BajaNomad - TJ Hijack ...details

TJ Hijack ...details

rdrrm8e - 9-5-2007 at 01:31 PM

This is a C&P from Surfer Magazine

Online Exclusives Industry News Pro Tour OP OneWorld

I'll Never Go to Baja Again
They were looking forward to surfing the uncrowded south swell. A pending protest at the border on Friday was sure to slow down the normal throngs of south bound surfers.
by
Scott Bass
Senior Online Editor At-large
Surfer magazine
Scott@surfermag.com
Comment on this article - Surfermag.com forums.

Baja at dusk. It should be an exciting time, but not a life threatening one.

It was 4 a.m. Friday morning, August 31. Duke, Walt and Roger, three buddies from North San Diego County, were headed down to Mexico keen on surfing the predicted south swell. Their destination: San Carlos, Baja California for a Labor Day holiday weekend filled with surfing, kite surfing and relaxation. This was trip they had done many times before. Duke and Roger especially, having grownup in the Solana Beach/Del Mar area

"The masked man stood there, with the gun pointed at my chest, both hands on the grip. I was now looking up, maybe five feet below his feet."

Combined, the three men have been traveling into Baja for over 60 years. Duke and Roger speak fluent Spanish--Roger with a slight gringo accent; Duke with the native tongue. They were looking forward to surfing the uncrowded south swell. A pending protest at the border on Friday was sure to slow down the normal throngs of south bound surfers.

They drove in two trucks. A Honda Ridgeline loaded down with three surfboards, four kite boards, six kites, a dirt bike and all the camping gear and food to keep them happy and fed through Tuesday-as they didn't want to get stuck in the returning border traffic on Labor Day Monday. Roger and Duke were in the Honda. Behind them followed their buddy Walt in a Toyota Tundra loaded down with five surfboards another three kites, two kite boards and more camping gear. Oh, and they had some beer, margarita mix and Hornitos Tequila.

- advertisement -

They crossed the border at 4:30 a.m. and preceded toward the toll road, driving along the well-worn road that hugs the border and then climbs the steep hill toward the Tijuana beaches, the bullring and coastal destinations further south. It is the road that everyone who has ever traveled into Northern Baja has been on. And the guys were fired up and optimistic as they followed the road south and descended less than half a mile from the USA/Mexico border. Then the blue lights hit their rear view mirror. Cops.

Tijuana police escort a young man.

They were being pulled over. "This stuff comes with the territory," explained Roger. "Duke and I didn't feel the least bit apprehensive; pay the cop for whatever bullchit reason he comes up with and move on. Good surf awaited." The three surfers knew the drill; this area is notorious for the $40 Mexican cop shakedown. Duke, who was driving the Honda Ridgline and leading the two-truck caravan handed all his cash to Roger--except for $40 to pay-off the cop.

"Open the door, " the cop said to Roger as he rolled down the passenger window. A handgun pointed at Roger's eyes. "Open the f-ing door," the cop said a second time as he slammed the gun against Roger's right temple, reached in and pulled the door open.

As this unfolded, Walt, in the truck behind them and doing his duty as back driver in the caravan, pulled over behind Duke's Honda Ridgeline and watched in the still, dusky light. 'It immediately looked strange to me," explained Walt. "The cops came out of their truck with their guns drawn. My first thought is that they were looking for drugs. I thought this wasn't going to be a situation where we get out of it with a bribe."

Within a minute there were two other cops/thugs all over Walt, demanding that he get out of the truck, before simply reaching in and unlocking the door.

In the meantime Roger, the passenger in the front vehicle, was being dragged out of the truck by his shirt at gunpoint. The Mexican carjacker was wearing a cut-off black wetsuit ski mask. "I offered the guy my wallet, " explained Roger. "At this point I knew this was serious and I offered him everything we had, the car our money, everything."

While this transpired Duke the driver of the Ridgleine also had a gun to his head and was being lead out of the car.

With a black semi-automatic gun to his head, Roger was led to the roadside guardrail by the masked man and into a dark, open lot with a formidable cliff 30 yards away.

Again Roger tried to reason with carjacker. "Take my money," he said and handed him the $200 Duke had given him earlier. The car jacker directed Roger further into the darkness. Roger was getting closer to the cliff and deeper into the darkness. Again he tried to fend off the attacker with money. "I reached into my second pocket and threw a wad of cash at him," explained Roger. "The $240 I had for the trip. It fell to the ground and the attacker looked down, grabbed a wad full and left the stray twenty dollar bills. He looked down at the remaining bills--$60 or $80 dollars-then looked at me, jerked me forward again. He wasn't interested."

The fruits are very tempting. But will you go to Baja?

Again Roger pleaded with the man to leave him alone. The attacker's dark brown eyes stared at Roger and then twitched. "I think he was high-- on coke or something," explained the Roger. "His eyes were twitching. The man then continued to lead me further away from the others, into the darkness."

All sorts of thoughts raced through Roger's head. "I wondered if I should run. Would he shoot me? I was living in the moment. Instinct drove me, for better or for the worse."

At the edge of the 100-foot cliff the man stopped Roger and stared him down. Below was darkness--a 100-foot cliff, trash and debris. Roger stood facing the street, his back against the pending overhang.

Meanwhile Walt, in the truck behind Duke and Roger, was dealing with his own nightmare. "One of the Mexicans jumped in next to me pushed his c-cked gun into my face pushing my head onto the dashboard," explained Walt. The cops or carjackers or Federales --nobody is really sure what they were or are--demanded that Walt get out. "The thug on the passenger side grabbed my shirt and put me over the road-side guardrail," explained Walt. The Mexican forced Walt's head over the guardrail and c-cked the gun against the back of his head. Walt was waiting to die. Walt glanced up and out of the corner of his eye saw Roger down on his knees over by the cliff with a gun pointing on him.

"That's when I thought, 'I'm not going to let this guy shoot me here,'" explained Walt. "It wasn't a heroic action by any means. I just wanted to move out, so I pushed myself up off the guardrail and started walking toward the big ravine that divides the USA from Mexico. That's really when I thought, this is it, my life was over." Walt figured the Mexican thug was going to shoot him in the back. After five feet or so, and without hearing from the man holding a gun to his back, Walt started jogging in a zigzag motion toward the cliff, hoping that if the attacker did start firing his gun, perhaps he would miss him. His plan was to jump off the cliff; at least he had half a chance that way.

The Nissan Frontier cuts directly in front of the taxi, slams on its brakes and skids to a stop in front of the Americans in the taxi, blocking it from going forward. "We all started screaming "Go! Go! Go!," explained Roger. "It was a scene right of the movie 'Traffic.'"

The masked attacker that held Roger at gunpoint ordered him to get on his hands and knees and crawl down the cliff. It wasn't a straight drop, but more of a steep incline. Roger groveled down until he found a ledge. He stood and looked up at the mask.

"It was dark, but I could see. My eyes had adjusted to the darkness. It would be light in about an hour,' explained Roger. "The masked man stood there, with the gun pointed at my chest, both hands on the grip. I was now looking up, maybe five feet below his feet."

The mask looked to his left as if awaiting a signal from the other thugs. He again stared down Roger and again turned to his left. This time he took his right hand off the handle and pulled the barrel forward and then back, c-cking the gun. He inserted a bullet. The gun was now pointed down directly at Roger's chest. The man in the mask turned and shot the gun, just above horizon towards the street. He said something, which Roger couldn't make out and jogged slowly towards the vehicles.

Roger looked over to his left and saw Walt hunched over some twenty yards away. The two saw each other, said nothing. After waiting 30 seconds, maybe a minute, Roger and Walt ascended the cliff. "This cliff is a big cliff, and it's right on the border and as it got light we could see America on one side and we're in Mexico," explained Roger. "We were just sort of freaking out. It was surreal. They could have easily killed us and no one would have known. The two walked up to their friend Duke and the three said nothing. They were in shock. But at least it was over.

Or so they thought.

There was van across the street, an older model van. Beat up. Rickety. Broken down. The kind of vehicle you often see in Mexico. There next to the van was its owner, an old Mexican man. The three surfers yelled out to the old man in Spanish and he acknowledged that he saw the entire ambush. "He said he was scared for us, but that he could do nothing because of his age," explained Roger. "We ran over to him and the man opened up the sliding door of his van and Duke and I immediately jumped in, but Walt was adamant about not getting in this guys' van. "The last thing I wanted to do was get in some strangers old van," explained Walt. "It didn't feel right."

Walt eventually acquiesced and reluctantly hopped in the van. The old man closed the van door and the three surfers looked at each other anxiously like, 'was this a good idea?' Their sole focus was to get to the border, and this vehicle was going to get them there.

At this point Roger notices that there is a young man in his 20's sitting in the passenger seat. "The fact that a younger guy was in the passenger seat which sort of freaked us a bit," explained Walt. "After getting carjacked at gunpoint by Federales we didn't really trust anyone."

The old man turned over the engine in his van and it immediately started up. "I thought it was supposed to be broken," explained Roger. "So I start thinking was this guy involved. It was very weird."

The old man, the three surfers and the van start rolling down the hill, with the USA on their left and the sun rising brightly. At the bottom of the hill where the street next to the border fence flattens out, and less than a half mile from the carjacking, a Tijuana Police officer had pulled over a truck. A flat bed truck. The kind of flatbed truck that you tow other trucks with.

The three surfers tell the old man to stop his van. "We got out of the van to tell the cop about our carjacking incident," explained Walt. The cop then did something rather unusual. He picked up his cell phone and made a call. He didn't use his official police communications radio installed on his police truck. "I didn't think much about it at the time, but thinking back on it, it seems strange," explained Roger.

The three American surfers asked the officer to take them immediately to the border to file a report of the incident. "The cop tells us to get in the back of his police truck and we thought we were going to the border," explains Roger.

But to the surfers dismay the policeman turns onto Avenida Revolucion into the seediest part of Tijuana and pulls over. The surfers demand that he take them straight to the border. The cop refuses. He suggests they get some cash (Duke still had a hidden credit card) from the ATM machine and hire a taxi to take them to the border. By this time the surfers are nervous, restless, and paranoid. They ask the TJ police officer to please file report on the incident but he refuses telling them that the incident happened outside of his jurisdiction.

Not what you want to see in the morning,

Fed up with the lack of regard for their situation, the surfers climb out of the cop's truck and start walking toward the ATM machine so they can get cash for a taxi to the border. They spot another TJ police officer walking the street beat. It's 5:30am on Avenida Revolucion in Tijuana and all sorts of sketchy people are around. hoars. Street people. Thugs. Drunks. The cop is on patrol to keep some sense of order. She is genuinely kind and concerned for the three Americans, and she directs Duke to the ATM kiosk.

Duke walks into the ATM machine kiosk and immediately two guys follow him into the ATM machine. "I was very nervous about it," said Walt. "The woman cop ran over to Duke and basically guarded him from these two guys."

With cab fare in hand and their focus still on the getting to the USA the surfers, with the help of the cop, hail a taxi. The women cop tells the cab driver to bring the Americans to the border and to not stop for anyone. "That part was little odd," explained Walt. "It was like she knew something was going to happen."

Walt, Duke and Roger got in the taxi and headed towards the USA, maybe three miles away from the border. "The cab took us on a one way street toward the border. Not unusual, I don't think," explained Walt. "Then I hear a loud truck barreling down the street behind us. It's going like 60, maybe 70 MPH."

The Nissan Frontier cuts directly in front of the taxi, slams on its brakes and skids to a stop in front of the Americans in the taxi, blocking it from going forward. "We all started screaming "Go! Go! Go!," explained Roger. "It was scene right of the movie 'Traffic.'"

Then another vehicle, a VW Tourig, loaded up with four Mexicans, screeches up behind the taxi and boxes it in from behind. The cab couldn't move. All three surfers are screaming at the cab driver to move out.

Serendipitously, the driver positioned the cab in a manner so that she could escape from the two pursuing vehicles and the taxi bolted full speed to the border.

Carjacked and kidnapped and contracted for death, at this point the three American Surfers were completely spun. The would-be kidnappers pursued, but there were other cars around by this time as the commute across to the USA was filling up traffic.

They paid the taxi driver and bolted a hundred yards or so to the pedestrian crossing. They attempted to tell another Mexican police officer but again, no help. They crossed the border. They called 911. They called their wives. They were safe at last.

In hindsight Duke, Walt and Roger believe the masked carjacker was a police officer. According to the three, that may explain why he wore a mask and the other carjackers did not.

Another interesting note: According to the surfers, the carjackers all spoke fine English, with barely a trace of an Hispanic accent. The carjacking was very professional, and went down with a strategic polish one might see in the military. "These guys were pros, " explains Walt. "Their guns were drawn and they were on us fast. Even if we had a gun, there is no way we could have acted."

Mexico has always been a scary place. According to one report, more journalists have died in Mexico than in Iraq. It's the Wild West. It is not safe. "I'll never drive into Mexico again. I've been surfing in northern Baja for over 20 years and I'll never go back," explained Roger. "There is nobody that cares about you. Nobody. You are all alone and the bad guys are the good guys and the good guys...well there aren't any."

honda tom - 9-5-2007 at 02:03 PM

Im crossing tonite at 1am. I dont think I will pull over for anything till the toll booth, after reading that.
I have a friend whos info is sometimes shaky.... he tells me that some kind of statement has been made by the chief of police or the govenor of baja norte that no american citizen is to be pulled over in that zone. anyone heard anything like that?

it would be nice to get it in writting!

rdrrm8e - 9-5-2007 at 02:08 PM

I don't think these cops are reading the chief's memos.

I read that same story about the "ticket free zone" in Gringo Gazette in may or june I think. I haven't seen a cop in that area since.

vandenberg - 9-5-2007 at 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom
Im crossing tonite at 1am. I dont think I will pull over for anything till the toll booth, after reading that.

After all that and you are crossing into TJ at 1 in the morning :?:

Must like to live dangerously

Somewhere in my head I got another word for that :?:

CaboRon - 9-5-2007 at 02:16 PM

Honda Tom,

After all that's been written here about driving at night in baja, and expecially on the toll road, won't you please reconsider and leave at 8am instead ?

Just a friendly word,

CaboRon

rdrrm8e - 9-5-2007 at 02:22 PM

Hey CaboRon..I live in Anaheim

rts551 - 9-5-2007 at 02:54 PM

reads like fiction... fiction from a very poor rag... but then I don't have to cross in TJ either

bacquito - 9-5-2007 at 03:12 PM

Good Grief- I'll try to avoid crossing at night!

DanO - 9-5-2007 at 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom
I have a friend whos info is sometimes shaky.... he tells me that some kind of statement has been made by the chief of police or the govenor of baja norte that no american citizen is to be pulled over in that zone. anyone heard anything like that?

Oh, they're pulling people over, at least in the daylight. (After reading this story, BTW, my personal preference not to drive anywhere south of the border on pavement is now a personal rule. Fiction or not, I figure it's better to be safe than sorry.) On Monday afternoon they had a speed trap set up under the bridge at the bottom of the big hill, just past the turnoff to Playas. Two motorcycle cops with radar guns pointed up the hill, with a third waving people over to the side for their tickets. I saw at least one car pulled over with U.S. plates. BTW, they had another highway cop with radar pulling people over at La Mision, at the bottom of the downgrade past La Fonda, last Friday.

oldhippie - 9-5-2007 at 03:23 PM

according to the original post

"Another interesting note: According to the surfers, the carjackers all spoke fine English, with barely a trace of an Hispanic accent."

Well that leaves out anybody born and raised in Tijuana or any part of Mexico for that matter. How many Mexicans have you met that speak fine English without an accent? How many Americans have you met that speak fine Spanish without an accent for that matter?

If this story is true, and I REALLT DOUBT IT, then it must have been people raised in the United States doing the dirty deeds. Well, then, maybe it is true.

Taco de Baja - 9-5-2007 at 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom

I have a friend whos info is sometimes shaky.... he tells me that some kind of statement has been made by the chief of police or the govenor of baja norte that no american citizen is to be pulled over in that zone. anyone heard anything like that?

Tell that to the polite cop who pulled me over on the 18th just before the Playas exit.... :rolleyes:

oldhippie - 9-5-2007 at 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Taco de Baja

Quote:

Originally posted by honda tom

I have a friend whos info is sometimes shaky.... he tells me that some kind of statement has been made by the chief of police or the govenor of baja norte that no american citizen is to be pulled over in that zone. anyone heard anything like that?

Tell that to the polite cop who pulled me over on the 18th just before the Playas exit.... :rolleyes:

I heard that rumor too and I didn't see many cops on the road, I travel it a couple of times a week, until the army checkpoint was removed. They're there now. Like I said in another thread, I was pulled over for speeding, which I was, and the cop very politely gave me a warning and let me go.

But, I think we will start taking a cab to and from la Coahuila on our occasional late night forays into the dark side. :cool:

I suppose it could be recent deportees raised with American values getting even. That would make sense.

[Edited on 9-5-2007 by oldhippie]

rts551 - 9-5-2007 at 03:49 PM

Keep spreading this story. the more people that stay north. the better it is for me.

DANO...."my personal preference not to drive anywhere south of the border on pavement is now a personal rule". Does this mean no more BAJA?

mtgoat666 - 9-5-2007 at 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rdrrm8e

Combined, the three men have been traveling into Baja for over 60 years.

A first-person version of the story is online here:
http://www.surfline.com/surfnews/surfwire.cfm?id=10923

Almost the same words, so looks like a creative writing exercise, various drafts floating around, experimenting with writing in first and third person, perhaps?

Anyhoo, the guys had 60 pretty dumb years of travel experience to have never learned about driving at nite.

DENNIS - 9-5-2007 at 05:27 PM

Went through the area where the military checkpoint was, before the entrance to Playas, today at 3:30 PM. Two bubble-headed bike cops had a car pulled over. One negotiating through the passenger side window, the other watching oncoming traffic.

BajaNomad - 9-5-2007 at 05:37 PM

Here's the surfermag.com link:
http://surfermag.com/features/onlineexclusives/carjackedmexi...

woody with a view - 9-5-2007 at 05:55 PM

made it down and back without anything worse than a sunburn and noodle arms from the RELENTLESS set waves.

bajabound2005 - 9-5-2007 at 06:50 PM

Sure hope they bought Mex insurance and cleared it through the lienholders on those loaded vehicles before leaving the USA...

wakemall - 9-5-2007 at 07:59 PM

I always cross at 0300 to 0430 pulling a boat. What would happen if you did not stop until you hit the toll booths. Kind of hard to stop a big truck and boat with a small car. Not scared of anything other than bullets?!?!?!!?!?!

How many people cross the border at this time and get attacked? Less than 1%... Flip somebody off in LA and see what happens.

DO not know what to think...

fdt - 9-5-2007 at 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oldhippie
Well that leaves out anybody born and raised in Tijuana or any part of Mexico for that matter. How many Mexicans have you met that speak fine English without an accent? How many Americans have you met that speak fine Spanish without an accent for that matter?

Who are you asking? I personaly know many, many of both.

xiv015 - 9-5-2007 at 08:46 PM

Makes my story about getting pulled over on that hill by the border sound like wining the lottery. I have to agree with rts551 though, reads like fiction.

capn.sharky - 9-5-2007 at 08:49 PM

It may read like fiction to some of you, but what about all of the other accounts written in the past two or three years on this site? I, for one, am taking this very serious. No longer will I drive through TJ in the dark hours---coming or going. I don't have a lot of years left, but I want to live them to the fullest. Thank you for letting us know about this incident. Frankly, it scared the crap out of me. We also need to remember, the Mexicans aren't just real happy with our country right now. Building fences, sending illegals home without their children and shooting a few is not the best way to treat our neighbors to the south. On the other hand, we do need to keep terrorists out of our country. I am sorry for all of you that have had to go through anything like this. My heart would not have taken the stress of having a gun put to my head. Not that it would do a lot of good, but I hope that Fonatur and the government gets this as it will definately hurt turisom in Mexico. Right now Bagdad may be safer than Tijuana.

Bruce R Leech - 9-5-2007 at 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajabound2005
Sure hope they bought Mex insurance and cleared it through the lienholders on those loaded vehicles before leaving the USA...

Insurance wont pay anything if you don't file a report in the jurisdiction where the problem occurred.

bajaguy - 9-5-2007 at 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by capn.sharky
.......Not that it would do a lot of good, but I hope that Fonatur and the government gets this as it will definately hurt turisom in Mexico........

Hit the nail on the head, Cap'n. If it affects the economy in TJ, something will be done. It's all related to $$$$$$$

JZ - 9-5-2007 at 10:40 PM

Captain Sharky has about the only sensable post on this thread. I can't believe the rest of you are brushing this off so easily. It should terrify you. And don't think it could only happen when driving at night, as half of you are trying to fool yourselves with that thought. This and all the other incidents in the last 2 years are bad, bad news and signal a change in times.

The lack of sympathy on this board for your fellow Baja travelers amazes me also.

[Edited on 9-6-2007 by JZ]

bajadogs - 9-5-2007 at 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bruce R Leech

Quote:

Originally posted by bajabound2005
Sure hope they bought Mex insurance and cleared it through the lienholders on those loaded vehicles before leaving the USA...

Insurance wont pay anything if you don't file a report in the jurisdiction where the problem occurred.

Right Bruce,
I have a feeling this writing experiment will not have a follow-up report. So, the dudes ended up on Revolucion looking for an ATM to pay for a taxi back to the border? In those 60 years of experience they didn't know the pedestrian route over the bridge? Too many other shaky details.

Terry28 - 9-6-2007 at 08:46 AM

I absolutley believe this story,( and the others in the past) This DOES happen and people need to be aware. I drive that road 30 times a year at least and are always watchful...I have done it at night but never again.
Loving Baja does not mean ignoring the problems that come from a third world country. I think some folks do a disservice (sp?) to others by downplaying this problem. Capn Sharkey is correct ( at least for me) things are not getting better in the TJ area, police wise. Just hurry thru in daylight and try not to draw any unwanted attention.

oxxo - 9-6-2007 at 09:11 AM

I don't know.....sometimes it is hard to tell the difference between this story and a creative writing exercise by OSPREY. One of OSPREY's stories was posted on another board as a true story.

I don't know.

Skeet/Loreto - 9-6-2007 at 09:24 AM

Suggestion:

Take a little longer and go through Tecate.

Go during Daylight hours:

Travel with a Dog in the Cab.

Might try the Old route through TJ where there are lots more People.

DanO - 9-6-2007 at 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rts551
DANO...."my personal preference not to drive anywhere south of the border on pavement is now a personal rule". Does this mean no more BAJA?

No, it means I'll make an effort to stay off of paved roads -- i.e., the highway and streets in populated areas like TJ and Rosarito (and probably even Ensenada, which I have always considered a safe place), at night. Dirt roads, where I spend most of my time anyway, are just fine. My travel to and from Baja destinations on the highway, or provisioning trips to and from paved populated areas, are mostly during daylight hours already. But I'm starting to think of it in more definite terms. Think of it like a vampire movie -- if you're out on the paved roads at night, you're risking becoming one of the undead. Or hitting a cow in a vado.

DanO - 9-6-2007 at 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo
I don't know.....sometimes it is hard to tell the difference between this story and a creative writing exercise by OSPREY. One of OSPREY's stories was posted on another board as a true story.

I don't know.

I think Osprey has been fairly careful here in pointing out the nature of his writings. Care to post a link to the other board so we can verify?

oldhippie - 9-6-2007 at 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fdt

Quote:

Who are you asking? I personaly know many, many of both.

I was asking anybody reading my post. Please don't think I was being insulting. I wasn't. It's my experience, limited I suppose eventhough I live in a TJ community of well educated Mexican professionals and I'm one of the few Americans, that people speaking a second language without an accent is a rarity. And I would think that folks smart enough to do so probably don't resort to such brutal criminal activities.

But then again, maybe the bad guys were from the United States.

[Edited on 9-6-2007 by oldhippie]

fdt - 9-6-2007 at 09:51 AM

I didn't think you were insulting, I just thought you were generalizing and since I was reading, just thought I'd ask. Sometimes I think (I know) that the only people some visitors to Baja California or México in general meet is those that never went to school or had parents of some kind and I don't want to be insulting but we have many of those but in no way are they the majority.

Mango - 9-6-2007 at 09:54 AM

Having worked for BIKE magazine in the past, which shares the same office with Surfer Magazine, I know those guys had all the latest and greatest stuff just bulging out of their brand new cars.

I try not to blame the victim; but, they might have been well off to paint a giant target on the side of their car.

I'd like to see the results of driving through Oakland, S. Chicago, Newark, St. Louis, South S.F., E. L.A., North Vegas, Kingston Jamaica, etc.. etc.. at 3 or 4am loaded to the gills with expensive toys.

The fact is, the world is a dangerous place. Here in the USA, Mexico, and elsewhere.

(Fill in the "I have traveled all over Mexico for years without any problems story here")

When I goto poor parts of Mexico. I don't wear a watch, flashy clothes, etc...Normally I travel by bus, like the locals. Call me scared or call me smart. But, I like to think a smaller and harder to see target lost in the crowd is one that is less likely to get hit.

I now drive my 2007 car around Mexicali all the time. It gets parked under a tree and stays dirty most of the time. There are so many new cars, many with California plates, here that I don't think any more about it than I would if I was in Oakland.

Just be careful and know that things can happen. The chances a pretty rare in reality.

Just a word of advice. If you goto Oakland or Mexico City. When it is dark. Stay off the streets if you know what is good for you.

Four people were shot and killed in Oakland just the other night, thats not even counting the victims of crime were not killed and did not make the paper. Should you avoid the entire state of California because of crime in a few cities? You make the call.

Is crime in TJ and elsewhere serious? Yes. Can you be a little smarter and limit your chances of being a target. Sure, just use that thing called a brain and hope for the best.

toneart - 9-6-2007 at 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
Suggestion:

Take a little longer and go through Tecate.

Go during Daylight hours:

Travel with a Dog in the Cab.

Might try the Old route through TJ where there are lots more People.

I do all these things except for #4. This incident and many others, including the police commander who was ambushed and killed a few months ago, happened on this stretch of the HWY 1, past downtown Tijuana....in broad daylight, by the way. The colonia to the left of the highway isn't a place you want to venture into. You used to have to make that dip and go down to a very confusing intersection before starting back up to the highway.

I do believe the story in this post. Even if it is a fabrication, there are plenty of incidents that have occured to warrent caution, or even avoidance.

Finally, there is some merit to Old Hippie's question: there are gang members from the U.S. who have been known to operate in this corredor. I suppose it is possible for them to buy red and blue police lights. They began operating just after Arellano Felix was arrested in San Diego. There is a drug cartel turf war going on. By the way, look out. Arellano Felix has just been convicted in Mexico and now faces extradition.

DENNIS - 9-6-2007 at 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DanO

I think Osprey has been fairly careful here in pointing out the nature of his writings.

Not always. A while back, Osprey posted what appeared to be nothing short of a confession for burning a pile of gill-nets on the beach. As well as he writes, the story was accepted by me as a true accounting of his act. I believed it to be true and who here is more cynical than me?
It was left to those here who were familiar with Osprey's craft to point out that he had spoon-fed us a fiction, a convincing one at that.
I don't recall Osprey catagorizing the story as fact or fiction even after the dust had setteled. It doesn't make him disingenuous. Or does it?

gnukid - 9-6-2007 at 12:02 PM

I like Tecate crossing, it is beautiful and the truckers there keep moving along. It sure makes life less stressful.

When crossing TJ, I drive to the border area in the US and rest until about 5:30am and cross then to be sure to hit TJ at sunrise when the police and the druggies are asleep or busy. Like dracula, the night loving criminals hide at sunrise.

I bring radios and share them with anyone I can meet and gather in the US they can return them later down the road.

Over the years, I stress about this TJ to Ensenada section quite a bit. I drive very slow 15 mph initially until it gets weird with someone following, then I punch it out of there in the 70-90mph. Most US cars can ditch crappy criminals cars. Lock all doors, stay alert and hopefully from the border I team up with others who look similar, gringos loaded and moving well. I smile and wave, hopefully to try to make friends with my fellow drivers and stick together-bumper to bumper with room to stop or escape. I never stop for anything or anyone even flashing lights. Most fake cops are crappy cars with crappy lights. You'll know if its a real cop=real cop car, cause most likely you saw him as you passed a stop sign. Just keep going and stay way in front of trouble makers. The robber guys always pull away and give up, probably cause they don't have gas money for a race nor do they want to go too far from their favorite crime zones or pass a toll booth.

I don't think it worth stopping for anything ever that is until you hit well south of Ensenada.

QuePasaBaja - 9-13-2007 at 03:29 PM

Keep in mind that the United states is deporting more than 1000 mexicans a month back to Mexico. Man of whom were raised in the US from a very young age.

They worked jobs there and made ok money. How long of working for 15 dollars a day before they decide that there us a better way.

And I personally do not believe that story!

Taco de Baja - 9-13-2007 at 03:39 PM

Roger Hedgec-ck is currently reading the surfer hijack story on his KOGO AM 600 radio program in San Diego.

At least it's beginning to get more media attention.....

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuePasaBaja
Keep in mind that the United states is deporting more than 1000 mexicans a month back to Mexico.not believe that

Who could forget that weenie fact? That's 33 per day. Jeezo......I'm so impressed with the billion dollar vigiliance.
How many come in per day? Do you think it may be more than 33?
Pull your head out of that warm spot in your body and do the math. How long can this go on before liberals like you see the problem?
Legal immigration is the answer. Not ignoring the illegality of the issue which immigration advocates tend to do.
Immigration is good. Breaking our laws is not good.

woody with a view - 9-13-2007 at 04:15 PM

WHERE'S THE FENCE?????

comitan - 9-13-2007 at 04:19 PM

Dennis

I agree with you on immigration, How can this be, I consider myself a liberal. Can I be a modified Liberal, mortified, justified not satisfied Liberal.

woody with a view - 9-13-2007 at 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
Dennis

I agree with you on immigration, How can this be, I consider myself a liberal. Can I be a modified Liberal, mortified, justified not satisfied Liberal.

you can always be a free thinking independant............ :light:

bancoduo - 9-13-2007 at 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody in ob
WHERE'S THE FENCE?????

It's on the way.
Be there SOON.

FEDEX

:lol:

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 04:43 PM

The fence. Ah yes.
I think the fence will be built only in the minds of those who believe that the United States has boundrys. I'm one of them.
The steel fence in question is a joke. Something to be written on, peeed on, spit on and torn down, not to mention reviled politically and ignored as meaningless.
I'm hurt, it disheartens me, that Mexico sees our laws on the border as meaningless and at the same time feels that her interests are relavant to her legions of felons in my country. We have to abide and protect her castoffs as she never would. I'll put up with the human wave but I can't tolerate being told by a foriegn government how we should act.
When will anybody from the US stand up and say,"Screw you" to these profiling jerks?
Oh...I know. Never. That would take a stand more spherical, as in balls, than our country posseses.

comitan - 9-13-2007 at 04:50 PM

Dennis

It seems that I might be a free thinking Liberal, and after your last post I would say you have to be a free thinking Conservative.

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 04:56 PM

I'll buy that, Wiley.

Mango - 9-13-2007 at 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by QuePasaBaja
Keep in mind that the United states is deporting more than 1000 mexicans a month back to Mexico.not believe that

According to the ICE factsheet I found for the fiscal year of 2006. 186,600 illegal aliens were removed from the country during that year. Thats about 511 people a day. I will admit, I am not sure what what percentage of Mexican nationals were part of that 186,600 figure.

http://www.dhs.gov/xnews/releases/pr_1162228690102.shtm

But, according to Dennis' higher than thou math that may have been pulled from a warm place, he is saying that Mexicans only make up 6% of all illeagals deported?

Let me do your math for you:

(186,600/ 365 = 511.23 people per day deported)

In his post Dennis stated that only 33 Mexicans a day are deported. Using his obviously superior logic and fact we can "do the math" and find that only 6% of the deportees are Mexican.

(33/511 = .064) That translates to 6% for you liberals and independents out there..

I figured I'd "do the math" since Dennis seems to be too busy working on his statesmanship by reading, "How to talk to a liberal" to do it for us.

(ramble on)

Not that I am advocating breaking the law or anything. I am sure there are a few Native American tribes that wished people followed the laws and treaties they made in the past. (We wouldn't be speaking English west of the Mississippi if the law was followed, for starters.)

However; the past is the past. I agree. Legal immigration is the key to our country's future and prosperity. But, I also think some people need to lighten up a bit and see reality for what it is instead of trying to twist it to suit their delusional view of what the USA should be. We can all agree it is not working now.. so let's figure out how to work together to fix it.

If you want to live in the black and white world of the 50's and name your kid Beaver, go ahead. I agree. Everyone should live in the past and realize the Spanish were here first and learn to speak the language of the people that were here first. Oh, wait.. that would be Miwok, Ohlone, Apache, Nahuatl, etc.. etc.. nevermind.. faulty logic.

Anyways, if you want to pay taxes to the your queen still.. go ahead... it's the "law"... We all blindly follow the law because the law is allways right? We could just ask Rosa Parks if she was still alive.

Maybe I'll just eat an imported $40 salad and think about why laws should allways be followed and never changed to cope with reality.

Good thing I can have a beer with it now that somebody in the past changed a law that was not working. It must have been hard when nobody was drinking in the 20's. Imagine that. Everyone sober all the time. I'm sure they all followed the law.. right?

:light:

hmm.. I wonder if the other 94% are Canadians? Maybe if we didn't charge them so much more for magazines they would just stay home?!

(ramble off)

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mango

But, according to Dennis' higher than thou math that may have been pulled from a warm place, he is saying that Mexicans only make up 6% of all illeagals deported?

Now, Mango.....
I know where your head's been and if I where there, I'd offer you a roll of toilet paper.
I made no comment on the ratio of nationality concerning deportations.

So, Mango, if you want to have some fun, get your facts straight so I can respond to reality.

Halboo - 9-13-2007 at 05:19 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZkAoosVLkA
Please listen to the whole song amigos
:cool:

[Edited on 9-14-2007 by Halboo]

lemme see......

woody with a view - 9-13-2007 at 05:24 PM

511 people who have no RIGHT to be in this country are deported daily equates to.......186515 per year........there's only 12 million (yeah, right!) here now so the comes out to 64 years just to get rid of the ones who are here now, not to mention their kids who will (50/50 chance) end up in prison....what demographic are best represented in prisons today?

aw, who cares right? i'm only gonna be around a scant 40 years anyway.....

we need a marine with a full ammo box every 100 yards, and orders to use the ammo stationed all along both borders....

you're witnessing the fall of the modern roman empire my friends.....get your front row seats.....

how did this thread deteriorate so fast????

Gadget - 9-13-2007 at 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Taco de Baja
Roger Hedgec-ck is currently reading the surfer hijack story on his KOGO AM 600 radio program in San Diego.

At least it's beginning to get more media attention.....

TdB finally exposed it. Its beginning to get media attention. I know that if this happened to me I would be singing from every roof top, radio station, media outlet , newspaper, grandmas brothers sisters cousin about what happened.
Surfer magazine? Who reads that???? Surfers!!!! The very demographic that this story is targeted at to keep the crouds down durring this swell season. There is so many inconsistancies, contradictions and rediculous hollywood esk dramas in this fiction, I mean come on folks. Would you go home and write a story up like this and send it in to your gardening mag, readers digest, GQ ?
Roger bit on the anti illegal / dislike for Mex deal that he is all on about and sounded like a kook reading this on his show. I could almost hear in his voice he didn't beleive what he was reading but he couldn't stop.
Leaving for my long range surf vacation very soon and I'm thinkin the lineup will be very empty :lol:

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 05:44 PM

Great presentation, Halboo. What are you saying? "Who's going to build your wall?"
Your representitives of your theme were truly country, disinfranchised by modern day standards but, were they representitive of a society that is in need of "Otro Lado" to better their life? They didn't look like they would appreciate outside help. They looked proud. Wanting but, proud.
So, do they care about the fence? Do they care about their pride in themselves? Young kids with purpose in the fotos, old men with pride of a lifelong accomplishment. Do they need interference with what's left of life?
I doubt it.
We interfere at the wrong times and we bring unsupporting witness as your UTubealooba has attempted to do.
Try again.

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody in ob

how did this thread deteriorate so fast????

Oh golly.....These things happen.

Halboo - 9-13-2007 at 05:53 PM

I just like the song! :lol:

Especially the part about the white guy in the golf shirt!!!!!
:lol:

Get organized or get over it.

DENNIS - 9-13-2007 at 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Halboo
I just like the song! :lol:

Especially the part about the white guy in the golf shirt!!!!!
:lol:

Get organized or get over it.

--- ? ----

bajajudy - 9-13-2007 at 06:33 PM

Halboo
That was a terrific video. I liked the music and the photographs are tear jerkers(for me anyway) Wonderful faces of Mexico
And who is going to build this wall?

woody with a view - 9-13-2007 at 06:43 PM

US!!! me and my fellow americans!

Mango - 9-13-2007 at 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Mango

But, according to Dennis' higher than thou math that may have been pulled from a warm place, he is saying that Mexicans only make up 6% of all illeagals deported?

I simply did the math, with YOUR "FACT" and a fact reported by ICE after you berated another user for making up facts. You were the one who berated and dismissed anyone who dares to think different from you, simply because you don't agree with them politically. You we the one that stated only 33 mexicans a day are deported.

My intent, was merely showing how your facts were wrong. Yet, I'll admit, your post was a response to another BS post.

Before you jab a stick at a bunch of BS, make sure thats actually a stick in your hand you are jabbing and not some of your own BS. According to you in your earlier post.. my math was correct according to the reality you were in during your earlier post.

And in reality, I agree with you on many points on this issue. We need a wall (north AND south), we need reform, but we don't need to discredit or berate people simply because of their political views.

That is why I jabbed back. If you really want change, I suggest you end the ad hominem attacks that lead to no solution, only more division.

CaboRon - 9-18-2007 at 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gadget

Quote:

Thank you for introducing sane thinking on this issue.

- CaboRon