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GNUKID

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kimberlee - 1-29-2008 at 01:19 PM

Yawn. this is the Baja NEWS fourm

gibson - 1-29-2008 at 01:57 PM

DOPE

Skeet/Loreto - 1-29-2008 at 01:57 PM

Yes Kimberlee- A "newbie".

You may be bored with my Offer or maybe wise enough to do an Investigation on your on.

My offer was not meant to be a "Classified Ad" since it would be Non-Profit.
It was meant to :Help" GNUKID" with the Collection of Facts. So that others also may be willing and Able to try to Learn things that they cannot do themselves

I would Hope that you could have Understood

Skeet/Loreto.

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 02:30 PM

Thank you Skeet.

I, like you, believe in the good of La Paz. I believe we all want to make La Paz more safe and more gentle. But it just isn't that easy...

I assume you are referring to the specific incident I witnessed last week with kidnapping and extortion. Why don't you u2u me and we can meet at your leisure anytime-today would be great-it would be nice to meet you, and perhaps it can be more clear to you. Heck you probably know me already from around town. I'll pass on the details and all contacts to you via u2u and you can take it up. Though don't step on anyones toes, the investigation is underway. A phone call or visit won't hurt.

But please be careful and don't suggest that I am somehow a victim or involved other than as a witness and advocate who is likely already too scared to testify, again. In this case i rescued friends from a typical scam. I don't need to spend more time making corrupt cops with guns and sandanista masks more mad than they are for me busting up their gigs.

Having spent the majority of my life here too, I can't imagine anyone who thinks that these are lies, as a group we (in la paz) are surprised by reactions of denial but I understand it is upsetting and therefore many people have different reactions.

Many scams have occurred especially recently, they say its related to the election, my concern is the safety of family, friends and neighbors and really I don't believe anyone will pursue prosecuting the cops who rob people.

We are heavily involved in many community activities and charities at this time and we have had ample time to discuss these issues among many people including many leaders, none of whom have chosen denial but instead apathy or something along those lines would be more accurate.

I expect to live here for a long time too, so if the majority of Nomads don't believe or expect things to change that's fine. I have better things to do than to battle corruption 24/7.

I am more interested in adventure and ecology.

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 02:49 PM

Not sure this is related but I solved another crime the last few days which I am also proud to report.

I went to an event party with about 100-200 people. There I imagined how certainly some drunk would side swipe every car at the party. I went outside and sure enough my car had been hit. I stayed calm. I took pics of the tracks, tire tread and paint marks. Then I began driving up and down the streets, slowly down every one looking for a car that matched the tires and paint. Low and behold after 20 minutes I found it! I went to the door and knocked, and out came a gringo who I know! He said, "oh gee I am so sorry, I was going to come and find you later, it was late I just left, I know the car is your baby, I hope its nothing!" I replied, "don't worry about it we'll get it fixed it won't be expensive," but inside boy was I mad and shocked. It takes all kinds. But I caught em, again. yay.

Gnupersleuth

p.s. Skeet I got a lot of stories and they are all true. I am an honest and happy person and a member in good standing in my community.

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 03:45 PM

I have u2ued everything to you, contacts, names and locations and there is an official police report which I have a copy of. They don't often give out copies of reports but this was a gift from the police prosecutor to pursue this case. Please report back here that you did or didn't receive the data and make the calls right now to the people and numbers i gave you. Your effort will help, if you are polite and respectful. I also expect an apology from you.

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gibson
DOPE

No drugs were involved. The police in fact took tests of the victims which are in evidence of the case showing no drugs, a positive result would otherwise have been used to their detriment but in this case it is evidence to the benefit of the victims.

bancoduo - 1-29-2008 at 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto

While you are looking around you might check into the Case of "Chopy" for basic Inormation go to the early Threads of this Board.

Keep up the Good Work.
Skeet/Loreto

GnuKid

I think he's insinuating that you could be a "dead man walking" if you keep pursuing this. :cool:

Cypress - 1-29-2008 at 04:18 PM

Skeet and GnuKid, Why don't you hash this out U2U? :bounce:

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 04:24 PM

I agree... I am not pursuing this.

I am a quiet kid who wants nothing to do with trouble.

Its quite a bit different for those of you who are sitting in the lap of luxury up in the US or Canada--in your nice office or in the living room watching tv. You feel brave and confident and you see no way for these things to be the way we live, but this is how we live in mexico. At the same time, we get t go fishing and surfing and we have a great life full of love and friendship.

Skeet said he wants to pursue determining if I am telling the truth. I hope he understands that it is up to la paz minsterio to pursue their problems if they choose, not us.

The truth is there are a laundry list of reasons for corrupt police--the most basic is they cant pay their bills on 6000 pesos a month and they need to feed their families. There is no money. Gringos have money. They are hungry. Get it?

Skeet/Loreto - 1-29-2008 at 07:02 PM

Gnukid:
To late! I have already pursued this Story;

This Incident did not Happen as related by you on this Board.

Out of Respect to the Good members of this Board I am deleting this Post.

Skeet/Loreto

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 07:04 PM

Huh?

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 07:07 PM

Ok thanks skeet its all taken care of then. Thanks for all your help.

Skeet

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 07:41 PM

Skeet has maligned the reputation of people here with no regard for the well being of residents and no factual presentation of his delusions.

To be clear, I made a huge mistake in trusting him to be kind to people here, his actions caused a great deal of stress and trauma and likely have endangered the victims of crimes here in ways far more serious than he is apparently aware.

Its unfortunate what happened over the last few hours under his actions and my trusting of him. We can all learn about culture and people through these posts. I am happy for that at least, to know more about the differences and hopefully I will learn to be less open and less trusting of people such as Skeet who would do more harm than good in serious matters.

Roberto - 1-29-2008 at 07:48 PM

Kid,

I have had my disagreements with Skeet. That said you can't come on a public Internet site, make those kinds of accusations and not back them up in any way. Either shut up, or put up. Anything else would make you a person of no honor, and someone who should be banned from this website. So, put up or STFU.

Oso - 1-29-2008 at 08:34 PM

Ditto, more or less, that. The skeetereman is an old timer here and you are not. Many of us do not agree with much he has said over the years but still afford him a modicum of respect for much that he has said. If nothing less, he is a repository of knowledge about what Baja once was. Until you have demonstrated enough for a relative degree of such respect you would be wise to STFU.

Hook - 1-29-2008 at 08:41 PM

What..........gnukid has to show his "sources" whereas Skeet gets a free ride with this latest contentions? Based on his having first been in Baja 50 years ago?

I say Skeet needs to come forward with what he has supposedly found out, too, and cite where he got it. It cuts both ways.

Skeets's getting pretty far removed from Baja at this point. The place has changed dramatically in 5 years.................it's much different than the Llano.

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 08:42 PM

Forget it, Roberto and Skeet are totally loco. Who in the world would go to such lengths to deny a sad incident and complete report which has official stamps, witnesses, exact police officers names, locations, identified victims, odd circumstances. THe cops already have backed down and admitted they had a "misunderstanding." How would those things be made up? How would so much data be available if it was false? You are totally delusional and worse hurtful.

Good for you. If it makes you happy I will not mention anything about crime that we suffer.

I have no interest in playing this game with you and Skeet. This is not a video game. People's well being and lives are at stake. Its not fun I didn't enjoy being part of it. You think I like having guns piointed at me and threats made by crazy cops as often as it happens? Do you really think I would report an incident for any reason other than I witnessed it, was present and I am concerned? I am out. I have zero confidence in Skeet, who should stand up and acknowledge he received tons of factual data, copies and contacts and who knows what he did except exacerbate the problems and traumatize people involved. Scary. Why do you think Mexicans have contempt for Gringos? For exactly this type of nonsense. Believe me, we will never forget what Skeet did to the people involved today. Really something to be ashamed of.

vgabndo - 1-29-2008 at 08:48 PM

Where is the DATA for this thread? Can someone point me to the original thread? Was it edited out, creating the confusion?

OK this has been made clear by the compilation of the threads....

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by vgabndo]

soulpatch - 1-29-2008 at 08:52 PM

Wud up, G?
Why would anyone think Skeet has any credibility after reading any of his posts? Whatever he was or supposedly was, he ain't now.

soulpatch - 1-29-2008 at 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
If he had the goods on Gnukid after challenging him publicly, why would he simply dump the post?

I am guessing it's because he is a nut.

gibson - 1-29-2008 at 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vgabndo
Where is the DATA for this thread? Can someone point me to the original thread? Was it edited out, creating the confusion?

it's a conspiracy by the owners of BajaNomad enticing you to be continually logged on, not to miss any drama.
DAMN this site is addicting when mixed with the love of baja, and they know it!!

"bring the Minnow back, just bar him from baja!!" :lol:

vgabndo - 1-29-2008 at 09:08 PM

Gibson...amazing ain't it. I have less than 1000 posts, but I'll bet if there was a record of the number of log-on's since Doug started the site I'd be a mega-something. It is really hard to stay away, especially when you are in the final weeks of preping for the next trip!

There are dual sport motorcycle and land sailing sites I visit, but they can't hold a candle to my interest in my "family" here on Nomads.

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by vgabndo]

Actually, the Minnow is back....

thebajarunner - 1-29-2008 at 09:26 PM

Quote:

"bring the Minnow back, just bar him from baja!!" :lol:

and quite well behaved too, I might add!!

gnukid - 1-29-2008 at 10:04 PM

This isn't so complicated:

A few days in a row, gringos recieved large tabs at a totally empty club after a couple drinks.

Police arrive in seconds to arrest the scoundrel gringos who question paying the mere $12541 peso surprise tab, so they move the gringos around town in the back of a truck with guys in masks over dirt roads and stop in to taunt them at various stations.

The help comes in the form of good cops who intervene on behalf of the gringos who still pay a hefty payment to escape.

Official reports exist with official stamps, original copies, police names, victims, locations, bar owner names that states the gringos each finally agreed to pay $3000 to be freed.

Skeet intervenes and nonsense ensues on BajaNomad as viejitos cry foul: Surfers go back to surfing.

vgabndo - 1-29-2008 at 10:08 PM

Skeet and I have a long past of mutual respect where our common ground of experience exists in San Nicolas', and extreme ugliness on the off topic forum (which I quit cold turkey in the middle of last year). I have not found Skeet to be accountable when any of his many false accusations were refuted on the off topic forum. My personal experience tells me that it is perfectly correct for folks on this board to hold Skeet's feet to the fire. In my world, you don't call a man a lier unless you've got the absolute proof and you lay it right on the %&*#$%!! table.

Here's the table Skeet. I invite you to be responsible or be accountable.

Roberto - 1-29-2008 at 10:11 PM

Ok, with the new "data" things look significantly different. When I posted, all I saw was tjhis post from gnukid

Quote:

Skeet has maligned the reputation of people here with no regard for the well being of residents and no factual presentation of his delusions.

What do the added posts tell me (entirely subjective)? We are dealing with TWO (as opposed to one) certifiable kooks. :lol:

I jumped down the kids throat because I saw wild accusations with no backup. With what I see now, I wish I had kept my mouth shut. Hopefully I will remember this lesson in the future. Carry on.

bajabound2005 - 1-29-2008 at 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by thebajarunner
"bring the Minnow back, just bar him from baja!!" :lol:

and quite well behaved too, I might add!!

I and many other Nomads pray you are wrong!

capt. mike - 1-30-2008 at 06:35 AM

i would like to know here who besides me has met Skeet face to face and talked with him - in person.
well i have - at the book signing, 1st one.
and then again in mulege.
i find him to be honest , knowledgeable and trustworthy.
and a true friend of all things Baja.

his experience is broad and deep.
when i do my Mexican development and if he's around and available i'd hire him in a heart beat.

Skeet - iligetimi whippersnappers non carborundum ol' buddy!!

vgabndo - 1-30-2008 at 06:48 AM

Mike, you obviously don't have the grave character defect of having received your college education at Cal Berkeley. Skeet has made it perfectly clear, in his "reasonable" way, that just living in a Berkeley zip code automatically makes a person unfit to draw breath out of the same atmosphere as a good god fearing man like himself. :lol:

bajadedom - 1-30-2008 at 07:39 AM

Gloves or Dueling pistols??

Oso - 1-30-2008 at 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Roberto
Ok, with the new "data" things look significantly different. When I posted, all I saw was tjhis post from gnukid

Quote:

Skeet has maligned the reputation of people here with no regard for the well being of residents and no factual presentation of his delusions.

What do the added posts tell me (entirely subjective)? We are dealing with TWO (as opposed to one) certifiable kooks. :lol:

I jumped down the kids throat because I saw wild accusations with no backup. With what I see now, I wish I had kept my mouth shut. Hopefully I will remember this lesson in the future. Carry on.

Oops!, me too. Stepped into it thinking it was just mud. If I'd seen what preceded what looked like an unprovoked attack, I would have been better off with a cup of my own STFU.

Natalie Ann - 1-30-2008 at 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vgabndo
Mike, you obviously don't have the grave character defect of having received your college education at Cal Berkeley. Skeet has made it perfectly clear, in his "reasonable" way, that just living in a Berkeley zip code automatically makes a person unfit to draw breath out of the same atmosphere as a good god fearing man like himself. :lol:

I'm from Berkeley - and Skeet and I are old friends. When my friend died unexpectedly in Baja Sur, Skeet immediately sent me information about how to proceed and who would be a good abogado to call for the legal stuff. At other times he has filled me in on special places in Baja to fly or visit via land travel. I value his friendship and his information.

Nena

DENNIS - 1-30-2008 at 09:03 AM

I too am a member of the Skeet Fan Club.........I don't care what he said.

Paula - 1-30-2008 at 09:21 AM

I've met Skeet, and he is a great guy. A man of strong opinions that I often don't agree with, but truly a good person.

elgatoloco - 1-30-2008 at 09:23 AM

Perspective
the choice of a context or a reference (or the result of this choice) from which to sense, categorize, measure or codify experience, cohesively forming a coherent belief, typically for comparing with another.
To choose a perspective is to choose a value system and, unavoidably, an associated belief system. When we look at a human perspective, it is a more social value system and its associated beliefs.

weltanschauung
a comprehensive conception or apprehension of the world especially from a specific standpoint

ed- stolen from the internets

gnukid - 1-30-2008 at 09:27 AM

This is really silly, an initial post about police misconduct divides you posters into two groups--those that insult each other and those that defend those who insult each other. Have you no compassion or reason?

Obviously many of you would go to great lengths to obsfucate the simple message--watch out for the overcharge scam, which leads to extortion and kidnapping. Stay calm.

Skeet however did three things wrong, he called the witnesses liars, insulted the integrity of the victims and traumatized those involved then attempted to damage everyones credibility.

Whatever his motivation--however good and kind and knowledgeable, he owes me and those victims and you here an apology. And he owes it to Baja to either get involved in a helpful, kind and positive way or stay out of the issue of corruption.

BajaTrooper - 1-30-2008 at 09:33 AM

Well... no more General Hospital for me! This is so much more katty! :lol:

elgatoloco - 1-30-2008 at 09:38 AM

gnukid

Thanks for the heads up on the scam.

gnukid - 1-30-2008 at 09:49 AM

And really what is worse? Lets say you are a newly arrived gringo and you enter an empty restaurant in let's say la paz, you want to enjoy your visit and you are happy to spend your money there, but something goes really weird that you don't understand--you receive a bill for $12541 pesos after having drinks and all the glasses are on the table. The bill of $12541 would account for hundreds of drinks? It makes no sense? The restaurant owner shows you receipts for what looks like hundreds of drinks? In the same moments 6 Policia are standing over you with guns and masks and they tell you you are going to the ATM to get the money. So, fine you say, let's go, but they don't take you to the bank? They aggressively push you around and throw you in the bed of a truck and drive rapidly over really bumpy dirt roads and arroyos in circles, while you fly around like a ping pong ball. Periodically, the glaze eyed cops stop at other jail cells apparently looking for a place to hide until they arrive at one subcommandancia a long way away. Its very small and remote and there they tell you they are going to make you pay for your crimes, no charges are filed, they is no evidence of crimes there is only the threat of permanent life in jail if you don't pay whatever they ask and they are asking for a lot.

Now, if that happened to you, obviously there is no reasonable explanation, either there are charges such as two gringos robbed a restaurant or there is a case of kidnapping and extortion. Either one or the other. This point is clear and the more that it sticks the easier the whole problem becomes.

If you are the victim and you don't speak spanish well or undersand the type of spanish spoken by the capital city cops, you would have no idea what happened, or where you are, or why you are there or what they want except that guys with masks and guns are demanding money and its doesn't seem right. In fact it seems really wrong.

Of course, if a knowledgeable Mexican authority pursued the case (which never happens) you would have many varying stories and defenses from the 6 cops, the various capitans respsonible, the restaurant owner, all of which are indefenseable to any reason or logic.

Enter Skeet, who I too believe is capable of many things like any good samaritan, including being careful, discrete and kind while asking what happened. Just asking the question kindly can get huge results, but one must move cautiously to avoid inflaming the situation. One must simply ask the people involved to defend their postition which is impossible--aha the catch!

Rarely does a paper trail exist in mexico which notes the masked cops names, the victims, the mastermind of the scam, the times and locations and notes the demand for money and notes money was paid for the release of the victims. But in this case it does becuase it was obvious to fellow cops that this wasn't meant to be, it stinks to high heaven to have this continue unabated. The report is a simple gift to anyone who will pursue it naming the bad guys.

Whatever the case, WHO would then waste their time attacking credibility of the victims? or the report and attempt to justify that was all reasonable or somehow deserved? You would. Skeet would. WHY because you are scared that these things happen. You would prefer to deny the reality than live with the truth.

But that isn't the answer, the answer is to be calm, know that things will go right in the end, good people eventually are proven right and bad guys are proven to be bad guys. So if it happens to you don't panic, the bad guys are just teasing you, they can't and wont hurt you, they are just small town cops who are trying to intimidate you and they will eventually let you go, sooner than later. Stay Calm.

Now, go play with your dogs and let's wait for a HUGE apology from Skeet and hopefully some effort to mitigate the damage he's done in this case.

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by gnukid]

kimberlee - 1-30-2008 at 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
What..........gnukid has to show his "sources" whereas Skeet gets a free ride with this latest contentions? Based on his having first been in Baja 50 years ago?

I say Skeet needs to come forward with what he has supposedly found out, too, and cite where he got it. It cuts both ways.

Skeets's getting pretty far removed from Baja at this point. The place has changed dramatically in 5 years.................it's much different than the Llano.

you hit the nail = right on the head hook! :coolup:

sorry HOSE A that you have to play referee to all of this

gnukid don't sweat the small stuff this will pass as entertaining as it is, hook es correcto en todas sus palabalas allí arriba

tripledigitken - 1-30-2008 at 10:56 AM

I'm just curious if any of the Nomad residents of La Paz have met Gnukid. If they have they sure are curiously quiet. :?:

Reading back through his posts over the last year makes me wonder why Gnukid would continue to live in that environment.

Ken

gnukid - 1-30-2008 at 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
I'm just curious if any of the Nomad residents of La Paz have met Gnukid. If they have they sure are curiously quiet. :?:

Reading back through his posts over the last year makes me wonder why Gnukid would continue to live in that environment.

Ken

Hmmm have you evr lived somewhere that you called home? Have you had friends and neighbors and loved ones and had roots but once in awhile bad guys tried to rob the neighbors or you?

It happens, but we live here. This is our home.

So what do you do, you work together to make the community more safe. You educate, you raise awareness, you work with the community and you make little improvements to the security of the neighborhood.

Funny though, Ken, are you suggesting that you want to discourage me to leave my home, run me outta' town because I know about some attempted robberies?

might actually get out more than the average retiree and while doing so, on many adventures I saw robbers... If you had any idea or lived life out on the playas and arroyos you too would find there are lots of good people and a few bad ones. I report it because we want to help our town.

What kind of person does that make you?

And yes I know many many people here on line and here in town. We are all happily working toward living our lives and resolving the problems described here.

And no, we're not leaving.

JESSE - 1-30-2008 at 11:25 AM

I love this thread :lol:

Skeet is a real person

David K - 1-30-2008 at 11:26 AM

Like Capt. Mike, I met Skeet at the Pyramid Resort's first book signing party... Here is Jimmy Smith with his arm on Skeet...

I am with Ken and wonder if La Paz is so horrible, why would Gnu want to be anywhere near there...

I also want to add that I do not have any reason to not believe his story at this time... but some other people with that experience in La Paz really should come forward to help validate Gnukid's story.

Paula - 1-30-2008 at 11:27 AM

Boy, Gnukid, you've got me stumped. You sound like an honest, sincere person who just wants to help people by giving a heads up on a potential situation. But you're talking about a La Paz I've never seen. Maybe we just hang out in different places at different times, and my La Paz is safer than yours. Anyway, thanks for the info.

comitan - 1-30-2008 at 11:33 AM

Paula

Would you be out bar hopping at 3AM like these guys were doing, in La Paz or anywhere!!!!!!!!!!

Cervisin - 1-30-2008 at 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
I love this thread :lol:

..doesn't that avatar supposed to indicate good taste.... :lol:

Paula - 1-30-2008 at 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
Paula

Would you be out bar hopping at 3AM like these guys were doing, in La Paz or anywhere!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely not!

Well, maybe a few years back... :bounce:

tripledigitken - 1-30-2008 at 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
I'm just curious if any of the Nomad residents of La Paz have met Gnukid. If they have they sure are curiously quiet. :?:

Reading back through his posts over the last year makes me wonder why Gnukid would continue to live in that environment.

Ken

I'm not suggesting that you give up on La Paz and bail. Just find a safer neighborhood. If the neighborhood I lived in was such as yours, for the safety of myself and family I would find a better place to live. Of all the Nomads that live in La Paz you seem to be in the minority of being exposed to so much crime and drama. Best of luck. I love your City and it saddens me everytime you post a new incident. In your mind in makes me a bad person to suggest you move to a safer neighbor. :?:

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by tripledigitken]

kimberlee - 1-30-2008 at 11:52 AM

I don't know gnukid but am wondering how many of you speak spanish and have had those who do not ask you for help?

<crickets>

maybe this is the position that gnukid is in
and maybe he is experiencing situations that a non spanish speaker normally wouldn't enounter unless they were unfortunate victims.

:light:

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by kimberlee]

The Gull - 1-30-2008 at 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Paula

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
Paula

Would you be out bar hopping at 3AM like these guys were doing, in La Paz or anywhere!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely not!

Well, maybe a few years back... :bounce:

The last time I did that, I had a $1200 bar bill but the local cops didn't offer the cab service back to my hotel.

gnukid - 1-30-2008 at 12:32 PM

From long term experience this week things will go crazy... The bad cops need to get in their last robberies before the new power takes place and then a bunch of new problems will begin. And most importantly, recuerdes que la ley seco en domingo (no beer buying on sunday).

We are all pretty excited and talking about the elections. Anyway, after many days of electoral discussion, do you know that I hear from many Pacenos that they believe that gringos come here but don't contribute much? They think gringos bring almost everything they need from the US, special olives, cheeses, wine, etc... even chairs gasp and buy and spend very little here, arguiing about the prices etc... taking advantage of free beaches and oceans.

Just so you know, you might want to make an effort to get involved in your communities and demonstrate your contributions. It would be appreciated but its also a responsibility. There is no them and us, solo nosotros juntos.

JESSE - 1-30-2008 at 12:58 PM

For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

capt. mike - 1-30-2008 at 01:01 PM

i am pretty conservative with respect to lazy fair politics.
but libertarian when it comes to personal freedoms.

one of my good friends took his masters at Cal Berkely. He is intellegent bordering on genius and hilarious. Skeet would appreciate his style for sure.
can't judge a bookie by his zip code.

Cervisin - 1-30-2008 at 01:04 PM

Jesse: More power to you. I feel the same... Sorry about my remark before. You right - in fact that thread is getting better by the minute....

The Gull: You been in a "restaurant" like Lord Black or such... ???

No taxi service?? Maybe they had not the complete uniform (i.a. ski-mask on them....)

Thanks for the reminder... somebody comes down from S.D. and can bring me some olives?? I like the ones stuffed with garlic...

And maybe bring some cheese for that guys whine....

comitan - 1-30-2008 at 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

do you know that I hear from many Pacenos that they believe that gringos come here but don't contribute much? They think gringos bring almost everything they need from the US, special olives, cheeses, wine, etc... even chairs gasp and buy and spend very little here, arguiing about the prices etc... taking advantage of free beaches and oceans.

That statement just goes to show that you know nothing about the overall picture in La Paz, Just why are all these gringos asking where to buy furniture and many other items on this forum, if you would get out of that barrio you live in and go to some of the stores you will see many gringos buying big ticket items and helping the economy. You have yet to convinced me that you are helping La Paz in any way with your gossip.

Just where do you think all the people that are buying the thousands of homes being built in La Paz are buying all the furnishings. And what are the workers that are building these homes contributing to the economy of La Paz, all in all very short sided thinking.

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by comitan]

[Edited on 1-30-2008 by comitan]

gnukid - 1-30-2008 at 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

I agree--just remind yourself with la policia coruptada its all a silly game and the most patient wins. Move slowly, stay calm and wait it out.

Oso - 1-30-2008 at 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

I agree--just remind yourself with la policia coruptada its all a silly game and the most patient wins. Move slowly, stay calm and wait it out.

While you're waiting for Skeet's, you can have my apology. Apparently something was deleted and I thought your slam was coming out of the blue.

Now, what I want is the name of the place so I can be sure I never go anywhere near there.

Russ - 1-30-2008 at 05:16 PM

Wow, Kid you can really stir a nice caldo! I'm enjoying the hell out of this thread.

Pescador - 1-30-2008 at 09:23 PM

I have greatly enjoyed all the years of posting by Skeet and loved his ornery and cantankerous personality. Over the years you got to be able to pretty well predict what Skeet was going to say about something but there was always a thread underneath that rang true and while you did not have to agree with things he said, you knew that he believed it.

Gnukid has been posting since he came on the scene not too long ago and he also has a definite flavor and (scent) to his postings. I find it very hard to take them completely seriously. I do think that they accurately portray how he sees the world and experiences it but I find it so far removed from my perceptions that I am always slightly jarred by the revelations expressed.

DENNIS - 1-30-2008 at 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pescador
I have greatly enjoyed all the years of posting by Skeet and loved his ornery and cantankerous personality. Over the years you got to be able to pretty well predict what Skeet was going to say about something but there was always a thread underneath that rang true and while you did not have to agree with things he said, you knew that he believed it.

If I didn't know better, I'd think this was an obituary.

Cap - 1-30-2008 at 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

We are all pretty excited and talking about the elections. Anyway, after many days of electoral discussion, do you know that I hear from many Pacenos that they believe that gringos come here but don't contribute much? They think gringos bring almost everything they need from the US, special olives, cheeses, wine, etc... even chairs gasp and buy and spend very little here, arguiing about the prices etc... taking advantage of free beaches and oceans.

Just so you know, you might want to make an effort to get involved in your communities and demonstrate your contributions. It would be appreciated but its also a responsibility. There is no them and us, solo nosotros juntos.

I don't know Skeet or Gnukid outside of their postings here. But, This kind of anti-norteno, idealistic lecturing doesn't endear you to anyone. Maybe (and this is pure conjecture) people only doubt your story, because thay can't believe anyone would be so careless as to make themselves this big of a target. Getting overly excited about the politics of a foreign country is another way to paint the cross hairs on yourself.

I know older guys can be surly and like to hear themselves roar (more conjecture), and they are slow to admit when they are wrong. Again, not an endearing quality.

JESSE - 1-31-2008 at 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

I agree--just remind yourself with la policia coruptada its all a silly game and the most patient wins. Move slowly, stay calm and wait it out.

I am from Tijuana gnukid, the La Paz PD seems like mall security guards compared to the Tijuana cops. And i have never seen Mexican cops stop to help you when your car breaks down, or stop traffick in order for pedestrians to cross the street like La Paz Police do all the time.

I wouldnt change La Paz cops for any other in Mexico, regardless of a few typical bad behaviors they might have.

shari - 1-31-2008 at 04:42 PM

This thread is so interesting...so my dos pesos follows...I tend to believe gnukid as I have seen some pretty crazy extortion scams in a small town in BCS (not Asuncion) and was very amazed by them...that was before I was a Nomad...I had kind of forgotten about them until gnukid brought up this type of scam and I remembered these....which are true...happened to gringos that I tried to help deal with them...I choose not to divulge the info to protect myself and my family but this crap does happen...even in nice towns...I applaud gnukids attempt to warn people not to be naive...hey...even I sometimes find myself in a bar in La Paz in the wee hours in a rather "happy" state....and I'm glad to be warned of the possibilities. Even though I knew these scams existed in the place I lived, I never thought about moving from there...just learned to be more aware...street smart...its' a challenge living in another culture and ALOT goes on that most of you would never imagine. Now, if you live in baja, it's hard not to be involved in politics especially now that the elections for county seats...presidente del municipio...are on sunday...every single person is talking about who will win and the changes that will come about...everything changes with a new election and there is so much craziness right now of people trying to protect their jobs by keeping thier "gallo" candidate in power.

Whoa

The Gull - 1-31-2008 at 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

Hey wait a goll dang minute, most American cities are as dangerous as Baghdad without the comparison to La Paz. No way should ANY American city be compared to La Paz.

American cities specialize in violent crime against others and we sustain it through our effective educational system, political system, economic system and policing & court policies.

We will never be outdone in the area of crime by the likes of La Paz and to try to compare is, in itself, an insult.

Hook - 1-31-2008 at 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

Yes, but who officially records the crime rate? Who has the power to ignore incidents, refuse to take a crime report, extort money from legitimate perpetrators of crime (in lieu of charges), intimidate victims into not filing a report, "lose" a report if they insist on filing one anyway and then conveniently not count all the reports that might end up getting when the count is asked for in Mexico City?

The same people this thread is questioning....................THE POLICE OF LA PAZ.

Jesse, I dont doubt that it's infinitely better than TJ. But crime statistics in Mexico have always been suspect. Way on the low side. It's generally left up to news organizations to come up with realistic figures on the number of murders in Mexico. Who knows about lesser crimes???

amir - 1-31-2008 at 08:40 PM

No comment.

Cap - 1-31-2008 at 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
Now, if you live in baja, it's hard not to be involved in politics

efine involved. Can you vote? Can you legally involve yourself in any way?
It is morally presumptuous for foreigners to offer opinions about anything involving another country's governance. It reminds me of all of the Canadians offering unsolicited advice and punditry about American politics and government.

Most tourist towns in Mexico survive on a milder form of the scam purported by Gnukid. Cabo was built on overcharging.

Keep yourself out of trouble, don't run a tab in places you don't know, and trust the help, and butt out of other people's business.

Terry28 - 1-31-2008 at 09:47 PM

Cap,
I wish I said that...well done.

UFC Rules?

Lee - 1-31-2008 at 10:05 PM

Skeet might not be up to date on La Paz. And he can be opinionated and orrnery but I like him -- but not always what he has to write.

Gnukid is a straight shooter and someone I want to meet next time I'm in La Paz. Like he has written, it's not all that complicated. I believe he has insight and good advice.

No further comment.

JESSE - 1-31-2008 at 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

Hook,

La Paz seems like a small town to me, i dont know where gnukid hangs out, but in the two years that i have been here, and from what i have seen and heard, La Paz is a pretty safe and tranquil city. I cant deny gnukids experience, but mine is completely different from his, in my experience, local cops are pretty helpful and honest, and i have yet to meet someone that has been robbed or his house broken into yet.

Just my two centavos

The old days

Lee - 1-31-2008 at 10:38 PM

Last time I was at Migracion on the Malecon, a cop did stop traffic so me and my dog could cross. Now he might ''fine'' me for having my dog on the Malecon?

shari - 2-1-2008 at 09:43 AM

By "involved", I don't mean vote...but in everyday life in a baja town revolves around politics, particularly these last months before local elections. Family members campaign for thier favorites and everyone talks politics and lots of issues that affect those who live here involve politics. Many things are on hold till the "new" government comes in and changes things...other things are shoved through quickly before the old guard changes. What I am trying to portray is how our daily life is affected by politics....like it or not. Being married to a mexican family (here you arent' just married to the man) is different than just being a foreigner living here with your foreign spouse. I see mexican culture through very different ojos. One of the presidential candidates is a very dear friend of mine so I guess that may allow me to have a political "opinion" which is not against any law.

Sunman - 2-1-2008 at 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Gull

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

I swore I wouldn't get sucked into this sword fighting match, and for the record I'm with Gnukid on this, but...

...most American cities as dangerous as Baghdad??? Are you serious? I can't think of too many American cities with bombs going off in crowded churches and markets or carbombs being detonated with regularity in public places. Yes, we have our problems with violence, but to categorize us with Baghdad is utter nonsense.

ELINVESTIG8R - 2-1-2008 at 10:17 AM

I used to be on-board until a person whose name shall remain anonymous wrote that 9/11 was a government conspiracy. It was at that point the person lost my vote of confidence. My personal view is if you think like that your view on everything is skewed in a direction I do not wish to travel.

vandenberg - 2-1-2008 at 10:31 AM

My take on this is that old Skeet is a cantakerous old goat who is starting to live in the past. However he has a certain knowledge of the goings-on in Baja, a liitle antiquated but still valuable. He also tends to pontificating and throwing religeous sh*t in the mix. Not my cup of tea.
Gnukid 's posts are a delight to read with some of them requiring special reading skills to make heads or tails of them. I take most of them at face value, with 25 to 40 percent truth and the rest embellishment, at which he has no equal on this board.
Like to meet both of them.

Hook - 2-1-2008 at 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sunman

Quote:

Originally posted by The Gull

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE
For the record, La Paz is right now, the safest small city in all of Mexico, with a crime rate that makes most Mexican and American cities look like Bagdad.

Yeah, just a wee bit of hyperbole wouldnt you say?

Most of us aren't this Gullible to fall for it, though.

DENNIS - 2-1-2008 at 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
Most of us aren't this Gullible to fall for it, though.

Just consider the source. When these bilious birds unload on the hood of your car, you're supposed to immediatly wash it off, not play with it.

gibson - 2-1-2008 at 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vandenberg
My take on this is that old Skeet is a cantakerous old goat who is starting to live in the past. However he has a certain knowledge of the goings-on in Baja, a liitle antiquated but still valuable. He also tends to pontificating and throwing religeous sh*t in the mix. Not my cup of tea.
Gnukid 's posts are a delight to read with some of them requiring special reading skills to make heads or tails of them. I take most of them at face value, with 25 to 40 percent truth and the rest embellishment, at which he has no equal on this board.
Like to meet both of them.

yep, again, you've nailed it!
I've thrown a few back with Gnu after a great days' kiting. He kites like he yarns .... very entertaining. While it's true that I personally throw my verbal diahhorea(sp) switch to 'on' while conversing... I can assure all that this is one 'good egg'. He has others' welfare at heart.

Now bubbas that have had plenty of time on this planet yet still invoke false dieties, display textbook redneckism, and imply the collapse of western civilisation partly due to scantily-clad women... well ... phew. 'nuff said. jmho

kimberlee - 2-1-2008 at 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cap

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
Now, if you live in baja, it's hard not to be involved in politics

ohh that's a pretty funny post there :lol:

and the Mexican government doesn't make it a point to involve themselves in American politics? what a hoot! take a look at their constant meddling in american immigration policy. thank about it, please. nfm.

DENNIS - 2-1-2008 at 11:55 AM

What is kiting? You guys actually fly kites or is it something more exotic?

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 12:00 PM

You can sweep or rake the neighborhood, pick up garbage, work together to raise money for schools and needy groups. You can educate, take classes and share the wealth of information you have. You can get involved in animal adoption.

There is no limit to the amount of involvement you can achieve to help your town without being meddlesome or an irritant.

The Kiters and windsurfers working with pangueros and teacher in La Ventana raised 11k US in just 4 days this last week and built 4 new school bathrooms and even more school supplies learning tools. That's a good example.

vandenberg - 2-1-2008 at 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
What is kiting? You guys actually fly kites or is it something more exotic?

Dennis,
You mean like in "Go fly a kite "?
I think it has something to do with some kind of watersport.
Hanging under a big kite that's towed by a boat. :?:

Gibby, enlighten us. :biggrin:

comitan - 2-1-2008 at 12:03 PM

Dennis

Kite boarding I think is a better description.

Tomas Tierra - 2-1-2008 at 12:32 PM

Aweful quiet there Skeetero.....?

Cap - 2-1-2008 at 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kimberlee

ohh that's a pretty funny post there :lol:

Alright I'll think about it:

I am not denying that people and gov'ts get inapropriately involved in foreign matters. What I am objecting to, is expatriates that stick their noses in local politics, as if it is their place. I realize that political outcomes affect them because they live there, but it is presumptuous to bring your northern sensibilities to their adopted home. Not to mention, depending on how far they take it, there are legal ramifications.
There are more than a few expats that get overly enthusiaistic about their new surroundings, and derive a sense of self importance from proving how well assimilated and connected they are. Then, they take these attitudes into overstepping their welcome.
The only reason I brought it up, was to answer a smug lecture on civic responsibilities, from someone that seems to be involved an a significant amount of drama.
I would usually ignore this behavior, and just enjoy the looks the locals give when they leave, but a call to action on these pages was a little to much to leave alone.

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 12:54 PM

On the other hand, not being involved in your surroundings is considered shallow, cold and aloof which was the point of civic involvement.

What if you were personally invited by neighbors to visit a city rally/fiesta where purchases of food and drinks benefited the community or a specific charity and you didn't go? How are you perceived?

The argument for being involved is that some people who want the benefits of living in mexico should contribute to the well being of the city.

Its painfully obvious...

No one is forcing you to be a part of your community wherever you live but to argue against being involved to do your part is really silly.

[Edited on 2-1-2008 by gnukid]

Cap - 2-1-2008 at 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
On the other hand, not being involved in your surroundings is considered shallow, cold and aloof.

What if you were personally invited by neighbors to visit a city rallys/fiesta where purchases of food and drinks benefited the community or a specific charity and you didn't go? How are you perceived?

The argument for being involved is that some people want the benefits of living in mexico should contribute to the well being of the city.

Its painfully obvious...

apples and oranges, my friend.

Hook - 2-1-2008 at 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cap

Quote:

Originally posted by kimberlee

ohh that's a pretty funny post there :lol:

Even worse, they sometimes insist on implementing rules like back at home............and end up destroying the very reason they came to Mexico in the first place; too damn many rules in the US of A.

It's a fine line to walk, really. You want some accountability out of a government that has rarely shown any to it's own citizens but you dont want it becoming any less free than it is.

I'll leave it to others to figure out which government I'm talking about here. :lol:

The Repubs seem to have a new definition of accountable in Washington these days. Sad, really. I used to identify more with them but Bush changed all that. Recent polls of other likely Republican voters show I am not alone. I guess it takes disasters like Nixon and the Bushs to come along every so often for some of us to even CONSIDER voting for Dems. :lol:

I am risking having this thread banished to the off-topic area so I'll end it here.

Skeet/Loreto - 2-1-2008 at 01:00 PM

WOW!!!
Thnaks to all of the Posters, Good, Bad, and indeferrent!!

Please all Posters to back to my Original Post. Then go down and read where Gnukid was going to send U2u without names {at my request}.

Those U2U's were never received by me {5 days ago}.

To Jesse and all of my other good Friends{and to TUCKER in his Heaven}, May he Rest in Peace!

I did a pre Investigation of this Matter as posted by GNUKid- There was no evidence that it ever Happened!!

For some of you Posters, Police and Investigation matters are done different in La Paz as in Calif. or Texas. They must be done very Quietly and with out revealing your Sources.

My Offer to do a complete Investigation still stands without revealing any of my Sources.

Now I may seem to be Religious in that I beleive in Faith, Hope and charity! Also Common Sense. I am only 76 years old with a Beautifull young Wife of 52 Years who I will celebrate 21 Years of Marriage on Feb. 14th 2008, We have been together 27 years!
I still Fly Airplanes, Ride Horses, Run a Tractor, and Serve as Alderman to my Texas Community. So don't you write me off Yet!!

Nataline Ann, "Who Peed in a Pan" I love because she is a Real Person of Quality and she is from Berkerely!!!
Same goes for Bajalera- and she lives in La Paz as well as many others who are Quality People.

Do you not think If all this bad stuff was happening that None in La Paz would complain to the Bureau of Tourism????,The Minstero of Police???
The Governor??????

Comon People make some Inquries to you Local Friends about this "So-Called Happening".

Gnukid: I would appreciate those U2U's as well as a Photo posted on this web of the Bismark 2 Fish Stand located about 4 blocks East of Setp 16th
Gnukid have you ever been to the Public Market?? Where is the Sports Shop Located. ??? How about the very good Bookstore. and while you are near the Bookstore let us Know what the Building behind the Mission Contains? Who Occupies it??

I will again Apolgize to any of the Board Members who I may have Offended , on this Thread and any previous Threads.

Vag. You are right I did get a little excited and got off the Off-Topic. Will never go Back!

Now I will go back and read everbody's Post again to see if I missed anything. God Bless you All and keep you safe Happy and SANE!!

Skeet/Loreto
Anon The Preacher
Skeeter Peter.

comitan - 2-1-2008 at 01:02 PM

Ban, Ban, Nixon was a pussycat Ban, Ban

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 01:03 PM

And to the point of this thread, when someone reports that there are robberies and has evidence in the form of police reports noting the bad cops names etc... provided by good cops wouldn't the appropriate response be, lets ask the city to look into it, not to assasinate the character of the victims, witnesses, friends and long distance posters?

Lets stick to the issue. As a group it would benefit us to learn to work with the system. When you have a problem, you need to follow the normal path to resolution.

1) Report the crimes, with as many witnesses as possible.

2) Call the authorities and ask them to check into the investigation.

3) Tell neighbors and friends about the problem and let them when and where to be on guard.

4) When you see something suspicious call the police and report it.

5) Follow up repeatedly.

No guarentee these things work but they are among the many steps which will help to raise awareness.

comitan - 2-1-2008 at 01:06 PM

Gnukid

Maybe you should start a Mexican ethics class, Blah, Blah.

And I swore to my self I wouldn't give you anymore of the attention you seem to need so badly.

[Edited on 2-1-2008 by comitan]

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 01:07 PM

skeet I asked you if you received them and you never replied? Is the proper method to u2u just put the name skeet in the name field, correct? I did tests as well to myself and they were received.

And if you never received them how did you make your conclusions reporting you did investigate? Whatever I am kind of over this sidetrack of the issue which is actauly being addressed by authorities.

Skeet why don't you u2u me and see if I can reply to you?

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 01:09 PM

Comitan I am sorry if this line upsets you. Thats really not my intention. If there are other approaches you have to help out here with a neighbor in need, please I am open to suggestions.

kimberlee - 2-1-2008 at 01:12 PM

Calmate Skeeter, and thanks for the offer, the "charitable non profit" (as per your post to me) offer to do a full investigation. Please do the investigation and report your findings here as many of us just don't have time to verify every internet post in cyberspace and determine if it is truthful or not. You seem to have the capacity and have proved yourself among many in this crowd. So I among this crowd am awaiting your full report.

I'll check back when you have posted it.

Cap - 2-1-2008 at 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto

Nataline Ann, "Who Peed in a Pan" I love because she is a Real Person of Quality and she is from Berkerely!!!

Skeet, I don't know you, or know what has transpired with this incident. But it looks like we agree on one thing. Nena, is lovely, and truly a quality person. Now, I think I need to hear the pan peeing story. :yes:

Skeet/Loreto - 2-1-2008 at 01:21 PM

Van; Hate to inform you but I do Not Lie; Every thing I have Posted has been the Truth. My Opinions are my Truthfull Opinions. I will refer you to my very First Post about Loreto Bay Villages when I ask "Where are they going to get the Water??"

Tell me Van: Do you know who has the Power in Loreto?? Constitution, Mulege? La Paz.?? Hope you get out of you House and Ask Questions, look around, might be surpised.

My Faith has always carried me through Life, I happen to beleive in Positive Good Things instead of "If it Feels Good Do It" kind of a Life Style>
I was able, through Hard work to retire in Loreto when I was 53 Years Old, I became honored by the Loreto People to the Point that I was trusted to buy and sell their Property.,. Never ever had a Mexicano talk down at me for going to the Mission and saying a Prayer, even through I am Not Catholic.

I am proud to say that I was one Americano that became involved in my Community of Loreto successfully.I happen to like the Mexicano People and their Way of Life.
Skeet/Loreto

gnukid - 2-1-2008 at 01:21 PM

Skeet

I am a little bit over your insulting and off topic posts. You have been of no help here and if anything have wasted our time here.

As you would see I have posted the contact address for the secretary of tourism Albert Trevino Angulo and many other addresses?

What is the possible point of accusing me of not living in La Paz? While the one who is not in La Paz is YOU!

There is no shock to anyone living here that the police are often engaged in extortion and hassling of people for nothing. The issue at hand is what do you do about it?

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