures than any other marine organism . Immediate RX is Urine, long term and more civilized is of course household acids and or liberal applications of HOH aka hydrogen peroxide to aid in lifting the spine out.

So if you are not up to the activity continue with your sewing, knitting or what ever turns you on..

But give tha UW a chance,

DM

FARASHA - 11-5-2006 at 09:20 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dean miller
So if you are not up to the activity continue with your sewing, knitting or what ever turns you on..

But give tha UW a chance,

DM


:lol::lol::lol: OH yeah - anyone who knows Kelly will have a good laugh at this ...:bounce: especially Kelly herself :biggrin:

I'm sure she WIL give it a chance - as sewing etc... is ruled out already, AND she want's to go diving with me!!:yes:

But nicely spoken DEAN, and soooo true!! regards Farasha

kellychapman - 11-5-2006 at 07:22 PM

OMG this is funny....Farasha is right about me not really being the type who can sit still for more then 5 minutes.....I appreciate all your information Dean and honestly I was just being dramatic and having some fun....and it truly was...
I am going to find a very good diving instructor and experience something beyond anything I have ever known. It may take some time...but the blessings of living in Loreto allow me that....and yes Farasha we are going to go diving and have some great times......but....thank you all....:yes:

Summanus - 11-6-2006 at 09:48 AM

The multitude of stings and punctures from the small skates (butterflys) that our camping bunch has received over years of splashing (high-stepping rather than shuffling..opps) through the shallow beaches of Baja have never been too serious, thank goodness...just a lot of pain and discomfort. Of course we treat the wounds quickly with urine, antiseptics and antibiotics if needed. (Has anyone else ever used Adolfs Meat tenderizer to draw out the bad stuff? ;D) Being a mite adventurous and often thrown into harms way, it helps to have a nurse as a mate.

I recall a wounding incident long ago at Punta Chivato, which is north of Mulege, when a young guy and his girlfriend were snorkling and free-diving off those nearby low islands..called Santa-something. Poking around in the many holes in some large caves and rocks, the girl encountered a large eel, agitated it somehow, and it bit her on the ankle/foot. It was a serious wound and very painfull.

There was a retired US Navy veteranarian living at the large house at Punta Chivato then who treated the poor gal for the gashes and infection. He suggested immediate hospital care, just in case. Luckily, she was then rushed back to San Diego in a small plane furnished by an aero-club that was having a get-together there on the airstrip. Her young man packed hurriedly and drove their pick-up camper back. We were told much later that she had some scars, but had healed okay.

The owner of the place told us that the eel was maybe a wolf eel and could inflict a severe bite..especially one that size. He showed us a skull of an eel he had for a momento. He said this was a wolf eel and it was very nasty looking with large canine teeth...fairly good sized, about the size of a grapefruit....brrr, would not like to be chewed by that thing.

This is just a recollection of a past event...Do not assume this will happen to you. Many types of eels.. morays, etc... are plentiful in the Cortez, but are very diver-friendly if not molested, as all experienced divers know.

I did a little research on these wolf eels and noted that Googled sites put thier distribution range in the Pacific... mostly in colder waters from Japan to US northwest coast down to Imperial Beach, Ca. I guess they range a little further..if this was indeed a wolf eel. Can anyone out there confirm seeing a true wolf eel in the Cortez?

This is what the toothy wolf eel looks like. Like a lot of things briney, best to look, but not touch.

- wolf eel -.bmp - 46kB

howat - 11-7-2006 at 05:11 PM

A few years back we were camping at the beach about 30 miles south of San Felipe. I've been around saltwater beaches for over 50 years and have never been stung. Well it finally happened and got it good deep down into the fleshy part of the top of the ankle. I'm sure it bottomed out into the bone. i immediately called my buddy over and had him pee on it. he thought I lost my mind. we were a few miles from the campsite but fortunately we flagged down a dune buggier and he gave us a ride back. After 4 hours or more of hot water, the pain subsided enough to bare it. That nite i went into cold shivers even though it was over 90 degrees out. it took the wound about 6 months to heal completely. it's a pain and experience I do not want to go thru again. Only thing equal is a sculpin sting.

i know the halibut must have talked to their ray cousins to get even with me.

Halibut Howie

FARASHA - 11-10-2006 at 12:09 AM

I've been lucky til now, never been stung or bitten by anything, while diving. I touched once (on purpose) an electric ray (torpedo ray), I wanted to know if and how it feels like. :biggrin:
YES I'm VERY adventurous, thats why I became a nurse, saved me the hassle to run for a doctor all the time.
I found a small one ( was about 1ft and a half).
OH my,I touched it only with a fingertip on the side, and what a very intense electric sensation I felt !!

With the Moray Eels I usually never had any problems.
The only occasion I was PESTERED by one, was on a divespot where they used to feed them!! I didn't know that when diving there. While cruising around, at the end of my dive, I picked up a piece of paper that floated around.
The moment I had it in my hand, a Giant Brown Moray Eel came out of her habitat, and went straight to the hand where I held that paper. I could fend her off with putting my fins between me and her - and at the same time I stuffed that piece of paper in the BCD's pocket of the Divemaster next to me :biggrin: (my BCD doesn't have any pockets)
The moment that paper was out of sight she left us alone!

dean miller - 11-10-2006 at 06:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by FARASHA
NO WORRIES!! Kelly,...

... So keep going, get your OWD certification, so we can dive TOGETHER!!!!"

________________________________________________

WELLLL!
FARASHA, you promised the first dive to me...I have already placed your name on my dive card..

Off the post out of mind?....

DM

dean miller - 11-10-2006 at 08:35 AM

[ ]Originally posted by Summanus

...just a lot of pain and discomfort. Of course we treat the wounds quickly with urine, antiseptics and antibiotics if needed. (Has anyone else ever used Adolfs Meat tenderizer to draw out the bad stuff? \

_______________________________________________--

Adolfs Meat tenderizer is tradionally used for jelly fish stings.

Adolfs contain and enzyme called Papain ( or possibly Paperain) which is found in a natural state in the tropical fruit Payaya.

It's enzymatic action neutalizes the stinging cells of the jelly fish -or so I have been told--every time I have been zapped by a jelly fish good ole Adolp is at home. now we always have a bottle handy in the trailer.

I donot know its value in a sting ray accident --but from conversations with my wife and reading the posts any theraputic measure would be welcomed.

Recalling the earlier post and my wife's second encounter --the Mexican nationals wanted to find a particular catus to apply to her punchure.. Perhaps it too, contained papain?

However, the best treatment for sting rays remains very hot water.. and as a placation perhaps some hosehold chemical additives...and a few swigs of an adult beverage.

KELLY--you reading and taking note all of this?

DM

FARASHA - 11-10-2006 at 09:59 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dean miller
Quote:
Originally posted by FARASHA
NO WORRIES!! Kelly,...

... So keep going, get your OWD certification, so we can dive TOGETHER!!!!"

________________________________________________

WELLLL!
FARASHA, you promised the first dive to me...I have already placed your name on my dive card..

Off the post out of mind?....

DM


No havn't forgotten about OUR dive - but one needs
1) a back up - dive buddy (you know things happen)
2) we can still have a 3some dive also ( you know nice things happen too) :biggrin:
edited for biggrin

[Edited on 10-11-2006 by FARASHA]

[Edited on 10-11-2006 by FARASHA]

FARASHA - 11-10-2006 at 10:14 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dean miller
[ ]Originally posted by Summanus

...just a lot of pain and discomfort. Of course we treat the wounds quickly with urine, antiseptics and antibiotics if needed. (Has anyone else ever used Adolfs Meat tenderizer to draw out the bad stuff? \

_______________________________________________--

Adolfs Meat tenderizer is tradionally used for jelly fish stings.

Adolfs contain and enzyme called Papain ( or possibly Paperain) which is found in a natural state in the tropical fruit Payaya.

It's enzymatic action neutalizes the stinging cells of the jelly fish -or so I have been told--every time I have been zapped by a jelly fish good ole Adolp is at home. now we always have a bottle handy in the trailer.

________________________________________________
DEAN

I never heard about this Meat tenderizer - maybe it was not on the market here because there is ADOLPH's name in it!

NO, seriously - beside hot water for FISH or RAY stinges, the only other useful thing that really works good is
1) for Jellyfish=Vinegar dilluted with water(50%), to rinse off the remaining tentacles, and to neutralise the toxines.

2) for sea urchin= papaya OR pure Vinegar, rubbed on the spot where the sting entered the skin, those are very brittle and dissolve then quickly under the skin without any pain!!
Looks only for some days like a mishapped tatoo.
Had it many times while diving around the Seychelles, was almost a routine after every dive. The places where infested by them!
Farasha