BajaNomad

GPS advice

dorbaja - 12-21-2007 at 11:08 AM

I'm planning to buy a GPS and wonder about what is both very affordable AND does a good job (especially living here in beautiful Baja). A TomTom One (3rd. ed.) is cheap but will it work well in Mexico?

Hook - 12-21-2007 at 11:17 AM

Define affordable.

Dont be caught up in the Xmas frenzy. Better deals to be had after the holidays. Be patient.

GPS units aren't nearly as valuable in Baja as they are in the US. A good map like the AAA map is all you need, if you arent going offroad or hiking. Hey, there aint that many roads, really.

I typically use cnet.com to review electronic products. Go to their review section and see how they rate units.

I prefer Garmin products.

David K - 12-21-2007 at 11:41 AM

Most of the 'street pilots' (ie. tom tom, etc.) are only for use in the U.S.

I have a Mio and use it to navigate to customers and other places... We used it going through Arizona, and it was great.

TecateRay - 12-21-2007 at 12:15 PM

I have a Garmin MAP76C along with the LB Maps Expeditioner maps of Baja. It not only provides all of the major routes through the state, some dirt roads, but it also provides actual street maps of the major cities. Wandering around La Paz or Cabo or Mexicali I have found the detail to be amazingly accurate and a big help in finding my way.

It might be a little pricey, but well worth it to me.:yes:

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-21-2007 at 12:16 PM

I have a Garmin Nuvi 250W GPS with the North America Map. I recently bought an SD Card with the Baja Expeditioner GPS Map to plug into my Nuvi GPS. I used it to go to El Rosario and it worked great. I think they have the Garmin Nuvi GPS loaded with the Mexico map which I believe includes all of Baja California. The card I bought covers from the Mexican Border all the way to the end of the Baja Peninsula. There are detailed street maps for some selected cities in Baja. Go to http://www.mexicomaps.com to view what they have. They even have topographic maps in SD Card form. It came in handy when I missed my turn in Tijuana to get back to border crossing and because I saved a way point when I first entered the border I was able to navigate back and get into the USA lanes.

805gregg - 12-21-2007 at 02:20 PM

I've got a Garmin 2610 I use on my motorcycles and cars, I have a card with Baja, one with topo of the western US and one with US citys, not cheap but works great.

bajalou - 12-21-2007 at 03:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by TecateRay
I have a Garmin MAP76C along with the LB Maps Expeditioner maps of Baja. It not only provides all of the major routes through the state, some dirt roads, but it also provides actual street maps of the major cities. Wandering around La Paz or Cabo or Mexicali I have found the detail to be amazingly accurate and a big help in finding my way.

It might be a little pricey, but well worth it to me.:yes:


I have the same thing Ray - works great - and you can take it with you up the trail at the end of the drive.

mgray - 12-21-2007 at 04:39 PM

I'm in the market as well and have done a little, but not alot of reading.

I've been hearing issues with those Mexico/Baja Atlas maps and the Nuvi's. Something about not being able to upload to the memory? I dont know if that means you can't upload to them, but you can always plug in a pre-loaded SD card?

I kinda like the Nuvi's, but I don't know if they are the best unit to use with the Mexico/Baja Atlas maps since I'm unsure if they provide a crum trail (starting to learn the GPS lingo) or allow saving waypoints and routes. I like the look of the screen shots on the LBmaps.com and Mexicomaps.com site (I think they are from the Garmin 76c), but I'm not sure if you can get that same kind of information from the Nuvi's.

And last, for me I'd like to be able to load the entire Mexico Atlas since I plan on venturing to the mainland, at least to PV or Acapulco. But since the whole Mexico Atlas map is apparently 219mb, I'm unsure how that factors in to all the Garmin units. I don't know if its as easy as buying a larger capacity SD card, or if the units themselves limit the amount available.

Anyways, hopefully someone can answer some of those Q's

Hook - 12-21-2007 at 05:17 PM

I believe the Nuvis will breadcrumb. What I dont believe they will do is save the breadcrumb trail as a separate file. And they dont let you share any files with other users. No routes, no tracks, no waypoint sharing. Garmin seems to want you to buy the preloaded map cards but you can upload maps from Mapsource through the USB connector OR you can write a .img file directly to the cards using a card reader/writer.

My experience with the Garmin badged maps of Mexico is that there is little detail in anything but the major cities; mostly the mainland.

On the SD card capacity, I have most of the Western US covered in the City Navigator maps, the 2008 topo maps, the Trip and Waypoint Manager, a tidal info program and more than a few of the National Parks maps (all from Garmin). It is taking up almost all of a 2 gig micro SD card. Seems like more than a few megs are being taken up by formatting and whatever else the cards need to store. You dont get 2 gigs of pure maps on a 2 gig card.

Individual map sizes should be the same across all Garmin products.

mgray - 12-21-2007 at 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hook
I believe the Nuvis will breadcrumb. What I dont believe they will do is save the breadcrumb trail as a separate file. And they dont let you share any files with other users. No routes, no tracks, no waypoint sharing. Garmin seems to want you to buy the preloaded map cards but you can upload maps from Mapsource through the USB connector OR you can write a .img file directly to the cards using a card reader/writer.

My experience with the Garmin badged maps of Mexico is that there is little detail in anything but the major cities; mostly the mainland.

On the SD card capacity, I have most of the Western US covered in the City Navigator maps, the 2008 topo maps, the Trip and Waypoint Manager, a tidal info program and more than a few of the National Parks maps (all from Garmin). It is taking up almost all of a 2 gig micro SD card. Seems like more than a few megs are being taken up by formatting and whatever else the cards need to store. You dont get 2 gigs of pure maps on a 2 gig card.

Individual map sizes should be the same across all Garmin products.


When you say no sharing, do you mean downloading from GPS to computer and giving to another person? I can still save my own routes and waypoints for the trip back tho can't I? What would saving the breadcrumb as a serperate file allow? More than one route? Basicaly I want to be able to map my multiple paths so that on the return journey I can visit routes I've saved, or get back to a place I know.

For some of the older Garmin units like the 76 series, will they accept large SD cards?? I thought I read some of the older units can only accept 8mb cards, which would mean that the Mexico Atlas would have to be broken up into a zillion cards!!

Hook - 12-21-2007 at 07:50 PM

My Nuvi experience is from someone who has recently bought a 760. We talk about his experiences daily, but not ALL of this is first hand knowledge for me.

We tried uploading and downloading routes and tracks. The routes were a combination of ones created manually in the Nuvi and ones created manually in Mapsource. While Mapsource seemed to be offering the transfer of these as an option in the download prompt, the routes never appeared in Mapsource or in the route category in the Nuvi 760; uploading or downloading.

I think the 76 series units will take much larger capacity cards. I think maybe they came with smaller cards. The 76 owners will verify this, if true. I believe the 60 and 76 series units use the micro SD cards and I BELIEVE the max capacity on those is 2 gigs. I think you have to go with a unit that takes the standard SD card for more capacity.

But 2 gigs is a lot of map. And they are pretty cheap now. You could burn ones with different maps and carry them with you, I suppose. All the western US is generally enough for me.

Saving the breadcrumbs (individual tracks, if you want) allows you to save an actual route you traveled, as opposed to saving a route created by the map itself. Tracks are more accurate; you will realize after having a GPS that some maps are not completely accurate with respect to the roads. Especially true of dirt roads or offroad travel using map software derived from older maps. Not a big deal usually but could be important for foot travel or offroad travel. I have some tracks to camps I only share with a few and I can send them a track that takes them right to the spot.

Also, I believe his 760 will only store TEN routes max. That's not much. If that's the case, you would have to write over old routes when you reach your maximum of ten.

So, basically, this thing is more suited to creating route and finding waypoints while in the car. And I have to admit that it is much more user friendly than my 60csx. But I like the ability to create routes in Mapsource and upload them BEFORE YOU GO. Or, bring along a laptop with Mapsource and load as you need.

UPDATE: I just got off the phone with him and his Nuvi is DOWN! Apparently it has a sliding on/off switch that broke off! After 1 month of very limited operation. He always felt that it was a very weak switch and sure enough. OH man, he's pi$$ed! He leaves for Utah on Sunday and wont have it.......

We're thinking this might be a silver lining. If he can trade it in for a more rugged one (this thing is beautiful but it is SOOO "city" with it's MP3 player, traffic alerting, etc.), he's gonna get something else. He didnt realize it was not trulycompatible with Mapsource.

governor - 12-22-2007 at 12:50 PM

do any of these units have street to street navigation throughout TJ? If so I would be al over that.

Nuvi and the Baja maps

TripleG - 12-22-2007 at 01:41 PM

I can confirm what Hook is saying about uploads to my Nuvi 660. I have talked to Alberto at bicimaps and he is very helpful. Seems you cannot upload direct from Mapsource to the Nuvi, but instead need to transfer (in my case-a Tijuana free road route) to Oziexplorer or similair program and then to the Nuvi. Of course this takes some learning on my part and at the moment hasn't happened.

I have up loaded the entire Baja Expeditioner to internal memory of the Nuvi and also the language guide. Seems to be plenty of internal space.

Interesting thread.

Thanks guys.:biggrin:

mgray - 12-22-2007 at 02:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by TripleG
I can confirm what Hook is saying about uploads to my Nuvi 660. I have talked to Alberto at bicimaps and he is very helpful. Seems you cannot upload direct from Mapsource to the Nuvi, but instead need to transfer (in my case-a Tijuana free road route) to Oziexplorer or similair program and then to the Nuvi. Of course this takes some learning on my part and at the moment hasn't happened.

I have up loaded the entire Baja Expeditioner to internal memory of the Nuvi and also the language guide. Seems to be plenty of internal space.


So you are saying the only way to get the Mexico Atlas (or portion of) on the Nuvi's is to use the program Oziexplorer?

What about if you bought the Maps preloaded on a SD card and plugged that in, would that work? I notice Mexicomaps.com sells both the preloaded SD card and a download.

Hook - 12-22-2007 at 08:17 PM

My experience with the Nuvi was that loading maps was no problem. With the Nuvi hooked up via its USB port, we were able to select its internal SD card as a source and wrote directly to it.

It's true routes and apparently waypoints that are the problem. You can create them internally in the Nuvi but not in Mapsource and then upload them to it.

bajalou - 12-22-2007 at 08:34 PM

I personally wouldn't want a GPS that I couldn't download/upload tracks as well as waypoints/routes. Keeping the tracks in my computer so I can reload them and retrace my explorations is important to me. Auto-routing on streets isn't something I care much about. Sooo highway travel in US = one type of GPS, off road and exploring Baja + one with different capabilities.

Up loading Nuvi routes

TripleG - 12-22-2007 at 09:34 PM

The creating of routes in Mapsource, which is a snap, and then uploading the route to the Nuvi 660 is not possible directly from Mapsource. You have to save the route as a *.gpx file in Mapsource, and then some how move to Oziexplorer which I'm told will then load to the Nuvi.

My problem is the Garmin file the route is saved in doesn't load in the Oziexplorer. Same Garmin file can be found, but no route file. The Oziexplorer doesn't seem to have a *.gpx function to make the route appear?? I only have a trial version of the Ozi so maybe that is a problem?

Anyone help me??

Hook - 12-22-2007 at 11:32 PM

Well, I was under the impression that .gpx files were a rather universal file format that GPS from most all mfgrs would be able to read. Not proprietary at all.

Try this GGG, assuming you do have Mapsource. Hook up the 660, open Mapsource and click the "downlload from unit icon". Make sure you have at least one route and maybe a track in the 660 and de-select the maps as a download option. If the route and the track appears in their respective tabs in Mapsource after downloading, use the Save As function in Mapsource and choose the .gpx file format in the pull down menu near the bottom of the Save As window. Then , see if Ozi will open that file and recognize the routes.

If not, you may want to snoop around on the gpsbabel.org site. I havent, but it sounds like you may find info about whether all this is possible on that site.

bajalou - 12-23-2007 at 11:35 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
Originally posted by bajalou
I personally wouldn't want a GPS that I couldn't download/upload tracks as well as waypoints/routes.
Which GPS are you using that you can actually upload a track (as differentiated from a route) to? I've always thought tracks were by their nature, read-only.

--Larry


Garmin Map76CSx is what I use but I think the 60CSx and several others will allow uploading tracks. I use OziExplorer but can use MapSource (I think) This is one of the most important parts of gps use for me.

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-23-2007 at 11:51 AM

Ok so I thought I knew it all and I don't. Can anyone tell me how to get the actual coordinates off of my Nuvi 250W. The map I was using is the Baja Expeditioner GPS Map which is on a plugin SD card. When I was in Rancho El Metate (Rancho San Juan De Dios) I saved the location on my Nuvi GPS. I remember it showed the coordinates as I was saving it. Now I cannot seem to find them. HELP.

Hook - 12-23-2007 at 02:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Ok so I thought I knew it all and I don't. Can anyone tell me how to get the actual coordinates off of my Nuvi 250W. The map I was using is the Baja Expeditioner GPS Map which is on a plugin SD card. When I was in Rancho El Metate (Rancho San Juan De Dios) I saved the location on my Nuvi GPS. I remember it showed the coordinates as I was saving it. Now I cannot seem to find them. HELP.


You mean you want to simply read the coordinates off the face of your Nuvi and write them down? Or you want to download the waypoint and use it elsewhere?

My answer to the first question is I dont know how and to the second, I'm not sure it's possible.

Unfortunately, in viewing the Nuvi 760 manual online, I was struck by how badly it sucked with respect to GPS info. This thing almost seems like a mp3 player first and a GPS second.

Garmin is getting hammered on a few message boards I've searched for the seeming regression of the Nuvi line as a whole.

Hook - 12-23-2007 at 03:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
Originally posted by bajalou
I personally wouldn't want a GPS that I couldn't download/upload tracks as well as waypoints/routes.
Which GPS are you using that you can actually upload a track (as differentiated from a route) to? I've always thought tracks were by their nature, read-only.

--Larry


Lorenzo, the trickiness I've found with my 60csx and tracks is that you need to be familiar with the options in the track menu to understand how to Start a Track and Stop a Track and then have the wherewithall to actually remember to do this on each leg you want to record as a track. by doing this you save discreet tracks as individual units, as opposed to letting it perpetually "breadcrumb" and ending up with a huge file.

You can also "divide tracks" in Mapsource if you have large ones that you want to separate into smaller ones. But here you become somewhat dependent on the accuracy of the maps if you are looking to start and end tracks at a specific geographic point. Understand it is not the track that is inaccurate in this method, just the placement of it on the map.

Hook - 12-23-2007 at 04:21 PM

I believe that .gpx files, which is what many Garmins wants to save tracks stored on the memory card (as opposed to storing on it's internal ram memory), is only lat/long recordings; no time or elevation recording.

However a track saved in its internal memory is a proprietary file and it should be able to share time, elevation, maybe even barometric readings with other Garmin devices.

bajalou - 12-23-2007 at 04:49 PM

As Hook states, the "Saved" track is stripped when it is saved to the card. The active track has all the data incl. speed etc. In a 76csx, if you set to record all tracks to the card, it saves all the data in a file by date, on file for each day. I use OziExplorer most of the time to edit, save, append, etc. I believe some of these can be done with MapSource, I'm used to using Ozi and find it much easier. With Ozi, saved waypoints, tracks, etc. can be loaded to many other brands of gps - but they have to have the ability to receive data from external source. Example, Magellan Meridian Gold will accept waypoints (or output waypoints) but will not output or accept tracks. I'm sure other Magellan units may handle tracks.? Lawrence units with a card can load tracks, waypoints etc to the card. Remember "Routes" are just a group of waypoints in a file that has them connected in a particular order. If you can load waypoints, you should be able to load routes.

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-23-2007 at 06:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hook
Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Ok so I thought I knew it all and I don't. Can anyone tell me how to get the actual coordinates off of my Nuvi 250W. The map I was using is the Baja Expeditioner GPS Map which is on a plugin SD card. When I was in Rancho El Metate (Rancho San Juan De Dios) I saved the location on my Nuvi GPS. I remember it showed the coordinates as I was saving it. Now I cannot seem to find them. HELP.


You mean you want to simply read the coordinates off the face of your Nuvi and write them down? Or you want to download the waypoint and use it elsewhere?

My answer to the first question is I dont know how and to the second, I'm not sure it's possible.

Unfortunately, in viewing the Nuvi 760 manual online, I was struck by how badly it sucked with respect to GPS info. This thing almost seems like a mp3 player first and a GPS second.

Garmin is getting hammered on a few message boards I've searched for the seeming regression of the Nuvi line as a whole.


Thanks Hook. Yeah I just wanted to get the Latutude and Longitude so I could put them on Google Earth. Oh Well! Thanks again.

[Edited on 12-24-2007 by ELINVESTI8]

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-24-2007 at 06:57 AM

Ok I figued it out with help. You have to plug your Nuvi into the computer with the USB and find the .gpx files and use Notepad to read it to get to the Latutude and Longitudes of the places you saved on the Nuvi 250W. Thank you to those of you who responded to my dumbness.