BajaNomad - Mexico warned to upgrade

Mexico warned to upgrade

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 08:41 AM

Through State department backchannels, Mexico and France have been warned to upgrade security at their airports.

The terror threat now, is that of planes from overseas (and Mexico) coming into US airspace, that have had their security compromised.

The warning came with a blunt statement. Fix your security, or your country will be put on a list of " no accepts ". FAA would not allow any aircraft originating or touching down from such a country into the US.

Dave - 12-23-2003 at 08:54 AM

Man, I hope not! One of the nice things about living in Mexico is not having to take off one's shoes to get on a plane. I hope Mexico tells the U.S. to take a hike! I don't know how you folks up there stand for all this crap. I will NEVER fly out of the U.S. again.

Nobody from here wants to fly there anyway.

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 09:11 AM

Why would anyone want to go to a country as jacked up as that one anyways. Especially when most of the world wants to eliminate it.
I think it's best if all you gringos just stay home and count your money while you still can.
We will stay out of your country and wish we were you. But from a safe distance we hope.
Bon Voyage suckers.

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 10:03 AM

I really disagree with your stance on America, but totally respect you on one level. Instead of just living here and b-tching about America while accepting all the services and "good" things about it, you actually Moved to a country you found more favorable. Bravo! I wish all the people here like you would do the same thing, you should be saluted. On the other hand when the going gets tough and you need medical attention you slither your way back up north, that would make you no better than the rest.

jerry - 12-23-2003 at 11:09 AM

first of all i flew out of loreto a year ago and yes i did have to take my shoes off
and i dont see anything wrong with trying to help protect the country that afforded us the ability to to spend time and dollars where ever we want to its not a perfect counrty but it still the best bar none and yess ill wave the flag jelousy is usally behind those that comment negativly becouse they werent afforded the same birth right or prefer to live off someone elses sweat or between the cracks just an opinion

Dave - 12-23-2003 at 11:10 AM

As a taxpaying U.S. citizen I have the right to accept, "all the services and "good" things about it" if I so choose. I also pay for medical insurance and would use it if necessary. However I find the level of medicine as practiced in Mexico to be more than satisfactory, so much so that I am considering canceling my insurance in the States.

Does that make you feel better? I wouldn't want to "slither" when I could slide. :lol:

Sr. No name

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 11:20 AM

Actually, it seems to me that the actual slithering is being done by the cancer patients coming south to get cured because their wonderful western medicine won't accept cures that actually work or they don't have insurance and can't afford to see a doctor. Unless of course they happen to be a prisoner for committing some sort of crime in the U.S..
This entitles you to the best of medical care the U.S. has to offer. By the way, are the doctors prescribing aloe vera yet. I doubt it bacause it works and it's free to anyone who wants to grow it. I expect it to be listed as a dangerous narcotic by the FDA for just that reason.
Yep, yall are better than anyone else on the planet and it certainly shows. You should be proud.

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 11:33 AM

Ski Baja, you don't have to answer this, but how do you afford to live in Mexico? Did you make all of your money in Mexico and continue to enjoy the freedom from the fruits of your labor? Or, did you make some money in the U.S. and then slide into another country where that money is more powerful? What I?m getting at is questioning if you built your financial stability in the U.S. and then moved to Mexico, or if you built your financial stability in Mexico in the first place. If you did indeed make your money solely in Mexico, please state so, accept my apologies, and I will delete this post. But if you made your money in the U.S., please read on. We work very hard up here to provide secure futures of our children. However, the reason the world hates up is not due to our fiscal or even social values. It has to do with in part with our maintaining our domination of the oil markets, and to a lesser extent ? other markets, which necessitates our domination of whole regions of the world. If you are going to criticize how our country is faring, please criticize distinct issues and please offer ideas for solutions of how we can alleviate these particular concerns while our country can continue to build a viable economy that keeps us out of poverty and continues to prevent other countries such as Mexico from sliding into unimaginable poverty as the case in Haiti and Somalia.

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 11:37 AM

Oh, I can't delete that thread. I'm posting anonymously. :light:

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 11:46 AM

In the past year I have flown out of Mexico City, Guadalajara, and San Jose del Cabo. I found the airport searches to be every bit as intrusive as anything in the US. I'm not sure if other airports in Mexico are not as thorough, or if the greater ease of entering the country is the point behind the US warning.
Frankly I want people searched, I want baggage searched, I want profiling even if it means giving up some of the freedom we have.
I'm moving to Mexico in a couple of years to get away from the rat race and to be with people that want the same thing. I'm not moving there because I want to be shaken down by every cop that sees a Gringo, not for the unsanitary conditions of a third world country, and not for the roadside attractions of South San Diego.
Rick

Bob H - 12-23-2003 at 12:00 PM

It seems to me like about 100% of the time it's an Anonymous person that starts crapola like this! The very first post has nothing to back it up and I choose to disregard it in it's entirety.
Bob H :fire:

Financial stability

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 12:30 PM

Hahahahahaha. That in itself is pretty funny. When I moved to Mexico, not that it's anyones business I didn't have a cent because of an ex wife.
I became one of the lead carpenters for the Titanic movie and did alright. Then, I had an exhibition of Titanic props and photos at the Rosarito Beach Hotel. Then I ran a couple construction crews down here (legally) and I write guidebooks that are on hold right now because of the changes being made.
Now I have started Baja Search and Rescue which has three projects going on. Assistance to travelers in Baja, providing the underpriveledged humans that don't benefit from the Gringo fishermen, windsurfers, and other lovely tourists, and educating the people about their environment as far as cleaning it up and maintaining it as the fragile strip of land that it is.
Graffiti removal is one of our ongoing projects but you will be hearing more on that subject later.
Baja Search and Rescue will be working directly with the environmental agencies down here because of our environmental attitudes towards protecting one of the last untouched areas and people in the world.
So, I guess you could say that what little I have was made down here. And believe me, there isn't much and it is spent down here as well. I can actually get something for my money down here because they don't charge 10 times what things are worth as in your country.
And besides, the food is healthier here so as far as needing american medical attention, I don't think so.

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 12:53 PM

Your story is an inspiration. Money made from the Titanic set is, for the most part, U.S. money, but that is splitting hairs, really. You have the right to stand tall, but I ask that you please be a bit more conscientious when you criticize any country. Our world is a neighborhood and our countries are our families. Several things are going on in our neighborhood: Some family members are ditching their families for other families. Some are jealous of other families? accomplishments. Some families play ?keeping up with the Jones?. Whatever is the case with any of these families, snide criticisms alone will likely get nobody anywhere. Try to influence your neighbors by your own good example, for actions scream where words fall on deaf ears. Let peace be with you my brother, for everybody in my neighborhood is family.

TMW - 12-23-2003 at 12:57 PM

Ski Baja, ex-wife took it all, now I know why you are so bitter.

Good point

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 01:04 PM

You are right, that certainly was U.S.money which unfortunately I had to pay the taxes on. Thank you guys because you paid me well !
In spite of not having a name , your philosophies are quite human like. And I have many previous posts where I do try and spell out what I am trying to get across.
As long as americans think they are better than anyone else in spite of their ridiculous behaviour, I will stand my ground.
If on the other hand they begin to realize that they are no better than the people the U.S. Government is trying to wipe off the planet, or the tribes living in what's left of the rain forests and that every human can teach us all something, I would look at the americans with a new respect. Something tells me I won't be living that long though. Hope I'm wrong.

America has a huge problem on its hands

daveB - 12-23-2003 at 01:38 PM

on how to eliminate terrorists from plying their trade on its territory. The problem itself surely has been amplified because of the way it has reacted during the entire rule of Bush's administration, and it could get even worse before it improves.
Despite Rumsfeld's stating today that much of Al Queda's network has now been disolved, how many more of them are out there to take their place?
Airport security has come a long way (and yet in some ways it hasn't) since the dozens of airplane hijacking incidents of the late sixties and early seventies; no reason for this progress to stop now. Inconvenient? yes. The possible alternative? you know the answer. I say, with much regard for the countries of France and Mexico, that they should renew their efforts to comply at their airports. They must - for commerce in general, for those passengers on the planes and the protection of people in the cities.
My sentiments may well nearly echo Dave's first post although I have an American lingeage of some 365 years. For now, I am happier here in Canada or in Mexico. Can anyone explain that?

Nikon - 12-23-2003 at 02:03 PM

Sr. Ski, you asked if doctors are prescribing aloe vera, then answer your own question in the negative. Fact of the matter is, almost all of the HMO's now have traditional medicine branches, some say because they've been proven to work, others claim it's because of the high demand by the public, and to deny it would send all those dollars elsewhere. At any rate, the answer to your question is in the affirmative. Glad you're liking it down there. Wish all of our malcontents would follow your example.

[b]To Dave[/b]

Nikon - 12-23-2003 at 02:15 PM

Other nice things about Mexico: not having to wear seatbelts when driving, you don't need two headlights on your vehicle, nor taillights of any sort. And not having to put away that Tecate when you slip behind the wheel is a definite plus. But to stick with the aviation theme, the point is not whether passengers in the U.S. put up with "crap" or not, inbound flights from Mexico will practice our same procedures when landing at U.S. airports, a much belated requirement, which makes me wonder how Dolt Bush could have made the statement in Chicago days after 9/11 that the "skies are now safe"

Comparisons

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 03:34 PM

Try comparing your lovely country to a non third world country and see how you fair pickle head. :lol:

And I do believe it was the malcontents from many countries that killed all the local inhabitants to form your great empire. Still going on if you hadn't noticed.

[Edited on 12-23-2003 by Ski Baja]

bajaloco - 12-23-2003 at 04:17 PM

Ski Baja...Life is too short to be as bitter as you are. If you can't get past the problem you have with the U.S; you may need some professional help. Almost every post is negative towards the U.S. Most everyone one this board are from the U.S.

[Edited on 6-23-2004 by bajaloco]

Nikon - 12-23-2003 at 04:22 PM

You have my pledge to stay out of any caves in Baja. For someone who has an irrational phobia of scientists, collaborating with PROFEPA and INAH seems a bit contradictory, doesn't it?
Picklehead.

You are probably right.

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 05:10 PM

I tried to stay off the topic of politics by staying in the general discussion section but failed, I got caught up in it like I said I wouldn't.
As far as my feelings go, I have not just stated crap but how to fix certain things that are possible. Like open mindedness. I have not been simply trying to make fun of you or hurt feelings but point out some truths in order to try and make more human beings. There seem to be fewer and fewer.
It's my getting a feeling for what the majority of the population of the world thinks that drives my political feelings.. Which is why as a disappointed american I would like to see it change up there.
If the majority of you want to continue to ignore what is happening right under your noses, there is nothing I can say to change anyones minds. I will try again to stay off the subject of politics as I should. It is probably having an effect on the donations the children get down south which is one of the things that truly matter to me.
As far as irrational phobias go regarding scientists, hahahahahaha. I have talked to many about this exact same thing on both sides of the border and the majority including INAH and PROFEPA agree with me. Until all areas are documented on film without disturbing relics, and all expeditions are accompanied by local guides, foreigners shouldn't have access to these areas. Especially when they are publishing the GPS coordinates on the internet.
This is Mexicos history and the history, tradition, and relatives of the humans that have lived here for hundreds and thousands of years in some cases.
By a better understanding of this, many people are coming to their senses. Education and action prior to trying to repair what has already been done is a pretty good idea. It isn't to late here.
As far as you wanting me to leave this board because I think differently than you, if that's what the majority of you want, hasta la vista, if not, I guess yer just stuck with my political ramblings when I forget I am not supposed to have an opinion.

pappy - 12-23-2003 at 06:07 PM

malcontents here, fortune seekers there.In each case the indigenous are not in leadership roles....far from it.

Happy Thanksgiving

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 06:11 PM

Nikon - 12-23-2003 at 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
It's my getting a feeling for what the majority of the population of the world thinks that drives my political feelings.. Which is why as a disappointed american I would like to see it change up there.
If the majority of you want to continue to ignore what is happening right under your noses, there is nothing I can say to change anyones minds.

A fair bit of guesswork would be necessary to understand what you're talking about when you claim to have a sense for the feeling of the majority of the world. I'll go first; anger at the heavyhandedness for the present administration having two wars in less than two years, using bombers to extinguish civilian lives indiscriminately with combatants? We've heard a lot about those reactions, whether they comprise the majority, I'd doubt, but whatever, that horror is indeed justified. There are a lot of Americans filled with shame, and many hope it will translate into changes at election time, no predictions here; Democrats are too unreliable for exercising voting rights for that.

You'll have a difficult time selling the idea that the desmadre that is Mexico is preferable, you may find it better than whatever you had going on up north, but the standards by which living conditions are judged don't bear it out. Unless instances of wholesale bus robberies, victimization of motorists by police, and rampant corruption by officials qualify as the "good life". Aside from cheap living conditions, resultant from a lack of workers' benefits, affording cheap labor, (how much cheaper it would be if Mexico were not a net importer of goods, including food!) no one but American retirees have ever found reason to live in Mexico in any significant numbers, other types do, to be sure, but relatively few in number.

In summary, we are a country of 290 million people, and yes they are all humans. Plenty of social problems and other serious issues that need to be addressed, but I don't see the open debate in Mexico on its issues that is found here, and I don't remember any politicians or military ordering the massacre of hundreds of protesters in a square as in Tlatelolco. Kent State was the result of scared, nervous soldiers, and was openly investigated in its aftermath. There is to this date no accurate number of Mexican students murdered by the military. The peasants in Chiapas can thank the international press for not receiving like treatment.

GPS & INAH

David K - 12-23-2003 at 06:41 PM

JR, this is such a tender issue with you, let me remind you that my Baja Missions web site http://davidksbaja.com/bajamissions was initially made to display (for everyone's benefit) the many wonderful photographs of Baja's missions and visitas taken by retired science teacher, Jack Swords WITH INAH authority.

Jack also LIVES IN MEXICO half the year. Jack contributes to this board, as well. Jimmy Smith has taken Jack and Baja mission book author Ed Vernon to additional historic sites.

Any that are at risk, will not have GPS published with their photos. Jack found one of the sites for Mision Santiago, he sent me the photo (which I added to my web site), but suggested the GPS remain unpublished... fine by me.

I have added a few GPS to missions Jack hasn't been to, yet with a GPS... None were 'fragile' or secret locations that a GPS would bring new 'destructive' vistors to.

Mexico thrives on 'tourism'... the Baja missions are a draw. Their destruction in the past has been due to weathering & age, locals using building material from them (after they were abandoned), and treasure seekers thinking the padres actually had any time to gather gold and pearls!

Anyway, GPS for all the missions is already published in Ed Vernon's book 'Las Misiones Antiguas', you may have met Ed at Keri's book signing party. Also, a new book is being published, called 'Saints and Demons in a Desert Wilderness' by Dave Werschkul. It also has GPS. What I am getting at is there is no secret were the missions are. GPS only helps one find them sooner, thus saving time, gas, trespassing, etc.

You have every right to not want Americans (or Mexicans) from visiting historic sites. But, they did find them before GPS.
I will agree to continue to not publish any fragile sites' GPS, as I have already. I discussed three examples (in my Christmas gift thread) where others have told me or shown me a site and to not publish, and I have always complied.

{Also, it is likely that an annon. poster may start harassing me again, as he did last night until the moderator closed the thread. So, let me be clear: I have NEVER posted any GPS if asked not to. All GPS in my web pages are from my travels, unless stated by me as otherwise (about 4).

Every GPS in my list is at a place I photographed and posted or passed through to a photographed site, as proof I was there}

[Edited on 12-24-2003 by David K]

Thank you

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 07:27 PM

Now I can rest assured I won't be running into you down here, what are you doing on a "Baja" board if you hate it so much here?

GPS sites

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 07:41 PM

David, that last post was for Nikon, not you.
But, that is wonderful you are giving all the GPS coordinates away to "prove you were there". What exactly do you do when you are there besides prove you were ?
And, if you think I haven't read the posts that are thanking you so they can now get to these places, you are wrong. You are attracting more tourism to places that haven't even been fully examined by the people that have the rights to them. The Mexicans.
And because thus far they haven't been able to afford thorough evaluation of their historic sites, (not just missions) americans should be able to come in and destroy them by whatever means be it promoting tourism to that place or scientific expeditions coming in to dig them up.
I don't think so my friend. What the heck do you have to "prove you were there in the first place for. Try just taking pictures. Works for me and if anybody doesn't believe me, who gives a chicharrone?Sp. hahahaha
I forgot the rest of your comments and dinner is ready. I'll continue this later.

THE GREAT EXPANSE

msawin - 12-23-2003 at 08:04 PM

Wow Ski.. I guess all that have read the thread can tell where you are coming from....I have allways wondred where that thumbnail photo of you skiing was taken from. have a great x-mas

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 08:15 PM

Nice pics Ski! Looks like you had one heck of a great adventure. I bet you can't wait to head back down.

[Edited on 12-24-2003 by Q87]

Dave - 12-23-2003 at 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
And, if you think I haven't read the posts that are thanking you so they can now get to these places, you are wrong. You are attracting more tourism to places that haven't even been fully examined by the people that have the rights to them. The Mexicans.
And because thus far they haven't been able to afford thorough evaluation of their historic sites, (not just missions) americans should be able to come in and destroy them by whatever means be it promoting tourism to that place or scientific expeditions coming in to dig them up.

Sorry JR, I don't want to sound elitist but I haven't noticed the Mexican Government or any archeological entity in Mexico give more than lip service to preserving or investigating their archeological heritage, unless of course it would mean the generation of tourist dollars. It's my impression that the average Mexican would just as soon pave over a sensitive site for a garage as protect it. The same goes for preserving their ecology.

Fact is there is plenty of discrimination to go around when it comes to the Indian peoples of Mexico.

Once again, this is a casual observation. Feel free to correct my assumptions.

Preserving

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 09:39 PM

And, speaking of preserving, I just finished dinner of ham with Guayaba Jelly and Plum Chili sauce. Both were from the mountains, Plum from Canadians trying to be with Mexicans rather than the tourist groups, the Guayaba from the mountains down here. What this means is that none of you can put me in a bad mood now. I am supercharged from super flavors! Another reason it shouldn't change down here. What would all of you pay to be completely healthy like these folks are.
Dave, this is very true about their lack of "funds" to get anything done. This is still the case but improving gradually. It is all about education and realizing what they have and leaving it the way it is.
Amazingly, I am the first lamp to go to many of these places and even more amazing is neither have the locals in some areas. And that means, neither has any of the environmental agencies.
Which is why I am trying to preserve what is there before it turns into every tourist in the world following certain parties GPS coordinates to get there. And, by the education I am trying to give these people prior to these areas turning into Yellowstone or most of the other national parks, perhaps there will be some trash cleanup, security and a plan in effect prior to everything disappearing, and the sites being documented as found and on film. For a museum and everyones enjoyment rather than to make myself look cool or just a few people getting rich. Which is what usually happens and everything disappears.
That is why I am working on it now. I have seen so many areas that are worth preserving for "tourism" if nothing else. And there can be a lot of $$ in tourism if you have something unique which they do. You have to be fairly rugged to deal with most of these areas but there is a market in tourism for that as well.
Nevertheless, the wheels are in motion and I have seen how fast wheels turn down here. hahahahahaha. Llanteras everywhere!
This is Mexican territory, not american. Yet! Education, $$ and ayuda is what's necessary. And I am making every effort to make that happen for these people. They are the deserving ones. Not greedy foreigners.

Anonymous - 12-23-2003 at 09:47 PM

AAAAwwwwhhh. Burp. A LLeno estomago makes a happy man. Cheers!

When you gonna post all those photos sos we can see them, or are you gonna keep teasing us?

David K - 12-23-2003 at 11:18 PM

JR, I really have a difficult time understanding your posts.
In one, you are asking me when are we going back to Dave's for another great pastrami, and in another you insult me for being the Baja travel writer that I am and have been since I was 15 (1973). Instead of writing just for magazines and newsletters, I am writing in a Baja Internet message board. That's a pretty limited audiance, but it is the prime target (Baja travelers).
Why is your Rosarito travel guide and your posted photos okay but my travel stories and photos not? Are your trip reports and photos trying to prove you really saw those bones or those ranch people? No, I think you are doing the same thing as I... SHARING.

I would never say you were lying or stealing. In one post (that was removed) I was called a child molestor, nice, huh? The host here knows me, and is my friend. My guilt is limited to my hyper enthusiasm for Baja. Bernie Swaim understands me and wrote a chaper about me in his new book, with a cartoon of me, no less.

People come to this board for Baja stories and information. I think with alomost 40 years of Baja travel experience, I QUALIFY to provide some.

My GPS list is data that I collected and felt like sharing (for free) to my fellow Baja travelers. It is not to "prove" I was anywhere. Even though you or someone kept claiming they were mostly taken from others. If you don't
like what I write or share, then don't read my stuff. Soon all cars will have a GPS built in.. get used to it. All directions will be by GPS instead of milages...

Have you lambasted Ed Vernon yet for actually writing a book with every mission's GPS in it... for shame!

Have I chastised you for the fees you are asking for or the frequent mentioning of the Baja search and rescue? No, I offered to help you with it (in an email). It was funny how I have been accused of 'self promoting' when I don't sell my Baja knowledge or have a Baja business... Has anyone accused you of the same... specially since you do have a Baja business? Perhaps like the president, I am just an easy target for such childish comments or actions.

Friendships mean a lot to me and I never would call my friend any of the things that I read on this board today or yesterday.

In fact, if I saw the kind of posts (that were thrown at me), thrown at you... I would have given my mind to the anonymous coward. You were on last night... you said nothing.

I am really confused by this... If I am reading your posts wrong or you didn't mean any harm, I am listening...

As for what Baja is to me... Not beer drinking at Gypsy's or camping at Gecko... It's the hike on the El Camino Real with just my son. It's camping in the dunes far from civilization with my kids. It's walking along the Las Flores railroad line with just my daughter... That's what Baja is to me. Being able to occaisionally bond with my friends who feel the same about Baja, is a great thing too, but we all know what it is that kept us returning to the magic peninsula, and camping in noisy RV parks isn't it... Merry Christmas

[Edited on 12-24-2003 by David K]

Re reading

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 11:43 PM

Geez, Im just getting it by the club tonight. David, I don't recall calling you names and have in fact stuck up for you at times. Not sure what was going on last night but didn't notice anywhere I should have stuck up for you unless it was not taking my posts off as you asked.
On the other hand, I am dead against foreigners posting GPS Coordinates to other countries historical sites. No matter what's been done before or by whom. If it wasn't from the people that live here and the credit and money given to them, it shouldn't have been done.
And most people agree with that. As far as your writing books go, I did mention something about the La Paz Museum carrying quite a collection. Done by people that grew up with it as their history, not some $ making endeavor that they really don't know a heck of a lot about.
My books started because I got tired of answering the same questions day after day and it certainly wasn't disclosing anything besides what there is to do in Rosarito.
I have ignored what the other board has said about you guys as well as ignoring what you have said about them.
As of tonight, I see what they are talking about with the chicken coop group. Oh wait, I think it was me that said that. And obviously I was right.
By the way, Carols son is coming down tomorrow night but if you and the kids want to come down in the daytime to not discuss this BS, I will be here.

Don't put words in my mouth

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 11:47 PM

"Why is your Rosarito travel guide and your posted photos okay but my travel stories and photos not?" Are your trip reports and photos trying to prove you really saw those bones or those ranch people? No, I think you are doing the same thing as I... SHARING.

I have never complained once about anything but posting GPS coordinates.

I see who is lying here now.

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 11:53 PM

"Even though you or someone kept claiming they were mostly taken from others."

trying to embellish a little David like yer bro Mike to make yourselves look good in front of your sheep?
That is a pretty low accusation and I could care less where you get them whether you have been there or not. I just don't think they should be published by foreigners. I think I have made my point perfectly clear on that.

O fishy O Nadas

Ski Baja - 12-23-2003 at 11:57 PM

Guess the rest of what I have to say about that one girlz. And Merry Christmas.

David K - 12-24-2003 at 12:24 AM

GPS is just a new way to give directions to a place JR. Before, we used milages... like the mission is 14.5 miles from Rancho No Tengo... etc.

GPS is not evil... people who damage historic sites are not Americans with GPS.

The historic onyx school house of El Marmol was not half demolished by Americans either. But a couple Americans (Tim and DK) with web sites sure called attention to it... and guess what, there's a fence around it now... hmmm.

Mexicans, Egyptians, Peruvians, whatever generaly do not/ did not have a great interest in discovering, documenting, and presving historic sites as much as do the British and their cousins, the Americans.
The same is true in Baja. The wonderful (to us) historic sites in Baja were slowly disappearing. Plowed over for crops, demolished for building materials, allowed to melt in the rain, do to desecularization policies. If it weren't (primarily) for American authors, and American tourists wanting to see them... very few of the abandoned missions would be known or visible today.

Because of the heightened interest and value to lure tourist dollars, restoraion on some missions has been started.

We are not ugly for having an interst in Baja history... or California history. Merry Christmas to you.

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 05:00 AM

Nice pics Ski! Looks like you had one heck of a great adventure. I bet you can't wait to head back down.

David K, I feel sorry for you. Honestly, your every trip has to be documented and laid out on every message board that welcomes you. Do you believe that Jimmy Smith, Jack Swords, or any of the other Baja People whom you are so fond of name dropping, ever had a compulsion to do similar, or was it only after years of many and varied experiences that they published what they had found. Your constant self promotion has become grating. You for the most part are preaching to the choir. Your efforts would be better spent answering questions on the various Qand A boards. Perhaps you could even establish a program where you go around and do a presentation at schools in your area. To rehash the same things over and over on these message boards is condesending to all the regular readers, of which it is obvious most here are. You make yourself a target, and degredate yourself in the process. ODB

Here's the rest of what was deleted by the moderators. What is so offensive? Oh it is critical of the self proclaimed kingofbaja. David K.

JR, I love your photos

Bob H - 12-24-2003 at 08:40 AM

....but when is the last time you sat down at Burger King and ate one of those wonderful Whoppers? Huh? :bounce:

Whoppers

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 09:25 AM

Bob, as much as I love health foods like that, I am trying to wean myself off of them. I prefer knowing what goes into my food. So, I eat at Mexican taco stands! :lol:

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 10:08 AM

It's pretty disgusting how some of you ex-patriates pump your new adopted country with such vigor while showing so much disdain for the US, all while you clearly ignore the abhorent corruption and crime in your own, new backyard.

I suggest that to show real aliance to making things better in your new home, that pronounce loudly your desire to capture anyone from the "Felix A" cartel.

Of course this is not realistic because your death would be imminent.

Then again, your entire platform of praise and disdain is far from realistic and honestly very juvenile.

Get my drift?

Bob H - 12-24-2003 at 10:11 AM

OK, here's proof of post #1...
http://www.cnn.com/2003/TRAVEL/12/24/security.usa.airlines.r...

JR - I read a lot of your anti American posts and continue to remind myself that you are entitled to your opinion even if I disagree with they way you think about my people. I am the kind of guy who gives EVERYONE a chance to prove they are decent people, regardless of where they come from. And, I enjoy traveling all over the world meeting them and enjoying different cultures. I only wish you felt the same. I hope to meet you some day and shake your hand regardless of your feelings towards us.
Bob H :yes:

Dave - 12-24-2003 at 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anonymous
I suggest that to show real aliance to making things better in your new home, that pronounce loudly your desire to capture anyone from the "Felix A" cartel.

I applaud the work of the cartels who supply all the dope for drug starved gringos. Good work guys! You should get a medal for your contributions in strengthening the gene pool.

Ski Baja??

Baja Red - 12-24-2003 at 10:59 AM

Ski...Does your X-wife work for the U.S. government?? :lol:

Just trying to calm you down a little. We are all entitled to our opinions. There are things that I agree with and things that I don't about the U.S. Is Mexico doing "everything" right? I know that you don't like us but I would love to sit with you and have a Tecate/soda. Merry Christmas!

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 11:13 AM

I am one of those "your people" guys as well . Going back to some of my original political posts, I consider all people to fall into three categories no matter where they are from. Humans, people and politicians. Politicians also includes religious fanatics and cult leaders.
I also consider all people equal as long as they don't have a "better than thou" attitude because of race, money or whatever and don't go around slandering their neighbors , robbing or murdering.
This is what riles me about many americans, especially it seems, on this board. They think that because of the fact that they have money, everyone else on the planet is lazy.
With this philosophy, there are so few people on the planet with any substantial amount of money or any at all that the majority of the planet is populated by lazy people.
Although, it also seems to me that these people that don't have money are the happiest and work the hardest just to stay alive.
Obviously, this isn't always the case but the third world areas I have spent time in, Mexico, Malaysia and the Philippines, these people were all poor, family oriented hard working happy individuals.
Key word, "happy".
I know many americans having grown up there that are not happy. Some are very wealthy, (money does not by happiness), some are dieing or extremely sick(money does not buy fitness and health) And some are very poor with the same problems.
The difference between the two is that it is generally the poor people that jump in to help when there is an issue. The others are too worried about getting ripped off of their $$ that paranoia keeps them from venturing their assistance. Or, they are just lazy. That will happen when you spend your life counting $ and get caught up in the gold fever.
On politicos, there is no excuse for killing other human beings. Anyone that does this will be going to hell if you follow Skeets beliefs. So many people have died in this "war on terrorism" from both sides and the dead ones had very little to do with the causes of this war. They were just victims of political ideas and greed.
On religion, the next worse thing to $ on the root of all evil scale. Any religion that condemns anothers beliefs is coming straight from the devil himself. People get caught up in this nonsense and there we have the "better than thou" roots.
Seems to me I read somewhere that all people were created equal. Perhaps that just applies to rich americans but I really don't think that is what they meant.
If this doesn't make sense to any of you, I am obviously wasting my breath which according to some, I am not.
If some of you want to make personal attacks on me as happened last night, I expect it from you. Comes from having a narrow mind.
These are my beliefs and I have some ideas for solutions as well rather than the nonsense I was accused of last night.
Merry Christmas to all the humans on the entire planet. Here's a lobster for you all to enjoy.
Oops, sorry Doug, edited to shrink the picture!

Nikon - 12-24-2003 at 11:29 AM

Myopia. "Happy" people comprise now and in the past, practically all the visa applications into the U.S. Happy must not be all you present it to be, or emigrants would want to stay home and keep being "happy".

To talk about people who are going to hell, and mention religious fanatacism in the next breath sends a confusing message. Same thing applies when mentioning Skeet and disparaging those who ridicule other peoples' beliefs. Or, is it not ridicule to say one's ideological foes are "brainwashed"?

You got yourself on this slippery slope and you just keep digging a deeper hole for yourself.

Get a grip on the bitter attitude.

Oh, your back.

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 11:35 AM

Feliz Navidad picklehead.

Fun, fun, fun

academicanarchist - 12-24-2003 at 11:50 AM

Boy, I have been missing the fun. David K., are you forgetting who else has given you fotos for the Bajamission site? I hate to admit it, but I agree with David K. on one point (miracle of miracles). THere have been numerous travel guides to the Peninsula, for example the Garhard and Glick book from the 1950s, that provided detailed directions on how to reach the mission sites. The GPS coordinates are not giving away a great secret. I first visited many of the Baja California mission sites, and some of my photos are posted on David K's Bajamissions site, in 1974, and found the sites without the benefit of GPS.

On the other hand, countries such as Mexico, Peru, Bolivia, etc, are concerned about preserving historic sites, but do not have the benefit of the resources to do so.

Photo of San Fernando

academicanarchist - 12-24-2003 at 11:55 AM

For example, I was able to find the site of San Fernando mission using the ghost of Serra as a guide.

[Edited on 12-24-2003 by academicanarchist]

Thanks Bob H

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 12:06 PM

Thanks for confirming the info provided on my first post on this thread.

Just a tip, I will be posting more inside information on the Nomad General Discussion Board as time goes on.

In January, a major announcement will be made by the State dept regarding travel to Baja.

FYI

Bob H - 12-24-2003 at 12:17 PM

Anon... would we find this January announcement in the form of a Travel Warning posted here?....

http://travel.state.gov/

Bob H

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
Any religion that condemns anothers beliefs is coming straight from the devil himself.

And then, you say things that 100% correct.

As for Dave's comments that seemingly align drug use with gringos and then applauding the Cartels.

Sir, you should be ashamed.

a) Drug abuse is not centric to the US.
b) Cartel's regularly assasinate righteous civil leaders and their families in your very own locale.

Dave - 12-24-2003 at 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anonymous

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
Any religion that condemns anothers beliefs is coming straight from the devil himself.

No sir, it is American drug users who should be ashamed, and jailed. I hold them personally responsible.

a) While drug use is not "centric" to the U.S. the cartels operating in Mexico do not ship their "product" into the U.S. to be then distributed to the rest of the world. They operate SOLELY to supply the U.S. market.

b) Their ONLY reason for the cartels existence is that U.S. citizens break the law to buy their product. If no American did, they (and their violent criminal behavior here) would disappear.

JR, what religions would you include if you were to make a list?

Religions

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 01:57 PM

Are you trying to get me in more trouble here?hahahahahaha
I don't know that much about many religions (on purpose) but so far, the only religion that I am aware of that accepts all others beliefs is Buddhism. And no, I am not one. But, the more I learn, the more I realize I probably could be pretty easily, if I were into that sort of thing! :lol:

Pictures

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 02:00 PM

AA, you can delete those big ol pictures and shrink them from 1280 pixels to about 400 and they will come out peachy. I usually save the shrunken version as a copy so the originals remain the same. :light:

Dave - 12-24-2003 at 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
Are you trying to get me in more trouble here?hahahahahaha

Who, me?

Ski Baja - 12-24-2003 at 02:07 PM

:lol:

Hey Bob H

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 02:58 PM

Current security matters are fluid. (note Air France events today).

The warnings from State are not keeping up.

I'll try to point out some of the stuff off the radar and relating to Baja, as it comes.

The Pentagon is

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 03:16 PM

running this operation, with assistance from the FAA and Homeland.

State may be the last place that gets this action oriented data.

Dave - 12-24-2003 at 03:22 PM

Hey Anon, how do you know all this stuff? Are you a secret agent man? If so, what are you doing spending all your time on this silly web site?

Silly?

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 03:28 PM

I'm just a Bajafile.
Home for the Holidays,
For now, I'll post here...Silly keeps the mind spry. Got to go, I've got to finish my honeydoos

Anonymous - 12-24-2003 at 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by academicanarchist
Boy, I have been missing the fun. David K., are you forgetting who else has given you fotos for the Bajamission site? I hate to admit it, but I agree with David K. on one point (miracle of miracles). THere have been numerous travel guides to the Peninsula, for example the Garhard and Glick book from the 1950s, that provided detailed directions on how to reach the mission sites. The GPS coordinates are not giving away a great secret. I first visited many of the Baja California mission sites, and some of my photos are posted on David K's Bajamissions site, in 1974, and found the sites without the benefit of GPS.

On the other hand, countries such as Mexico, Peru, Bolivia, etc, are concerned about preserving historic sites, but do not have the benefit of the resources to do so.

AA/ Dr. Jackson... It was GPS data that was being discussed and I mentioned who provided GPS waypoints for the missions in our mission web page

http://davidksbaja.com/bajamissions.

Any photos sent to me are credited with their source. You have sent some great historic photos and some of your own. In each case you are credited for providing the photos. If I missed any, I am more than happy to add.

Merry Christmas!

David K - 12-24-2003 at 08:30 PM

Oops, that was me... I changed from my pc to webtv and forgot to sign in before posting! The link to AA's and others' mission pics is http://davidksbaja.com/bajamissions I didn't leave a space before the period, and the link didn't become 'hyper' above.
Merry Christmas

Death waits for no one

Anonymous - 1-2-2004 at 08:50 PM

A Better Question

timperkins - 1-3-2004 at 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ski Baja
Why would anyone want to go to a country as jacked up as that one anyways. Especially when most of the world wants to eliminate it.

A better question is: Why does the rest of the world want to eliminate us?

In the case of the Arab world, its the same reason they want to eliminate the Jews: Because we/they aren't Arab. In that regard, Bin Laden is like Hitler, without the means (yet) to destroy everything that isn't Arab/Muslim.

When I'm in Mexico, I act like a guest and respect the land, people, customs and laws. All of the Mexican and Canadian people that I know do the same when they are in the US. If Mexico or Canada were under the threat of Arab fanatics, would they do less than what the US Government is trying to do? I don't think so.

Why does the rest of the world want to eliminate us!

Skeet/Loreto - 1-3-2004 at 01:11 PM

That sir you should be able to answer easily!

We are the Richest and most Powerful Nation!
Freedom
Christainy
Jealous
Indivdual Rights
Morality

Those are just a few reasons.
The Top Dog allways gets challenged.
I think that if we are defeated it will come from within.I will not be here to see it. thank God!

Cannot you see the Nascar Folks,the NRA boys, the 4 Wheelers all with guns taking on the Liberal Acadmenia. It would be like a Mel Gibson Movie!
Skeet/Loreto