BajaNomad - Material Witness to a Murder

Material Witness to a Murder

awfulart - 6-12-2008 at 02:15 PM

I read a news report that an American in Cabo San Lucas was a witness to a murder and is being held as a witness in a witness protection situation. He has been there for at least 30 days and apparently will be there another 30 days against his will. If true would not this discourage Americans from coming forward when witnessing a crime?

I have since tried to retrieve the news article and it seems to have vanished so I cannot state in any way that the story is true or its source.

DENNIS - 6-12-2008 at 03:14 PM

Old news.......

Bruce R Leech - 6-12-2008 at 06:23 PM

unfortunately this is the way the law works in Mexico.

Woooosh - 6-12-2008 at 06:32 PM

or doesn't work

Paulina - 6-12-2008 at 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by awfulart
...would not this discourage Americans from coming forward when witnessing a crime?

There was once a Gringo out collecting cardon sticks in the desert (back when it wasn't against the law), when he happened across a recently dead body.

He didn't touch it, left it right where it was and drove into town.

He didn't go straight to the delegado, but happened to stop at the house of a well respected local man and started to tell him of his discovery when he was quickly interupted.

"You didn't find that body, I did" corrected the Don.

The man was confused for a moment, but then he understood. What he understood was that he didn't know anything about the dead man, where he was, how he died, and they also never had that conversation.

The Don drove out, walked around the body, leaving only his own foot prints, then returned to town to report his find.

That gringo was lucky he made his first stop where he did.

From my experience, the answer to your question would be, yes.

P<*)))>{

bajalera - 6-12-2008 at 07:32 PM

Dennis, I don't mind the ordinary forty ore fifty delete buttons. The big red one that vaporizes the poster's body is the one I worry about.

Fortunately, Hose A doesn't put it to use very often.

fulano - 6-12-2008 at 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
Gee, I like you too! Nice to meet you Dennis....

It's obvious your avatar is a fake, BajaGringo. A real jailhouse photo would say 'carcel de tijuana' and they would have about a dozen automatic weapons and stacks of money piled in front of you that they claimed they found in your car.

:lol:

DianaT - 6-12-2008 at 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Paulina

Quote:

Originally posted by awfulart
...would not this discourage Americans from coming forward when witnessing a crime?

Yikes, he was one lucky person who made a good choice. A good lesson is in that story----thanks

DENNIS - 6-12-2008 at 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
Gee, I like you too! Nice to meet you Dennis....

Oh, don't take it personally. You just asked what makes a moderator tick. I happen to know this 'cause I've been moderated to the max in the past. It's a tiring process to pee-off a moderator and I'm resting now. Gotta build up my muscles for the next run at 'em.

BajaGringo - 6-12-2008 at 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fulano
It's obvious your avatar is a fake, BajaGringo. A real jailhouse photo would say 'carcel de tijuana' and they would have about a dozen automatic weapons and stacks of money piled in front of you that they claimed they found in your car.

:lol:

Never claimed it was real but if you were active in some of the other Mexico related forums I have participated in for years you would know that it is one of the avatars I have always used. I am new to BajaNomad but have over 30 years living in Latin America and about half of those living and working in Mexico.

Some habits are hard to break...

Since Dennis has already decided that I am either offensive, stupid or both I won't bother explaining why my posts were really deleted (I later found out). He seems to have already made his mind up.

Nice to meet you anyway...

DENNIS - 6-12-2008 at 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajalera
Fortunately, Hose A doesn't put it to use very often.

Yeah, Lera......I think you and I will be the first to know.

fulano - 6-12-2008 at 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
Since Dennis has already decided that I am either offensive, stupid or both I won't bother explaining why my posts were really deleted (I later found out). He seems to have already made his mind up.

Nice to meet you anyway...

For some people here, this forum is like the chickens in the barnyard. Chickens have a pecking order. If you toss a new hen into the barnyard, all the chickens will peck at each other until they sort out the new pecking order, then they go back to scratching for worms.

Dennis is sorting out the new pecking order.

BajaGringo - 6-12-2008 at 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fulanoFor some people here, this forum is like the chickens in the barnyard. Chickens have a pecking order. If you toss a new hen into the barnyard, all the chickens will peck at each other until they sort out the new pecking order, then they go back to scratching for worms.

Dennis is sorting out the new pecking order.

So basically you are saying that according to Dennis I am a stupid and offensive barnyard animal.

Nice...

I just read a post he made in another thread saying that he didn't say that. I don't know, even this stupid old Gringo can read a little English and that is what it seems to say in the post he made after I asked why my previous post was deleted. Maybe there's a secret language I have yet to learn here...

:?:

Paulina - 6-12-2008 at 08:27 PM

I think that the rest of the back and forth conversations on this thread should be taken to u2u as it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

P<*)))><

woody with a view - 6-12-2008 at 08:29 PM

there he is!!! that's our man dennis the heckler!!!! besides a passion for the magic elixir, aka pacifico he's a hell of a nut stomper.... get in line....

BajaGringo - 6-12-2008 at 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by grover

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo...I won't bother explaining why my posts were really deleted (I later found out)...

If you could manage, I would appreciate knowing what happened.

Thank you.

My post contained a reference to US politics. I guess that is a big no-no around here...

As well as quoting to Dennis his own posts.

Still nice to meet you Dennis...

postholedigger - 6-12-2008 at 08:38 PM

Oh boy...didn't a thread like this just end not long ago?

MICK - 6-13-2008 at 06:20 AM

We need JR back!!! ( secret code)
Welcome anyway bajagringo. I like the Pic.
Mick

awfulart - 6-13-2008 at 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
Old news.......

This may be old news to some but new to others

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-13-2008 at 07:56 AM

Elitists Members stop telling the Unwashed Members what to do. We the Elitists and Unwashed should probably stop hijacking this thread though. Sorry for my addition to the hijack. Oh can anyone in here tell me what CCG stands for.

oxxo - 6-13-2008 at 09:56 AM

BajaGringo - 6-13-2008 at 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lencho

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
I am new to BajaNomad but have over 30 years living in Latin America and about half of those living and working in Mexico.

Unusual! Working at what?

--Larry

I spent 20 years consulting to the oil industry in Argentina, Venezuela, Brazil and Mexico with a few side trips to Sumatra. I have spent the last 12 or so designing online marketing solutions and incorporated databases to clients in Mexico and the US. It allows me to work out of my home wherever I have lived.

Nothing is perfect but this is as close as I have found...

toneart - 6-13-2008 at 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo

Quote:

Originally posted by grover

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo...I won't bother explaining why my posts were really deleted (I later found out)...

If you could manage, I would appreciate knowing what happened.

Thank you.

My post contained a reference to US politics. I guess that is a big no-no around here...

As well as quoting to Dennis his own posts.

Still nice to meet you Dennis...

Being that we weren't privy to the "offending" post, I would think that a US political reference would not get deleted because of a particular stance, except for the fact that it probably didn't belong in this thread. Some do sneak through, but they really belong in Off Topic.

There are lots of posts, including this one of mine, that should get deleted or moved because they don't really pertain to the thread.

BajaGringo - 6-13-2008 at 11:11 AM

I actually tied the post into this thread but was told that because it was US politics that it belonged elsewhere.

Learned my lesson.

Tail between my legs.

Moving on...

CaboRon - 6-13-2008 at 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by awfulart

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
Old news.......

This may be old news to some but new to others

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=31437

and here's another

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=31488

Good reading,
CaboRon

shari - 6-13-2008 at 11:27 AM

so pardon my off the topic pregunta...but did your comments get moved to off topic? or deleted?
Now back to the thread topic...very good lesson from Paulina...reporting crime is often a problema and one should look for alternative methods to do so as in the post mentioned...or at least seek the council of a trustworthy local persona as to how to proceed.
These topics are very useful learning tools for the baja traveller and "good to know".
(bajagringo...love your signature and nice to have a new crap disturber on board..one who isn't afraid to defend himself and actually has a sense of humor too)

Sharksbaja - 6-13-2008 at 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Oh can anyone in here tell me what CCG stands for.

Sorry, not in public.

You'd have to ask JR to do that! :rolleyes:

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-13-2008 at 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sharksbaja

Quote:

Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Oh can anyone in here tell me what CCG stands for.

Sorry, not in public.

You'd have to ask JR to do that! :rolleyes:

JR Please respond and let me know.

DENNIS - 6-13-2008 at 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
JR Please respond and let me know.

You'll need a Ouija Board for that one, David.

I know Dennis I thought JR would get a kick out of that one while looking down on us from heaven.

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-13-2008 at 12:39 PM

BajaGringo - 6-13-2008 at 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari so pardon my off the topic pregunta...but did your comments get moved to off topic? or deleted?

deleted eliminado zapped borrado gone forever

Quote:

Originally posted by shari (bajagringo...love your signature and nice to have a new crap disturber on board..one who isn't afraid to defend himself and actually has a sense of humor too)

Stand by.

I am sure that I will say something here to make you change your opinion. Give me a day or two...

Capt. George - 6-13-2008 at 01:16 PM

elinvest

CCG Coast Guard with a stutter.

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-13-2008 at 01:19 PM

Ah Thank you Skipper. And I like your signature. It kind of fits in with what I have been saying.

"The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men" Plato

rdrrm8e - 6-13-2008 at 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo

Quote:

So basically you are saying that according to Dennis I am a stupid and offensive barnyard animal.

Nice...

:?:

I think Dennis was saying you are a stupid and offensive pecker! :cool:

BajaGringo - 6-13-2008 at 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rdrrm8e
I think Dennis was saying you are a stupid and offensive pecker! :cool:

Refreshing to see that I am meeting so many nice and friendly folks here. You guys really know how to roll out the red carpet.

Make note - Add to favorite sites...

CaboRon - 6-13-2008 at 02:09 PM

BajaGringo - 6-13-2008 at 02:19 PM

Pass the popcorn.

All this work is making one crudus vado very hungry...

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-13-2008 at 02:25 PM

Go over here and proudly vote who you are. If you do not vote you are a Sheeple and in league with the Devil Elitists in Baja Nomad. http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=31848

NOTE: Maybe the powers that be will see their way clear and move the poll over here to the Elitist side of the railroad tracks where it will get to see the light of day.

[Edited on 6-14-2008 by ELINVESTI8]

Material Witness

awfulart - 6-13-2008 at 07:02 PM

Does anyone know what ever happened to the Material Witness who was being held against his will by the police or did I miss something?

awfulart - 6-14-2008 at 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by grover

Quote:

Originally posted by awfulart...did I miss something?

Yes.

Grover : Thank you for being so helpful and definitive?

awfulart - 6-14-2008 at 09:13 AM

Thanks Grover, I guess we can conclude that Thompson is still being held against his will. I guess the moral of this story is to say "I saw nothing, and heard nothing" otherwise you could spend months in Mexico against your will and possibly lose more than just time in "protective custody"

There must be some way he can post some kind of guarantee, perhaps a bond of some sort, that he would return at the appropriate time.

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-14-2008 at 09:24 AM

Speaking of witnessing a shooting death; When, I was in Medellin Colombia in 2005 I was walking down a sidewalk of one of the big main streets. I spotted a man briskly walking from the street toward another man who walking toward me on the sidewalk. When I was about 15 feet away from them the fast walking man walked right up to the man walking toward me and shot him eight times in the face. He then calmly put his semi-automatic handgun into his waist band and started walking off. We locked eyes for what seem like an eternity until he got into a car without plates and took off. When the National Police came to investigate (I should laugh when I say investigate) I tried to give them a statement as to what I saw. They just waved off the Gringo, picked up the body and had the fire department wash the blood into the street. I don’t know how this relates to La Baja unless the hit-man (sicario) was from La Baja.

I have another about a woman who was either pushed or threw herself off the top of a 20 story apartment building where I was living at the time. I heard the thump of her body hitting the ground. I ran down 10 flights of stairs to go checked on her. She was squished. Again the National Police came picked up the body and left. When I asked them if they were going to investigate whether she was pushed or not I was told to "Mind your own business she was crazy." "No te metes en esto ella estaba loca." I later found out she was a Registered Nurse who lived in the building and was having domestic problems with a boyfriend. I was never held as a material witness thank god.

oxxo - 6-14-2008 at 09:58 AM

There was one report that "the American held against his will" actually knew both victims prior to the assault, not an innocent bystander. Another report said that "the American held against his will" was the jilted lover of the female victim. Another report says that the three were part of a drug deal that went bad. Whether these reports are true or not, I cannot say. It was confirmed by "the American held against his will" that he indeed did occupy the room adjacent to the crime scene. No, I didn't save the links to these reports.

My personal opinion is that there is more to the story than what has been revealed so far. It is interesting that the female victim has remained silent. If I were to hear a loud argument in the hotel room next door at 11:30 pm I would call the front desk, not go next door myself to investigate.

If you don't like Mexican laws and court system, you shouldn't travel here......but I'm not sure I like the American Court system any better.

David K - 6-14-2008 at 10:03 AM

Both countries have the best court systems money can buy... right? :light:

awfulart - 6-14-2008 at 10:09 AM

There are many things in life we don't much like but as we mature we learn to accept them, particularly when in a foreign country. In our own country we may try to change them. Certainly, nothing is perfect.

As far as rumors, hmmmmmm. :?:

BajaGringo - 6-14-2008 at 10:56 AM

Don't even get me started on the US court system. Mods would delete my post anyway...

oxxo - 6-14-2008 at 11:16 AM

My gringo neighbor here in Los Cabos, a full time resident and business owner locally for about 20 years, swears that the following story is true.

They said they have a gringo acquaintance that owns a single family home in the Cerro Colorado development (an upscale community primarily gringos) here on the Corridor. A few years ago they returned home late one evening and found a Mexican burglar ransacking their house. The resident pulled a hand gun from a secret location and confronted the burglar. The burglar lunged at him and the resident shot him dead. Rather than deal with a messy investigation by the Policia that would certainly land the victim in jail, they loaded the body into the trunk of the car and drove out into the desert.......way out........and dumped the body. Problem solved, justice served.

I don't know, but my neighbor swears that it is true. If I found myself in this same situation, I think I would do the same (but I don't own a gun). I would probably dispense with the burglar by forcing him to watch old Jerry Lewis movies and he would commit suicide!

[Edited on 6-14-2008 by oxxo]

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-14-2008 at 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo
My gringo neighbor here in Los Cabos, a full time resident and business owner locally for about 20 years, swears that the following story is true.

They said they have a gringo acquaintance that owns a single family home in the Cerro Colorado development (an upscale community primarily gringos) here on the Corridor. A few years ago they returned home late one evening and found a Mexican burglar ransacking their house. The resident pulled a hand gun from a secret location and confronted the burglar. The burglar lunged at him and the resident shot him dead. Rather than deal with a messy investigation by the Policia that would certainly land the victim in jail, they loaded the body into the trunk of the car and drove out into the desert.......way out........and dumped the body. Problem solved, justice served.

I don't know, but my neighbor swears that it is true.

Case Closed. :lol:

BajaGringo - 6-14-2008 at 11:24 AM

I know of a similar story here in the Rosarito area. The difference is that their local security where they lived called the police. The police showed up, recognized the perp to be a local and ongoing problem. After hearing the story they told the man that he didn't shoot him. The real story was that he had called the police and they arrived and shot him. They even gave him back his 9 mm and told him to keep it hidden and secure.

Never even had to go and make a formal statement.

durrelllrobert - 6-15-2008 at 10:02 AM

Quote:

My post contained a reference to US politics. I guess that is a big no-no around here...

I had one deleted because I mentioned another Baja board (another no-no?) :?:

BajaGringo - 6-15-2008 at 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by durrelllrobert
My post contained a reference to US politics. I guess that is a big no-no around here...

I had one deleted because I mentioned another Baja board (another no-no?) :?:

Good question. I am still learning the ropes around here myself. I figure that if you don't ruffle the feathers in the hen house once in awhile, you aren't really contributing...

Probably not what you wanted to hear

fulano - 6-17-2008 at 12:43 AM

Arrestan a estadounidense en caso de canadiense muerto en México

["American arrested in case of Canadian murdered in México"]

Las autoridades arrestaron a un estadounidense que habría atestiguado el asesinato de un canadiense en esta ciudad turística bajo cargos de haberle mentido a la Policía.
El comandante de la Policía del estado de Baja California Sur, Omar Barajas, dijo que los investigadores determinaron que Michael Thompson, de 32 años y residente en Chicago, conoce al asesino de Bouabal Bounthavorn, de 29 años.

Al principio, Thompson dijo a la policía que vio a un sujeto desconocido que discutió brevemente con Bounthavorn antes de balearlo en su habitación del Hotel Riu, en Cabo San Lucas.

Barajas dijo el lunes que Thompson fue acusado el domingo de dar una declaración falsa a los investigadores. Había estado detenido en calidad de testigo desde el asesinato del 15 de mayo.

El funcionario dijo que la policía también tiene retenido a un mexicano, sin informar la causa o si los investigadores han esclarecido un móvil del homicidio.

[Authorities arrested an American who witnessed the murder of a Canadian tourist in this city, on charges of having lied to the Police.

The police commander of the state of Baja California Sur, Omar Barajas, said that investigators determined that Michael Thompson, aged 32 and resident in Chicago, knows the murderer of Bouabal Bounthavorn, 29 years of age.

At first, Thompson told police he saw an unknown subject having a brief discussion with Bounthavorn before firing bullets in his room at the Hotel Riu, in Cabo San Lucas.

Barajas said Monday that Thompson was accused Sunday of giving a false statement to investigators. He had been arrested as a witness to the murder which occured on May 15.

The official said that police has also detained a Mexican, without stating the cause or whether investigators have determined a motive for the homicide.]

awfulart - 6-17-2008 at 01:25 PM

Barajas said Monday that Thompson was accused Sunday of giving a false statement to investigators. He had been arrested as a witness to the murder which occured on May 15.(quote)

Thank you Fulano, This anwers my original question as to the the status of Thompson. Things are not always what they seem.

Art

The story continues to develop

fulano - 6-19-2008 at 11:00 AM

"Two charged in death of Canadian in Mexico: report"

LOS CABOS, MEXICO - Mexican authorities have arrested and charged two men from Mexico and the United States in connection with the May hotel shooting death of a Canadian who was staying in a Cabo San Lucas hotel with his girlfriend, a local daily newspaper is reporting.

Ricardo Cruz Pineda, 35, from Acapulco, and Frank Jule Sandoval, 48, from Los Angeles, were arrested Wednesday and charged with premeditated murder in connection with the death of Bouabal Bounthavorn Ingo, 29, a Laos-born Canadian who was shot three times in the head inside a hotel room he was sharing with Masha Heikali, 24, from Burnaby, B.C., the La Paz-based newspaper el Sud Californiano reported Thursday. Heikali was shot in the foot during the incident.

The newspaper reported Baja California Sur state authorities said Bounthavorn was shot with a 9mm handgun."

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=d4f972...

Strange there is no mention of the witness from Chicago.