BajaNomad - Word for centavo-P-ncher

Word for centavo-P-ncher

Osprey - 7-22-2007 at 11:41 AM

Piojo

I’m not too proud to tell you that I use a thesaurus. I write short stories, books and articles for magazines, ezines, etc. With Google, Roget and Brittanica at hand you would think I could find the perfect word most of the time. Not this time. The English word has not yet been coined for this particular kind of character trait.
The word I have been searching for needs to describe the mind set displayed by those adults who must have a bargain in everything they purchase. Greed and Avarice describe another condition; those who must have wealth, those who are only happy when they have more than they need, more than they could possibly use, eat, drink, consume, utilize, enjoy.
Cheap doesn’t come close. It’s an adjective describing things, not people. A cheapskate is a miser. Stingy means someone who is unwilling to share what he has. Most of the time I hope my articles will not evoke “letters”. This time I’m hoping for letters. I hope I can read them; if there is a proper word out there, it’s in another language and I hope those Jews, Italians, Germans, etc, will get back to me.
It remains a mystery to me that we don’t already have a word close at hand. Surely we recognize the condition; Priceline and lots of other sales gimmicks thrive on the growing phenomenon. On a commercial services level setting your own price, naming the highest price you will pay comes close to the logic: “I’m only satisfied about the price if I think I’ve taken advantage of the seller”. The need to cheat the seller runs so deep that often the value of the thing or service takes a back seat to the necessary huge gap between what the buyer wanted and what these people will pay.

All you proud Anglophiles out there: before you begin to run your laundry list of English words I might have missed, please wait until I define, in broad terms, the characters who demonstrate the condition.
Allow me to eliminate those casual bargain-hunters who don’t fit the pattern. We all like a bargain. Please drop from the list those of us who pay retail most of time but seek out bargains when and where we can.
The millions of people I’m talking about are those who delight in finding an uninformed or distressed seller. These folks are unable to pay the asking price for anything — never have, never will. For example one of them might learn that a boat worth $20,000 on today’s market, in the region of the sale, in the visible and contractual state of condition equal to that value, is being sold by a person in monetary distress. The buyer discovers that for a quick cash sale the seller might accept $10,000. It is at this stage that our guy will offer $5,000. He makes it clear his offer is firm, shows the seller the cash, does not even flinch when the boat sells to another bargain hunter for $8,500.
By way of demonstration let me shine a light on some of my neighbors with the trait. This little scene could happen in any of a dozen or more garages in this little Mexican village. I stop by Fred or Bill’s to say hello, maybe share a beer. Fred is cleaning a gas generator with a solvent and a rag.
I said “New generator?”
“No. No. I bought this about six months ago in Santiago. Some old Mexican codger was sick, his kid got the word around, I went over there, picked this sucker up for $250. The new Hondas in this model are $2,200.”
“Great buy. Just what you needed for down here.”
Fred said “No, I got two others. Bigger, quieter. I’m just saving this one for some time when the storms hit, when the hotels need more juice. I can maybe unload the thing for $1,800 or so. Depends on how bad the storm was, how bad they need it.”
I suppose what sent me looking for the word was my brief encounter with a realty bargain hunter. Lots of gringos stop by my gate to ask directions, ask if I know of any good deals around here on homes or land. They are all looking for a bargain. This particular guy sticks in my mind.

He said he was from Canada, really liked our little village, wanted to buy a lot here, build a house or buy a little Mexican house like mine, fix it up the way I did. He wanted to know about land ownership. I told him there were several 1/4 acre lots in town for about $25,000 or so, some with an ocean view. I explained that the realty purchase process would cost him about $7,000 initially (Mexican purchase agreement, notario fees, honorarios, etc) and about $400 per year for the annual cost to maintain a bank trust. He just shook his head in disbelief, said he wasn’t interested in that kind of deal in Mexico.
Just for fun I told him I had a Mexican pal who had a nice lot with an ocean view, was just tired of the responsibilities, just wanted to dump it, get rid of it. I said “He’ll just sign the deed over to you, be done with it. No money involved. You can have it.”
He said “Do I have to pay fees?”
“Sure, I just told you, around $7,000 to get the bank trust, to know that it’s in trust for 50 years in your name with a Mexican bank, guaranteed by the bank and the government. The trust is renewable so you can pass it on if you like, or sell it, rent it, whatever.”
He said “No, no thanks. I’ll pass. See you later.”
While I was telling this story for months about a guy who was so cheap he wouldn’t take a piece of free land “he’d steal a hot stove, go back for the smoke” kind of guy, I missed the point. Without the distressed or uninformed seller there can be no joy. My joke implied that the seller would be better off without the property. No deal for these folks; no sad and bleeding seller crying in the night at his lose, no joy for my buyer. So, it turns out these folks could find a big gold nugget in a stream, never say a word about it. Pay 10% of the value for a wrist watch they don’t need, will probably never sell, leave the poor seller, the dumb bastard wondering how this slick guy got the better of them — now that’s a story worth the telling.
I asked a couple of my Mexican friends if there might be a word in Spanish for these people. They suggested piojoso. Not quite what I was after. A piojo is a louse, as in body louse. That would translate to lousy. When they say it they are referring to a mean, stingy person, clean or dirty. If I don’t get any positive feedback on this thing pretty soon, I’ll just have to make up a word. Putting a proper handle on these people, for me, would be just like tagging a big marlin, releasing it. Like a sign: “caught ya.”

oldlady - 7-22-2007 at 12:07 PM

Osprey,
You write well.
I use "exploiter"....sometimes. However, in less guarded moments, "blood-sucker" usually communicates the nuances well.

Diver - 7-22-2007 at 12:23 PM

You could call it "DAVE".
Nothing to do with the Dave of deli fame but rather with my grandfather, David, who, upon surviving a triple bypass operation, went for his check-up and tried to give the doctor $!5,000 cash for a $30,000 doctor bill.
The doctor took the cash and Papa Dave lived another 30 years.
The stories I could tell ...... if I could write like Osprey !

.

Oso - 7-22-2007 at 01:35 PM

Seahawk, you may be looking for Baratero (a).

This is, as you say, someone who never pays retail, asking price etc., someone who actively enjoys bargaining, the sport of haggling for the competitive thing itself.

It is not necessarily the same as Codo*= cheap, stingy, miserly. A baratero is not afraid to spend money, he just wants to be sure he gets the best deal possible.

*In Mexico, people from Monterrey, NL have this stereotyped reputation, often silently indicated by rubbing one's elbow.

DENNIS - 7-22-2007 at 01:42 PM

Osprey ....

A few words come to mind. All, I'm sure, have reservations and probably won't encompass the feeling which you seek in a word. In fact, some human traits would be ill-served by identity of a one-word title. But, that's something else.
"Smart", comes to mind when trying to catagorize a bargain hunter although, it probably isn't always a trait of the buyer so, that one's out.

How about thrifty? No, that won't work either. It most often applys when shopping at a certain drug store.

OK....This has to be it, "Frugal." What's wrong with that one? Not strong enough? You're probably right.

Well, Osprey, I don't think there's a word for it. In fact, I think the "it" in question is a condition, more closely related to an Obsessive Compulsive Disorder than a term from a merchandising text book. I believe the drive to "chisel" and control a transaction is more an emotional need than financial. But, what do I know? I'm still buying Pacifico beer in Mexico when I could be buying it for less in the states.

The answer to your question could be closer to your home than you know. If you're going to a friends house, as you say, and sharing a beer, that shows definite clinical presentation of an Obsessive Compulsive stingey host. The world's full of them. Tell him to fight his disorder and give you your own beer. It'll take him a long way down the road of recovery.

Oso - 7-22-2007 at 01:49 PM

As for the ethnic thing, many have a reputation for stinginess but I believe none truly compare with my Scottish ancestors:

Two Scots are sitting by the burn, fishing. One pulls out his well-worn briar pipe and asks the other, "Do ye have a match?"
The other grumbles a bit, pulls out a book of paper matches, carefully tears off one match and hands it to him.

The first Scot smiles to himself cannily and makes a show of searching about in his sporran. "Umm,"he mutters,"I seem to be out of tobacco."

"Then," says the second Scot, reaching out his hand, "Ye'll nae be needin' the match."

DianaT - 7-22-2007 at 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Well, Osprey, I don't think there's a word for it. In fact, I think the "it" in question is a condition, more closely related to an Obsessive Compulsive Disorder than a term from a merchandising text book. I believe the drive to "chisel" and control a transaction is more an emotional need than financial.

Osprey---love that story and your description. I think I agree with Dennis on this one as far as it being a "condition". But I would love for there to be a word for this---go for it Osprey, name this condition.

Thanks from one of your loyal fans
Diane

Russ - 7-22-2007 at 02:54 PM

Jeeze Osprey, you used a whole bottle of ink just to ask about one word? I read every word. Please do NOT apply this "condition" to your writing. Ever!

Pescador - 7-22-2007 at 03:12 PM

Baratero comes close but misses the essence of the trait. There are ethnic stereotypes that come close, some of my Jewish friends hold this trait to be held in high esteem and use adjectives like thrifty, wise, and perceptive, but I think the real essence comes from Eric Berne's Book , "Games People Play", in which he describes that personality as someone who is trying desperately to feel some level of power in life and can only express it by constantly "getting the upper hand" in all business transactions. So that would make the whole thing more motivated by lack of self esteem and overcompensating, than an internal need to conserve and take your dollars as far as they can go.

sylens - 7-22-2007 at 03:29 PM

can't wait to see how this one ends. osprey, beautiful, again. :bounce:

like jdtrotter, i say "go for it." give us a word :tumble:

it just occurred to me, you might call it "sandra." my sister-in- law takes great pride at christmas, when she is presenting her gifts, to announce that she paid "just a quarter," or "just fifty cents," or whatever other minute amount for the gift at a yard sale. it is a matter of tremendous accomplishment for her.

it is embarrassing to watch :?:

uh oh. and by the way, we are all heavily scottish. tighter than bark on a tree :lol:

Osprey - 7-22-2007 at 03:43 PM

I'm aware of the Scottish thing. An old Scot walked to town to the drug store, asked the clerk the price of a prophylactic. One dollar. He laid down a used one full of tears and holes and asked how much to repair it. Fifty cents. He said "I'll get back to you" and left. Returned the next day and said "the boys in the regiment want it repaired".

Codo etc

tehag - 7-22-2007 at 03:49 PM

Quote:

from Eric Berne's Book , "Games People Play", in which he describes that personality as someone who is trying desperately to feel some level of power in life and can only express it by constantly "getting the upper hand" in all business transactions. So that would make the whole thing more motivated by lack of self esteem and overcompensating, than an internal need to conserve and take your dollars as far as they can go.

Sounds like Trump with a capital T.

[Edited on 7-22-2007 by tehag]

CaboRon - 7-22-2007 at 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Osprey
I'm aware of the Scottish thing. An old Scot walked to town to the drug store, asked the clerk the price of a prophylactic. One dollar. He laid down a used one full of tears and holes and asked how much to repair it. Fifty cents. He said "I'll get back to you" and left. Returned the next day and said "the boys in the regiment want it repaired".

Bedman - 7-22-2007 at 06:59 PM

Here you go Osprey......there's an old Yiddish word..... "Goniff" ........Not sure of the spelling (not Jewish) and means nasty, thief, scrooge, peckerhead, slime bucket that would sell his own mother for a buck. Of course that was interpreted for me 30 years ago by a little old man in the garment industry. I still use it sparingly.

Bedman

Osprey - 7-22-2007 at 07:22 PM

Steve, a goniff is a thief -- pure and simple in Yiddish. I was born Irish Catholic on Miami Beach when all the people in my area were Jewish, spoke a lot of Yiddish. I was called "Jake the Greener" as a toddler cause an old Jewish man bent over my pram to give me a kiss, lost his full wallet, got it back days later -- a Greener is The Money Man.

danaeb - 7-22-2007 at 07:30 PM

Is there an autobiography in your future? You're a wonderful writer. I wish you'd reveal your identity so we could read your published pieces.

Russ - 7-22-2007 at 07:44 PM

So is that you pen name, Jake Greener? I guess I could find you now if I googled you.

Dave - 7-22-2007 at 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bedman
Here you go Osprey......there's an old Yiddish word..... "Goniff" ........Not sure of the spelling (not Jewish) and means nasty, thief, scrooge, peckerhead, slime bucket that would sell his own mother for a buck. Of course that was interpreted for me 30 years ago by a little old man in the garment industry. I still use it sparingly.

Bedman

Goniff simply means thief.

A mean spirited, nasty, revolting, dishonest, unscrupulous, corrupt person is a paskudnyak.

DENNIS - 7-22-2007 at 07:59 PM

danaeb ......

How right you are. Osprey can hide behind his feathered pseudonym no longer. He, in the interest of full-circle artistic appreciation, must molt, shed his downy disguise and step forward into the bright incubator lights of noteriety and fame.
Out of the nest and into your lives, we give you----- George.

Take a bow, Birdman of BCS.

Hate to be the bearer of bad news but...

Dave - 7-22-2007 at 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Osprey
I was called "Jake the Greener" as a toddler cause an old Jewish man bent over my pram to give me a kiss, lost his full wallet, got it back days later -- a Greener is The Money Man.

A greener is a rube...one who is taken advantage of...an immigrant not yet savy in the ways of the "new world"...country boy lost in the big city.

You were punked. Harmless fun I suppose. :biggrin:

DENNIS - 7-22-2007 at 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
You were punked. Harmless fun I suppose. :biggrin:

Unless, of course, you were doing thirty days in county.

Oso - 7-22-2007 at 08:30 PM

Hey, I was not born ON Miami Beach, but in Miami at Jackson Memorial and was initially mistaken and switched with a Jewish kid. I wasn't there long enough to lose any skin over it, so to speak. As my mom said; I was only there for lunch until they figured out the mistake. It could explain certain affinities but probably means nothing.

DENNIS - 7-22-2007 at 08:42 PM

Oso ....

Just there for lunch? Like the old saying goes, "Never eat tri-tip in a maternity ward." Especially in Miami.

craiggers - 7-23-2007 at 03:39 AM

The word scrooge comes to mind. I realize Scrooge is a Charles Dickens character but I'll bet it been add to websters meaning pretty much what you decribe.

CHIPOSO

BFS - 7-23-2007 at 06:41 AM

I have heard this one in southern Oaxaca often and now I use it everywhere!
Aq

Bruce R Leech - 7-23-2007 at 07:46 AM

Osprey I think the condition you describe is very noticeable in about 70% of the foreigners that live here in Baja Ca. and sur. for some reason the lifestyle here attracts them. and I dont think it can be described in one word. It will take the whole list above to describe this kind of person. :light:

the Mexican peple call them codos which translates into something like cheapskate. :lol:

[Edited on 7-23-2007 by Bruce R Leech]

Iflyfish - 7-23-2007 at 11:16 AM

Speaking of stereotypes I often begin a companiable negotiation in Mexico by pointing at myself and saying "total chiena", that usually gets a laugh and begins the inevitable bickering on a good note.

Iflyfish

rdrrm8e - 7-23-2007 at 11:21 AM

"Cheapalero"

"Pennypince"

Pescador - 7-23-2007 at 11:46 AM

Codo is referring to a general tightwad and is usually demonstrated by the Mexicans by holding a fist and banging on the elbow (codo) with the other fist. This implies that the person is holding on so tight to his money in his fist that when you hit him on the elbow with a rock he won't let go. In some cases they even refer to needing dos piedras or two rocks to hit the elbow which signifies a double tightwad.

DENNIS - 7-23-2007 at 02:38 PM

Hey Osprey..........

You have a habit of starting a bonfire of discourse then, you go into a coma. Are you still with us or, are we talking to ourselves?

Osprey - 7-23-2007 at 03:03 PM

Dennis, I'm a fast writer but a slow thinker. I'm thinking. I'm thinking.

DENNIS - 7-23-2007 at 03:07 PM

Well, as long as you think you're thinking, that's good.....I think.

Halboo - 7-24-2007 at 07:54 AM

Skinflint is the word that comes to mind.
I'm picturing a Snidely Whiplash type.

bacquito - 7-24-2007 at 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by craiggers
The word scrooge comes to mind. I realize Scrooge is a Charles Dickens character but I'll bet it been add to websters meaning pretty much what you decribe.

I believe craiggers definition meets your requirements. Perhaps a person you describe in your interesting article could be called a "Scrooger"-a new word!

Nick

Skipjack Joe - 7-24-2007 at 10:34 AM

Prior to starting our cross country trip my friend bought a loaf of rye bread and hard boiled a dozen eggs. As I pulled up to fast food places along highway 80 to get a bite to eat Nick would always decline and sit in the front seat chowing down on his eggs and bread. It was a hot august and somewhere near Illinois the bread started to mold. Nick deftly removed the bad sections and continued his regimen.

Eventually we got to Vermont and Nick met up with his girlfriend. We spent a fun day together and decided to go out for dinner. Nick ordered a sumptuous meal and insisted on paying hers as well. I couldn't believe my eyes. If she only knew what he had just been through, I thought to myself.

Cypress - 7-24-2007 at 11:15 AM

Some things are worth an extra peso/dollar or two, some things aren't. :yes:

Priorities. :bounce:

DENNIS - 7-24-2007 at 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
Some things are worth an extra peso/dollar or two, some things aren't. :yes:

Priorities. :bounce:

It doesn't seem to me that Osprey's elusive character is looking for a bargain as much as he/she is striving for control.
That's what he has on his hands here. A freakin control freak.

Osprey - 7-24-2007 at 11:53 AM

So far Skinflint comes close but it's not quite mean enough. I'll keep working at it. In the meantime more food for thought ......

Rich Gene, Poor Gene

Medical science is making breakthroughs in identifying human genes. They have identified genes which tell us if the human who grew the tissue, blood, bone will have a propensity for corpulence, a small proclivity for early onset diabetes, has blue eyes, had parents from Asia (major or minor).
I don’t have money for grants. The best I can do is sit on the sidelines and wait for news. The big news, the thing I need validation on will undoubtedly come from some famous lab or doctor. All the networks will carry it:

RICH GENE FOUND

I call this skewed news. They cannot find a gene that makes you rich. As usual, the media misreads scientific discovery -- it’s a language thing. Later, when they figure out what they should have reported, the header might read:

SPENDER GENE IDENTIFIED

That will be the news I’ve been waiting for. Because there are googles of combinations in the human helix the process is time-consuming and complex. For studies involving those people who can and do give blood or tissue to the process it is just a very simple matter of matching genes to tissue containing the thing you are trying to identify.
No rocket science in this part. The fat gene is found, over and over, in the blood samples taken from fat people. It is not found, or found in smaller quantities in skinny people. That’s how they identified the genes that cause diabetes, blue eyes, etc. Finding the spender gene took a little more time because big spenders didn’t want to give blood -- they didn’t want to be bothered. It would mean taking time out of their day to go to some clinic somewhere, share, if even for a few minutes, a waiting room with the great unwashed, feel the incredible pain of a pinprick to the finger.
They had little trouble finding donors who did not have the gene. These folks found the visit to the clinic a pleasant diversion from a day filled with drives from one garage sale to another or clipping supermarket coupons for discounts on coffee, aspirin and Depends.

The part that interests me is the way in which the medical scientists proved their hypotheses. With the fat versus skinny people it would just be a matter of changing the diets, the exercise regimen, the sleep habits of the people to prove the condition was in the genes, not solely controlled by environment. Before they could release their findings they would have to have incontrovertible proof -- a credible proportion of skinny people would have to remain skinny after less sleep, less food, the same amount of or more exercise than before the examination. The fatties would have to retain more fatty tissue than one could reasonably expect when they are deprived of calories, made to exercise more, etc.
In the spender versus cheapskate people they would have to make money available to those without and make paupers of the rich. The concept is as old as the theater. Books, movies, videos have depicted the foibles of those caught up in this switch -- from Robin Hood to Rodney Dangerfield we learned how quirky we are when it comes to money and how we spend it.
Let’s look at our differences. If we look at temporary living accommodations we see just how deep the gene goes. There are tens of thousands of four and five star hotels spread across the globe. A single night’s lodging runs from $500 to $25,000 (or more) in the finer hotels. There are hundreds of thousands of economy class motels and hotels around the world that advertise rooms from $60 to $90 per night.
What about food? Well-heeled gourmands everywhere think nothing of spending $300 to $500 for a dinner for two at fine restaurants found wherever the wealthy gather. At the same time people with the means to pay as much, spend no more than $20 for a modest dinning experience for that occasional nice dinner out.
The bank account balance has very little to do with how the money is spent. I believe science will learn that some genes hard-wire a profound and ineluctable necessity in some people. Those with spender genes could more easily change the color of their eyes than buy clothes from Good Will or food from Wendy’s. Bald men without the spender genes could grow a luxuriant mane of blond hair overnight before they could pay $130 for a plate of squab and foie gras.
Grossly overweight people probably took the news about the fat genes with a smile; maybe cheated a little on the diet. Perhaps scrawny folks took another lap around the park with a guilt-free smile.
The news release to come may be good news for everyone -- a small profit peak for the better restaurants, bigger crowds at swap meets. We all carry around way too much guilt. I say bring on more good news about genes and how they control all the things we do.

After the spender gene release the best I can hope for is news about a newly discovered, very dominant gene found in some men over forty. It inhibits the carrier from doing yard work, especially weeding.

DENNIS - 7-24-2007 at 12:14 PM

Osprey.........

If the quest would be to isolate the behavior genes, they should be searching for the designer of "True Desire." Having one's desire under one's control would trump all urges. Good and bad decisions would be a matter of conscious selection.

Martyman - 7-24-2007 at 12:31 PM

I don't believe were taking about thieves. How about lowballer?

bacquito - 7-24-2007 at 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bacquito

Quote:

Originally posted by craiggers
The word scrooge comes to mind. I realize Scrooge is a Charles Dickens character but I'll bet it been add to websters meaning pretty much what you decribe.

I believe craiggers definition meets your requirements. Perhaps a person you describe in your interesting article could be called a "Scrooger"-a new word!

and a person having been taken advantage of by a "scrooger" can be called a person "scrooged".

Halboo - 7-24-2007 at 06:41 PM

There's always Miserly..............