BajaNomad - Disposing of trash while in Baja

Disposing of trash while in Baja

RICHARDH - 12-30-2006 at 05:18 PM

Disposing of trash while in Baja

For someone visiting Baja for 6 months and doing a lot of remote, free camping, what is the most appropriate method for disposing of trash while in Baja? Are public trash cans readily available? If so, where can they usually be found?

Good For a Laugh !

MrBillM - 12-30-2006 at 05:27 PM

Just wait until you arrive in Baja. It will be readily evident to you what the custom is involving trash disposal by both the Mexicans and others. The most common method is also the simplest.

Marie-Rose - 12-30-2006 at 05:41 PM

As anywhere when you are camping in the wilderness, you carry out what you bring in. We have found that even over the past 3 years there seem to be more garbage cans along the side of the road. They are not always emptied in a timely fashion but I do believe it is an improvement.

RICHARDH - 12-30-2006 at 05:50 PM

Thanks, MrBillM and Marie-Rose. I would bother my conscience to dump trash anywhere except in recepticals intended for that purpose, regardless of what others do.

I suppose burying (burned?) trash might do in a pinch, but trash recepticals are preferred.

Bajaboy - 12-30-2006 at 06:01 PM

Richard-

We usually burn as much as we can. We recycle most of the glass we have (beer bottles). With the little that remains, we look for either trash cans along the highway or for the local dump, usually found at the edge of most towns. But, be aware that the dumps are pretty much that...a place to dump your garbage.

I have a feeling you're going to have one heck of a trip report for us when you return. I'm looking forward to it.

Zac

Capt. George - 12-30-2006 at 06:16 PM

go west young man and look past the garbage!

Summanus - 12-30-2006 at 06:22 PM

But, Capt. George...everyone knows that the Japan Sea Current throws all the Pacific's garbage up on that western Abrejos coastline!

Capt. George - 12-30-2006 at 06:38 PM

only on Monday and Thursdays!

the delivery days

pick up days?????????? there are none...

nightly thunder or is that simply flatulance?

capt g

'harmonious' nightly thunderings ...

Summanus - 12-30-2006 at 07:07 PM

David K - 12-30-2006 at 07:47 PM

It is sad to see so many towns in Mexico that have no system other than dumping over the hill where nobody in town can see it, or in an arroyo for the next flash flood to wash it out to the sea.

One bulldozer with an open pit (landfill) for the garbage could do wonders for the Baja landscape at each town... Where are local collected taxes going now? (on second thought, don't bother answering that one :lol:

)

Richard------

Barry A. - 12-30-2006 at 07:59 PM

I have always bagged my trash (after burning combustables) in trash bags, and then carried them to the nearest "dump", which, as said, is litterally that------a dumping place. I carry the full bags on top of my rig, or in my boat if it is on a trailer. Remember to place the trash bags our of reach of critters at night while still in camp.

If I am only down for a few days, I haul it back to the USA and dump it in an appropriate container at a gas station, or behind a foodmarket, or something like that.

I have seldom seen any "containers" in Mexico, and if I did I would not use them----they would just fill up and overflow.

Burying unburned trash is not recomended as it is dug up by coyotes, or dogs, etc. shortly after you leave.

Trash disposal IS a problem, but I refuse to contribute to the mess already there unless it is a big, established "dump".

abreojos - 12-30-2006 at 09:31 PM

RICHARDH
One man's trash is another man's treasure and there are no dumpster divers in Baja because there ain't no dumpsters to dive!
Trash, it is just about everywhere...and if you start picking up trash down here, you can spend the rest of your life doing just that and not put a dent into it. The NRDC paid one of the only people in Abreojos who regulary picked up trash to clean the beaches of trash. One man cleaning and 1000s trashing...good luck. Bring as little as possible with you, burn what you can and hope what you carefully deposit in the trash makes it to an even trashier place and the wind doesn't blow it back to you! It's like peeen in the wind worrying about it..

bajarich - 12-30-2006 at 10:50 PM

Buy returnable bottles for beer, pay the deposit and return them. The beer companies have started producing throwaway glass bottles. They are cheaper, but at a much higher cost to the environment.

Bajabus - 12-30-2006 at 11:12 PM

The only garbage I throw out the window is aluminum cans. They get collected pretty fast by locals who trade them in for cash. When traveling I just bag it up and take it to a trash can in the next town. I don't drive into the dumps. Too many punctured and damaged tires over the years.

On my property I have been filling in a small ravine, I set it on fire occasionally and every few years get a load of dirt dumped over it. Making a nice terraced area over time

Capt. George - 12-31-2006 at 05:04 AM

do you remember our highways and byways before Lady Bird and her Clean up America Campaign? I do.

The roads were pretty skanky. I take my trash to the dump site (all 2,652 sq miles of it) and burn what I can....

I've become accomplished at not seeing it...

harmonious nightly thunderings indeed! you're sleeping outside if you ever come to visit.

george

BajaBus------

Barry A. - 12-31-2006 at 10:51 AM

You say, "On my property I have been filling in a small ravine, I set it on fire occasionally and every few years get a load of dirt dumped over it. Making a nice terraced area over time "

This does work temporarily, but what happens when the "big one" hits?? (hurricane, tropical storm, etc). That ravine was caused by water running sometime-----it WILL happen again, and then all the "trash" will be moved downstream, to where????? (I just worry about things like this)

Like I say, trash in Baja is a BIG problem, and I don't pretend to have an answer-----this is one of the few things that Government is supposed to take care of-----I wish they would get started.

I guess in the mean time we just do the best we can, like Bajabus is doing.

Barry

Bajagypsy - 12-31-2006 at 11:01 AM

We burn everything we can while camping, throw nothing out the window while driving (other than the odd banana peal as its biodegradeable), and recycle all glass. (turn in our empty beer bottles in exchange for full ones

Nothing worse than garbage blowing all over the place. Baja has enough of that as it is and we dont want to be a contrubuting part to the mess.

Bajabus - 12-31-2006 at 11:44 AM

Barry, so far it seems OK, I am going to have to start building a retaining wall along that side sooner or later. My thoughts are that they just burn it at the dump in todos santos so why not just do the same at my place and keep it in house so to speak.

I see so many folks collecting aluminum on the side of the road that It really does not bother me to place it there for those less fortunate to pick up.

At my place in Elias Calles I bag the aluminum and as I drive to todos Santos, right before Rancho Nuevo by the giant billboard sign I drop it off for the family there. I always see her and her husband collecting on the side up and down their stretch of the highway

TMW - 12-31-2006 at 11:47 AM

What I don't burn in my camp fire I put in a plastic bag and leave in my truck bed until I find a trash can, either at a Pemex or other such place or bring home. Throwing litter along the highway, be it a can or paper or bottle, is a mindset people need to change. But educating ignorant people takes many lifetimes no matter which side of the border. We have the CDC in CA and similar people in other states to pick it up in the U.S. and it's still a problem. I've always been fasinated how someone could throw trash along the hwy and get mad if I were to throw trash in their yard.

gypsy----

Barry A. - 12-31-2006 at 11:48 AM

Believe it or not, banana peels sorta dry out, petrify, and last for years as a black "thing" sitting around (especially in the desert), but you are right, they eventually do biodegrade, but it takes years and years. We always hide those suckers behind bushes, or under rocks. :yes:

or include the squishy smelly things within our trash bags. :lol:

We never burn stuff in camp unless it is really combustable (paper, etc) as it sure does make for a smelly campfire otherwise.

cononaco-------

Barry A. - 12-31-2006 at 01:32 PM

-------yes-----and your point is------------------------?

"Location: Spahn Ranch" ??????? Isn't that where Manson and the crew hung out during their murdering days??????

David K - 12-31-2006 at 07:37 PM

If you have room to haul it IN to camp, you should be able to haul it out, empty is even easier!

Paper trash can be used to help start campfires or can be burned, but all bottles, cans, plastics can be hauled out to the city... best if returned back to the U.S. where we have the better waste desposal systems.

Baja Bus... I am really, really surprised at you!

But, I do understand your logic... :biggrin:

Bajaboy - 12-31-2006 at 09:54 PM

DK-

Just curious why you think we (the U.S.) has a better waste disposal system. I'm under the impression that trash biodegrades faster above ground than below ground. Also, there is plenty of trash on our highways and streets so maybe there is a problem north of the border as well.

Zac

Bajaboy------

Barry A. - 12-31-2006 at 10:51 PM

I am not sure where you live, but I see very little trash along the roads all the places I travel in the USA. I live in the far north part of California, but often travel to San Diego and El Centro.

pargo - 1-1-2007 at 09:32 AM

A touchy subject trash is. No one good answer. I agree, as someone mentioned earlier, this is an area where the goverment needs to get involved heavily and with no exceptions. All we can do in the meantime as individuals is not to leave trash scattered on streets etc..and dump where your particular location deems appropiate (community dumps, pemex and the like) or bring back to U.S. as much as possible. Finally to Bajaboy was it?...Our disposal system here in the U.S. has done a tremendous job. Our streets and highways don't look anywhere near what they used to look like...believe me. Those are tax dollars well spent.

David K - 1-1-2007 at 09:56 AM

Yah, no kidding pargo and Barry...

Zac, you are kidding, right? There is no comparison... Waste management is a science in the U.S. and with all the eco-nuts we have, how could you think that leaving garbage above ground (where disease is easily spread) would be allowed here. The next thing I guess will be to stop burrying people when they die so they too will biodegrade faster!! :wow:

Even without eco-nuts, how many 'normal' people in the U.S. (or most modern countries) would tolerate trash all over the countryside?

I bet pargo is old enough to remember our highways in the 60's, as I do...
We have come a long way in the U.S. ... Mexico is 40 years behind us in many ways. However, it is none of our business to tell Mexico what to do, but we can lead by example... Throwing trash out you car window is NOT good and just plain wrong.

[Edited on 1-3-2007 by David K]

Bajabus - 1-1-2007 at 07:28 PM

David, aluminum cans are not trash.....they are money....look on the sides of the road. Do you see many aluminum cans? It is a waste to throw them out with the regular trash.

Trash or treasure

Sharksbaja - 1-1-2007 at 08:42 PM

I'd say our roads here are some of the worst in the country and lacks the taxes to repair but the trash is always picked up. Many of our roads are picked up by corrections inmates and I see many people looking for aluminum cans regularily.

I was amazed to see a number of shallow arroyos cleansed of their wealth of trash and garbage by hurricane John. Hmmm, I wonder where it all went???

Capt. George - 1-2-2007 at 05:23 AM

eco-N-zis, the "N" word, Jewfish in Florida, Jap Rd in CA...

jeez, give it a break.

How could the use of a word, any word, trivialize anything as groteque as the Holocaust??? Much ado about nothing!

I grew up in the city (THEE CITY) the racist name calling there and then would make your hair fall out. Thank goodness that has diminished to todays more civilized standards....but agiain we seem to make too much of certain words. Get over it.

Can't wait to be bombarded by you left wingers...bring it on! Capt George

Capt. George - 1-2-2007 at 11:07 AM

Dave,

I grew up in Middle Village in NY. The neighborhood was a combo of German/Irish, Italian and Jews. My dearest friend growing up lost a good part of his family in that nightmare....they did not carry it around with them nor did they use it to flog themselves or the people around them.

I knew and was either a friend or customer of men and women that still had numbers tattooed on their arms. They took less offense at certain words then what goes on today in our "oh so fake" society.

I take offense at anyone thinking I lack compassion for those poor unfortunates caught up in that period of horrid history. I lived with & talked to (and about) the people that went through it..

Capt George

jerry - 1-2-2007 at 11:22 AM

i was born and lived till i was 14 in the no so politacal correct town by the name of Whitelaw wisconsin and no one seems to care about changing that towns name me included

pargo - 1-2-2007 at 11:50 AM

How'd we go from trash to N-zis?....Oh wait, I get it...trash=N-zis :?:

Summanus - 1-2-2007 at 01:48 PM

My college roomate's grandmother was a survivor of the concentration camps in WWII...with the tatooed numbers on her forearm..or so my friend, Shelly, told me. I never saw them myself, because in the four years I knew him and his family, his grandmother never came downstairs when there was a stranger in the house. I cannot fathom what horror was in her mind.

Cypress - 1-2-2007 at 02:03 PM

Every time the term "Red-Neck" or "Trailer Park Trash" is uttered it puts me into a catatonic state and I seek professional help. :lol:

What's with people that cling to negative experiences?? :?:

Bajaboy - 1-2-2007 at 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Yah, no kidding pargo and Barry...

Zac, you are kidding, right? There is no comparison... Waste management is a science in the U.S. and with all the eco-N-zis we have, how could you think that leaving garbage above ground (where disease is easily spread) would be allowed here. The next thing I guess will be to stop burrying people when they die so they too will biodegrade faster!! :wow:

Even without eco-N-zis, how many 'normal' people in the U.S. (or most modern countries) would tolerate trash all over the countryside?

So are you condoning the work of environmentalists now? Pretty brave move on your part. Without them, we might still be dumping toxics into our waterways and turning our heads to sewage runoff. I am old enough to remember the smog alerts of California and those enviromentalists who pressed for more stringent auto emissions. Anyways, back to the point....

I do agree with you David about our country not tolerating above ground dumps. But my point was that trash will decompose faster above ground than below. I did not make any judgements as to which was better.

Just wanted to clarify that I was not kidding.

Zac

bajalou - 1-2-2007 at 03:02 PM

Read reports on land fills that have stuff that has not decomposed in 20 years when sealed underground and wouldn't have lasted 3 months above ground.

Sealing it away in landfills is a good way to hide it - not dispose of it.

Interesting statement Bajaboy

Sharksbaja - 1-2-2007 at 03:20 PM

Bioremediation can be accomplished through many means. I have a friend that raises mycelium that helps break-down inorganic compounds in city dumps. He also raises strains that utilize organic substances like cardboard and paper. Heat like in the desert certainly removes the water in something but garbage can exist for centuries in some dry places.
For instance, abandoned autos in the PNW rust and decompose very fast whereas the same vehicles left to the forces of the arid SW could remain intact for decades if not longer.

With that said, one also must consider other factors at work. Looking at items recovered from deep cold seawater can give you an idea of how temperature,chemical and biological degradation work together. If the water was warmer you would see faster action.
Still, water is the greatest solvent and tool for breaking down stuff naturally. Well, except for maybe volcanoes. :lol:

Sharksbaja - 1-2-2007 at 03:24 PM

Ok Lou, that's true but landfills can decompose stuff faster the UV could destroy the same item. Although when you talk about most plastics, I would concur.

Hey, aren't we suppose to reuse plastic???? :lol:

Exposed to the Effects of Nature

MrBillM - 1-2-2007 at 03:28 PM

Well, the Zoroastrians always disposed of their dead by placing them in high open towers for the creatures and elements to pick clean, but the numbers today would be a Whole lot higher. It would probably make each town an especially Aromatic experience.

I've made the point numerous times that I don't think "words" can hurt. Anyone who feels pain because someone used non-PC terms is simply TOO sensitive.

As far as some of the more offensive words in our new PC world, I remember years ago when I was a bystander in a conversation between a few of the Old Bats working at GTE. They were discussing a particular "nut" (Brazil Nuts) that they knew all their lives as "******Toes" and wondering what they were called nowadays. They called on one of the younger female clerks working there who was Black and asked her about it. Her reply was "I've never heard them called anything but "******toes". I note that references say they are still referred to as such, although I doubt anywhere in the U.S. of P.C.

When Agatha Christie first published her novel "Ten Little Indians" in England, it was titled "Ten Little ******s". The British tended to refer to anyone of dark skin as such.

In the late 60s, I went into an Auto Body shop in South L.A. to get an estimate on repairs to my car. Everyone there (except me) was Black. The owner of the shop asked me if I'd been hit by a "******Man" or a "WhiteGuy". Growing up in South L.A. from birth, I heard that word time and again, usually from a Black.

I remember being sent down to the hardware store as a child by my uncle to pick up some "JewNails" (corrugated Joint nails). I believe the reference had to do with their crooked configuration.

The funny thing was that no one seemed to get riled up or collapse in misery. Somehow, we all survived living side by side.

Capt. George - 1-2-2007 at 04:08 PM

You said the N word, you said the N word, goin ta jail, goin ta jail, racist, racist, you said the N word!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my God, Mr Bill, what have you done..I must go take mt P-P-Prozac.

bajalou - 1-2-2007 at 04:12 PM

"Biodegradability is determined by what happens to a product when it ends up in a landfill. When something is thrown away, it may be incinerated or buried in a landfill. Environmental scientists who have studied modern landfills doubt that much of anything can degrade in them given their lack of light, water, and bacterial activity, which are the necessary elements for natural degradation. Interestingly, researchers have found thirty-year-old hot dogs in landfills that have mummified instead of decomposed!"

http://www.four-h.purdue.edu/foods/Recycling.htm

Barry A. - 1-2-2007 at 04:21 PM

Soon we will not be able to refer to various pipe fittings as "male" and "female"-------someone might be offended!!!

What a mess we have gotten ourselves into.

As for things deterioating (or not) above ground-------when I was pre-10 years old, I built some tiny stick-houses made from old wooden orange crates (like we all used to have), the wood being about 1/4 inch thick. This was in Owens Valley which is pretty deserty. Today, those tiny stick houses are still intact, and actually look pretty good-------that was more than 50 years ago.

So much for above-ground deteriorating!!! Did I mention banana peels, and how long they last above ground??? Many, many years.

Sharksbaja - 1-2-2007 at 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajalou
"Biodegradability is determined by what happens to a product when it ends up in a landfill. When something is thrown away, it may be incinerated or buried in a landfill. Environmental scientists who have studied modern landfills doubt that much of anything can degrade in them given their lack of light, water, and bacterial activity, which are the necessary elements for natural degradation. Interestingly, researchers have found thirty-year-old hot dogs in landfills that have mummified instead of decomposed!"

http://www.four-h.purdue.edu/foods/Recycling.htm

Yep, that's why smart people plan proper landfills. You need microbes to do the dirty work.

They can be a good source of methane for many years.

Bio What ?

MrBillM - 1-2-2007 at 04:41 PM

I look forward to discovering just how "Biodegradable" some people are.

DENNIS - 1-2-2007 at 05:10 PM

MrBill----
The British regard the Irish today as the raceially devided minds of the U.S. regard the Blacks. Im offended by that and, Im not even there.

"raceially devided minds" ?

MrBillM - 1-2-2007 at 05:26 PM

Whatever that Means ! Any Irishman (myself included) who is Still being gnawed at by the disgraceful and vicious acts of GB towards the Irish in the long ago past, needs to reassess their priorities.

I DO Fly the Irish Flag ABOVE that of the UK, though.

abreojos - 1-2-2007 at 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Capt. George
do you remember our highways and byways before Lady Bird and her Clean up America Campaign? I do.

The roads were pretty skanky. I take my trash to the dump site (all 2,652 sq miles of it) and burn what I can....

I've become accomplished at not seeing it...

harmonious nightly thunderings indeed! you're sleeping outside if you ever come to visit.

george

You guys are a riot! I guess I missed a few beats on this thread. George, I remember that program and have tried to get it going in Abreojos. Just look around the schools and see how well it isn't working. Native Americans just don't care and Mexico is predominatly Native American. Thank sombody we don't have neo natzies here. I take the trash anyday.

David K - 1-2-2007 at 05:59 PM

'eco-N-zis' changed to 'eco-nuts' in the post way above, as a peace offering to my friend Dave.

I do think opinions (which that term was) should not be offensive to anyone (in the name of freedom of expression), but that it was offensive to Dave, who I know, was why I changed my post.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Zac, I have no problem with saving the enviroment and conserving the good things on earth (I am a conservative, remember). I do have a big problem with people using the enviroment to push a socialist, anti American agenda and trying to take away my freedoms and lifestyle... You know, only pointing to enviromental problems in America, that America needs to cut back, that Americans have 'too much', etc. All the while ignoring the death of forests in the (now former) communist East Block, pollution pouring out of Chinese factories, and all cars in the third world, etc.

Capt. George - 1-3-2007 at 04:33 AM

you're going to Hell anyway David, apologies will get you nowhere on this one. You said a politically incorrect word..

first a little jail time with that slandering MrBill..

As for me, you know where I'm going, jealous ain't you. Floating around on those clouds looking down and throwing "garbage" at you vile sinners!

enjoy the heat right wingers.

Capt. George - 1-3-2007 at 04:34 AM

Abreojos

How come I ain't never seen ya in Abreojos?

Maybe cause I wasn't lookin?

el Vikingo de Punta Abreojos

abreojos - 1-3-2007 at 06:24 AM

Hi George, maybe you have. I haven't been there very much the last 4 years. Not at all last year. Got 2 trips in the fall 05', but I got skunked for the first time fishing there which POed me. Could see Corvina everywhere, but they just wouldn't even nibble!
f you eat at Bidio's Fish Tacos aka Las Palmas in front of the pangas you probably seen me there. I was there for 2001-02 all the time. Now I am stuck in Cabo trying to make enough $ for my second semi retirement. Years ago we almost bought a block like Ray did. He beat us to it by a hair. Prefer my place anyhow. Got phone Internet, elect and water right there and it was much cheaper, no road in front of it and easy to walk to town.
We are buying another house close to San Jose near Palmilla so I won't be building anything up there in the near future. Can't decide exactly what to build there anyhow.
Sold my airstream to Marcos Arce, Martin's older brother, who died last year. They still owe us half the money. If you hear of anybody looking for a trailer in Abreojos, let me know. They are worth 3 times what I am selling it for refurburshed in the states. I'd like to finish that going on 5 years deal.

Capt. George - 1-3-2007 at 09:23 AM

Marco was a good friend to me but a sly money guy...Martin & Chuey on the other hand, have been always honest and upfront with me We have phone, internet and I understand the water problem in Ojos solved, we'll see.

do you still have a place in Ojos, and if so, where, I seem to be reading "in town"? We won't be down, probably till Oct..moving up to Coffman Cove AK

hasta

joel - 2-2-2007 at 09:56 PM

Abreojos,

I'm looking for a trailer for a couple of Abre lots, by coincidence.

Can you provide any details, photos?

I may be down there in about a week or so, depending on work.

Joel

abreojos - 2-3-2007 at 06:17 AM

Joel check you U2U

rts551 - 2-3-2007 at 07:27 AM

Joe

Better check on your trailers. Someone has moved into one of the airstreams down by the airstrip. Don't know if it is yours though.

Bruce R Leech - 2-3-2007 at 07:57 AM

If you put your trash in boxes and tape them shut and leave them buy your car some one will steal them right away. :lol:

abreojos - 2-3-2007 at 08:33 AM

Thanks, we will check to see what is up. We have the title and and everything is recorded in the deligation.

oxxo - 2-3-2007 at 09:14 AM

With regards to trash, people will do whatever is right for themselves. We dispose of our trash in a proper manner in Baja, whenever possible. If not possible, we haul it back out. Call us eco-N-zis, eco-nuts, Liberals, or Irish (which I am), whatever you like, but it's the right thing for us. We have our own little private "Adopt a Highway" program in Mexico to pick up trash along the highway in response to those people who wish to dispose of their trash out the window.

On our drive out from Baja about a month ago, we had the van filled with about 6 or 7 large bags of trash. At one of the military checkpoints, the young soldier opened the door, and one of the bags fell out and spilled trash all over his feet. It was quite amusing to see the look of dismay on his face! We got an immediate wave through!

Trying to do the right thing for us, and proud of it......whatever you want to call me.