BajaNomad - Baja 1000 hi jacking

Baja 1000 hi jacking

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Frank - 11-19-2007 at 11:05 PM

Just passing it along.....

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36297

Your heartfelt calls, visits and emails are much appreciated.

Last night our family made the decision to drive home at San Quentin. We felt fine, not tired and saw lots of chase and race teams on the road- heck, it was only another 5 hours to get into our own beds. The drive went just fine until we were 7 miles from the border. We were almost to the last toll booth in TJ when we were pulled over by “the police”. As soon as we stopped another car stopped in front of the truck and trailer blocking our path. At the same time this was happening the truck (our 2007 super duty and McMillin’s Weekend Warrior) were surrounded by men with guns, their faces covered. They stuck a gun to Chris’ head and pulled him out of the truck. They then proceeded to pull the kids out and stuck a gun in my side and told me to shut up and not move but to put my head down. The kids and Chris were stuck into the back seat of the truck with a man sitting next to Tyler (age 16, this week) who stuck a gun in his side for the next very long 2 hours. We were driven with our heads down and guns on us up into the hills above the area near La Playa. The gunmen yanked Chris out of the truck and made him disconnect the trailer and then finally shoved him back into the truck. There were 10 men, during this time they were ransacking the truck and trailer and taking everything including the jewelry off of our bodies. They pulled the GPS for the stereo out of the dash. We still had the gun men with guns stuck to our bodies. We were driven further up into some new development that was just graded. They first took Tyler out of the truck and shoved him to the side of the road. They then removed me and pushed me to the ground, I laid over Tyler as best as they would let me. They then covered us both with a sleeping bag and threw a pillow on us. At this point they brought Divinia and Chris around and forced them to the ground. We all told each other that we love each. Our truck drove away. We stayed there for about 10 minutes not moving. We then did a 1 ½ hour hike thru cactus, barbed wire down a mountain in the fog wearing our shorts tanks and flip-flops. We ended up on the south side of La Playa where we knocked on doors and rang security bells for over an hour before a very nice lady let us into her home and called the police. The La Playa police came and decided to hurry us out of the country, giving us a ride to the border. The customs and immigration folks were less than helpful and even less sympathetic to our situation. While they did let us walk into the US they would not let us use their phone, bathroom nor have a drink of water. They directed us to the McDonald’s for assistance.

So this is what happened. The rumors are close but this is the boiled down version of what transpired. Please be safe. After 25 years of the Baja we are done. We can replace material things; our greatest pleasure comes from our great kids. We consider ourselves blessed and lucky to be home and safe.

Our family is very sad to hear that there was so much loss of life this race. Our prayers are with those families. We wish those of you that continue with the great Baja racing tradition safe travels.

Chris, Debra, Divinia and Tyler Hall

PS For Chris' friends whose numbers he has lost would you please PM him your number?
__________________
Chris Hall
El Cajon, CA

MexicoTed - 11-20-2007 at 01:05 AM

Thanks Frank for posting this. Horrible. I have been in recent discussions with Baja officials and they are very concerned as they should be. I was told they are coordinating a plan of attack to both catch/setup these criminals and increase security in Northern Baja.

If anyone knows Chris, please have him email me.

Thanks,'
Ted

BajaWarrior - 11-20-2007 at 05:58 AM

He said they were almost to the last toll booth, is this the first time there has been a robbery (abduction in this case) on a toll road? How could they make it through the tolls?

He said he was towing McMillans trailer? I wonder what their reaction will be to this?

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by BajaWarrior]

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 07:21 AM

The treatment from US customs makes me want to gag with disgust.

Diver - 11-20-2007 at 07:42 AM

Very sad to hear of this family's ordeal,

After reading this story, on one hand, I think "Why would they choose to drive the toll road, or any other in that area, at night ? Maybe they made the wrong decision." and "It wouldn't happen to me."

On the other hand, I travel with my wife, 2 kids and 2 dogs, all of which I love dearly. To put myself in the hijacked family's place for just a minute is a very uncomfortable feeling that I would choose to avoid at all costs.

I have always felt safe, but why take the chance ?
We will avoid TJ as we have the past few years, and plan to cross at Tecate. We will travel only in daylight.

If anyone wants to join us, we plan to cross with visas already in hand, mid-morning on December 18. Will overnight in San Quintin and then continue south the next day. U2 by December 11 if you are interested in joining part of our travels.

I think this year I will put the CB back in the truck along with the VHF handhelds and cell phones. A list of appropriate phone numbers or just a contact that can call the cavalry (Nomads). Maybe a gps tracker for the truck; maybe for the kids and dogs too ? Maybe.... ?
Am I being TOO concerned ?
Consider this happening to your family; I think not.
This year, I will turn the dial UP on the common sense that has always kept us safe.
Be safe all !!

.

CBP

bajaguy - 11-20-2007 at 07:43 AM

Maybe somebody should remind them.......

Mission

UNITED STATES BORDER PATROL
SAN DIEGO SECTOR

TO ENFORCE THE RULE OF LAW ALONG THE BORDER, WHILE ENHANCING THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THE PEOPLE WE PROUDLY SERVE.

WE VALUE:

PROFESSIONALISM

We strive toward the highest standard of ethical conduct.

HUMAN LIFE

We value human life and seek a safe environment for all.

INTEGRITY

We value honesty and integrity; always remaining loyal to the mission of the Service.

TRUST

We hold ourselves accountable in the performance of our duties to create and maintain an environment of trust.

SHARED EFFORT

We value ourselves, our community, and working together to solve issues of mutual concern.

Commissioned by the Agents and the Staff of San Diego Sector

4baja - 11-20-2007 at 07:53 AM

anybody know what time they were comeing through? we just got back last night and had no problems but we did come through tacate.

bajaandy - 11-20-2007 at 07:58 AM

Holy smokes! So much for the relative good 'ol days of the $20.00 shakedown.

So it seems the lesson we're supposed to learn from this (other than never going to Baja again) is to not stop for any flashing lights unless you're at a police station (or similar).

Need to vent????

bajaguy - 11-20-2007 at 08:04 AM

CBP Press officers

Send copies of the above post to:

Vincent Bond, Press Officer
Jurisdiction: Southern California/Mexico Ports of Entry
610 Ash Street
Suite 1200
San Diego, CA 92101Phone: (619) 744-5224
Fax: (619) 645-6641
Email: vincent.e.bond@customs.treas.gov

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Angelica De Cima, OFO Office of Public Affairs Liaison
Jurisdiction: San Ysidro Port
610 West Ash Street
Room 1200
San Diego, CA 92101Phone: (619) 652-9966 Ext: 192/114
Fax: (619) 645-6641
Email: angelica.d.decima@cbp.dhs.gov

Bruce R Leech - 11-20-2007 at 08:07 AM

I wonder if the toll road insurance will pay off in this case?

mikeintj - 11-20-2007 at 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaWarrior
He said they were almost to the last toll booth, is this the first time there has been a robbery (abduction in this case) on a toll road? How could they make it through the tolls?

There are of course many places to exit beween the tolls, and with ten men and probably 3 or 4 cars you only need one car to act as a spotter - the rest can be waiting.

For what its worth, I think this stretch of road (the freeway along San Antonio del Mar, Baja Malibu etc) is the most dangerous part of Baja in terms of extremely serious robberies. This is just my opinion from surfing this board.

I would recommend using the non-toll road since it is at least busier.

However the best advice, as many have said, is not bringing attention to yourself by travelling in expensive cars with even more expensive trailers.

This post gives an idea of what is happening between Tijuana and Rosarito:

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=28041&pag...

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by mikeintj]

805gregg - 11-20-2007 at 08:16 AM

So where are the police during all of this, or maybe it was the police.

Bruce R Leech - 11-20-2007 at 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 805gregg
So where are the police during all of this, or maybe it was the police.

I think you answered your own question :light:

comitan - 11-20-2007 at 08:40 AM

Just what will they do with Mcmillin's Race car, it has to be very very recognizable even if painted?

Bruce R Leech - 11-20-2007 at 08:43 AM

it is being sold by Parts.

Paulina - 11-20-2007 at 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 4baja
anybody know what time they were comeing through? we just got back last night and had no problems but we did come through tacate.

1:00 am.

mexwest - 11-20-2007 at 08:52 AM

Is it safer to cross in Mexicali or tecate? I'm heading down next week and am getting a little concerned with all of these posts. Our vehicles are not too flashy and we have no trailers, but damn.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 09:01 AM

In the old wild west, a hunter could find a herd of Buffalo, point his rifle in their direction, pull the trigger and an animal would fall. Easy pickin's and the word got out.
More hunters went west to point their rifles and watch the Buffalo fall and everyone was surprised at the ease with which one could take down a prize.
Then, more and more hunters arrived to cash in on the easy pickin's and soon the herd's were decimated. Near extinct.

Point is, I think the hunters are coming into Baja from all directions to find their fortune in "easy pickin's." We are the defenseless herd being hunted to extinction. When the visitors stop coming, who will they prey upon next? They won't stop.

Diver - 11-20-2007 at 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mexwest
Is it safer to cross in Mexicali or tecate? I'm heading down next week and am getting a little concerned with all of these posts. Our vehicles are not too flashy and we have no trailers, but damn.

I would choose Tecate'. It's safe and closer to points south.

Diver - 11-20-2007 at 09:52 AM

Dennis's analogy is right on.
At this point, we can only be vigilant buffalo.....

Let's keep getting the word out.
This has got to be stopped before it gets any worse.

.

David K - 11-20-2007 at 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
CBP Press officers

Send copies of the above post to:

Vincent Bond, Press Officer
Jurisdiction: Southern California/Mexico Ports of Entry
610 Ash Street
Suite 1200
San Diego, CA 92101Phone: (619) 744-5224
Fax: (619) 645-6641
Email: vincent.e.bond@customs.treas.gov

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I know Vince Bond ... I made a copy of this thread and will drop it off to him today...

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by David K]

Woooosh - 11-20-2007 at 10:38 AM

Hello. As I'm fresh on this topic- I'll chime in.

I'm very sorry to hear about this carjacking and what the family went through. Every time someone like me posts just how dangerous the toll road and border area is these days someone disrespectes the messenger. I'm tired of hearing "they only bother and kidnap businessmen- so just keep a low profile." That's bull. They rob/kidnap anyone these days that has more than they do- which is EVERY American, the day toursits are like a free gift to them.

The method used in this carjacking of the family is EXACTLY what we in Rosarito have been warning Americans about for months. I'm peeed off that these have been happening REGULARLY at night on the toll road for the last six months and NO USA AUTHORITIES OR MEDIA WILL WARN AMERICANS ABOUT IT! The MO: They pull you over at night with flashing police lights, another car pulls in front of you to block your escape and then they rob you, carjack you or worse. (At least these Americans didn't get shot like some others have). The bandits know that us law-abiding Americans will always pull over for the police. This happens at night mostly- so don't travel at night. If it does happen, don't stop- just keep driving until you get to a grocery store or other busy location and stop at the front door. The real police won't mind you doing this, but then again the real police arent out on the toll road at night protecting Americans'these days. They are just trying to stay alive themselves.

There is a security consultant guy who posts regular safety and driving escape tactics for americans on www.gringogazettenorth.com

Were these police who did it? Probably not. There are three levels of uniformed "police" here and none of them communicatre or work together, in fact they are fighting each other. They all have allies with different waring political parties (PRI/PAN) and the drug cartel. Even they don't know who to trust any more. They don't even know each other's uniforms well enough to tell a real one from an impersonator. The only thing they agree on are that Americans are fair game- they pull you over, terroize you, rob you, and then warn you NEVER to talk about it. Most of these incidents (and especially the express kidnappings) go unreported. I think people try to report these incidents at the border like this family did- but what you hear from the US Border Patrol is "you basically asked for it by going down there in the first place". They blame the victim and do nothing to help (the "go to macdonalds for help" attitude has to stop!).

I tried calling the news stations in San Diego a few weeks ago when the shootings of the American toursit family (and kidnapping of two spaniards with them) in Puerto Nuevo in broad daylight took place (there is a post on this site of mine somewhere about it). All three stattions told me that TJ and Rosarito was "not their market" and they don't cover it. When I stated that 10,000 americans live here, watch their news and ARE their market- they just said they would watch the wires for the story- which of course didn't happen because the Mexican government never releases the truth.

I don't know what the included insurance on the toll road covers, but there is some level of coverage that exists with a paid toll. Your USA insurance covers most incidents within 70 miles of the border or so- but that;s for passenger vehicles only. I would guess that trailers and ATV's are a different story. Whatever insurance there is- it will never repair the permanenet damange done to their family.

Thanks David

bajaguy - 11-20-2007 at 10:41 AM

The part that I am most concerned about is:

"The customs and immigration folks were less than helpful and even less sympathetic to our situation. While they did let us walk into the US they would not let us use their phone, bathroom nor have a drink of water. They directed us to the McDonald’s for assistance."

Maybe you could get Vince to be a regular on this board, or at least look at it once in a while.

Roberto - 11-20-2007 at 10:56 AM

All the talk about boycotts from folks like the ones on Baja Nomad and letters to Vincent Bond, etc will amount to nothing. There is no political will to do anything about this in Mexico - if we haven't figured that out by now, we never will.

HERE is the kind of thing that MIGHT, truly, have an effect:

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36312

When race teams like the McMillins start talking about not racing in Mexico any longer, I imagine folks like Sal Fish might start to pay attention. If the threat of the Baja races coming to a close or not attracting the high-end teams they do today doesn't do it, nothing will.

bajaguy - 11-20-2007 at 11:05 AM

Who has the horsepower to contact the new Governor, the mayors, the police chiefs, tourism directors and police/military officials of TJ, Rosarito and Ensenada, and BCN state/federal officials and make them aware of these incidents???? Maybe set up a meeting of concerned residents/travelers.

It seems that there is a lot of complaining but nobody is talking to those who can effect/affect change

Maybe FDT can have these officials on his radio show????

fdt - 11-20-2007 at 11:30 AM

bajaguy, I U2U'd you

Hook - 11-20-2007 at 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Roberto
All the talk about boycotts from folks like the ones on Baja Nomad and letters to Vincent Bond, etc will amount to nothing. There is no political will to do anything about this in Mexico - if we haven't figured that out by now, we never will.

HERE is the kind of thing that MIGHT, truly, have an effect:

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36312

When race teams like the McMillins start talking about not racing in Mexico any longer, I imagine folks like Sal Fish might start to pay attention. If the threat of the Baja races coming to a close or not attracting the high-end teams they do today doesn't do it, nothing will.

Never underestimate the power of a grass-roots level boycott, Roberto. All it takes is victims and the friends of victims to get media coverage, to talk to their travel agents, to post on boards with a combined readership of literally millions and pretty soon the numbers start dropping all over Mexico.

As the saying goes, "bad news travels fast".

Even without anything resembling an organized boycott, Mexico experienced a drop in tourism in 2006. Many had already made the choice to spend dollars elsewhere, as the cartel and police violence became more visible.

Tourism is/was the second largest industry in Mexico. Not the ancillary proceeds of a 4 day race.

The well-publicized boycott from ALL interested parties is the way to go.

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by Hook]

Roberto - 11-20-2007 at 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
Never underestimate the power of a grass-roots level boycott, Roberto.

I agree, generally, with your point. However, here are two points of my own.

The chances of a true "grass-roots level" boycott happening are slim and none. Just look at the reactions on this board to these types of reports for illustration.

Even if this happened, I really don't think the Mexican government gives a flip about this kind of tourism. The folks who fly to Cancun and go on the cruises - maybe, but that's a whole different ball of wax. Add to that the fact that the Mexican government is up to their ears with the drug cartels and the picture does not look good.

I hope, I'm wrong, frankly, because I'm pretty close to doing my own personal boycott - travelling alone in Baja or, worse yet, with my family is looking less and less worthwhile.

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
Tourism is/was the second largest industry in Mexico. Not the ancillary proceeds of a 4 day race.

The reason I believe that a boycott by high-end teams could make a huge difference is more related to the level of publicity this would get than the impact of the loss of the revenue in Mexico. And I would like to have some numbers regarding the size of the revenue generated, directly and indirectly by all the SCORE races in the course of a year compared to you and me, and all the folks on this board, not going to Baja any longer - aside from the fact that that loss would be completely under the radar.

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by Roberto]

Hook - 11-20-2007 at 12:19 PM

Just separate out the anti-boycott responses from people who have already invested in Baja or have businesses in Baja. They have a conflict of interest. But they are the only ones who can apply any local pressure. We have no rights.....except to choose to spend or not.

I have begun one, too. In my mind, I've avoided it for over a year, except the one albie trip. Now, it's official.

comitan - 11-20-2007 at 12:36 PM

I believe Tecate Beer is the sponsor of the Baja 1000 If someone contacted them, they could possibly put on some pressure in the right places.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Roberto

The chances of a true "grass-roots level" boycott happening are slim and none.

Probably true. At least as a movement by grass-roots individuals. Americans in cases such as this have three lethal faults. We don't learn from other's misfortune, we have no solidarity and we quickly forget. It will take group effort to get this ball rolling and at this point, the surfers are as close to that as we have. Perhaps we should start supporting them.

Denaca - 11-20-2007 at 01:19 PM

Point on the buffalo: the same could be said of nosotros los del norte and our migration to Baja.

Regarding los ladrones, maybe a massive letter/email/phone barrage to point out that visitors do spend a lot bucks in Baja and, who knows, word gets around and maybe there's a boycott to send another message. That message should include the harassment on the part of those Tijuana chotas (cops) as well.

gnukid - 11-20-2007 at 01:31 PM

Mexican officials are totally aware of the problems, they experience them too. And I can attest are painfully aware in a way that foreigners are not, here people have even less faith that change for Mexico is possible, that trait is an American concept not shared by many outside the USA.

Mexicans are looking toward outsiders to demonstrate the courage and know how to challenge the corruption. To Mexicans resolving a crime promptly, the right way is something so miraculous its almost frightening. The tools include, internet, photography, video and detailed stories which can be printed in places anonymously and demonstrate the corruption in detail in order to allow prosecution of corruption.

Prosecution requires jail time. We all know what a big expense that is as we have more jails in the US than anywhere in the world. Mexico doesn't have those resources either.

Basically, Mexico is totally corrupt, there is little but corruption. That is the system. There are almost no people willing to stand up for whats right because they would be killed by the bad guys. They say for every 100 pesos earned, 40% goes to pay off corruption and theft while 20-30% goes to the government for taxes so, that leaves 30% to pay for food, housing and miscellaneous.

Mexico can't change itself and most likely never will.

The truth is everything we love about Mexico is still here. Boating is nice, climbing and hiking is nice, playing in the ocean is nice and the majority of people are warm and pleasant. Its just the bad guys get in the way sometimes.

vandenberg - 11-20-2007 at 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
Mexican officials are totally aware of the problems, they experience them too. And I can attest are painfully aware in a way that foreigners are not, here people have even less faith that change for Mexico is possible, that trait is an American concept not shared by many outside the USA.

Mexicans are looking toward outsiders to demonstrate the courage and know how to challenge the corruption. To Mexicans resolving a crime promptly, the right way is something so miraculous its almost frightening. The tools include, internet, photography, video and detailed stories which can be printed in places anonymously and demonstrate the corruption in detail in order to allow prosecution of corruption.

Prosecution requires jail time. We all know what a big expense that is as we have more jails in the US than anywhere in the world. Mexico doesn't have those resources either.

Basically, Mexico is totally corrupt, there is little but corruption. That is the system. There are almost no people willing to stand up for whats right because they would be killed by the bad guys. They say for every 100 pesos earned, 40% goes to pay off corruption and theft while 20-30% goes to the government for taxes so, that leaves 30% to pay for food, housing and miscellaneous.

Mexico can't change itself and most likely never will.

The truth is everything we love about Mexico is still here. Boating is nice, climbing and hiking is nice, playing in the ocean is nice and the majority of people are warm and pleasant. Its just the bad guys get in the way sometimes.

And I, for one, think you can take that to the bank.

Thanks for that down to earth deduction Gnukid.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
Its just the bad guys get in the way sometimes.

Once is too often but, it's becoming epidemic.

Minnow - 11-20-2007 at 01:50 PM

Quote:

As painful as it is to write. DITTO. :?:

I think we all realize what the Kid is saying, but I just love the place so much. The people are so kind and genuine. The bad is just so hard to overlook.

Mexitron - 11-20-2007 at 02:06 PM

Thanks bajaguy--I sent a copy of the post to both addresses.

Frank - 11-20-2007 at 02:08 PM

I know exactly how you feel Minnow.......

BajaWarrior - 11-20-2007 at 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
Just what will they do with Mcmillin's Race car, it has to be very very recognizable even if painted?

The story read that it was a Weekend Warrior Toyhauler. I don't think they had a race car in there.

But the article did say they were forced to disconnect the trailer.

They did set out on foot though, wonder what happened to the trailer?

And what do the McMillans say about all of this when their own trailer is involved?

Nothing mentioned in Andy McMillans post on razedesert.com.

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by BajaWarrior]

So lets do something...

MrsFDT - 11-20-2007 at 02:33 PM

I read this incident with the family from the original message board it was posted on and I really dont know how to react.

Im angry, scared and saddened by all that has been going on.

I believe that a slow boycott has already begun. People are too afraid to cross the gauntlet and it has taken it's toll. The blatent way in which these crimes are escalating is whats so scary about it all.

I think the idea of getting the Secratary of tourism on the show is a good one and I truly believe that we can get him to respond, but there is a catch. We have had other people from the office on the show over the last year, but the big fish doesnt want to come unless there is big bait or at least thats how the office has responded in the past.

FDT does have an Avenue to get to the Sectratary's ear, as he has friends in certain positions, but tourism being a politacal type office, what they want is to see numbers. The larger the number the bigger the issue.

If you guys send Fernando all your emails, complaints and horror stories, Im absolutely sure he can poke a needle in there and make someone look this way.

There was a meeting today and many of the incidents were discussed. This I know, because a friend of Fernando's who was in attendnce, called during the meeting this morning for some info about another topic he had forgotten to take. This same friend had the printed email conversations with fernando about this robbery and a couple other reports to show the gravity of the situation. (yes, I do easdrop sometimes, sorry honey)

Calling in favors is the way it works around here. These certain people/friends arent that small of fish in the tourism arena, So an ear with the new Secratary of tourism isnt totally impossable.

With a folder or two full of letters directed at the Secratary, he may have no choice but to respond and it would give Fer just the leverage he needs to get him to respond on the air or otherwise.

When I say letters directed at: I mean addressed to him directly!
"Dear Mr. Secratary of Tourism......"

If anything I know Fernando CAN get them on his desk, one way or another.

Just a small note while im on the subject. This has been a large topic discussion with Fer his amigos (ive read the emails, heard the phone conversations) and they are all very aware of whats happenning and have said, in one fashion or another, the big wigs are running scared about the losing more tourist dollars. If there is ever a time to slam them with this, it's now, while the new guy is fresh and eager to create an impression. In all honesty I get the impression they really arent too sure of how or what to do, but know something has to be done.

Send as many emails as you can to fernado@ultimatebaja.com

There are never any guarantees as this is a whole new office, but if they are scared I think that, in itself, is a huge motivator.

(Just wanted to add something someone brought to my attention. Any email or corespondance will be completely anonamous. He would need volume of.. not names or email addresses. All would be presented with complete anoninimity and not accociated with this board or any other.
The point would be to get the person to go on air and respond live to any questions you all have and nothing more.)

[Edited on 11-21-2007 by MrsFDT]

Pescador - 11-20-2007 at 02:33 PM

You might put this one on the list of contacts as they are at least trying to do something and start the communication. There was some discussion and disbelief on the first incident that happened about a month ago but now this is becoming all to commonplace.
http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/baja-mexico-fishing-report...

jodiego - 11-20-2007 at 03:10 PM

1:00 AM. Man after all that has transpired in the past couple of months, traveling anywhere in norther baja at that time of night is just inviting trouble. I have never driven past dusk and I never will. So sorry for your terrifying experience.

fishbuck - 11-20-2007 at 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jodiego
1:00 AM. Man after all that has transpired in the past couple of months, traveling anywhere in norther baja at that time of night is just inviting trouble. I have never driven past dusk and I never will. So sorry for your terrifying experience.

I don't want to seem callous about this but that was a big mistake. How could you not kno of the risk?
If this happened at 1:00am they past through San Quintin at about 8 or 9pm. There are several safe and comfortable places to rest and continue in the morning.
I did recently cross that area after dark but it was about 7 or 8pm. No problem but I'll think hard about doing it again.
When I was on my way out of Ensenada a police car pulled up
behind me and put on his lights. I pulled over but he kept going. It was a Federal police Dodge Charger painted like a Chp. Clearly marked. I saw him and another just like it later at the Tollboth past Bajamar. Real cops.

Hook - 11-20-2007 at 04:17 PM

What do you mean "how could he not know the risk"? You think every Baja tourist reads this board?

Mebbe if the State Dept and the major media had given this some attention earlier, he might have known the risk.

Until there is more publicity on this, there will be more persons caught unaware (or just unlucky).

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by Hook]

MrsFDT - 11-20-2007 at 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pescador
You might put this one on the list of contacts as they are at least trying to do something and start the communication. There was some discussion and disbelief on the first incident that happened about a month ago but now this is becoming all to commonplace.
http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/baja-mexico-fishing-report...

I certanly hope that Bajabil is able to do something, but I would like to note that Fernando emailed the guy twice earlier last month, offering to join forces about getting to the right people, because he had the contacts that might have helped him, but the guy ignored Fer and never responded, so Fernando gave up. He emailed him directly, not through the bloody decks board. I got the impression that maybe he wanted to do it all by himself...

I showed fer the thread link, I thought maybe this is a good thing and he said he had already seen it, then Fer opened his outlook and showed me the emails from the 17 and 18th of October, when the fist reports of the incident happened, I think.

[Edited on 11-20-2007 by MrsFDT]

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrsFDT
If there is ever a time to slam them with this, it's now, while the new guy is fresh and eager to create an impression. In all honesty I get the impression they really arent too sure of how or what to do, but know something has to be done.

Send as many emails as you can to fernado@ultimatebaja.com

Thanks Simone...
Jeezo...You have given us more honesty to the situation than we ever could have hoped for. I hope it sits well at home.
How right you are that we have to strike while the iron's hot. The question now is, who's willing to pick up the hammer. I would in a minute if I had the connections, if I had friends or aquaintenances in high places, but I don't.
What I do have is a big mouth and I'm willing to give that to the cause if other big mouths such as mine will join in concert. We could be the strongest effort. We could support the groups who have the hammer. Those that have been abused.
Boycot Baja. Stay away untill it's a safe place to bring your kids. Make it a place that doesn't involve fear and death. Make it the Baja that is safe.

fdt - 11-20-2007 at 06:38 PM

Well Dennis, start sending to me.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 07:33 PM

Here you go, Ferna..........
A huge billboard at the entrance to Mexico that says, "Enter this country at your own risk"
Take the government to task for why they refuse to address the problem.
Take the US government to task for the same reason.
Allow Americans to protect themselves.
If Mexico can't control areas of crime toward visitors, make the areas off-limits. No Pase.

"No surfing. No camping. No isolation. No enjoying nature. No quiet beaches. None of this stuff because it's too dangerous."
That's what the signs should say if Mexico was honest to what's happening today.
But, that's a pathetic joke.

Mexico has gone into a no- win zone on crime, I believe. I don't think Mexico can kill the cancer it has given birth to and nurtured. Mexico started it with her tolerance of the cartels and she will live under the heavy hand of her bad child to the end. All we, as outsiders, can hope to do is, join together and defend ourselves.

How about you Ferna...What do you think?

Mango - 11-20-2007 at 07:51 PM

I was working up in Sacramento the last two days and this happened the other night - so it is not just happening in Baja:

Fake 'officers' carjack woman

STOCKTON - Men posing as California Highway Patrol officers carjacked a woman at gunpoint on Interstate 5 on Sunday night.

A 35-year-old Tracy woman reported she was driving north on the interstate at Matthews Road at 10:57 p.m. when she pulled over for what she believed to be an official vehicle. Instead, the vehicle's occupants sped off in her 2002 Chevrolet Corvette, according to reports.

The men were wearing black baseball hats and black windbreaker jackets with the letters CHP written on them, according to reports.

"When people are pulled over, they have the right to ask for identification or call us on their cell phone to confirm we have a unit pulling someone over," CHP spokesman Adrian Quintero said.

Stockton Police have seen several recent incidents of criminals posing as law enforcement officers robbing and carjacking people, but this is the first time robbers have posed as Highway Patrol officers and pulled people over on the interstate, Quintero said.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 07:58 PM

Oh good. Here's some of that reverse justification.

"Hey man, you think it's bad here in Stockton, you ought to see Tijuana."

Woooosh - 11-20-2007 at 08:06 PM

It's not just tourism loss the Mexican gov't needs to worry about. They have a billion dollars in real estate going in on the "gold coast" between Ensenada and the US Border. There are new million dollar houses in Puerto Nuevo built by Orange County developers. Trump's Baja Resort (on the toll road south of TJ) sold out their first tower in hours and set a record for Mexican real estate sales. Of course they held the sales event in downtown San Diego, not at the Trump site.

Can you imagine someone telling Ivanka Trump she has to dress like a hobo and ride in an old honda civic to get to her new penthouse condo in Rosarito? LOL

BajaNomad - 11-20-2007 at 08:21 PM

On this Rick Roberts show, "John" identifying himself as a "senior" customs officer says he was there when the family walked through... and here's more of what he says:

"They weren't denied drinking water - they were pointed to the public drinking fountain. We do not have a public restroom. We had to shut that down.

"If they'd asked for a supervisor I'm sure they would've been treated a little bit different.

"I stayed and made sure they were able to get through. Although I didn't deal with them, I watched from the side. I'm a senior officer.

"Um, the officer they went through didn't give 'em any trouble at all. But I think he should've realized it was a little more than the usual, 'people had their truck ripped off by the police or something', that happens, you know, eight or nine times a day.

( asked to repeat that statement, he follows with: )

"It happens a number of times a day that people lose their cars to the Tijuana police. They get ripped off for their vehicles... for stealing from the police or whoever.

"Right now we're having a lot of problems with the police down there."

Here's the audio (caller is at minute 25):
http://www.760kfmb.com/podcast/files/rick_roberts_4hr-11-20....

[Edited on 11-21-2007 by BajaNomad]

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 08:23 PM

One point of rebellion would lead to the next. the problem is, getting to point one.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNomad
"Right now we're having a lot of problems with the police down there."

Could anyone imagine getting cooperation from either one of these agencys? Not hard to understand why they don't get along with each other.

Dave - 11-20-2007 at 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNomad
But I think he should've realized it was a little more than the usual, 'people had their truck ripped off by the police or something', that happens, you know, eight or nine times a day.

( asked to repeat that statement, he follows with: )

"It happens a number of times a day that people lose their cars to the Tijuana police. They get ripped off for their vehicles... for stealing from the police or whoever.

"Right now we're having a lot of problems with the police down there."

I have no reason to believe that this doesn't happen but for the record:

I hear this kind of talk from border agents regularly. They don't feel like they work for us, actually dislike American citizens who cross and would say anything that would encourage our staying "home".

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by grover

How about an effective boycott; no street drug purchases for at least a month.

I know you're kidding Grover but, I'm serious with a proposal that if we all quit breathing for a month, Al Gore won't have global warming to worry about anymore.

This just in

fdt - 11-20-2007 at 09:21 PM

In regards to the meeting today with the new Secretary of tourism and other officials and local businesspeople, is that the Secture wil have continuous patrols on the corridor between the border and the first toll gate and as soon as they see a cop stop anyone, they will stop and investiate why the stop was made.
I don't know if they just thought of this in the heat of the meeting but that is what will be starting. Now, how long will it be in place? It's like someone asked me about the no ticket zone, that was a joke, something the substitute mayor dreamed up and was in place for a week, give or take a day or two.

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 09:25 PM

All efforts are appreciated.

bajabound2005 - 11-20-2007 at 09:29 PM

You all have some great ideas...but Dennis -- we LIVE here (you are included in that WE)....what do WE do? That goes for the rest of you that live HERE (in Baja) do?

DENNIS - 11-20-2007 at 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
I hear this kind of talk from border agents regularly. They don't feel like they work for us, actually dislike American citizens who cross and would say anything that would encourage our staying "home".

Dave......... U2U

Skipjack Joe - 11-20-2007 at 10:40 PM

I listened to the Rick Roberts audio and was disappointed to hear him repeatedly suggest that if you don't want to risk these crimes you should just not go to baja.

That's not an option for me. It's too much in my blood now to just let go like that.

On a lighter note I enjoyed listening to the ad for Michael Savage. I disagree with everything he says but I love the way he says it. What a perfomer.

Thank you, Doug.

P.S. I like your idea Dennis for an enormous sign at the border saying essentially "Enter at your own risk".

Roberto - 11-20-2007 at 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNomad
On this Rick Roberts show, "John" identifying himself as a "senior" customs officer says he was there when the family walked through... and here's more of what he says:

"They weren't denied drinking water - they were pointed to the public drinking fountain. We do not have a public restroom. We had to shut that down.

"If they'd asked for a supervisor I'm sure they would've been treated a little bit different.

"I stayed and made sure they were able to get through. Although I didn't deal with them, I watched from the side. I'm a senior officer.

"Um, the officer they went through didn't give 'em any trouble at all. But I think he should've realized it was a little more than the usual, 'people had their truck ripped off by the police or something', that happens, you know, eight or nine times a day.

( asked to repeat that statement, he follows with: )

"It happens a number of times a day that people lose their cars to the Tijuana police. They get ripped off for their vehicles... for stealing from the police or whoever.

"Right now we're having a lot of problems with the police down there."

Here's the audio (caller is at minute 25):
http://www.760kfmb.com/podcast/files/rick_roberts_4hr-11-20....

[Edited on 11-21-2007 by BajaNomad]

How about (and I'm paraphrasing) "a lot of the agents feel that there are warnings from the state department, people go down and they are tired of hearing (whine) oh, I got ripped off. You mean they got what they deserved?"

Tomas Tierra - 11-20-2007 at 11:42 PM

Quote:

Interesting,

When I was pulled over at the top of the last big hill on the way out of Baja last July, the moto cops escorted me up a side street away from the main drag. out of site for his $40.I hope the secture is aware of this tactic on their patrols.

A sad state of affairs here on the Nomads lately. I use to tune in to BS about out of the way spots, look at photos and read trip reports. now I'm on here twice as much, contributing twice less, and turning off my comp. in complete disgust after reading horrible reports of real experience :no:

Woooosh - 11-21-2007 at 12:49 AM

They designated the road that runs from the San Ysidro border to the first toll booth at Playas de Tijauna a "No Ticket"zone last summer. THey aren't supposed to stop cars that are obviously tourists. The whole route is totally on camera now. Funny story- the TJ police got peeed off when the Army was called in last summer and the TJ police all had their guns taken away from them for being suspect of corruption. Instead of taking to the streets with slingshots- a few cops began watching every minute of the cameras. They caught six of the Army soliders ripping off a carload of Americans in the "No Ticket"zone and actually caught the bill-passing on camera. This country is just too poor to expect people with no accepted social values to do the right thing.

The "No Ticket"zone was the direct result of pressure from the Rosarito real estate communty. They were estimating the amount of lost sales due to police harasssment in the millions of dollars last summer. People would call the agents and said they tried to get down to see the property, but were stopped by the policeon the way- turned around and went back home.

Trump didn't even try to sell his resort in Mexico- he figured a fancy reception at the San DIego Marriott with his daughter and slide shows with his logo would be enough to sell them out- and he was right. The reality is he billed it as "the new cancun"without telling them they have to run the gauntlet to get there. Of course he didnt want them to see the 3 million gallons of wastewaster CESPT dumps just 100 yeards from the site every day there either.

Bruce R Leech - 11-21-2007 at 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jodiego
[I have always felt safe, but why take the chance ?
We will avoid TJ as we have the past few years, and plan to cross at Tecate. We will travel only in daylight.]

Several of you have mentioned using the Tecate road to cross back into the US. It seems to be that that road would be asking for trouble, especially at night. Not a lot of traffic and not a lot of towns. Is my perception off here?

I would not drive any of those rodes at night anymore. I am one of those that prefer to drive at night, but no more in Baja north.

jodiego - 11-21-2007 at 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Diver
I have always felt safe, but why take the chance ?
We will avoid TJ as we have the past few years, and plan to cross at Tecate. We will travel only in daylight.

Several of you have mentioned using the Ensenada/Tecate road to get back to the US. I would think that that road would be less safe because there is less traffic and few towns along the way. Is my perception wrong?

fdt - 11-21-2007 at 07:49 AM

Maybe this sounds redundant but why not take the free road? If most of the reports of hijackings are happening on the toll road, why drive it. I am not justifying what is happening but I cant understand why people need to drive that hwy. It is very easy to get to the free road. Now here is a news item that sais that the roberies are not limited to the tijuana area and not limited to northamerican tourists
http://elvigia.net/noticias/?seccion=generales&id=39550

bajaguy - 11-21-2007 at 07:51 AM

Quote:

(edited by bajaguy)

WTF??????.....John says that he is a "Senior Officer"....and he just stood there?????......and we pay these guys????.......it's incredible to me that a VICTIM has to ask for a supervisor.

I would think that John, as a "Senior Officer" should have the initiative to take some kind of action on his own, and not wait for a supervisor......and should not everyone be treated the same??????.......why would someone be treated "differently" by a supervisor.

This whole response by CBP stinks and should be reported and investigated. We need to clean up our side of the border also.

:?:

vandenberg - 11-21-2007 at 08:11 AM

Quote:

I did think of that myself, till it dawned on me that to get anywhere from that highway, you have to backtrack to Ensenada or go to Tecate before you can dissappear. No side roads that go anywhere easy like there are on the tollroad. Easy to vanish there if you know your way around.

fdt - 11-21-2007 at 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vandenberg
I did think of that myself, till it dawned on me that to get anywhere from that highway, you have to backtrack to Ensenada or go to Tecate before you can dissappear. No side roads that go anywhere easy like there are on the tollroad. Easy to vanish there if you know your way around.

The Ensenada / Tecate road is were the comando that stole the body went thru, shot and killed 2 police officers and dissapeared. That road is full of places to hide, more than the toll road wich is fenced off and you can only use the paved exits.

Roberto - 11-21-2007 at 09:43 AM

Quote:

There are plenty of side roads there - just not paved ones.

Tecate - Ensenada Highway Is No Picnic !!

ElFaro - 11-21-2007 at 09:44 AM

I have travelled the Tecate-Ensenada Hwy (Hwy 3) for over 30 years and it is certainly no picnic. That road is frought with its own unique problems.

1) The hwy is the main truck route between Mexicali and Ensenada. A lot of trucks passing you and you having to pass. Many of the truckers are intoxicated or sleepy at certain times of the day swerving into your lane. No weight regulations on the trucks means the road takes a pounding especially in rainy weather. I've seen pavement sink and give way over culverts due to softened ground and heavy trucks.

2) Unlike the coastal "toll road" the Tec-Ens hwy twists, climbs, and decends through mountains and valleys. The hwy was built I believe in the 40's. Driving in the Summer and Fall takes its toll on your vehicle because it is so much hotter inland. I have driven the hwy when the temperatures are well over 100 degrees the entire length. This is especially hard on towing vehicles! Why drive this hwy in the summer when you can drive the toll road at low temps along the coast!! You have a lot of towing up and down hills and stuck behind slow trucks.

3) Another problem especially in the Summer/Fall are brush fires. I have come upon areas while brush fires are in progress that are jumping the road in several areas spreadout over several miles. No fun trying to run the gauntlet of roadside fires!

4) High winds are another problem especially in the late Fall/winter. Gusty high winds funneling through passes and arroyos throwing your trailer around are a real challenge when towing and passing high profile semis who often get flipped over.

5) There are local cops (e.g. in the San Antonio del Las Minas - Guadalupe area) who are looking for reasons to pull you over to extract $'s. I have had cops follow me for several miles only to turn around and head back to town. Along the Tec-Ens hwy there are many isolated stretches where shakedowns are possible.

If your going to travel this road in either direction the best time of the week I have found is early Sunday morning after light. Little local traffic, few if any trucks going Tecate to Ensenada, almost no slow trucks going Ensenada to Tecate, maybe a bus or two, no schools and children to deal with, even the cops and the crooks will take a day off !! Sunday is their only day.

Hope this helps...

Minnow - 11-21-2007 at 10:04 AM

Sunday is also the day you can expect a 4 hour wait at the Tecate Garrita.

Hook - 11-21-2007 at 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fdt
In regards to the meeting today with the new Secretary of tourism and other officials and local businesspeople, is that the Secture wil have continuous patrols on the corridor between the border and the first toll gate and as soon as they see a cop stop anyone, they will stop and investiate why the stop was made.
I don't know if they just thought of this in the heat of the meeting but that is what will be starting. Now, how long will it be in place? It's like someone asked me about the no ticket zone, that was a joke, something the substitute mayor dreamed up and was in place for a week, give or take a day or two.

All efforts are appreciated, FDT.

But I just cant help but question the effectiveness of coordination between law enforcement, tourism and the politicos. All of these entities seem infiltrated to such a degree that the crooks will know the game plan before it is even instituted and will have their plan B, based on it. I doubt plan B will be to cease and desist for anything but a short time. You destroy an ant hill, the ants just reform and rebuild the site.

No, I really think the concerted boycott is the way to go. No middleman to muck up the effectiveness, no subjective enforcement of the rules of engagement and no game plan to be leaked to the other side.

All the major players in this only ACT on one motivation.......dinero. They will talk morality but it's looking like morals are riding in the vest pocket over the heart instead of the heart. So be it.

DanO - 11-21-2007 at 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by grover
Federal Road personnel at the San Miguel toll booth told a victim that Federal Preventive Police clock out @ 9:00pm.

Now THAT, if true, is some key information. When the cats are away, the mice apparently will play. Just cements my commitment to never being on the road during the late night or early morning hours. If I can't make Ensenada by 9:00 p.m., I'm staying home.

fdt - 11-21-2007 at 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
[No, I really think the concerted boycott is the way to go. No middleman to muck up the effectiveness, no subjective enforcement of the rules of engagement and no game plan to be leaked to the other side.

All the major players in this only ACT on one motivation.......dinero. They will talk morality but it's looking like morals are riding in the vest pocket over the heart instead of the heart. So be it.

Ok, as a suggestion why not boycot the toll road, it would hurt the toll roads income.

Minnow - 11-21-2007 at 11:14 AM

Ferna, Go read the thread I posted under Baja crime and corruption. It will make your head spin.

They need to build a bridge from TJ to El Rosario.

Hook - 11-21-2007 at 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fdt

Quote:

Ok, as a suggestion why not boycot the toll road, it would hurt the toll roads income.

Are the toll roads privately administered? I thought it was the Federal govt.

Yes, of course, any part should be considered. If privately held, they will have sway with the Federal Govt, which is the only entity that will be able to ultimately fix this problem, IMO.

And not through inconvenient military checkpoints that the crooks can easily avoid and further discourage tourism. They need good intelligence and strong interdiction.

Maybe Mexico should consider hiring a Blackwater type firm to go after these guys in this corridor?

I am totally serious. Pay a firm that would be completely insulated from the fray and have better training and methods than Mexico has.

Hummer Forum Post

bajaguy - 11-21-2007 at 11:31 AM

Posted by a friend on a Hummer forum ...

i just got back from racing the baja 1000 and with the currant rains that they have had it made great trails for racing. the only problem is after this race i don't feel safe to ever go to baja again. there were quite a few deaths and one of the hummer communitys friends chris hall had his family kidnapped and his vehicle and trailer were taken from him at gun point...the mexican police took chris and his family to the U.S. boarder, the boarder gaurds would not let them use the restrooms, phones or give them a drink of water. they directed them to the mcdonalds a mile away. yes our tax dollars at work.....as you can tell i am a bit P.O'ed about this.
i am at this point thinking that my racing days are coming to a end. my family means more to me than the trophys in my office.
o.k. i feel better now,
hummech

Hook - 11-21-2007 at 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DanO

Quote:

Originally posted by grover
Federal Road personnel at the San Miguel toll booth told a victim that Federal Preventive Police clock out @ 9:00pm.

I think you're probably onto something there, but I have to wonder what two guys with handguns in a PFP squad car could (or would) do against the kind of firepower being displayed.

Dave - 11-21-2007 at 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
I think you're probably onto something there, but I have to wonder what two guys with handguns in a PFP squad car could (or would) do against the kind of firepower being displayed.

PFP carries auto weapons...But it's usually one guy.

[Edited on 11-21-2007 by Dave]

Tecate - Ensenada Road

ElFaro - 11-21-2007 at 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Minnow
Sunday is also the day you can expect a 4 hour wait at the Tecate Garrita.

Minnow...True if you show up at the crossing after 2PM on Sunday. That is why I said to drive EARLY Sunday AM. From San Quintin you get to the Tecate crossing about 11AM. From Ensenada (e.g. Estero) you get there about 10AM. A new alternative I am using is to take the Ensenada - Tijuana toll road north and then the free road to the new East-West toll road that starts at the FOX studio area. Then I head east and exit at the Tecate exit ramp off the East-West toll road and drop right into Tecate. This avoids the Tecate-Ensenada road all together. On Sunday I arrive at the Tecate crossing around 9-10 AM from Ensenada and the line is really short. 15-30 minute wait max.

Bajalover - 11-21-2007 at 04:40 PM

To Chris's family,
My heart goes out to you and the family, whether you drove at night or not.
It hit you as it could any of us; eventhough others include their strange points of view when they're not needed. Glad you got away w/o being harmed.

I'M ... NO.. LONGER GOING TO BAJA...... I ENJOYED BAJA FOR YEARS - BUT!!!

I don't need to lose my Airstream nor my truck pulling it - not to say my LIFE!!
Everyone on this site can say what you want about Baja - the good times are coming to an end and I don't want to be the last one laying at the side of the road.

FOR THE USA IMMIGRATION/CUSTOMS OFFICIALS :mad:

- they suck as much as the Mexican Police. They treat US Citizens as enemies of the state instead of the ones they should treat as enemies "the ones that come across as illegal criminals to benefit from the openess of our system".

comitan - 11-21-2007 at 05:25 PM

Bajalover, If you had a problem with Immigration its your own fault!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Immigration people here in La Paz are doing their Job, and I personally think they are doing, a good job. You do not know Baja or the Mexican people!!!!!!! That is my personal opinion and I will not discuss it further because nothing will change my mind. I too am sorry for the people that have been taken advantage of in the Northern Baja.

I'm leaving this but also have to apologize to Bajalover.

[Edited on 11-22-2007 by comitan]

Roberto - 11-21-2007 at 05:42 PM

Hello comitan? Knock knock? Anyone there? I don't think he was talking about Mexican immigration - rather comparing US immigration with Mexican police.

I don't really agree with what he said, but that's another discussion.

Minnow - 11-21-2007 at 06:02 PM

:lol:

Once again, Nomads taking reading comprehension to a new baja level. :lol:

aha baja - 11-21-2007 at 06:16 PM

guess the meth bust are up so these p.o.s. are making up for lost $. Karma shall eventually run over their dogma!!! :mad:

aha baja - 11-21-2007 at 06:24 PM

P.S. I hope they don't try to pull me over! HUGE MISTAKE FOR THEM... Better dealing with MEX justice than be carried by 6 pall berrers. I took a lesson from Rockhouse Tom. Be a Boyscout and be PREPARED!!! :fire:

DENNIS - 11-22-2007 at 07:11 AM

KOGO, a San Diego news and talk radio show, just this morning got around to reporting the Hall incident. Amazing. They certainly wouldn't want to disrupt the flow of tourist traffic into Mexico with commerce unfriendly facts like this before the holiday. This is the ultimate in irresponsibility.

David K - 11-22-2007 at 09:18 AM

You know... a break from Baja by us Nomads until things improve might send the loudest message to those who could act.

Mexitron - 11-22-2007 at 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
You know... a break from Baja by us Nomads until things improve might send the loudest message to those who could act.

Good idea but are there enough of us to even notice? We aren't economically important, in all reality. Someone was mentioning the racing community boycotting--that would probably raise a few eyebrows. Or get the weekender tourist trade to Ensenada somehow.

bajalou - 11-22-2007 at 09:51 AM

From a racing site----

From: Armando Carrasco <armando@toomuchfun.com.mx>
Date: November 20, 2007 9:31:40 PM PST
To: "Heffernan Building Services" <hirtintl@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Re; Baja MX Finals

What a shame!

I've lived in Rosarito for the last 30 years, and nothing like that had happened before. I' mountain bike at night, ride my dirt bike from my house to the hills all the way to Santa Veronica (Tecate) and back, run on the beach from point to point.
But this is very serious...

I came from Mexicali to study at the University of Baja (82-86), my Masters Degree is in Tourism, worked for the State Secretary of Tourism for 9 Years. And formed my own company (Too Much Fun Promotions) that have been promoting Baja for the last 25 years with more than 12 events per year!

This puts my Company, Profession and Business in trouble.

Tomorrow morning I'll request a meeting with the new State Secretary of Tourism, Mr. Oscar Escobedo, and will bring this to his desk....

What can we do?

Well the new Governor of Baja, Mr. Guadalupe Osuna Millan, promise to take care of this on his campaign, and he's got to do it! Mr. Escobedo is his representative in the matters of Tourism, and need to get his hands on the job.

I will also meet with the Elected Mayor of Rosarito, Mr. Hugo Torres (owner of the Rosarito Beach Hotel). I'll bet he will get on the job ASAP. He's getting a copy of this mail...

In the mean time, we'll need more details on the Chris Hall case... Exact date, times, description of vehicles, closest area where it happened, etc... so authorities can look for those criminals.

Please on behalf of the hard working people in Baja and the Tourism Industry, accept our apologies, and be sure we'll get to the bottom of this. We have no choice!

David K - 11-22-2007 at 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mexitron

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
You know... a break from Baja by us Nomads until things improve might send the loudest message to those who could act.

Yup, I know we are just a fraction. But, it's a place to start...

After Antonio's two brother-in-laws (one was a Tijuana policeman) were killed we stopped going for a while and now all this crap happening to Baja racers and surfers, etc..

We had a very nice vacation in Nevada and Arizona instead of going south for the 1000 this year and that seems to have been a good decision. Not only do the lack of tourists going south will have an affect, but all the tourist oriented businesses should be screaming to their political leaders for immediate action.

You know how much I love Baja, and it is sad that things have become so 'dark' that I am planning more USA vacations instead! I know that some time will pass and I will 'need' to return to the peninsula... perhaps via Mexicali only?

Ferna, Antonio (Baja Cactus), Jesse, Shari, Mia, etc. are the best allies we Norteamericanos have and could be the voices in Mexico needed to get to the governors of both Baja states that lawlessness will be the death of tourism in Baja.

Sal Fish (SCORE president) must have a serious meeting with both governors as well and threaten to pull the Baja races out of Baja until action is taken.

Just my opinion...

Bajalover - 11-22-2007 at 10:08 AM

Bajalou/David K - it really would be good to see both the San Diego side and the Tourism side in Baja take some active "public noticable" action to at least begin fighting these types of happenings. It would restore some faith in traveling south of the border w/o having to look over your shoulders all the time.
Besides Chris Hall's incidents, surfers have experienced and expressed similar situations - not just on the hwys, but on beaches within 200 miles of the border as well.
I KNOW THAT WE SHOULD NOT STOP before getting to San Quintin to call it a day.
But that alone doesn't help the safty issue.
Bajalou - I really really hope the Major, Tourism Industry can make an impact on this and make travel workable again.
Baja is a beautiful place and not being able to go anymore makes hearts sad and heavy.

BajaNomad - 11-22-2007 at 11:11 AM

Something I hadn't seen noted yet previously, but interesting, was this comment in the San Diego UT article this morning:

Quote:

...speculation in the Mexican media that extortion and other misdeeds by police have increased recently because of an anticipated crackdown once Tijuana's new mayor, Jorge Ramos, takes office Dec. 1.

Also, don't forget what time of year it is as well. I seem to recall increased problems prior to December holidays in the past. Yes?

55steve - 11-22-2007 at 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bruce R Leech
it is being sold by Parts.

I believe the trailer was empty...

DENNIS - 11-22-2007 at 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNomad
Also, don't forget what time of year it is as well. I seem to recall increased problems prior to December holidays in the past. Yes?

Yes it was that way and no it isn't any more.
I remember when things were smaller and more quiet....police would do their job and expect quiet gratuities, asking for donations to Christmas Balls etc, being more aggressive with traffic infractions and asking for five dollar fines. It was a comfortable expectation. Everybody knew it could and would happen to them, didn't care for it but, played the Christmas game. It didn't hurt. It was affordable.

It's a shame that the game has gone by the wayside, taken over by extortion and highway robbery by the same officers who would want five bucks for a present for their kids.

These men are the face of law and order in Mexico. They are what they are.

aha baja - 11-23-2007 at 08:45 AM

This incedent takes the term"Let's play good cop-bad cop"to an all time new level....

What do you expect?

Dave - 11-23-2007 at 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
It's a shame that the game has gone by the wayside, taken over by extortion and highway robbery by the same officers who would want five bucks for a present for their kids.

It's a logical extention. You expect corruption to exhibit restraint? :lol:

DENNIS - 11-23-2007 at 02:12 PM

One can only hope.

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