BajaNomad - Baja/Disneyland

Baja/Disneyland

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 03:04 PM

It has come to my attention that many on this board, and others seem to consider Baja,Mexico some type of Disneyland or personal amusement park that has no rules.
They come here thinking that the Mexicans that live here are just an annoying inconvenience to their vacations and something to be careful of as they are just there to rip us off.
So, they come, they drink their Tequila by the gallon and massive quantities of beer and whatever because it's cheap and proceed to act like idiots. They race around on their toys and quite often get hurt, they fight with each other and talk behind each others backs and set a fine example of americanism wherever they go with these actions.
And because of their paranoia from living in the U.S., they come in droves and go to little american type communities so they can be with themselves and safe from those horrid Mexican people that live in shacks, drive crappy trucks n cars, and don't immediately smile at them.
And then they complain about this, that and the other thing if they didn't have the "perfect vacation" while visiting a third world country.
Well, if you take a look at yourselves and then at the Mexicans, you might begin to understand why they don't immediately smile or take a liking to you. It's because they think you are scary idiots. And I have to say, I agree.
These people are not shallow and they are very observant of the planet and people on it. When they see the majority of americans coming down and using this type of behaviour the majority of the time, well, what would you think ?
And instead of the gringos trying to show them some respect, they just assume they are all thieves and people that "need to be watched out for".
This is about as wrong an assumption that can possibly be made. And if any of you really care about Baja and the people rather than just your personal playground or a way to make $$ writing books about your adventures rather than respecting Baja for what it is, you will pay attention to what I am saying.
Spanish is not that hard to learn if you work at it and don't be ashamed of trying to speak it. The Mexican people are more than willing to help with pronunciation. Just the fact that you are trying is showing respect.
These people are the same as the rest of the people on the planet and deserve the same respect as anyone. Especially you because they consider their families the most important thing. Period.. Just because they don't have money doesn't mean they don't work their butts off trying to survive and feed their families.
These families stick together through any ordeals. They do not put their relatives in "homes" when they become a burden. They care for them always and show love constantly. Can many of you say the same thing in your country ?
They will give you the shirt off their backs if you needed it. They always stop to help stranded motorists and will generally invite you to join in their meals and festivities if you are a human. I'll bet that happens a lot in your neighborhood. Some foreigner's car breaks in front of your house. What's your first thought, he needs help or we are about to get ripped off? Answer truthfully now ! And then, if the poor soul who's car has broken was fortunate enough to have a wife or kids in the car so you see he's not a crook, are you going to help them and invite them in for food and whatever they need. Doubt it.
Here's a little something to help the Humans along that are interested along. Try going to http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish

And then, clean up your acts and show some respect. It will pay off in the long run as you will make some incredible friends.

I agree with you, BUT

capn.sharky - 1-6-2004 at 03:40 PM

I have seen examples of what you have written about here, but most of the Americans I run into in Baja don't fit into your mold. You make it sound as if every American that comes down to Baja acts like an idiot. This is not the case at all---at least in Loreto and the sorrounding area. In fact, I find the Americans you write of in the minority down in Baja Sur. I have also seen Mexicans act pretty bad although most of them are very fine people. I have noticed over the years that some of our customs clash and one must be careful not to offend the other by doing everyday things that are common up here....and visa versa. Perhaps a slightly more gentle way of advising people of their habits would be in order.

Anonymous - 1-6-2004 at 04:28 PM

Therefore,as God's chosen people,holy and dearly love,clothe yourselves with compassion,kindness,humility,gentleness and patience. Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another.Forgive as the Lord forgave you. And in all these virtues put on Love,which binds them all together in perfect unity.
Colossians 3;12

jim janet - 1-6-2004 at 04:42 PM

Well, we are Canadians, and we certainly agree with you about the Mexican people. They are a friendly and a generous people, and seem to be far more happy with their modest lot, than most of us are with all our toys. I feel it necessary also to say that most of the US visitors that we have met while travelling tend to be friendly and green in nature. Perhaps that is because we mostly camp in areas that are far from the resort towns, and even from some of the 'free' and 50 peso beaches. We find people there who mostly like to enjoy nature and learn about the history and geography of the area.

Ski

Debra - 1-6-2004 at 05:52 PM

I feel very fortunate that I have managed to miss the Americans you refer too, maybe because I stay away from border towns where it's too easy to get too, Maybe it's the same as north of the border where the Mexicans also are not as polite as we would wish. People are people, sometimes wonderful, sometimes not.. That is human nature...I will say again at the risk of being repetitive, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you"

Right again

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 05:54 PM

I do tend to generalize which is wrong. I have met many people of all nationalities in Baja and enjoyed most every one of them.
I have also experienced the Gringo areas where this type behavior is the norm. And fortunately, unless you are not afraid of the Mexicans and unpopulated areas of Baja, these people keep to themselves in their enclaves.
Anyways, just some very valid points for some to think about before complaining about Mexico. For whatever it's worth.

Ski

Debra - 1-6-2004 at 05:59 PM

The only complaint I have is that you haven't invited me to go sking in Baja! :spingrin:

Ski

Big Al - 1-6-2004 at 06:05 PM

Ski:

I think you are preaching to the wrong crowd. The people you are speaking about don't tend to frequent this board. I rarely hear any complaing about Mexico here except for very specific topics.

Big Al

Skiing

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 06:06 PM

Skiing in Baja could happen again any day now. Our nights have been COLD and if we get some rain as predicted, strap those puppies on Deb. I would love to have a cross country ski outing down here.
I probably mentioned before though that the night I went to the mountains to ski was the coldest night I have ever experienced. 7 years in the Berkshires, 3 years in Jackson Hole, 10 years in Tahoe City and my coldest night to this date was in Baja. Go figure. Example; dogs water frozen solid in 1/2 hour. Good snow though.

Debra - 1-6-2004 at 07:08 PM

Well....there 'ya go.......They are sking at Queen Ann hill in Seattle I'm told today....I went out on a jaunt today in my "new" 4Runner....even saw some ski-mobils....(what the heck are they doing with them here?!) we don't ever have this, last time was in '96

FrankO - 1-6-2004 at 08:21 PM

Ski, I know you get around baja a lot and I respect that. ALL AMERICANS ARE NOT IDIOTS! Lighten up, brother.

Dave - 1-6-2004 at 08:27 PM

JR, living so near that POS town Rosarito Beach, that caters to the Gringo that we both despise has colored your vision. You need to get out more. :lol:

J.R.

Tucker - 1-6-2004 at 08:36 PM

Right on bro!

ferdic1 - 1-6-2004 at 08:37 PM

A very wise (it seemed to me) woman in Bahia de Los Angeles (Raquel, of Raquel & Larry's), commented to us when we dared mention the condition of the roads: "Bad roads bring good people; good roads, bad people."

I think the further away from the U.S. border you get in Baja, the more agreeable the U.S. visitor you'll find (Cabo excepted).

God save us from Baja road improvements!

Generalizing

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 08:51 PM

is what I am guilty of and I already apologized. And for those of you that read something different into what I said, I apologize again for generalizing.
But, my words were directed to specific individuals although I personally have no idea of who they are on here. If the Huarache fits, -------
And the rest of you guys crack me up. :lol:

Debra - 1-6-2004 at 09:19 PM

Raquel while a very great lady..was citing Mama Espanosia words from about 40 something years ago.

Skiing in Baja

Mexitron - 1-6-2004 at 09:30 PM

Hey Ski--I gather you do you're skiing in the San Pedro Martir...(?). Despite you're "coldest night ever", I've found the San Pedro to have an amazingly constant temperature year-round--I've had 18 degrees and snow in June, 28 degrees at night in August, and a low of only 25 degrees around New Year's with 2 feet of snow on the ground...of course daytime temps are higher in summer. Some literature regarding the forests up there remarked on the consistent growth rings in the trees as well, reflecting the consistent temps(and consistent year round water). Anyway, its a beautiful place to go to, and I'm sorry they're blocking vehicle access to most of the park now(understandably). I've had some great times exploring the old roads on that mountain, the old mill, the rancher's cedar shack, etc. Have fun skiing.....

Blocked roads

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 09:53 PM

There's actually a few places where you can ski in Baja. One of the reasons for Xcountry skiing would be- blocked roads.

Baja Bernie - 1-6-2004 at 09:56 PM

JR,
While I agree with some of the things your wider than wide brush painted I disagee with a bunch of it. As you know I write books and most of what I write about is people interacting with people both Mexican and American and I believe strongly that the average Mexican has a lot to teach some of us stressed out gringos. As far as making money on writing books about Baja that is a laugh. Not really a large market for Baja Books even though most of us enjoy them. Take a look at my last effort, Bouncing Around Baja, and read the chapter called 'A Wave and a Smile' that deals in a very positive and true fashion with the wonderful interaction between Native born and gringos. Or read the one on the Sage of San Ignacio which is about Don Jimmy. I write to salute the Mexican People and this great place we all call Baja. Enough of that.
I believe that your heart is in the right place but I believe you lash out at your friends here because you are exposed to more of the types you rail about than most of us. One thing I have learned after 40 years of kicking around Baja is to relax and realize that these great people truly have a lot to teach us. Patience is what sets them apart from most of us visitors.
I just sent you a private post about Don Jimmy and your idea about creating a monument for him--I think he is most worthy gringo who ever lived in Baja. He was an ol' slinger of ink who wrote a bunch about his home--Baja. He died with very few pesos in his jeans but he was the richest man I have ever met.

honda tom - 1-6-2004 at 10:11 PM

ski, I guess you dont get out of rosarito too much. Maybe I'm that guy that you point your finger at and call an idiot. Yea i race on my 4 stroke a little too fast and yea I've even been hurt down in baja. Hey sometimes I've drank soo much beer i passed out in a hammoc on the beach. But the next day I went fishing with my 70 year old dad, listened to jimmy buffet on the boat, and caught dorado all day long. So I guess what I'm getting at is that you are a pitiful, lonely person, that thinks they have some monopoly on the enjoyment of baja. 99% of the people I've run into (south of rosarito anyway) will do whatever it takes to help an amigo out, and thats the travler I am. So stay out of my way when I'm on the bike or heading to the bar, and I guess you want any help from this "idiot".

OK then.

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 10:25 PM

I rest my case. :lol:

FrankO - 1-6-2004 at 10:45 PM

J.R. You are seriously trippin'. If we were face to face as a man( or human as you like to say)I'd tell you to lighten the flock up. I'm glad I always blow by where you live so I can get south where I like it and away from the border zone, of which Rosarito couldn't be more.

I envy you.

Ski Baja - 1-6-2004 at 10:55 PM

all I know is lil ol Rosarito. There's Mexicans in those other places so I'd be afraid to go there. :lol:

JR

frizkie - 1-7-2004 at 12:04 AM

Just got one thing to say......"ATTABOY!!" :smug:

Don Jimmy

Big Al - 1-7-2004 at 09:49 AM

Who is Don jimmy that you all speak of?

Dave - 1-7-2004 at 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom
Yea i race on my 4 stroke a little too fast and yea I've even been hurt down in baja. Hey sometimes I've drank soo much beer i passed out in a hammoc on the beach.

Tom, that sounds just like the typical Mexican on holiday. :lol:

Don Jimmy

Ski Baja - 1-7-2004 at 10:27 AM

is one of the original norte americano pioneers of Baja. He is the author of the book "The Grinning Gargoyle" which is epic reading if your into humour and Baja.
I could go on and on but if you go to Baja.net there are some of his writings there.
A spectacular individual to say the least and it would be well worth your while to find out more about this human being. Not hard to do on these boards either.
Jimmys on the right.

Anonymous - 1-7-2004 at 03:20 PM

Ski Baja

How Happy is the one who does not follow the advice of the wicked or stand in the pathway with Sinners or sit in the assembly of Arrogant Fools!!!!
Psalm 1;1

Hey Ski,

M - 1-7-2004 at 04:47 PM

Ski, I have NEVER had problems from the mexicans. The only time I have had a scary problem was a couple drunk Americans. You are very right about the values the Mexicans hold, honorable, family oriented and respectful. You have already apologized for your 'generalization' of Americans. Honorable act in itself. I hope you can make "the Bash' in Cielito Lindo. I Look forward to meeting you and I think when you meet most of us you will have a clearer picture who we are. We are an eclectic bunch and everyybody I know is very respectfull of the Mexican people. As for broken down cars, I have ALWAYS stopped to offer help, rides, water or whatever. As a solo travelin gal, I have caught a lot of hell about that, but I said then, as I do now...I trust a Mexican man in Baja a lot more than I would trust an American man here on a long deserted road. (sorry to the gents on this board, obviously you do not apply) Hugs to all, M

M... i know you'd stop for...

capt. mike - 1-7-2004 at 04:52 PM

Neal Johns if he was broken down!!

see you in march at CL! really looking forward to it.

Anonymous - 1-7-2004 at 06:01 PM

Hey Tom, at least Ski didn't call you a "
Junior high kid drunk on gasoline fumes and booze. " as Baja Bus calls all that don't fit his idea of what a Baja afficianado should be.

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom
ski, I guess you dont get out of rosarito too much. Maybe I'm that guy that you point your finger at and call an idiot. Yea i race on my 4 stroke a little too fast and yea I've even been hurt down in baja. Hey sometimes I've drank soo much beer i passed out in a hammoc on the beach. But the next day I went fishing with my 70 year old dad, listened to jimmy buffet on the boat, and caught dorado all day long. So I guess what I'm getting at is that you are a pitiful, lonely person, that thinks they have some monopoly on the enjoyment of baja. 99% of the people I've run into (south of rosarito anyway) will do whatever it takes to help an amigo out, and thats the travler I am. So stay out of my way when I'm on the bike or heading to the bar, and I guess you want any help from this "idiot".

Just plain rude

Chris Holmstead - 1-7-2004 at 06:14 PM

Don't get his handle wrong if you post a reply to him personaly, if you do his only response will be, "You talking to me?"

So his respect (as his rant exhibits) extends only to his Mexicans.

Hasn't he heard that Baja starts at El Rosario. Living in Rosarito is like living in lower San Diego. No wonder he's angry; he lives in a place that's been a druken sufer's armpit for thirty years, and his expeditions probably aren't going that well. I smell desperation, resulting in a lash out at all of us Americans too dumb to pay him to show us what we could see on our own. :fire:

Those damn Mexicans

Family Guy - 1-7-2004 at 07:25 PM

On a recent side trip to Punta Chivato I was struck by a comment from a fellow gringo who pulled up on an atv with his son. I commented how beautiful the place was and he replied: "Yeah, no Mexicans."

I guess we all go to Baja for different reasons.

Anonymous - 1-7-2004 at 08:12 PM

The Tongue of the wise Treats Knowledge
Correctly but the Mouth of the fool Spouts out Folly. Proverbs 15.2

Since I am drunk,

Ski Baja - 1-7-2004 at 11:37 PM

after seeing some friends in Ensenada, all I can say is :lol:

Misunserstanding things on the boards

Ski Baja - 1-8-2004 at 10:08 AM

"Don't get his handle wrong if you post a reply to him personaly, if you do his only response will be, "You talking to me".
Chris, I said that on whichever post that was because you addressed it to BoB or something like that. I didn't mean that to be rude. I just didn't know if you were talking to me or not.
I think many of these wrestling matches that get started on here may be caused by misinterpreting what people are trying to get across. But, sometimes not ! :lol:

Anonymous - 1-8-2004 at 10:16 AM

A Fool Takes no pleasure in understanding but only in disclosing what is on his mind . Proverbs 18:2

Las tres Amigas

Ski Baja - 1-8-2004 at 10:28 AM

Great kids Family Guy. I guess that's where the name comes from ?

I haven't read every post in this thread...

flyfishinPam - 1-8-2004 at 04:25 PM

...so shoot me.

and I know the original post is full of generalizations but I can get the drift as I've had many of those same feelings.

The kicker is....if you spoke the Spanish lauguage and actually spent time with the locals, you'd be AMAZED at how they see us (gringos). Not all of us offend them but many do, and they are usually the same ones who offend me. Spanish in Baja. Learn it. Use it. You'll see this place with new eyes!

The weather

Ski Baja - 1-8-2004 at 05:17 PM

what's your weather like down there Pam? I'm headed that way soon.

Anonymous - 1-8-2004 at 08:03 PM

For the Waywardness of the Simpletons will Kill them,and the Careless ease of Fools will destroy them.

Proverbs 1:32

anonymous

Anonymous - 1-9-2004 at 10:53 AM

Anonymous is not Skeeter/Peter or Skeeter/Loreto. Could he be Skeeter/Preacher? Come on Skeet, talk to us.

You are Broken Record

JZ - 1-10-2004 at 01:15 AM

Get out of Rosarito if it bothers you so much. All the wishing in the world won't change this place. ****************

Most people on this board have the common sense not to stop between TJ and Ensenada. So, why do you keep this dicussing this area and its problems on this board.. It has no relavance.

[Edited on 11-1-2004 by M]

[Edited on 1-12-2004 by BajaNomad]

Markitos - 1-12-2004 at 10:27 AM

WOW o WOW
This is kinda like watching a 1st grade class, no wonder I like lonley beaches and sailing so much. Ya never realy hear the mexican people complain and nit pick this much. They just go about life and enjoy what comes about. And I might add they love those stupid drunkin gringos.
Fun to watch, laugh at ....and they spend alot of $